You woyld Bruan especially since they are going crazy about Russia bombing and inflicting huge damage on CIA…oops…oops the moderates…oops…sorry – ISIS!
Darn I keep confusing those three for some reason.

Jason, I read a lot of your posts, and some of them show an understanding of the global growth-political situation.

However, unless you can provide concrete evidence that Russia has not struck a single ISIS target since beginning their campaign, I will have to consider your comment null and void.

One fact that cannot be disputed is that Western interference in mid-east and African affairs has created the current turmoil we are experiencing in those regions.

Another fact is that, right or wrong, the Russian intervention in Syria was legally requested by the Syrian President. Also, since its beginning, it has managed to gain widespread support in the West, and appears to have upstaged the, very questionable, Western attempt to quash Isis.

Please excuse spell-check error. The above comment should read ‘geo-political’

I’ll provide evidence John as, unlike most people here, I actually justify what I say.

Here’s a currently-developing map which includes all known bombing locations by the Russians so far:
http://theaviationist.com/2015/10/02/heres-an-interactive-map-of-all-the-russian-airstrikes-in-syria/
Here’s another map, this time with a graphical representation of the territories held by various players within the civil war:
http://www.understandingwar.org/sites/default/files/Russian%20Airstrikes%2014%20OCT.pdf

Notice that both maps pretty much line up, give or take, in terms of the bombing locations? Also notice how according to the second map we can see very few bombing strikes against ISIS positions? The majority of the strikes according to all commenters have been concentrated on the areas of Aleppo and Homs. Neither of these are ISIS-held.

What matters here is that the butchering stops and Syria’s borders are restored so that the millions of refugees can safely return…perhaps then,money that is currently being spent on weaponry can be spent on rebuilding the country.The alternatives are too horrible to contemplate.

America needs to stop funding terrorists, they have been a cancer to the whole Middle East since the Twin Towers. .

JohnAbbs – don’t stop at America…Turkey,Saudi Arabia are also funding,facilitating and arming the Wahabi hordes…..

Jason whatever about ISIS,but you seem to have an issue with Russian airstrikes on Al Nusra and Army of Conquest. Groups who match Isis for savagery and Wahabbi lunacy. I wonder what that is?

Joachim. And you think Assad won’t stop butchering anyone that opposed him or his regime even if the war stopped tomorrow. All one has to do is look back at Assad family history. The Hama massacre in 1982 carried out by Assad Snr, where its estimated 20,000 were killed for daring to oppose the regime.
As long as the Assad family remain in power this war is not going to end.

An uprising that was organised by the Muslim Brotherhood.

The political uprising against Yanukovych in the Ukraine was organised primarily by Svoboda and other far-right groups and they suffered massively in the post-rising elections. What’s your point Sertorius?

Sertoris the vast majority killed were innocent civilians. That fact is recognised internationally. When you indiscriminately shell and bomb a city that you have laid siege to the majority of those who are going to die are not fighters but civilians.

Morning Mick.yes Mick…I agree,but,Assad has done a deal with the devil (Putin) and though I’ve NO evidence I believe Assad will have no role in post conflict Syria..the Assad dynasty will end with the war and Bashar MIGHT get out of it with his life.the old regime would be a rallying cry in the future Syria…but peace will be dragged into Syria if necessary…

“Russia hits more targets in Syria in a day then the US does in the whole of Syria and Iraq does in a week.” — If the US were bombing this much and this indiscriminately you’d all be whaling war crimes.

My point is you people are fooling yourselfs if you believe Syria is going to turn into a democratic paradise if the Assad government falls. Assad is the only thing preventing all out genocide and ethnic cleansing.

Joachim. Problem is for Putin now is that with Assad hitched to his wagon Russia has to keep him in power now if they wish to keep their Naval base. For all sides Russia is inextricably linked to Assad. And a Shia dominated government in Syria is untenable in the long term. Just like the US did in Vietnam and the Soviets did in Afghanistan Putin has fallen into the same trap. He has publicly backed a lame horse. And the majority of Syrians won’t forget it.

Sertorious. The Assad family and the Shia dominated Government is the major factor in this war. Like it or not with Sunni’s making up 80% of the population and Shia’s at 15% holding all the power something has to give.
Right across the entire Middle East the Sunni – Shia conflict has erupted once again. From Syria to Yemen, from Iraq to Bahrain. And with both sides hating each other and seeing the other as heretics it is not going to end anytime soon.

The ‘majority’ of Syrians support the Assad government. That is undisputed. The ‘majority’ of Syrians also know what will happen if the Assad government falls. Syria will become a Wahabbi hell on Earth.

Good point Ron, in fact there are initial reports that the Russian bombing campaign has killed nearly as many civilians in it’s brief existence than the entire bombing campaign by the US-led coalition has caused in total. Initial estimates put the death toll at 3,000 combatants and 160 civilians for US-led operations and 370 combatants and 120 civilians in the Russian strikes.

If the estimates are true and the Russians really are killing nearly 1 civilian for every 2 combatants, where’s the outrage from those who claim the US and Israel are butchers of civilians?

Sertorious. With only State controlled media in Syria for the past 50 years we have only the regimes word that they were backed by the majority. Its like saying that the Kim’s in NK are universally loved by the majority of North Koreans.

Sertorious, how exactly do you know that the majority of people support Assad with such certainty? You’ll note that there hasn’t been a free election there in decades.

Mick…Russia has been inextricably linked to Syria since the French were asked to leave after WW2 and in my opinion any force that is willing and able to destroy the Wahabi armies can only be a good thing,most Muslims – Shi’a,Sunna hate and fear the Wahabis,the refugees streaming into Europe and languishing in camps in Turkey,Lebanon,Jordan etc are not all running from the Syrian army and Hezbollah.Most Sunni,Shi’a,Christian,Druze Syrians lived alongside each other but the Wahabis are absolute..with them,its their way or no way.

Jason..be wary of the “Syrian Observatory for Human Rights”.. he’s a reclusive geezer living in an attic in an English Suburb…

The two stooges still blowing out the same guff even though the US plans to install a puppet regime in Syria have been blown out of the water, 1st off the elections held last year were monitored and deemed fair, 88% vote for Assad means he’s the man Syrians want to lead the country through this proxy invasion crisis, and secondly, it’s a secular government, Sunnis are widely represented in the cabinet. Do your facts lads instead of blowing US state dept hot air out of your hoops. XXX

& Jason, want pictures of your ‘moderate rebels’ decapitating people around the Homs governate in the last two weeks? Truth is, there is no distinction between ‘moderate’ and ISIL only the banners they carry. They’re both funded by the US, Saudi Arabia, Qatar and Turkey.

I am weary of it, hence the language in my comment. It is, however, the only hard numbers we actually have at this point relating to the death toll of Russian strikes due to the secrecy of the Russians on this topic.

The truth is we’ll probably never know, the amount of civilians they indiscriminately killed in Chechnya is still not fully known.

Polls that have being commissioned by of all people the Qatari Royal family have found that over 50% of Syrians wish for Assad to remain in his position of president. Okay they were commissioned 3 years ago, but unless you show me a more up to date poll then it’s the only barometer of support we currently have.

Joe, I’m just going to quickly quote from Wikipedia because I couldn’t be bothered at this point to find the actual in-depth sources to refute you:

“The Gulf Cooperation Council, the European Union and the United States dismissed the election as illegitimate.[5][6][7][8] Attempts to hold an election under the circumstances of an ongoing civil war were criticized by UN secretary general Ban Ki-moon,[9] and it was widely reported that the elections lacked independent election monitoring.[10] An international delegation led by allies of Assad[11] from more than 30 countries including Bolivia, Brazil, Cuba, Ecuador, India, Iran, Iraq, Nicaragua, Russia, South Africa and Venezuela[12][13] issued a statement claiming the election was “free, fair and transparent”.”

That’s some ringing endorsement of the ‘fairness’ of the election. This coming from Russia who personally selected each individual “observer” to the Crimean referendum who happened to all come from Russian-funded political parties.

Joachim. Putin had a chance even up to the point of getting involved in the fighting to avoid being permanently linked to Assad. Even if he had like the other coalition air forces stuck to hitting ISIS exclusively he could have walked away from Assad if things went south and negotiated a new deal for the Tartus base with the next government. That option is now completely off the table now. As with Yanokovich in Ukraine, in international politics you have to know when to cut your losses and not chain yourself to an anchor.

Joe. In the Elections in Syria the Opposition Candidates were hand picked by the regime!!! There was no real Opposition parties allowed because Syria is and has been a one party state since 1961.

Mick do you have an issue with airstirkes being carried out on the likes of Al Nusra and Army of Conquest?

Sell arms.

None what so ever Sertorious. A US air strikes killed a high ranking Al Nusra member a few days ago. What I do have a problem with is Russian air strikes against the Western backed FSA and their seeming lack of descretionary bombing of civilian areas. And that seems to be Russian military doctrine. Where as the West use a Scalpel to operate, Russia uses an Axe.

Ahh the FSA. They exist in imagination only. The reality is various Jihadists of different guises are running the campaign against Assad and the Kurds for that matter.
The ‘West’ certainly used a scapel when they bomebed the $hit out of that Medicin Sans Frontieres facility in Afghanistan.

Mick..for the Russians this “expedition” is bigger than Tartous…its about national pride,one up on the west and making it clear to Muslim states in the former USSR that he,Putin,is HARD!!! but I think too that if the west concentrates on punishing Russia by making Syria a failed state as both then Superpowers did to Somalia by proxy some decades ago…then the world will pay a high price.

An air strike called in and lit up by laser designator by whom Sertorious?? The Afghan National Army wasn’t it who said they were under fire from the building.

As I have previously said before Joachim. Putin’s Russia is by far the most dangerous threat to the West since the Soviets. It far out strips any threat of terrorism from a few rag heads.

Blatant bollox from Mick as usual, and Jason, Wikipedia? Please…
BTW Mick, the SAA have been giving Russia co-ordinates for up around 400 terrorist positions a day and the Russians haven’t carried out any in built up areas so far, if you watch the videos of the strikes you will notice that too. As for the FSA, they’ve been carrying out decapitations around Homs the last two weeks, some moderate CIA backed rebels they are…

You accuse us of “blatant bollox” and then come out with the gem that Russia isn’t striking Syrian cities. Even Al-Jazeera is showing footage of Russian aircraft bombing Aleppo.

You’re not going to do another ‘those aren’t Russians in Crimea’ on us are you Joe?

Joe. The SAA have been indiscriminatly barrel bombing, shelling and gassing civilians for the past 4 years what makes you think they are going to bother about civilian casualties with the co-ordinance they give the Russian Airforce?

Only casualties from Chemical weapons in Syria have been SAA & Civilians- straight from UN reports, you do the math, cop on and stop parroting what the likes of empty head Spokeswoman for the State Dept Jen Psaki says yar getting mugged off.

The US is now CONCERNED Russia might take out ISIS leaders. (https://archive.is/hKhCP#selection-1461.1-1461.125)

Afraid what they might say in questioning lads?

Seems nuts that no matter how much evidence there is people still seem to willfully ignore the fact that neither Russia nor Assad have been truly engaging isis.

Correct Joe civilian have been gassed.
Don’t you find it odd that during threat Damscus gassing event not a single SAA soldier was affected by the gas even though in some places SAA lines were only 100 meters away from areas that were affected. I find it rather strange myself. Unless of course those troops had been pre warned and were wearing their NBC gear.

Tony its a case of see no evil. They are willing to sup with the Devil thinking the are using a long spoon but not realising the Devil has poisoned the spoon.

What are ya on about mick? Keep them little gems comin yer not right in the head me aul mate.

In fairness America had a heavy presence in the Middle East for years before Sept 11th. Bin Laden hated US soldiers stationed near Mecca in Saudi Arabia. He attacked US embassies in Africa and also bombed the Twin Towers in ’98. This is why he was top of the FBI list for so long. 17 years I think. He was never indicted for Sept 11th though. The Taliban offered to extradite him to the US if they could provide evidence. The US had no evidence. Bin Laden denied it numerous times. The FBI said on record they had nothing to tie him to the Sept 11th attacks.

Jason who do you blame for the force feeding of prisoners in Gitmo.. Russia Assad ?? people that have not even been charged with a crime.. a human rights violation like no other.. how can you argue a moral high ground when your side has this on their CV.. disgusting and blind you are..

Davy, geopolitics isn’t a sport so your assumption that I have a “side” is quite frankly worrying.

Of course I find the carry-on in G-Bay horrible and hypocritical and would like to see that facility shut down. You need to ask yourself a question though. What about the equivalent facilities in Russia, China, North Korea, Iran etc.? Why do we never hear anything about them (you’d be naive to think they don’t exist)?

That’s because, unlike in Russia or China, criticising the government’s treatment of prisoners in the West doesn’t result in a direct trip to the same facilities you’re complaining about. In China or Russia you could very well end up being the next prisoner if you publicly denounce the government on these topics.

Assad is a saint compared to the bloodthirsty US administration that has caused more wars than the world combined since the 2nd world war not to mention the region of 25 million civilian deaths

To answer Jason’s Question, pictures state 1000 words. Its time for America to pack up its terrorists from Syria and Go.

http://www.davidicke.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/09/mccain-isis-587×413.jpg

I’m sorry John but you’ll have to do better than that. That image has already proven to be a fake. It was posted by one of Hezbollah’s newspapers in Lebanon and while the person photographed bears a superficial resemblance to al-Baghdadi it has been proven multiple times that it was not him.

John, it’s hard to know whether you’re deliberately ignoring Assad’s atrocities or you’re just plain stupid. I’ll give you the benefit of the doubt and say it’s the former. But in that case your comments are not even worthy of a reply.

As for your McCain pic, thanks for the laugh but it’s been debunked and if you don’t know that by now you may as well give up.

Jason Culligan_ McCain’s Twitter account spits out everything that wen’t on.

What was fake were all those phony jump suit beheading.

https://twitter.com/senjohnmccain/status/339455679800700928

Honestly Briny, I’m going to put it down to selective ignorance on John’s part. He doesn’t seem to do any research on what he talks about judging by his string of comments which also explains why he can never supply any sources or confirmation material which hasn’t been thoroughly debunked already.

Briny – despite the fact that for many of the world’s Wahabi Sunna it is now almost a rite of passage,indeed a Jihad,to make their way to the ruins of Syria to kill Syrian Army soldiers…whether with DAESH or any of the other 40+ “brigades”…Assad and his army have held out,I believe that the time for Assad to go – has gone,now that Iran and Russia have pitched in with men and machinery its time for reality/pragmatism….does the enlightened west back Saudi,Jabhat Al Nusra,DAESH as they strive toward a toxic Caliphate…..or do they resist these – back Assad,Syria,Russia and restore a secular state with HUGE implications for the middle East and the EU….the question is?what would replace Assad? think of Somalia,Libya,Afghanistan….

Jason, I would say that when someone resorts to putting up links to David Icke’s website then it’s surely time to call 999!

Assad is the only hope Syria has left. Whatever his faults – if he goes, there will be nothing but anarchy and further chaos.
Incidentally Assad is known to have a very good record of tolerance, towards Christians and other ethnic minorities, in Syria. The Western media never acknowledge this though.
Perhaps they would prefer to see them beheaded and crucified at the hands of ISIS.

I’m pretty sure his claim to being a tolerant leader died when he started using snipers and tanks to put down anti-government protests. Or was it when he used artillery to shell housing estates, or perhaps when he started to drop improvised barrel bombs and incendiaries from his aircraft on densely-populated urban centres?

There was no such thing as tolerance in Syria under Assad and his father. Plenty of brutal military crackdowns and massacres happened in Syria under their leadership.

They only want Assad gone because he opposed a pipeline going through his country to Europe. The pipeline was only wanted so Russia’s economy could be crippled.

If the US and Israel weren’t so obsessed with keeping a stranglehold on geopolitics and international finance, ISIS would never have been funded and the refugee crisis wouldn’t be happening.

Can I borrow that crystal ball when you’re done with it?

I’m sorry but all historical precedents completely disagree with you. Syria was a powder keg waiting to explode with sectarian tensions mixed in with political and military oppression. The country has been on the road to collapse for a very long time.

Christ Jase take a break son. Find yourself a nice girl, go out for a drink, relax.. It might never happen!

Jason has a girl, she got a face like the pugs ar$e, no wonder he’s his face buried in the journal all the time I wouldn’t be able to look at her.

Probably Russian.. Just to keep himself motivated

:D

I would report that completely distasteful comment Joe as I’m pretty sure that was a serious violation of the comment rules, however I won’t just so I can refer people back to just how pathetic you really are.

Whatever you have against me, but bringing someone in my personal life into this is just absolutely disgusting behaviour.

Whatever ye want Jason just remember my name when your kissing Pug bum face ;)

Do you honestly think you’re funny or creative Joe? It’s actually just sad that this is about everything your obviously under-utilised brain cells can rub together.

Pathetic troll account.

What oil? On the list of top oil producing countries Syria doesn’t even reach the top 50.

Jason Libya was up near NO1 and look at the mess that the Yanks have left that country in.

From one of the most prosperous and proud nations of Africa to now being a terrorist infiltrated dump.

Moammar Gaddafi warned Europe, “If I go down, Europe goes black”…. Its all happening now.

That depends on your definition of the term ‘near’ John. Even in 2006, well before the civil war there, Libya’s oil production was only 1.8 million barrels per day which was far below both Russia and Saudi Arabia who were both doing about 10 million barrels per day in the same period.

Libya’s economy was also nowhere near as strong as you make it out to be. Nearly 80% of it’s GDP depends on the oil industry and Libya had almost no supporting economy. Compare that to the UAE who is using their oil revenue to build an impressive tech and financial sector for when the oil runs out.

Jason Culligan_Gadaffi kept the lid on the Dust bin of his nation. Bad as he was he looked after his people.The Yanks can’t even look after their own people FFS look at the state of Detroit.

When the Yanks sent in their terrorists to slaughtered Gaddafi without trial they left a Vacuum and we have seen this repeated again and again, Iraq, now Syria. Its time the Yanks minded their own business and f eck off back to their own country because they are now totally OUT OF CONTROL

Quite the opposite John, Libya was a pressure valve waiting to go off under Gadaffi. Like Saddam Hussein and Assad, Gadaffi relied on nothing but brute force to subdue the various ethnic groups in Libya. As history has shown time and time again, it only takes a spark to ignite tension and conflict when it has been forcefully suppressed.

In Libya it was the Zawiya protests, in Syria it was Assad’s failure to deliver on promised political reform. These are just the latest in thousands of years worth of historical examples.

Jason…do you believe Syria’s war is/was that simple? failure to deliver on political reform? do you think the Shi’a/Sunni devide played any part?or Turkey?Saudi Arabia?the good ole US of A??

Read my comment Joachin instead of misrepresenting it.

I said it was the spark which set the powder keg off. That does not mean it was the sole cause and to represent it as such shows either a gross misunderstanding of what I said or purposeful misrepresentation.

Ethnic divides within Syria have played a massive role in the civil war. As I said in my comment, forceful suppression of ethnic tension can seriously amplify the already present hostilities. Yes the countries of Turkey, Saudi Arabia and America have not helped the situation but Russia propping up an unpopular dictator also didn’t help the situation either.

Thus,Jason,to misuse a phrase much loved by Irish Politicians following the bust…”we are where we are”.

Joachim. As Jason has said it was only a matter of time before Libya and Syria imploded.
Libya is not nor never was a homogeneous society. Like the former Yugoslavia it is in reality an artificial creation by the European powers. It is a cocktail of different Ethnic groups, Tribes and Clans that were held together by force firstly by the Colonial powers then by successive Arab rulers. The current war and chaos we see there now is those different entities fighting to gain as much power and influence for their own grouping as they can.
Syria on the other hand started out as a push for greater democracy but has morphed into a Sectarian conflict between the Sunni majority and the Shia dominated government.
Iraq was like Syria but in reverse. A Shia majority with a ruling Sunni minority with a butcher at its head.

Jason, large amounts of oil were found in the Golan Heights, which is an area of Syria provisionally under Israeli control. Those Israelis, getting lucky again!

What are the odds it remains under “provisional” control for the foreseeable future?

Jason LYBIA had the highest human development index level in Africa.. when Gaddafi took over it was the poorest in Africa ,when he was murdered it was the richest.. loans by law were intrest free..education free..if it couldn’t be provided it was paid for were ever it could be provided.. no homeless.. lump sum on getting married to build a house..if that is tyranny what do we live under.. there was no one leaving Libyan shores when he was alive.. yet 2 years after he was murdered they leave by the boat load.. you say Iraq was a disaster ..is that the new name for a war crime against international law.. you seem to justify barbarity when it suits.. you can’t see any fault even though is a crime.. you say early withdrawal is the reason why its a disaster.. as the email scandal is proving it was all based on lies.. why do you think they didn’t bring Saddam to the Hague.. can’t have the truth that Ronald Reagan sold him the chemical weapons that was used on the Kurds… they were meant for the Iranians not the Kurds.. shame on you not calling a spade a spade.. war crimes government toplings are the name of the game for the US…international law doesn’t seem to matter to you when it comes to the US foreign policy.. which is very consistent.. NOT

Davy, read my comments again on Libya’s economy.

I pointed out quite clearly that 80% of Libya’s GDP was related to oil income. It’s very easy to become prosperous when your country happens to sit atop a desperately needed natural resource but the remainder of the Libyan economy was and remains a shambles. Once the oil runs out, Libya has literally no way to pay for anything. It cannot even pay for the massive amount of food the country imports annually without oil revenue.

As I said, a short-term economy with absolutely no long-term prospects.

Again, any actual contributions to make or are you both just going to go for the ad hominem’s?

Jason is the only using actual facts to back up his argument. Not David Icke style facts either.

Honestly, I’ve come to accept that arguing with these people using facts generally doesn’t work. They tend to completely ignore any fact posted which doesn’t already conform to their preconceived notion that America is the sole root of all evil in this world.

The facts are more for others, generally the creepers who read the comments but don’t post so they can see that some of the posters here aren’t completely off their rockers.

Scarce 9 Jutro_ Jason like yourself gets your facts from the Main Stream Media,

http://www.sprottmoney.com/wp-content/uploads/2014/11/birds-planes.jpg

Good assumption John but sadly you’re wrong. I know it’s good for your ego to assume that I’m the blind sheep in this discussion and you are the enlightened one who can see through the dense fog of lies but this is simply not the case.

Unlike you I actually do research on the topic. Economic and social investigations, historical precedents, combat reports, first-hand reports and multiple sources go into the formulation of my opinions and arguments. From you, the only sources I’ve seen are conspiracy sites. Who exactly is the blind one led by propaganda in this saga…

Spot on Ryan probably hasbara too!

Where do you get your reports from jason. you have a point of view that america is great and without fault. others think they have questions to answer. you are to america what patrick j o connor is to Israel. blind defense. American media have generated terror when it comes to supporting the billions and trillions of dollars that flow into war businesses. even though you 10 times more likely to be killed by a cop.

US admin shills share the same bed with Hasbara shills and more than likely they are operating from the same class room.

Joe, I get my reports from various sources. Government sources, NGO’s and any other source I can find when they become available. I then analyse each one for it’s individual merit. Your accusations of me being a blind defender of America are, quite frankly, completely bogus if you’ve ever even bothered to read my comments. The fact that you cannot even do basic research on one person in a comments section before making observations about them is quite telling.

John, I’ve noticed you’ve ceased to provide any constructive commentary and have resorted to the ‘shill’ defence. Does that have anything to do with the fact that every ‘fact’ you’ve posted so far has been torn apart by actual factual evidence to the contrary?

Jason Culligan _ A US Marine F/A-18 Hornet jet just crashed in the UK.

Beat them to it.

I am always on top of the news.

Congratulations John, you completely disregarded the point and deflected from it once again. I’d honestly get a more thought-provoking and engaging discussion from a stone.

Jason Culligan_Arguing with any apologist is like shouting at a brick wall and this also applies to Hasbara trolls .

According to your twisted logic all “evidence” to back claims must come from Western Mainstream Media or else it is not credible.

Western Mainstream Media is nothing more than a Rothschild Zi0nist mouthpiece dictating from the White house

Nice attempt at worming out of your responsibilities to provide factual evidence to back up claims, however your weak excuse won’t hold.

I never said your evidence has to come from Western media, you are making that judgement call. Evidence from any and all sources is acceptable so long as it is factual, relatively unbiased and independently verifiable. The only evidence you’ve provided so far has been baseless, heavily biased and ruled to be unverified by experts.

Now, I’m sure with that in mind you’ll still refuse to back up anything you say with hard evidence.

I’ve NEVER been to the middle East but I’ll never claim to be an expert..just opinionated. – John.