@Mark Scott: given it leads the way on a good cycling system and progressive and safe attitude to cycling its a very good metric.

@Mark Scott: just copy the Dutch , its simples

@Tony Stack: The Dutch have been integrating dedicated cycle lanes into roads since the 1970′s, so to copy the Dutch system we would have to rip up all the roads and start again at huge cost. Whereas a Hi-Vi is a couple of EUR per person.

@Tony Stack: look out your window This isn’t Belgium or the Netherlands. We are subject to Irish bus laws.
Fed up with every counter argument with look what they do over there.

@Brian McDonnell: amazing logic, instead of trying to fix the overall issue, just patch it up…

@Brian McDonnell: hi viz has been shown to make no difference to driver passing distances on cyclists. On fact the opposite seems to be the case. Plus, the Dutch didn’t have to rip up their roads and start again. Neither did the Danes, the Swedes or the Belgians, who have copied the Dutch model. If you think hi viz is the answer, you’re asking the wrong questions.

@James Wallace: It may have no difference on passing distances but it certainly has a difference on visibility. Cyclists should be wearing them, no question about it.

@Tony Stack: I thought you were taking the piss!!

@Padraig Bateman: superior cycling regime overall, but I’ve seen some crazy dangerous layouts in Holland too.

@Elizabeth Hourihane: So we can apply that to all vehicles, hi-viz yellow vehicles should stop the carnage on our roads.

@Brian McDonnell: You advocate shifting the burden and cost of road safety away from the source of danger to the potential victims. Also – there isn’t a shred of evidence that says hi-vis is effective. It’s nothing more than safety theatre.

@Padraig Bateman: I’m looking forward to seeing your evidence that it’s effective. I’m sure you have lots to hand…

@Elizabeth Hourihane: strangely enough you’d think so. A lot of research has been done on this and the empirical evidence suggests that high vis actually doesn’t make you more visible. I can attest that the time I was knocked down, I wearing a high vis and in daylight with my lights on… Nothing will protect you if motorists are not paying attention to their surroundings.

@James Wallace: why is it mandatory for motorcyclit’s then (learners) ? Same Dept, same Govt.

@Elizabeth Hourihane: most of my cycling clothing as high vis built into it. One jacket has high vis as one of the threads in the weave does that count? I suspect it would be too difficult to enforce unless you made everyone wear yellow vests. Which are ridiculous on a road bike as the strips are generally at the wrong angle.

@James Wallace: how do you figure that the dutch only started building more cycling facilities in th 60s as a response to rising car use.

@ed w: where did I say that? I said they didn’t have to dig up their roads and start again, like someone said we would have to. By the way, the Dutch began investing in proper cycling infrastructure as a result of parent power movement, that was a reaction to the numbers of kids being killed by motorists.

@Elizabeth Hourihane: May aswell just scrap Dublin Bikes and the equivalent Cork & Galway ones too, unless people always carry a hi-viz with them in case they might possibly cycle that day.

@Tony O Neill: very generalised there Tony. I cycle, I won’t bite you.

@Al Madzer: in fairness, cyclists that don’t follow the rules don’t scare me. Motorists do though

@Tony O Neill: #triggered

@Tony O Neill: and where would you put them, it’s illegal to cycle on the footpath, if you’d actually read the article?

@Tony O Neill: Ahh just the exact sort of brain dead comment I was expecting when I saw the headline.

@Tony O Neill: “Cyclists should not be allowed on the road”. Where do you think we should go? Do you realise that a very large proportion of cyclists are car owners?
Maybe we should get back in our cars instead and clog up the roads for dimwits like you.

@Tony O Neill: That’s what’s good about this article Tony, the guards will be targeting people with attitudes like you. Be careful out there.

@Al Madzer: I’m in a similar position to you. I have high viz gear, helmet and lights. The lot. As a cyclists and a motorist I would hope that it makes me a more conscientious road user. I know that I can make mistakes like the next person. Enforcement of both road users is the key I think and consistent enforcement at that. We are all trying to get somewhere and hopefully unscathed…..

@Tony O Neill: motorists should not be allowed on the road. They are a nuisance to pedestrians and cyclists. They feel they do not have to follow the rules and must get to their destination without stopping and have no regard for other road users and are also very aggressive if approached. Be careful. They are a danger to society

@Al Madzer: I’d go so far to say a lot of motorists are brutal. How many times have I narrowly missed getting ploughed into at Redmond sq wexford because some dozy idiot is in a hurry or on the phone or slapping the legs off the child in the back or while out cycling on roads drivers nearly slicing my hip off as they get too close. At all times I wear my helmet and Hiviz and I’m a big lump of a guy kinda hard to miss and cycling a white bike. Beggars belief really

@Ben Dromey: copycat!! Plagiarism.

@Tony O Neill: good trolling, fair play.

@Bilbo Baggins: the guards should do their duty and arrest these law breakers

@Tony O Neill: motorists kill over 1 million people every year every year world wide and cyclist are the danger to society? And that’s just road collisions, it doesn’t include the millions who die younger due to the air pollution cased by motorists. Get a grip, man.

@Tony O Neill: How many pedestrians were killed by motorists last year Tony? There’s your menace to pedestrians right there.

@Tony O Neill:
“They are a danger to society”

Who kills the most on roads – drivers or people on bikes…?

@Barra O Brien: I don’t drive, live on the outskirts of Dublin city and either walk or use public transport. I used to cycle until my bike was stolen and haven’t replaced it. I would agree that many cyclists are, indeed, a menace. They weave their way on and off footpaths in busy traffic as if it’s their right and I’m fed up of not being able to walk on a footpath without keeping an eye out for what’s coming from behind. I don’t know what the solution is, but it’s going to become even more of an issue as more and more people take to their bikes without any regard to the rules of the road and other road users and pedestrians.

@Tony O Neill: Drivers should not be allowed on the road. They are a nuisance to pedestrians and motorists and cyclists. They feel they do not have to follow the rules and must get to their destination without stopping and have no regard for other road users and are also very aggressive if approached. Be careful. They are a danger to society.

@Tony O Neill: You look like a BO smelling obese Taxi driver…

@Dotty Dunleary: close…..he’s bus driver for SE. Quite scary that cyclists share the road with him driving a 20 tonne bus.

@Michael Carolan: I hope he loses his bus driving licence.

@Tony O Neill: I agree that *subsection* of motorists who run red lights (as a motorist I witness it at junctions every-single-day) are an enormous danger to all other road users – other motorists, pedestrians crossing, cyclists, motorcyclists.
Hundreds of kilos of metal – scary scary stuff
The Gardaí should be stamping down on it or better yet have cameras that record this activity and take photos of reg no’s

@Tony O Neill:
http://www.stickybottle.com/latest-news/8-times-more-drivers-than-cyclists-caught-breaking-red-lights-in-dublin/

@Tony O Neill: same as a lot of the drivers I see around Dublin too. They’re the ones breaking the rules the most and are more of a danger with a 2 tonne steel Box than any cyclist is.
Your statement is baffling.

@Tony O Neill: ah, our Tony is a “professional” coach driver with Swords Express…..possible THE most dangerous group on the road.

@George O Neill: sure – then be able to fail it – slap an L plate on and still be able to drive/cycle

@Barry Somers: the age they take the test in the Netherlands is seven I think…..

@George O Neill: Where should the certificate of passing this test be displayed by the bicyclist?

@George O Neill: Your troll game is poor.

@Dotty Dunleary: like a driving license, it would be illegal for you not to produce it upon request by a Garda I guess

@davey boy: I don’t agree it’s not too bad

@George O Neill: because that system works so well for motorists that we don’t need fines or penalty points at all

@The Prancing Stag: totally unworkable…

@Dotty Dunleary: why?

@George O Neill: Did that when I learned to drive. What year did you do your test George? Before or after the theory test?

@Barry Somers: in the Netherlands children start bike and road regulation lessons in school at age 5. By 8 they’re cycling to school trips. Road safety is indoctrinated into them from an early age. They take the test in their last year of primary school. “In the Netherlands, all children in their last year of primary school must take two tests to earn a bike diploma. First, they sit for a multiple-choice exam on the rules of the road. Then, they head to the streets for a real-world biking test on a course that winds through traffic. The bike diploma is one of the reasons about half of all people in the Netherlands ride a bicycle at least once per day.”
https://www.bostonglobe.com/2013/09/21/how-much-you-know-about-bike-safety/wBwlu3gHDVl32kqxf0ndDN/story.html

@Barry Somers: brilliant lolol

@GClare: I’m not doing your Google searches for you!

@George O Neill: I’ve no argument with that in principle, but passing “road theory tests” doesn’t make every motorist a good driver / exhibit awareness or adhere to the rules of the road does it? Be honest now George.

@George O Neill: Doesn’t seem to work for drivers.

It’s been shown that forcing motorists to wear helmets reduces injury far more than with cyclists. You’re right Mark, if we’re serious about safety then every car should be fitted with 5 helmets that are compulsary to wear, same as seat belts.

Then we can start talking about cyclists’ helmets.

@Dara O’Brien: Dara, good for you. You are not obliged to stand in and yet you do it. I also walk and run a bit and I also stand in when a car is coming because with the standard of driving I see, I am too scared not to stand in. Cycling is different, whilst a stop might be a welcome break for a runner or a walker, it’s just not safe or practical to pull in a bike when a car comes but is sometimes the only way. There are a lot of inconsiderate cyclists out there but the they don’t pose the same danger as inconsiderate motorists.

@Dara O’Brien: Sorry, but by and large that’s rubbish! “pulling in and yielding to faster moving traffic”

If when out on a bicycle I did that i’d never get home from all the stopping!

Besides, I don’t see city drivers pull in and clear out of my way when i’m cycling at 25kph and they are stopped or doing 15kph

@Bat Daly: I play two sports , don’t smoke. Jog regularly whilst wearing a hi visibility top. Actually praised a cyclist for having a wing mirror in my comment. Don’t c why a cyclist should have less safety equipment or training that a motorcyclist.

@Dara O’Brien: Motorists do not have equal rights to be on the road, they have to be licensed , which may be revoked , Cyclists legally have more rights to be on the road than motorists.

@JayK: do you seriously believe someone driving a car needs a helmet more than someone on a bike? Get a grip.

@MarkSul: “Don’t c why a cyclist should have less safety equipment or training that a motorcyclist.”

Are you saying that a motorcyclist on say a Sport bike with 150bhp available at the twist of the wrist and a capability of doing about 260 kph is the same as someone on a bicycle weighing 8kg and 0.1hp??

@MarkSul: Maybe you should get one?

A 2006 study showed that “280,000 people in the U.S. receive a motor vehicle induced traumatic brain injury every year” so you would think that wearing a helmet while driving would be commonplace. Race car drivers wear helmets. But since almost no one wears a helmet while driving a regular car, you probably fear that if you wore one you would look silly, attract the notice of the police for driving while weird, or the attention of another driver who took your safety attire as a challenge. (Car drivers are more likely to hit bicyclists who wear helmets.)

@MarkSul: I agree there has to be an effort on everyone to be safe. I wear bright clothing to help being seen. The reason I am against mandatory hi viz etc is because I don’t agree with anything that helps dumb down the level of driving skills a motorist should have. It would be a travesty if a motorist was absolved for killing a cyclist just for not wearing hi viz. There are many hazards at night on the roads, dogs, wildlife etc . You are expected to see them whether they are highly visible or not. It’s called driving with due care and attention.

@Dotty Dunleary: helmet (ok not a full motor bike one) lights, visibility top and knowledge of the rules of the road ya.

@Dotty Dunleary: if I’m in a crash with a cyclist because some other driver clips him on a roundabout and he lands in front of my car and gets a belt in head I won’t be going to hospital, the cyclist will. Surely suggesting compulsory helmets for cyclists on a major roads inst a bad idea? Never said they shouldn’t b on the road.

@MarkSul: A piece of foam and plastic cycle helmet is designed to stop more serious injuries from a low speed impact with the ground, not from stopping Mr. Car or Truck driver from rolling over someone’s head…

You should really Google these things before coming on here..

@Dotty Dunleary: go away your just being a troll. Your right tho, no helmet will never save someone’s life. Tell all d lads on the Tour de France not to bother.

@MarkSul: When you can’t raise a sensible logical counter argument in a debate then you should call the other commentator a Troll. And sprout some nonsense about a French bike race….

Come back when you start to have a little tiny bit of a clue of what you’re trying to talk about…

@Dotty Dunleary: do I need a counter argument for people not wearing helmets?

@Bat Daly: I live in an rural area, I work shift, leave when its dark and back when its dark, iv seen (just about) cyclist in all black gear in wet/ misty conditions. Anything that helps me and other divers see cyclists as early as possible should be encouraged if not enforced.

@MarkSul: See not c, motorbikes can hit speeds that cyclists never reach and easily kill the rider or pedestrians

@MarkSul: are you comparing cyclist in the Tour De France who can hit top speeds of 90 kmh with the grandmother who cycles down to the shop for a pint of milk? One is a high risk activity, the other isn’t.

@IrishSportives.ie: no I’m not on about speeds, I’m on about the damage a cyclist can take from a fall. Helmets can only help, but apparently not.

@IrishSportives.ie: and fair play to your grandmother for being so active. Good for her

@Bat Daly: Why do you think people who want better road awareness and safety for all are Neanderthals? Are you honestly suggesting some cyclists don’t adhere to the rules of the road? There are bad drivers on the road, there are also irresponsible, reckless cyclists who act like they’re in the Tour de France and own the footpaths as well as the road.

Mark, it’s a fact that forcing people in cars to wear helmets will cause a much, much larger reduction in head injuries than making cyclists wear helmets.

Do you not care about safety? I thought wanted to reduce injuries? Because if you oppose compulsory car helmets then it seems your point is actually incoherent. That you’re actually just waffling about something you don’t really understand at all.

@MarkSul: It sounds like a good idea, but they really don’t protect the brain from serious impact.
Also, let’s face it, cyclists in traffic have to be agile and keep their wits about them. It’s worth considering that a helmet can restrict your field of vision.

@Bat Daly: good points

@EillieEs: I think you are being a bit reductive and lumping a subset of the occasional/ casual cyclist type (who cycles on footpaths without giving a shit, etc) together with serious road bike users who in fairness you’ll never see doing that.

@MarkSul: So, in your scenario we have not just one, but two, drivers trying to kill a cyclist.

@MarkSul: How about drivers take some responsibility and use their mirrors and look around before entering and leaving lanes and before opening doors onto cyclelanes!

@sue: I have yet to see one cycling club that allows more the two abreast and I have never seen someone with out a helmet on the big club spins. It just doesn’t happen. I will agree that I can’t understand cycling wearing all black, we even changed our club jersey so get a bright colour on the back so we could be seen. And unless the sun is splitting the stones i use front and back lights during the day. The cyclists you see are newbies who just haven’t a clue.

You were taught a wrong and dangerous thing then Sue. It’s safer to cycle two abreast. If you really care about safety then I assume you support that?

Or do you not care about safety at all and you’re just having a selfish whinge?

@sue: If your knowledge of road safety is based on what you learned back in the 70′s then I suggest you go look up RSA.ie and check the latest rules of the road…

@Tony Stack: I was giving you the benefit of the doubt before I saw this comment.

@davey boy: I’ve met cyclists five abreast on country roads. These cycling clubs act like they just bought the roads.

@willow moon: Every day local roads are clogged with cars causing tailback and traffic jams, a lot of these cars are black or dark colours, they should all be hiviz so that they are easy to see.

@davey boy: clubs are only a % of cycle traffic. There’s a huge amount of ‘spins’ at weekends that follow no rules.

@sue: Nobody cycles 3/4 abreast, cycling clubs promote safe cycling. It is perfectly legal to cycle 2 abreast and makes it easier to overtake.

@willow moon: Spot on! How many of these weekend warriors know the Rules of the Road? And how many have roadworthy bikes, i.e. with reflectors and bell?
I am a cyclist and they annoy me.

@Barry Somers: Yep, that’s what I mentioned as well. Such a money-making opportunity for clamping companies yet none of them seem to bother!

@Mickey Finn: and all cars should be painted with hi-viz paint

@Mickey Finn: in the dark, cyclists are required to have lights. Same as cars and motorbikes. That should be enough. Demanding them to be draped in hi-viz is akin to having every car painted hi-viz.

@Barry Somers: all cyclists and pedestrians should wear hi viz. I realise this plays havoc with your fashion sense but it’s probably better to be easily seen. If you’ve ever driven a country road at night and met a pedestrian without one you’d appreciate the idea is sound.

@Bat Daly: we all have a responsibility to keep ourselves safe on the road. There’s no passing the buck when it comes to safety.

@Bat Daly: excluding for footpaths, you as a pedestrian you have a duty of care to not only yourself, but to your family and even drivers to not put you or them at risk. You are basically abdicating responsibility when you have an input. That’s just ignorant.

@Mickey Finn: exactly I was pulling out from the side of the road the other day. I nearly dropped my phone when this cyclist nipped past my bumper shouting something about me being in a cycle lane. Cheek of him. Idiot
If he’d been wearing a hi-viz gilet jaune, I might have at least caught a brief glimpse of him in the side view mirror whilst texting my buddy