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THOSE WHO HAVE not paid their Irish Water bills may still owe money, even if the utility is scrapped under any plan by the next government, Fianna Fáil warned today.
The party’s transport spokesperson Timmy Dooley told RTÉ News at One that charges imposed by Irish Water are legal and may not be retrospectively cancelled under law.
If or when a law is enacted to abolish charges, those who have not paid may still owe the money, he explained.
His party is currently in the final stages of drafting a new law to scrap Irish Water and suspend water charges.
He said – if enacted – it will “bring an end to the charges from that point forward”.
Dooley added that he did not expect people to be fined for not paying, but assumes there would still be a remaining outstanding debt.
On the staffing question, he said some Irish Water employees would be offered a redundancy plan, while others would be transferred back to the local authorities. He conceded that there may be a number “surplus to requirements” who could be laid off.
While talks to form the next government continue, other parties are also discussing what to do with their Irish Water-induced headaches.
Sinn Féin has proposed that an independent commission be set up to examine the best way to deliver water services.
What to do with Irish Water
Gerry Adams today said his party’s proposed commission would operate under “strict terms of reference” to prevent it from making certain findings.
He argued that it would not be allowed to return a finding that the best model is the one that currently exists under the Irish Water brand.
“They cannot do that,” he said, adding that the commission would be given specific terms of reference to work with.
It can’t if it’s given terms of reference, which I have just outlined. All these commissions, all of these bodies which are set up to do certain jobs of work are given terms of reference. So the terms of reference are ‘what’s the best public model for ownership of water and for water as a human right’.
He said the commission could not return a recommendation that Irish Water should be kept and said his party would not support any finding that charges should be higher than those already in place.
Scrapping water charges
Adams reiterated Sinn Féin’s wish to scrap water charges completely.
We are firmly of the view that you’re charged for water already. The second charge that came out of a little deal the government did with the Troika.
He compared his party’s vision for the operation of the commission as being much like a ‘kitchen conversion’.
“I don’t know what you guys don’t understand. If you ask me to do a job of work, whatever it is, you want to convert my kitchen, right. You give me the terms of reference, you tell me the type of kitchen you want. You tell me the price you want and so forth. And I’m obliged to go and honour that. I don’t go and make your kitchen into a dining room.”
Respect the findings
Earlier, Sinn Féin TD Eoin Ó’Broin told RTÉ’s This Week programme that he did not believe the commission would return a finding that Irish Water should remain in its current existence.
However, he acknowledged that if an independent commission is set up to look at the best model of water service supply, then there is a “responsibility to accept its recommendations when they come back”.
Pearse Doherty weighed in on the discussion on RTÉ’s News at One programme stating that it has long been his party’s stance that they are opposed to water charges and are in favour of their abolition.
He said the terms of reference would look at the best model for the governance of the utility, how to make it accountable to the Dáil and what type of board would be in operation.
How a water services utility would operate
“The idea it would work outside its terms of reference and that we would reintroduce water charges is just laughable,” he said.
Doherty said his party has legislation ready to go that would abolish water charges, but says it cannot be tabled yet. He asked Fianna Fáil to support the motion so the issue “can be dealt with once and for all”.
In terms of Sinn Féin supporting Fianna Fáil’s bill to scrap Irish Water and suspend water charges, Adams said Fianna Fáil’s plan does not go far enough.
Adams said he wanted to see the detail in the plan. “They are playing catch up with us on this issue,” he said.
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Interest rates have reached a level that makes borrowing to grow employment giving investment impossible.
@thomas molloy: Interest rates have been much higher in the past. At one point in the 90s, rates were in the mid-teens.
The low interest rates we have experienced over the past decade or so are an anomaly, in historical terms.
They will claim that they have achieved their objective in that inflation has reduced. They cannot see that their hiking of rates contributed to the inflation rate rise.
@Pato: ehhhhhhhh no.
@Pato: Explain.because everyone else will disagree with you.
@Pato: Please do explain
@Donal McCarthy: I think Pato is largely correct.
Inflation can be caused by two things:
1) A shortage of some goods, or service
2) A surfeit of money in an economy
As I understand it, the inflation we experienced – and are still experiencing – was due to (a contrived) shortage. A shortage in energy, driving up fuel and electricity prices, which then fed into everything else. This was preceded by another shortage caused by the Corona virus pandemic shutting down lots of manufacturing, particularly in China – the so-called supply chain shortages.
The way to address inflation caused by too much money in the economy is to remove some of that money. Increasing interest rates is one way to do that.
However, increasing interest rates will not bring down the cost of electricity.
Or petrol.
When the (major) cause of our inflation is the profiteering of energy companies, increasing interest rates just puts more cost onto all of us, including businesses. Which can only recoup those additional costs by increasing their prices.
Which adds to inflation.
The best way to address such profiteering by the oil (and gas, and associated energy) companies would have been a windfall tax.
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: pato stated that the interest rate rises caused the inflation which was incorrect. yes energy prices and supply chain issues were minor contributory factors, but the primary factor was 10 years of free money, which was then acclerated into turbo over drive during covid when physical money supply in the US and EU increased by near 50%. There were 50% more dollars/euros in peoples back accounts after covid then before covid. I do not believe we will see near zero interest rates for some time. I believe it will remain between 2-3% for the very reason that this new money had to be extracted out of the economy and it needs to stay there otherwise it will result in another cycle of inflation.
@Niall English: No, Pato did not say that.
Pato said that raising interest rates “contributed to the inflation rate rise.”
Which is correct, in my view.
Bitcoin fixes Central Bank Ponzi Schemes
@Snacktoshi Nachomoto: how?
@Snacktoshi Nachomoto: anyone who buys crypto currency is a fool and typically didn’t study business subjects in school. The government and central banks decide what Currency we use whether that may involve digital euro. Profiting from digital euro is foolish.
@Snacktoshi Nachomoto: I’m afraid you are not as well informed as you may think. Bitcoin is the real ponzi scheme.
@Snacktoshi Nachomoto: bitcoin is the currency of crooks
@Liam Clifden: but maybe the worst performing in 2022, so what’s your point??
@Liam Clifden: Actually that’s a lie, xrp has preformed better than bitcoin and that’s with a court case hanging over it head, xrp is up over 50 percent from its bottom this year, bitcoin isn’t up over 50 percent from its bottom this year,
@Liam Clifden: bitcoin has zero intrinsic value. people like yourself are pursuant to the greater f00l theory. in order to profit, you need to find a bigger f00l to buy it at a higher price.
Control the money control the people
Great news. And well done central bankers. A solid victory over the ever populist economists.
@Itwaslikethatwhenigothere:
I don’t think you’re correct in relation to a windfall tax. Windfall taxes do nothing to protect against profiteering, they simply allow the state to increase their tax take.
Consider this. Company A usually makes profits of €100m and pays 12.5% tax on this. So they net 87.5m
Now they increase their prices and their income doubles to €200m – the government introduce a windfall tax of 20% on profits in excess of 100m so they now net 87.5m on the first 100m and 80m on the second 100m – net profits have increased to 167.5m – why would that entice them to reduce prices?
Even if the windfall tax was 50% – there is still no incentive to reduce as 50% of something is better than 100% of nothing. The only winner here is the exchequer.
If you want to limit profiteering then a price cap is the only way it could work. Windfall taxes are ineffectual.
@Liam Clifden: Bernie Madoffs Ponzi scheme was running for 17 years…
Happy Christmas from the European Central Bank
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