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HOUSING CHARITY THRESHOLD is calling for a change in legislation to protect tenants after reports of landlords asking for viewing fees.
Agents working at the housing charity have recently received phone calls from people querying the practice.
In one case, a young woman requested advice from Threshold.
The woman expressed an interest in viewing a property. She then received a phone call from an agency and was told that she had been invited to view the property that afternoon – but that she’d have to pay a €500 fee.
According to Threshold, the woman was told that this was a requirement of anyone hoping to view this property.
If she was not in a position to pay this fee then she’d not be able to view.
Stephen Large of Threshold says that landlords and agencies requesting viewing fees is becoming more common.
Increasingly, he says, Threshold is seeing “further barriers” that prevent people from accessing accommodation.
Current demand on the Irish rental market means people have very few options, says Large.
Although now we have legislation in place people don’t have options. The bar has never been lower.
Landlords and agencies do screen prospective tenants at times, says Large. “But you can see that some of what they’re asking is excessive”.
Large says that at the moment there’s no legislation preventing landlords and agencies asking for fees prior to property viewings.
It’s a grey area. It’s an area that’s open to abuse and has been abused. There is room there for exploitation.
In another case reported to Threshold, a woman seeking a HAP tenancy was required to pay a €300 deposit to an agency.
After being informed that the property was above the HAP limit, the woman could not sign a lease. The agency, however, refused to refund her money.
Students
In some cases, students have paid landlords money up front before viewing a property, according to Colm O’Halloran of the Union of Students in Ireland (USI).
O’Halloran says that some students have been asked for deposits or fees once they have viewed a property and expressed an interest in it.
But it’s ridiculous that a landlord is charging somebody to just show them around the place.
O’Halloran says that some students have no choice, however.
They’re looking desperately for a place, the term’s just about to start and often they feel under pressure.
Another case reported to Threshold concerned a man who was asked by a landlord for his PPSN, a copy of his passport, confirmation of employment, his employment history and his salary details before viewing a property.
The man was also asked for a €150 viewing fee.
Landlords asking for fees like non-refundable deposits or viewing fees do so to “filter out” potential tenants, says Threshold’s Large.
Non-refundable deposits are becoming more and more commonplace in the rental market, says Large.
But these, and viewing fees, are discriminatory, he says.
It affects everyone. But if you’re dependent on HAP (Housing Assistant Payment) or if you’re not working then you’re automatically disadvantaged or discarded.
Clearer definitions of what landlords can and cannot request of prospective tenants is needed, says Large. “Therefore the consumer will know.”
However, this would need to be regularised and enforced, says Large.
Stephen Faughnan, chair of the Irish Property Owners’ Association (IPOA), says that asking people to pay to see a property is “a disgrace”.
Faughnan says that standard landlord practice involves a landlord advertising a property and people coming to view it.
There’s no such thing as charging. There’s no such thing as presenting documents until a person shows an interest in a property. There may not be regulations but that’s best practice.
The Residential Tenancies Board (RTB) says that it has not received reports about landlords charging for property viewings but recommends that people only hand over money “when they are happy with the property and the terms and conditions of the letting”.
This article was updated at 11:05pm on Wednesday 17 October following additional information provided by charity Threshold.
Since the article’s publication, Threshold has reviewed its case files.
The charity has said that it incorrectly characterised upfront monetary requirement as a ‘viewing fee’.
Anecdotally the term ‘viewing fee’ has been used by Threshold callers.
However, Threshold’s client records only refer to upfront booking deposits and more limited references to non-refundable booking fees, the charity has said.
‘Threshold wishes to apologise for the lack of clarity and any public mis-information arising around the concept of a ‘viewing fee’ being a growing phenomenon.”
This should be illegal and landlords should be named & shamed
@Martin Sinnott: this plan assumes they feel shame.
@Martin Sinnott: Let’s hope this is fake news as it may well be. A person with the intention of taking the property to let if it suited would be wise to bring a deposit with them to secure it, and might be advised to do so. Twisting an assurance of this into a sensationalist story as above would not be beyond the behaviour of the angst, click crazy fake news media.
@Tom Molloy: it says fairly clearly that this is a new phenomenon though Tom, with multiple recent calls. It’s standard practice that you have your deposit and first months rent sometimes both sums x1.5 so the 500$ wouldn’t add up to even the deposit. I’d suspect that this is anything but sensationalist given the desperation ppl are experiencing. These vampire landlords see an opening for more cash money.
@Bruce van der Gutschmitzer: but not a single complaint to prtb, hardly a phenomenon. Click bait nonsense based on here say.
@Carpentoza: Typically you’d hear from threshold first though. PRTB deals with the complaints themselves. Be interesting to hear what they have to say if questioned on the matter. If threshold are talking about this I’d listen.
@Tom Molloy: wow, the landlord lobby are out in force this morning
@Carpentoza: the PRTB only deal with complaints/ disputes from tenants in active residence with the problem landlord, hence why at the stage of the above problems, they would not be resident at the premises mentioned, unlike Threshold, who do.
@Bruce van der Gutschmitzer: if you want to hear what the PRTB have to say I’d suggest you read the full article before commenting as their position is stated towards the end of the article
@Carpentoza: PRTB only deal with registered tenancies. These people have not even been accepted for a tenancy, never mind registered one. Which means you are either dismissing the claims without knowing the full information in these cases or you do not know what the PRTB actually does.
@Martin Sinnott: why should it be illegal?
@Stephen Carroll: Some sound like they’re raging that they never thought of doing it.
@Martin Sinnott: How do you get around the state law that landlords cannot refuse rent supplement?
Introduce a fee which is immediately discriminatory, cutting out the poor from gaining an equal chance to gain a roof over their head.
@Vocal Outrage: ya missed that bit at the end. Regardless, my stance still stands. #alliterationoverload
@Bruce van der Gutschmitzer: The problem is if you are a person needing HAP assistance you will not have all the deposit and first months rent up front so these desperate people will be left out of the rental market.
@Martin Sinnott: also estate agents,they seem to be getting away with murder these days,I had a tradesman working on my house,which I rent and keep pristine,but told me that some of the slums he worked in belonging to the same agent?
@Charliegrl80: And this is one of the greatest problems with HAP. It is paid in arrears unlike private rentals. The HAP is discriminatory against landlords with councils taking forever to process applications ,able to cut off rent on whim but won’t discuss it with the landlord. In todays market any landlord would be mad to accept HAP. Its more work, more hassle for no extra gain and a higher risk of non payment.
Charging fees to view a property is ridiculous but I wonder how widespread it is. I never heard of it before . Just because somebody rings Threshold, an organisation with an anti-landlord agenda does n’t mean its true. I would prefer to see figures with proof rather than listening to the rumour mill.
I can see how it would separate the wheat from the chaff though and I’m sure it would cut down on time wasters but its totally wrong.
I would love to know if people have actually paid this fee and if they did were they successful in getting the property
@Tom Molloy: I’ve stopped having sympathy for the mammy daddy landlord. They invest in property to up their percrntage return on savings. There is no real value in a fixed asset unlike a tech start up or suchlike that actually creates real value in our society. If the return from a pension fund is not enough let them get into true venture capitalism and take the rough with the smooth.
@Brian Ó Dálaigh: if you read the article Brian the prtb have not heard of this and it certainly can be raised once a viewing turns into a tenancy.
Threshold are partisan and increasing more anti landlord. The truth or how much this is happening doesn’t matter anymore they seem to use all available here-say. Their role is too important to be acting like that
@Martin Sinnott: Fat chance …the FG’s support this and will give them a fat tax break in the next budget
@Stephen Carroll: Actually I am advising would be tenant in a scares market how to capture the place with a holding deposit and not miss out on a place they like.
This country is completely and utterly and totally out of control. Everyday we read about the latest con or scam to extract more and more from the ordinary Irish person.
@David Corrigan: you can’t beat the Irish for scamming people. Once money is involved we’ve no problem screwing over everyone else.
Has anybody seriously seen this kind of carry on in any other country in the world?
Amazing how in Ireland how homes and housing have become cash cows for the rich and the government just sits on its hands and does nothing. Just what are they actually governing?
Shortage of accommodation, ever increasing prices for rental and buying properties, hospital over crowding just to name a few ongoing issues and the best that the government can do is to everything on their advisors or saying that they were not aware of things that happened within their departments or portfolios and constantly saying that the can’t do this and can’t do that. Either that or they have no recollection of past events or meetings that hey may have had in the past. Nothing is ever their fault.
Accountability and responsibility are foreign words for most of the countries leadership.
@David Corrigan: ha, we’re just baby america, f yeah.
@Jay Coleman: the government are the best teachers
@George Vladisavljevic: I’ve heard it’s common in London.
Seriously, we need to start mass protesting. The is a bigger issue than Irish water was and there has not been a single march. We’re getting fu%$ed as citizens and were all just sitting here taking it and telling everyone else how bad it feels
@Michael Bodycoach: there was a march last week!!! Look up raise the roof. Some of us have been involved in raising awareness for quite some time now.
@Michael Bodycoach: off you go and organise it then
@Michael Bodycoach: there have been several marches. Raise The Roof organise them. Get up off your arse and join in instead of giving out
@Michael Bodycoach: maybe a lot of us can’t stomach been associated with. The. Irish water mob
To be honest, and I say this as a tenant, I’d be against bringing legislation to prevent this. Instead, and its a novel idea I know, lets just build more homes.
Further interference in a free market restricts the market. Yes there’s a shortage, but its a free market. Interference ups costs. Look at our building regulations. If you are homeless, or in an expensive rental, you couldn’t give a fiddler’s if the bedroom faces south, or has dual aspect. You just want 4 walls and a roof and is affordable.
I live in an apartment in Dublin 18, the building is 4 floors high. No-one in Georgian Dublin would be affected if it was 12 floors high. We need to build up, otherwise by 2050, the Dublin subarbs will be in Mayo.
@denartha: we have f all interference in the free market. For decades all we’ve had was incentives for developers and property speculators . We need to build affordable housing. If we did it when we had holes in our pockets as a country why can’t we do it today. Sole reason the poxy free market , neo liberal idea that private capitalism solved all ills. It doesn’t and shouldn’t be in certain sectors. Speculation on roofs over heads is one and should be regulated properly.
@JustOneScoop: Your first two sentences contradict each other
@denartha: “further interference in the free market”. What Ireland do you live in? This is precisely what happens when a government lets the “free market ” do what it wants. Property developers have no interest in “building up”, they have an interest in maximising their profits, which our light touch regulations allows them to do with land hoarding, raising demand by restricting supply, cosmetic upgrades masquerading as “improvements”, and being able to convert any old shed, to space between a shed and a wall, into a “studio apartment” and charging 800 a month for it.
Literally the only building restriction Dublin has is the skyline limit, and you’re blaming this for the shortage and price gouging going on? No, this is Capitalism 101. If the government won’t compete with the privateers by building housing, then no one will. The Neoliberal answer to this issue has failed.
@Dow Dubrov: alright then:
For decades all we’ve done is encourage and inflate the free market, and look where it got us.
@denartha: This is interference in the market; it is imposing a financial barrier to entry.
@James Doyle: they seem to have built hundreds of thousands of houses, of various sizes, in all areas as a result of a free market. there was corruption in zoning, which was interference, but in general they have built all the houses you see today, and the 30k currently being built will free up more older houses to reduce costs. that’s the way the market works. ask yourself: was your house built by the state, or a developer?
@James Doyle: James. Building up would allow developers to increase profits and also supply
@Dick Face: “Well, sir, there’s nothin’ on Earth like a genuine bona-fide electrified six-car monorail!”
@denartha: I was just listening to David McWilliams speaking on the BlindBoy podcast about the housing crisis. He explains the root problem as he sees it and suggests solutions. The problems he identifies is land hoarding and dereliction.
Land owners are hoarding the land they have and this is a big problem. Also if you look above the shop fronts in Dublin city you’ll see a lot of empty building space. This dereliction should come at a cost. The government needs to punish bad behaviour and reward good behaviour. Incentivise.
@JustOneScoop: The current government has done nothing but interfere with the free market. Introduction of rent pressure zones, rent caps, enforcement of HAP. None of it has worked. It’s economics 101. Interference in an effort to control a capitalistic market makes the situation worse. Landlords (including myself) are selling up in their droves and it’s been going under the radar. Has it occurred to you that the rental situation has been inflamed by the fact that the number of available rental units is rapidly dropping as a result? It’s not for no reason that FFG are now frantically back peddling, trying to repair the damage already done from market interference, by now introducing budget tax breaks. To little too late. Time to stop demonizing landlords. They provide a valuable service.
@Paul Heffernan: where you sent here by the devil?
@denartha: the problem is too that th more the government and prtb try to restrict the free market that rental should be the more landlords will sell up and leave the business. Thus depleting further the stock of housing. Landlords are having to find novel ways of making ends meet and ensure the safety of their property and the viability of their business. Nobody cared during the recession when the government imposed Draconian measures on landlords at a time when rents were plummeting. Many had to leave the market and are still paying for it now. Others are only beginning to break even after a disastrous 10 years.
@denartha: from reading your post I’m not quite certain you understand what the free market means..
If there is nothing illegal about this practice then there should be no problem naming the Agencies and landlords engaged in it.
@John Campbell: How about this Journal?
Greed is an unbelievable thing with these people
@Mr Mystery: just accept the €500 fee and charge them €600 for your time and presence plus €50 administration fees.
@Steven Fitzpatrick: there’s a key turning fee of €20 and €15 for any electric used, if they use the toilet it’s €5!!
FG/FF seem to be letting this happen with no regard for people. and are working for the landlord/vulture fund class. we need a big change in who represents us in government.
@Sean Conway: Who do you suggest ?
@Philip Morgan: ANYONE would be an improvement.
@angryDuck: ‘anyone’ includes venal hogs such as the Healy-Raes. It’s bad enough that they’re in the Dail at all.
Such properties should be instantly targeted for ‘occupation’ – and the Gardai instructed to leave any subsequent bailiff team out on their own.
@Michael Kavanagh: it’s getting to the point where law breaking is justified.
If an agent or landlord asked me for a ‘viewing fee’, they would be calling a glazer the next day.
The government created this situation by leaving housing open to private industry. Greed will abound. Money is the driving factor. People are being fleeced.
Social housing done more than house those who could not afford private housing. It kept the market in housing and rent in check, stopped it boiling over to the extent that’s now going on.
But this is the neoliberal way.
What free market? There is no free market!
If there was a true free market we would see 10+ floor buildings all over the place.
The market is in fact very highly regulated, and often to the extent where due to regulations it simply cannot make any profits thus resulting in housing shortage.
And how exactly will building more free houses for the unemployed will help someone on a 30K salary?
@Termaz Fx: “Free houses”? The so called “market” is rigged. A free market doesn’t mean high rise buildings.
“Highly regulated”? Regulation has no part in neoliberal dogma.
@Termaz Fx: because anyone on a salary under 35k can apply for social housing..
@Katie Murphy: Exactly. I am fed up with people pushing propaganda about social housing being free housing, as if everyone who is unhappy with the absolute state of the housing situation in Ireland wants to be unemployed and have a free house. No, most work and have families and just want some security.
I’ve never heard of this practice of charging a viewing fee but if one landlord does it EVER let’s do an article about it and generate the necessary outrage. You would have to question the intelligence of a prospective tenant that would be willing to hand over five hundred to view a property.
@Sean: Would you have to question their intelligence or their desperation? Also if you read the article there was more than one instance mentioned in this article alone. You are one callous individual.
@Diarmuid Hunt: if you’ve saved hard to raise a deposit up for somewhere to live then nobody in their right mind would hand over 500 euro to view a place..no matter how desperate you are .
@Siobhán Ni Mhurchú: When is the last time you tried to rent a house? I’m lucky renting in the same.e place for 4 years, haven’t had to go looking in the current mess.
@Sean: it doesn’t say that anyone handed over 500 or any amount to view a property anywhere
@Brianto: The 500 figure is mentioned in the subheading of the article. Further down the page a woman pays 300 to view a property and this money is not returned to her. There is also a mention of a man being requested to pay 150.
@Sean: Yes 500 is mentioned but not handed over as Brianto clarified for you…
@Diarmuid Hunt: if nobody is handing over any money then why is it a problem?
@Sean: Nobody is handing over 500 euro, the other figures were handed over, do you need every detail explained?
@Diarmuid Hunt: you’re being very obstreperous there now Diarmuid.
@Sean: Had to look it up, thanks for teaching it to me, I wouldn’t have to be obstreperous if you didn’t keep making ill-informed comments.
Keep the recovery going..
@Willy Mc Caul: pay the landlord by cheque
Report if cash only stipulation
Ask for receipt
@Willy Mc Caul: pay the landlord by cheque
Report if cash only stipulation
Ask for receipt
Cancel cheque of place not for you
Sounds like an idea from the FG party
Politicians who are also landlords need to removed from any debate and vote on any issues to with the rental market.
A name and shame list of agencies and landlords who resort to despicable practice like this should be generated with bans from operating as a landlord being introduced.
@Jesus Christ: what?? And how exactly do you think they could fleece the public? Explain yourself jeebus.
Walk away. This approach doesn’t suggest a trustworthy landlord.
you cannot beat the ingenuity of Irish people to screw over their fellow citizen. It is endemic in our genes and not to admit it is to deny who we are as a people. What separates us from Nigerians is colour…
How on earth is this legal? What an absolutely bonkers country.
Looks like the auctioneers are looking to make money off buyer and seller…….
As a landlord, I can’t imagine doing this, or how it would serve any purpose.
my guess is that these are cash landlords still outside the system. If they don’t get reported, the RTB won’t know they exist
Disgusting scam. This is an abuse that needs a quick remedy.
Should publish a list of agents and landlords who are charging a viewing fee. Shame them!
Just when they said it couldn’t get any worse
Disgusting carry on. Pure taking advantage of people …these people should be ashamed. Roll on all the new builds and watch the landlords struggle then.
You could find some landlords making more money out of viewings than really renting. . . . Put the wee apartment up at the start of the month; get a handful of charged viewings. Decide to take it off the market and then repeat the next month.
Someone needs to do more investigation in to this. The details are too scant in this article. Let’s see if the other outlets pick it up.
If it is found to be a growing practice, perhaps a good idea would be to set up a website, link the the property from Daft and name the agency. People can then make a decision to use them, boycott them, whatever.
Difficult to police, I know, but just an idea!
Any properties requesting viewing fees should be torched, and the property owner publicly flogged for being a cuunt!!
Something not quite right here ,maybe the reason was that particular Tennant or Tennant’s were not wanted .I am not saying it’s right but I suppose it’s a way of discouragement everything is upside down at the moment
How do you get around the state law that landlords cannot refuse rent supplement?
Introduce a fee which is immediately discriminatory, cutting out the poor from gaining an equal chance to gain a roof over their head.
Truly frightening development
Would these be the same landlords who have just recived 100% mortgage interest relief in the budget?
Pay per View –
Stop voting for FF FG LAB
Scandal after scandal with this disgraceful FG and FF government get them out
Disgusting behaviour
A person with the intention of taking the property to let if it suited would be wise to bring a deposit with them to secure it, and might be advised to do so. Twisting an assurance of this into a sensationalist story as above would not be beyond the behaviour of the angst, click crazy fake news media.
@Tom Molloy: sensationalist…. Wake up you absolute Mong. This IS happening.
@Tom Molloy: This isn’t about bringing your deposit with you, that’s something that has been common practice for a while now.
@Tom Molloy: you need to brush up on your comprehension skills.
have they no shame? Modern Ireland, totally polarised society. Returning to the days of the tenant without any right s . Ireland is getting ripe for revolution
500 to have a look why would u rent it out at all 10 a week youd be laughing this is Beyond ridiculous next thing car dealers will be charging or test drives
Hopefully this isn’t true but if it is then it’s pure greed and if people are asked to pay this to view a property then everyone should say no and they will quickly change their way when no one is viewing the property and they should be named and shamed on every social media site going
A Jazus this is getting ridiculous, has property world gone quite mad
If Fine Gael knew that before the budget they would have put a set fee for the poor Landlords
Charles Stewart Parnell is rolling in his grave.
How can the country of the land league and the three F’s of tenants rights be allowing this nonsense to happen again ? Has much changed since Black ’47?
Time for a new land league movement in Ireland.
Oliver Goldsmith and the deserted village, Yeats and drying the marrow to the bone fumbling fingers in a greasy till, John B. Keane and the Field.
This country hasn’t changed. New Politics? It’s as bad as ever.
Miserable state of affairs. I hope they all lose they’re overly expensive extra income.
GREED
Start organising people its going to get worse. This government have lost control of their own greedy pals. Time for some violence.
@Brian harris: I would have disagreed with this sentiment a while back but things are now out of control and whilst violence may be a step too far i think widespread civil disobedience is now called for. We can’t make ends meet anymore despite us both being in full time employment and our media and the governments PR people continue to push this “boom” recovery propaganda. Yes there are more people working but business profits are through the roof whilst wages are worse than 10-15 years ago whilst health, insurance, housing, rent, childcare etc… costs have gone mental.
Time to kick FG to touch.
@Mark Jones: Agreed.
The free market has failed the people of Ireland. Strict regulation is necessary. If this does not happen then occupation and direct action against landlords is required.
@mursim: also estate agents,who are getting away with blue murder these days renting slums for their fees and passing it onto landlords as they’re excuse.??
Name and shame these arasholes. put their details on billboards, ads in papers. flush these parasites out, that will soften the leeches coughs.
“Keep the greecovery going”
Lol.
Some country. Us millenials are such entitled snowflakes.
Violence is unfortunately the only way to handle this crisis. Instead of just sitting and posting we have to strike again.
@Igor Galicki: It seems to be getting to that situation, ive said for a few years that we need a good auld revolution in this country to put politicians and the likes back in their box. They need to be shown they work for us, not themselves or their landlord friends and family.
Deposit should be on an account own by the tenant AND the agency or landlord. That will smooth things down.
Regulation must be brought up concerning responsabilities.
Viewing fees should be illegal.
That country is under housing emergency and it’s the farwest now.
Imagine the idea : “I don’t need to increase the rent as I will organise hundreds of viewings AND ask for non refundable deposit !!!”
And as a tenant : “I will change the locks and ask for a fee as well” .. imagine how these vultures would get shocked!
FG’s Ireland
I’ve never heard of this practice before but I did hear that wedding dress shops have started to charge a fitting fee, taken off the price of the dress if ordered. A way of weeding out time wasters who just want to try on a wedding dress.
A viewing fee for a possible rental is crazy. I imagine it’s to weed out time wasters as they do exist. People who just want a nose around and don’t even want to rent out the property. Still a crazy practice though.
If this happened to anyone and if it is true, get proof and then do something about it.
Bloody disgrace sure it would be better fr landlord to just keep viewings going ..if 30 people turn up to view hes quids in …needs to be stamped out ASAP.. goverment avent a clue whats actually going on as per
If what I read is true, that is REALLY TAKING THE P*SS. What scam is next in this disgraceful saga?
I’ve said ‘jiminy jillikers!’ so often that the words have lost all meaning!
Money and pure greed is all this kip is about now,all landlords and agents who operate on behalf or landlords should be investigated I rent and keep the property in very good condition,a tradesman who works for the estate agent who manages my house says that he has worked in terrible slums belonging to that agent,who in turn gets a fee from the landlord,to maintain these slums.
I’ve stopped having sympathy for the mammy daddy landlord. They invest in property to up their percrntage return on savings. There is no real value in a fixed asset unlike a tech start up or suchlike that actually creates real value in our society. If the return from a pension fund is not enough let them get into true venture capitalism and take the rough with the smooth.
I’m actually impressed someone could have the balls to even ask for this.
When you live in a country with a tatcherite government,why would you expect anything other than greed and exploitation?
The reality is that there are so few properties for rent that all those that are for rent receive way more viewing requests than can be granted. The problem is too few properties for rent. That’s the issue that needs to be addressed. Remove burdensome regulations, get rid of rental caps, deal with land hording, deal with the construction worker skills shortage etc. What we are experiencing is a symptom of supply restriction. The reflex seems to be more regulation – this will just restrict supply further disincentivising additional supply coming onto the market.
the Gombeen man revisited….he hasn’t gone away it seems
So threshold have now said they made a mistake and this never happened, but the furthering of their anti landlord agenda is the winner.
Should landlord groups seek damages for defamation?
Should there be an update to these articles?
Parasites , thats all they are!
As bad as it is that people are asking for viewing fees and it should be illegal the bigger idiots are the people that actually pay it to them.
Fuc**ng disgrace, but ah no apparently everything is rosie in Ireland. 9.0/10 my highest yet.
Greed is a killer …
Absolutely disgusting practise.
@Joseph Mc Grath: Practice is the noun. Practice is the verb.
@Sean: and then it autocorrected me which I’m guessing is what happened to you. Practise is the verb.
have your say