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WE’RE INTO DAY three of counting in Election 2014.
Dublin’s seats have been decided, Ming is off to Europe and Brian Crowley and Liadh Ni Ríada are joining him.
The main stories today…
Morning!
Daragh Brophy here for Day three of our election liveblog…
Unless you’ve been living under a rock (or sensibly getting a good night’s sleep) you’ll know the main drama overnight has been in Dublin 4, where the count for capital went on until the early hours.
Our Political Editor Hugh O’Connell was there until, well, pretty recently, and has all the detail.
Eamon Ryan‘s due to meet the returning officer at lunchtime, and any decision on a recount will be announced at 2pm.
There’s nothing confirmed results-wise at the Ireland South and Midlands North West count centres in Nemo Rangers’ and Castlebar’s Royal Theatre. They’ll be back at the count tables at 9am.
So… Can the Green Party leader pull a rabbit out of the hat?
It’s Europe – the final countdown…
Could Sad Eamon Ryan be the new Sad Keanu?
Possibly…
Photocall’s Mark Stedman captured these images overnight at the RDS…
Meanwhile, the Greens have been touting their electoral success this morning, with 12 councillors elected around the country.
This, from a press release sent out at around 5am…
Eamon Ryan: “Voters have given us a fresh opportunity to work hard for them, and to make their voices heard at council level. From today, that work begins for all of us.”
This morning’s front pages all tell a similar story.
The Herald, perhaps, puts the scenario facing Labour in the starkest terms…
A wider cabinet reshuffle is now on the cards following Labour’s shellacking (as Joan Burton put it) and Fine Gael’s ‘wallop’ (to use a phrase Enda’s fond of).
The Taoiseach and the Tánaiste are set to meet later today to discuss the fallout from the weekend.
More here…
There’s less than 40 council seats yet to be filled around the country, as of right now.
Our Nicky Ryan has the lowdown on the situation this morning…
And don’t forget...
You can check who’s been elected to every single seat in every single constituency right here.
The latest on the Euros…
Paschal Sheehy‘s just been on to RTÉ’s Morning Ireland from Cork. He says we can still expect a first count at the Nemo Rangers’ count centre sometime between 11am and lunchtime, at which point its expected FF’s Brian Crowley will be elected.
The perennial poll-topper’s surplus of around 50,000 votes will then be distributed, with SF’s Liadh Ní Riada expected to claim the second seat.
He says it “could be a long time” before there’s a result for the third seat, expected to go to FG’s Sean Kelly.
Deirdre Clune and Simon Harris (also of FG) remain in the hunt for the fourth seat.
Of course, there’s also some other big news in Cork this morning, and Paschal’s all over that too…
Meanwhile, RTÉ’s Cian McCormack, in Midlands-North West, says the first count in Castlebar is still expected at some stage in the afternoon.
He says there’s likely to be a “right schamozzle” for the fourth seat in the 15 county constituency between independent Marian Harkin and the FF pair of Pat ‘the Cope’ Gallagher and Thomas Byrne.
It looks like Ming ‘Euroming’ Flanagan‘s on his way to Europe though…
[Pic: Orla Ryan]
A quick look at the councils…
There’s a recount under way in Mayo.
It was a long night in Donegal.
And they’re moving on in Carlow-Kilkenny.
Get the full lowdown on the locals here.
After a surge in electoral success here, Sinn Féin are also expected to top the poll in Northern Ireland.
Martina Anderson‘s expected to retain her seat.
Counting begins this morning in the three-seat constituency.
The DUP’s Diane Dodds and Ulster Unionist Jim Nicholson are also defending their seats.
More from the BBC.
Anderson’s been sending her congratulations to her Dublin colleague, Lynn Boylan, who was elected at the first count last night….
More criticism for Eamon Gilmore this morning, after another Labour Oireachtas member said yesterday that it was time for then entire front bench to go…
It follows the party’s drubbing in the local and Euro elections.
More here…
Matt Carthy of Sinn Féin saying this morning that his people are now “fairly sure” he’ll take a seat in Midlands-North West.
Counting’s due to get back under way in the massive 4-seater and in Ireland South around now.
“Anyone who wants the job will have to take out Eamon Gilmore.”
— RTÉ’s Political Correspondent Martina Fitzgerald, this morning.
Yikes.
And we’re back under way in MNW..
And in Limerick..
There are are a number of recounts under way today.
Spare a thought for Dublin’s news staff as you arrive in the office this morning.
It was sunrise by the time many of them finished at the RDS this morning.
And from the looks of it, dawn wasn’t even that impressive…
Get the full report from Hugh, here…
Jackie Healy Rae‘s been on to Radio Kerry from his hospital bed to congratulate his grandson Johnny on his Kerry County Council victory at the weekend.
Jackie’s son Danny (Johnny’s father) also retained his seat on the council at the weekend…
The family patriarch, who is recovering from knee replacement surgery, was given special dispensation to leave his bed and cast his vote on Friday.
[Pic: Daragh Brophy]
Some recount news from the locals, where there’s just 35 seats of the total 949 yet to be filled.
In Kilkenny..
In Mayo.
In Longford.
In Limerick.
And in Kerry.
Gerry Adams appears to have had at least eight hours sleep…
More than many journalists.
Will Ming send a replacement to Brussels?
There had been speculation he would.
Here’s what he said today.
I can categorically say that if I get elected to the European Parliament I will as promised go out there and represent people there.
However, he left the door open to a possible early return from the continent, saying it was his intention to serve the full five years “but it was also my intention to stay in Dáil Éireann for the full term”.
More…
Image: @AnastasiaQuiche
John Gormley, the former Greens’ leader, had something to say about Labour’s possible renegotiation of the Programme for Government at the weekend.
If anyone would know….
Another council result…
Not many seats left to fill now…
But they’ve moved on to any other business at other local authorities.
In Midlands-North West, the first count result could be between 2 and 4pm this afternoon.
By the way, it should be said — as with many predictions being made this weekend, those estimates for first count times come with health warnings.
In Dublin, of course, we’re still waiting for news on a possible recount.
Eamon Ryan‘s requesting a fresh look at the ballots after he finished just over 1,149 votes behind Brian Hayes in the early hours of the morning.
Here’s what (a slightly hoarse) Hayes had to say about the situation at the RDS earlier….
Our own Órla Ryan is back on duty at the MNW count centre in Castlebar…
It may be another long day for her…
Meanwhile, in Cork we’re still minutes away from a first Ireland South count.
Meanwhile, our Political Editor’s back on Dublin watch after a very late night (yes, he was working)…
Eamon Ó Cuív breaking with party line on the Mary Hanafin story on RTÉ just now…
While most FF TDs wheeled out to give reaction to the party’s decent showing in the council elections referred to Kate Feeney as ‘the official Fianna Fáil candidate’ in the Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown Blackrock ward, Ó Cuív said he regarded both women to be FF councillors.
He said the issue surrounding whether or now she should have filed those party electoral papers was “a small procedural issue that needs to be clarified”.
In some encouraging news for Micheál Martin he said he had no problem with the party leadership, and claimed (somewhat implausibly) not to have heard John McGuinness’s comments on the issue yesterday….
Still waiting in Cork…
*Places hands nonchalantly in pockets, whistles.*
Brian Crowley, the country’s longest serving MEP, has been elected for a fifth term in the European Parliament after the result was announced in Ireland South.
The Fianna Fáil politician’s victory had been widely anticipated — he’s topped every opinion poll of this year’s campaign by a huge margin.
The result was elected at the Cork count centre at Nemo Rangers’ within the last few seconds.
Crowley’s Brussels vote was, as expected, only massive.
The veteran Fianna Fáil MEP claimed 180,329 of first preferences out of a total valid poll of 657,498.
His surplus of 48,829 will now be distributed and counting will continue.
Interestingly, Simon Harris is ahead of his Fine Gael colleague Deirdre Clune following that count…
Also…
Phil Hogan‘s been giving his reaction to FG’s poor showing over the weekend…
The party’s Director of Elections said that after three years of tough decisions “you expect people not to be rewarding you for that”.
Outside of the top 5 in Ireland South, here’s how the candidates fared in the first count…
A better than expected showing from Diarmuid O’Flynn of Ballyhea Says No…
Diarmuid O’Flynn (non-party) 30,323
Phil Prendergast (Lab) 30,317
Kieran Hartley (FF) 29,987
Grace O’Sullivan (Green) 27,860
Teresa Heaney (Catholic Democrats) 13,569
Richard Cahill (non-party) 10,719
Jan Van De Ven (Direct Democracy Ireland) 9,255
Jillian Godsil (non-party) 9,179
Peter O’Loughlin (non-party) 6,561
Donal O’Riordan (Fís Nua) 1,634
Preparations for a recount under way in Dublin 4.
From our Political Editor…
I’ve just arrived at the RDS where staff are preparing for what looks certain to be a recount in Dublin with just 1,149 votes separating Eamon Ryan in fourth and Brian Hayes in third.
Ryan has said he just wants to be certain of the result given the late hour at which it Hayes and Nessa Childers were elected to the third and second seats in the capital.
Meanwhile in Castlebar…
There are no Labour councillors in Cork city as a result of Friday’s election.
The party’s lost all seven of its seats…
Just 30 local election seats still to be filled around the country…
Check out the full list (now with fancy graphs and such) here >
More trouble on the cards for Eamon Gilmore.
TheJournal.ie’s Paul Hosford has the story…
Labour leader Eamon Gilmore is to face two no-confidence motions in the coming weeks.
Motions will be tabled by both the party’s central council and parliamentary party.
The parliamentary party will meet this Wednesday, while the central council will meet in the coming weeks.
News from the RDS…
More news from the RDS..
Yes.
Meanwhile:
Oh, and that recount (or ‘bundle check’) is under way…
And Midlands-North West will be ready to announce shortly….
Afternoon all, it’s Christine Bohan here, taking over from the capable hands of my colleague Darragh Brophy.
Despite the many, many promises that a first count in Midlands North West would be due within minutes, we’re still waiting.
ANY. MINUTE. NOW.
In the meanwhile, here’s a rather cool thing on the website of newly-elected Green Party councillor Claire Byrne (no, not that Claire Byrne).
It shows an animation of every single election count in each local election area, with bar charts showing how it all played at.
Watch as the bars magically move! Guess who’s going to make the quota! Wonder at the proportional representation-single transferable vote system! Drum your fingers as we wait for news of Midlands North West!
BREAKING: Beleagured Labour leader Eamon Gilmore is to make a statement at the Department of Foreign Affairs at 4pm today, with reports suggesting that he is to resign as party leader.
Labour slumped to just 7 per cent in the local election results, significantly lower than opinion polls had indicated.
AND WE HAVE A FIRST COUNT AT MIDLANDS NORTH WEST! Here we go:
Total poll: 663,703
Invalid ballot papers: 17,258
Quota: 129,290
Luke Ming Flanagan (Ind) 124,063
Matt Carty (SF) 114,727
Mairead McGuinness (FG) 92,080
Marian Harkin (Ind) 68,986
Pat The Cope Gallagher (FF) 59,562
Thomas Byrne (FF): 55,383
Jim Higgins (FG) 39,908
Ronan Mullen (Ind) 36, 326
Lorraine Higgins (Lab) 31,951
Mark Dearey (Green) 9,520
Ben Gilroy (DDI) 7,683
Mark Fitzsimons (Ind) 2,424
TJ Fay (Ind) 2,002
Cordelia Nic Fhearraigh 1,829
Quick analysis: Luke ‘Ming’ Flanagan, Matt Carty and Mairead McGuinness all look set to take the first three seats – unless Carty fails to pick up the transfers ,which has been a problem for other Sinn Féin candidates.
There’s going to be a dog fight for the fourth seat, though. Marian Harkin, Pat The Cope Gallagher and Thomas Byrne could all do well on transfers
The five lowest candidates, who all got under 10,000 votes, have now been eliminated and their votes will be distributed.
Meanwhile, back at the RDS, Green Party leader and oh-so-close-to-being-an-MEP-but-not-quite Eamon Ryan says he doesn’t want a full recount of the hundreds of thousands of votes.
Instead, he wants bundles of ballots to be checked in case there were any mistakes made.
Ryan finished fourth in the 3-seat constituency in the early hours of this morning, just 1,149 votes behind Brian Hayes of Fine Gael.
He spoke to our political editor Hugh O’Connell a few minutes ago about the dramatic count:
Phew, it’s all go right now, isn’t it? Within the last two hours we’ve had Eamon Gilmore possibly about to resign, Ming topping the poll and Brian Crowley getting elected by a mile in Ireland South.
For a breather, here’s a terrible joke from a commenter.
As we enter what may be the final few minutes of Eamon Gilmore‘s tenure as leader of the Labour party, let’s remember happier times.
Gilmore final interview as leader was here with us, just last Tuesday. In the interview Gilmore said that he wasn't overly concerned with what position he holds in government, but was more concerned about what government does.
Eamon Gilmore hasn’t even resigned yet and already some people in Dáil Éireann are acting as if he’s gone.
Former Labour TD Colm Keaveney decided against using Latin, which he has used in the past for big announcements, and instead went for something slightly less formal.
That’s all, folks.
Eamon Gilmore announces that he is stepping down as Labour leader.
The Labour leader is flanked by Ministers Pat Rabbitte, Joe Costello and Alan Kelly, as well as chief whip Emmet Stagg as he makes the announcement. They applaud him as he finishes his statement.
Gilmore says he will remain involved in politics and wants to seek re-election in his constituency in Dún Laoghaire at the next general election.
His stepping down will be effective once a successor is appointed.
He tells the assembled media that he made the decision last night. He says he doesn’t believe his departure will destabilise the government, and says it was the responsible thing to do following Friday’s election results for Labour.
We’ll get back to the European and local counts shortly, promise, but here’s some snippets from Gilmore’s speech.
For starters:
At 10.30 am this morning, I informed the General Secretary of the Labour Party that I intend to stand down as Leader of the Party, with effect from the election of my successor.
He said the party had taken on the responsibility of Government in a difficult time but had tried to address the crisis as fairly as possible.
But it was a course which carried a high political risk, and Labour has paid the price for that in the local and European elections.
I deeply regret the loss of good public representatives and the defeat of outstanding Labour candidates last Friday.
He said the party needed to renew itself and look to the future before thanking everyone he had worked with over the past seven years.
It has been an honour to lead you, and I look forward to working with you for a long time to come.
With Eamon out the door, what does front-runner Joan Burton have to say? Not too much, as it turns out:
Getting back to the world of elections, Fine Gael MEP Jim Higgins isn’t too happy.
He has just conceded at the counting centre in Castlebar after coming 7th out of the 14 candidates in Midlands North West. He has been an MEP since 2004.
The finish line is very much in sight for the local elections, by the way. 97 per cent of all council seats have now been filled. Hurrah!
There are just 28 seats to go out of 949.
There’s some chatter on Twitter about the performance of Theresa Heaney, the Catholic Democrats candidate who ran in Ireland South. She scooped 13,500 votes, putting her 10th out of 15 candidates.
You can read our interview with her here where she talks about her views on women staying in the home, why a same-sex referendum will never happen in Ireland, and why the contraceptive pill is polluting the water.
With Eamon Gilmore out of the picture there’s a job vacancy at the head of the Labour party (predictably, some wag has already put it up on JobBridge).
Nominations for both leader AND deputy leader of the party open tomorrow and will close seven days later. If a ballot is required, anyone who is an ordinary member of the party will be allowed to vote, and will have almost one month to do so.
Expect to see the new leader of the party unveiled either next week (if there’s only one candidate) or else on 4 July, the deadline for returning postal ballots.
If you’re looking for a state of the nation (or its politicians, actually) on how people feel about Gilmore’s resignation, Michelle Hennessy has been gathering reaction here.
Nice pic, Michelle:
The best – but slightly less official – reactions on Twitter are over on DailyEdge.ie.
Such as:
Our reporter in the Midlands-Northwest count centre in Castlebar, has been speaking to Ming Flanagan, due to be elected as the first MEP there on the next count.
That count is due in around 20 minutes.
BREAKING:
Of course, with Ming’s election, that means there will be a byelection in the Roscommon-South Leitrim constituency.
There will be another byelection in Dublin Southwest because Brian Hayes is likely to keep his new MEP seat (subject to Eamon Ryan’s recount) in the Dublin constituency.
TWO MORE ELECTIONS. What fun.
Here is Ming Flanagan and supporters celebrating in Castlebar just now.
Sorry that this is on its side. It was pretty hectic down there:
Oh.
Well, he is still Minister for Foreign Affairs.
The second count has just happened in Ireland South.
Gav Reilly of Today FM and late of this parish has a tallycard here that shows why no-one has yet been elected to join Brian Crowley as MEP.
HOWEVER, Liadh Ní Riadh of SF is really close to the tally of 131,500. She’s now on 125,309.
From Hugh O’Connell:
I’m back at the RDS where we are expecting the results of the ballot recheck within the next 90 minutes. Around 352,000 votes have been checked and now counters are doing random sampling of transfers from Mary Fitzpatrick and Paul Murphy.
“Incredibly minor discrepancies” have been uncovered according to staff here which means the overall outcome – the election of Brian Hayes and Nessa Childers – is unlikely to be affected.
Meanwhile, back in Castlebar, the fate of the three remaining MEP seats up for grabs after Flanagan’s win is intriguing.
Matt Carthy of Sinn Féin is likely to make the 129,290 quota in some near count because he’s currently on 117,670.
Next is Mairead McGuinness (FG) on 94,019; Marian Harkin (ind) on 72,045; Pat ‘The Cope’ Gallagher on 60,466 and then Thomas Byrne (FF) on 56,290. Jim Higgins (FG) is still in it at 40,462 but has already conceded that he won’t be in with a shout of a seat, and is in fact retiring from politics.
Ronan Mullen (ind) and Lorraine Higgins (Lab) have been eliminated.
There we have it.
Brian Hayes (FG) and Nessa Childers (ind) are confirmed the final two MEPs for Dublin.
They join Lynn Boylan of Sinn Féin.
Evening folks, Paul Hosford taking over from Susan Daly here.
It’s been a breathless couple of days, hasn’t it? What do you make of it all? Let us know in the comments or tweet @thejournal_ie or @PTHosford
This could be big news from Kerry.
Independent candidate and former Fianna Fáil senator Dan Kiely says he’s taking a legal challenge against the result in Listowel.
Kiely told Radio Kerry that he is seeking a full recount.
So, where are we at?
Well, Dublin has its three MEPs, Ming Flanagan is off to Europe, Brian Crowley is still massively popular and 931 council seats have been filled.
Oh, and the Tánaiste announced he is stepping down as Labour leader.
A result from Granard, County Longford.
Two seats were left to be filled and they have gone to Martin Mulleady of Fianna Fáil and his party-mate Luie McEntee.
That means that Granard’s six seats were split evenly by Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil candidates, mirrroring what happened across Longford.
The two parties will hold 15 of 18 seats on Longford County Council.
Here’s how the political representation on Longford County Council looks:
In the massive Midlands-Northwest constituency, a third count is expected at around 9pm.
Here, from our reporter in Castlebar Orla Ryan, ‘s how it looked after a second count:
Who will be on the plane to Brussels with Ming? Matt Carthy looks like he’s almost there, and Mairead McGuinness must be feeling fairly secure, but that fourth seat is still very much in play, with two Fianna Fáil candidates, Thomas Byrne and Pat The Cope Gallagher fighting it out with independent Marian Harkin.
On the local side, there are just 16 seats to be filled: seven in the Fingal County Council ward of Swords, three in Ratoath in Meath and six in Ballybay-Clones in Monaghan.
The Monaghan seats won’t be decided for another week, however, due to the sad passing of councillor Owen Bannigan on Friday.
Want to know what gets the staff of TheJournal.ie through weekends like the last one?
It looks like this, but with more pizza:
Slowly, the Swords recount is taking shape, but there are still five seats to be decided.
Of course, it’s not all that simple. There are a few recounts due to take place around the country.
In Dun Laoghaire-Rathdown, the Dun Laoghaire LEA will have a full recount on Wednesday, a recount in Castlebar is underway and the Tullamore recount is examining 15 misplaced ballots.
Expected recounts in Wicklow, Kilkenny and Ballina were cancelled earlier.
After three days of counting, I don’t think anyone is surprised those involved are tired in Swords.
Here’s how the third count in Ireland south went.
Eamon Gilmore will no longer be the leader of the Labour Party come 4 July.
However, just last week he sat mere feet from where I sit right now and told our political editor Hugh O’Connell that he planned to lead the party in 2016.
How a “shellacking” can change things.
So, Eamon Gilmore is gone, but who’s going to replace him?
Ronan Duffy ran the rule over the potential candidates for the job.
One feature of these European elections has been the rise of the far right.
In France, Francois Hollande was particularly stung by the rise of Marine Le Pen’s National Front.
Here’s where the right succeeded:
News from Castlebar, where Orla Ryan has been staked out since Saturday.
Counting will resume at 9am tomorrow.
There are still 16 unfilled council seats – but only 10 that will be decided tonight.
Swords and Ratoath, all eyes are on you.
BREAKING: Sinn Féin’s Liadh Ní Riada has been elected in Ireland South on the fourth count.
BREAKING: Rónán Mullen has been excluded after third count in Midlands-NorthWest – he was on 41,164 votes. The quota is 129,290.
Here’s the moment Liadh Ni Ríada joined Brian Crowley on the plane to Brussels:
Two counts came in pretty close together there, so let’s break down the results.
In Midlands-Northwest, Matt Carthy is now just over 8,000 votes away from being elected.
However, Carthy will have to go home and prepare to celebrate tomorrow, because they’re shutting down counting in Castlebar for the night.
So here’s the state of play as the candidates in Midlands-Northwest as candidates head home for the evening.
That Swords recount is still ongoing, by the way. Independent Michael Collins, who requested the recount, has been eliminated on the 14th count.
After a marathon recount, Fianna Fáil take four seats in Tullamore and Offaly County Council goes onto the list of completed councils and will get its own graph here.
While Ireland South looks like it may be a three-horse race for two seats between the Fine Gael candidates, independent Diarmuid O’Flynn remains in with a shout.
He sits on 34,840 votes, around 20,000 behind Fine Gael’s Simon Harris in fourth, but could attract a lot of transfers.
If that remains the case, it will be a massive upset.
The celebrations for Liadh Ni Ríada’s election included singing.
The newly-minted Liadh Ní Riada MEP says that her election to the European Parliament is a “victory for the ordinary people of Ireland”.
Speaking from the count centre at Nemo Rangers GAA Club in Cork, she said;
“Sinn Féin went to people of Ireland South with the very clear message that there is a better, fairer alternative to the politics of austerity and cuts.
“My election is a victory for ordinary people who have suffered so much under the regressive policies pushed by the European Commission and implemented with such relish by successive governments here at home.”
The next count in Ireland South is not expected for another 40 minutes. Settle in folks, this one is going to go on all night.
Spoke too soon!
The fifth count is in down south, but nobody has reached, or is close to reaching, the 131,500 quota.
It’s notable that Diarmuid O’Flynn, the Ballyhea Says No activist remains transfer-friendly.
So, what of the recounts in Swords and Ratoath? Still going, 73.4 hours after the polls closed.
Also, the recount in Castlebar won’t be announced until after midnight. Good news for insomniacs, I guess.
Movement!
The Castlebar recount is expected in the next few minutes. Note: expected.
In Swords, independent Joe Newman and Fianna Fáil’s Adrian Henchy join Philip Lynam of Sinn Féin and Darragh Butler of Fianna Fáil on Fingal County Council.
That is four of the nine seats there filled and it only took three days and 16 counts.
Remember that expected recount result in Castlebar? That’ll be another hour or so.
Quick update from Ratoath, where Fine Gael TD Regina Doherty is on site, it being her backyard and all.
This was shared earlier, but deserves to be again.
Watch the proportional representation system in action, thanks to Clare Byrne.
And just like that: it’s on.
Count six in Ireland South sees Catholic Democrat Theresa Heaney eliminated and Fianna Fáil’s Kieran Hartley and Diarmuid Flynn both benefit.
Hartley could make a play for the fourth seat here.
There are still three seats to fill in Ratoath, but only four candidates left.
Here’s how they stand:
Swords has finished its count and will make an announcement shortly.
Luckily, Fingal County Hall is in Swords, so the victorious candidates will be able to make the journey to the chamber fairly handily.
In the UK, Nigel Farage seems to be pretty pleased with himself, but if he thinks Ming Flanagan is going to be taking him out for Belgian waffles in Brussels, he’s got another thing coming.
And Swords has a result!
Labour’s Duncan Smith, AAA’s Eugene Coppinger and independents Paul Mulville, Anne Devitt and Justin Sinnott are all elected on the 17th count in a recount.
After the sixth count in Ireland South, nobody has reached the quota. Counting is underway in the seventh count, after which the count will resume at 9am.
So, what do does results from Swords mean for the representation of the people of Fingal? Here’s how it looks in handy doughtnut chart form:
The three remaining seats on Meath County Council in Ratoath will all go to Fine Gael candidates.
Gillian Toole, Maria Murphy and Gerry O’Connor will all take seats.
That result from Ratoath finishes the representation on Meath County Council and confirms that Labour will not have a seat in the Royal County from June’s council meeting on.
So, where are we now?
Well, we have six of our 11 MEPs elected – three in Dublin, one in Midlands-Northwest and two in Ireland South – and 943 of our 949 councillors.
The six unfilled council seats will be voted for in Ballybay-Clones on 7 June, following the sad death of outgoing councillor Owen Bannigan on election day.
There are also two recounts – one in Castlebar that is due to be announced tonight and one in Dun Laoghaire that will be carried out on Wednesday morning.
That Castlebar recount is becoming the Chinese Democracy of Irish LEA counts. It was due at various stages of the evening, but we’re still waiting.
Still with us? You must either be off work tomorrow or an insomniac. Either way, welcome!
The last counts of the evening- the Castlebar recount and the seventh count in Ireland South are due fairly soon.
I know Midlands-Northwest has packed up for the evening, but Matt Carthy and Matt Saracen from Friday Night Lights, separated at birth?
And that’s it for the night from Ireland South. On the seventh count, nobody is elected.
But, that’s not to say there’s not big news. Kieran Hartley is now just 2,000 votes behind Simon Harris in fourth.
Candidates will be back in the count centre in Nemo Rangers in Cork in a few hours, but many won’t sleep a wink. This is going to be tight.
Here’s how they stand:
The third day of counting in the local elections has drifted into the fourth and a recount of a ward with 15,000 valid votes has stalled.
The first indication was that Castlebar would deliver a recount verdict around 9pm, but five hours later, there is no result.
It has been 65 hours since counting began in Castlebar, but a result is now “imminent”.
And finally! A result from Castlebar!
It shows no change, so Michael Kilcoyne (Ind), Lisa Chambers (FF), Therese Ruane (SF), Cyril Burke (FG), Frank Durcan (Ind), Blackie Gavin (FF), Henry Kenny (FG), Al McDonnell (FF) are all elected.
And what does that do for Mayo County Council?
This:
Can’t wait to what the special branch of the journal will have to say about this.
A lack of evidence from 43 years ago is vindication for Gerry.
Enda Kenny will not be prosecuted for paedophilia, due to lack of evidence.
Joan Burton will not be accused of dealing heroin, due to lack of evidence.
etc..etc.
Shinner O Bot 43 years ago is right. A long time ago enough for the family of Joan Connolly to move on im sure their hurt is as real as every other family who lost someone in the aggression against oppression war up in the North. Peace is on the minds of most people now outside the political point scoring charade that most people dont want to play or see their leaders play.
Joan Connolly went to help a boy who was shot by British forces acting on tip offs in the internment days . Joan had 8 children she was shot several times by British soldiers her wounds were so bad some off her face was blown off she was left their to bleed to death with her face blown off . Anyone who tried to help was shot at . Joan Connolly counts Joan Connolly counts too . Remember that and then move on Shinner O Bot you toolbag.
So right B-Egan my sympathy is with the McConville family but they have been used by media, politicians & certain dissidents for their own ends. South Government almost brought the peace process to an end in the want to keep their seats & of coarse obscene wages.The Labour party have their own skeletons in a cupboard, Gilmore, Rabbitte would know more etc while with workers party, Killings & money laundering, before & during the troubles, some now have jobs in Gov.buildings. . Then we have brit soldiers killing mother of 8 & a priest as they tried to help a dying man, many many killed by soldiers, Ruc. UVF, loyalist murder gangs. Of course blame it All on SF/IRA. As a political party SF have many young & decent people involved, the real reason why Gov. are running scared.
I wouldn’t be happy with the public prosecutor saying there was insufficient evidence to warrant a prosecution if I was accused of murder. It’s a very ambiguous statement.
Do SF actually view Ms McConville’s death as murder?
“Enda Kenny will not be prosecuted for paedophilia, due to lack of evidence.
Joan Burton will not be accused of dealing heroin, due to lack of evidence.
etc..etc.”
Nice try, but Kenny and Burton aren’t strongly suspected of those things. Gerry on the other hand…
As much as they view all the other deaths during the troubles as murder, so probably yes
Shinner O Bot is entertaining as I always read his comments in Jorrys accent. 20 years ago I would have needed an actor.
I hope it wasn’t you tweeting on the yfg account last weekend though.
@Shinner, cunning is no substitute for humanity, intelligence and compassion. You and your ilk are losing.
But we all know he was never in the RA…
If they do view it as murder, why did Mary Lou refuse to call it such last year on national radio?
I don’t know MK, I’m not a Sinn Fein spokesman. You’ll have to email Mary-Lou
Perhaps cos she didnt refuse, I do recall Mary Lou condemning the killing of Jean McConville on the Late Late show, you know what I have yet to hear a SF spokesman who condoned it
wow so he’s arrested before an election and then found not guilty before and election. well done on the timing DUP/Fine gael….
Elections very year be they euros, locals, dail, stormont, Westminster . 2012 last year there was no election
- shinners paranoid again
True, Shinnér Ó Bót. I’d defy you to point to any armed conflict in history where a mother wasn’t killed.
Joan Connolly, for instance. A mother of eight, murdered by the Parachute Regiment of the British Army in Ballymurphy in 1971. Joan was shot as she left her place of safety and went to the aid of a young boy (Noel Phillips) who was shot and wounded by the same regiment. She was shot several times in the head and body, with injuries so severe that part of her face was blown off. Joan’s autopsy report indicates that she bled to death. Eye witnesses of the events agree that Joan was blatantly refused emergency medical attention, even as she cried out for help. By the time the Para’s were finished, Joan’s remains were so badly disfigured that it took her husband three attempts to identify her. Two of her eight children only found out about it when they happened to hear it on the news from the refugee camp they were staying in across the border.
But of course, neither Joan nor her children matter to keyboard “wits” like yourself. You can’t make a good enough political football out of her death.
Yes O’Bot,
Kathleen Thompson, Norah McCabe, the Maguire sisters to name a few shot dead by the British soldiers and ignored by hypocrites.
@ tir Eoin.
…the article is not about the paras…..its about someone who want to be the next taoiseach of Ireland….Is he a suitable person to lead our country?….the people will decide…..mind you he was elected to represent the people of west belfast but headed south of the border for some reason!
Who has now been found innocent, Bill. Do you support the system or do you not? Another hypocrite.
Could you highlight the court case where he has been found innocent a chara
He hasn’t been found innocent:
“concluded that it is insufficient to provide a reasonable prospect of obtaining a conviction against any of them for a criminal offence.”
“…the article is not about the paras”
Indeed. But the comment I was replying to was about the deaths of mothers in conflicts. Am I to take your comment, and the fact that my above post (so far) has 24 red thumbs, as yet more proof that Jean McConville’s death is being cynically used by people who give not one toss about her, but actively dislike references to the fact that Joan Connolly was also a mother who was murdered in the troubles, since that fact is just downright useless to them for political pointscoring?
“Is he a suitable person to lead our country?”
That’s up to the people to decide. Personally, I’d love to see him as Taoiseach. God knows it would make a nice an actual republican, non-partitionist, citizen focused man at the helm, and one who has, more than anyone else, managed to take the gun from Irish politics.
“the people will decide…..mind you he was elected to represent the people of west belfast but headed south of the border for some reason!”
And the people, be they in West Belfast or Louth, decided that he was the right man, and ensured he ended each election at the top of the poll in each constituency. (P.S. You say, “for some reason” he went to Louth – it’s worth remembering that being elected to one constituency is not a job for life. You can stand wherever you like. If the people are happy, they’ll vote for you. Don’t believe me? Just ask Gerry.)
@ Patlyndo
Innocent until proven guilty. This is a western democracy. Unless there is evidence to bring him to court, then his innocence is accepted as a given, and does not have to be “found” innocent. Some people here, quite clearly, would just love to take the concept of no evidence as being clear evidence of guilt, it seems.
@Bill Madden
lol – notaboutery…
Sorry Baz. I should have said innocent until proven guilty. So he is as innocent as you are then.
You think he’ll take a civil case against those associated with the Boston Tapes.
If I was innocent I would
Two issues there.
1. If he took cases against everyone who dislikes him and made accusations against him, he’d get nothing else done.
2. The people who made the accusations are dead, which makes civil cases against them quite difficult.
Oh yeah, and
3. The people who made the accusations did so as part of an agreement that their accusations wouldn’t be publicly attributed to them until after their deaths, which conveniently, meant that they could say what they liked about Adams (a man they detested), without having to worry about being taken to court.
Right baz so a complete lack of evidence is now not a basis for presumption of innocence in your book… How democratic of you and your ilk.
Tell us TEG, are you part of the 4% of the population who believes Adams was not in the Provos?
Yes Larry, because the British army killed mothers that makes it perfectly OK for Gerry or whoever in the IRA/Sinn Fein to..totally and eye for an eye!!! Good god I hate sinners and their excuses for murder being nothing more that..”well they did it too”
Insufficient evidence = no evidence of a credible nature….no surprise there, timing of arrests very suspicious in the middle of an election campaign
….anything ” Diarmuid of the albino monkey avatar ” has to say is highly ironic given his calls last night on others to shred their anonymity while maintaining his own, bless
How can he, Baz? They are all dead. You must believe in the afterlife.
Eh Bill – the article is about someone not being charged. TO’s point was in reply to SoB, who has just figured out that people die in wars. It was passionately written it was factual and it was germaine.
None of those compliments could be directed at your snivelling little piece, could they?
You’re going to have to point out where anybody said killing anybody was ok tinkerbelle. Here’s a hint – nobody did, you made it up to suit your mangled viewpoint.
God I hate small minds who twist other peoples words so that they can stay trapped in their own delusion.
Link to where I said that Caoimhín…
Now, now Tinkers. No evidence against Gerry now.
To paraphrase your own quotation. Good God, I hate those with excuses for British murder who just want to forget about the victims unless they can score a political point from it.
Tell me what did the Free-State regime do to political opponents during the Civil War – tied them to land mines and exploded them and shot prisoners without trial. Give me a break, you hypocrite.
Hi Diarmuid. Only an idiot would admit that they were in the IRA, a proscribed organisation, especially when those asking are their political enemies. Probably their feet would n’t hit the ground and they would get several years for being such a member. Then you and your ilk would want to know off them who else was in it and what they done, etc, etc. Away and take a running jump to yourself. Come back when they start charging paratroopers for Bloody Sunday and Ballymurphy or special branch for murder and collusion.
@Diarmuid http://www.thejournal.ie/profile/380833/robert-where-welsh-connection-im-irish-born-bred-4281976/
Shinner O Bot read half the history book then threw it out.
Tir – this is what I responded to.
“Who has now been found innocent”. This implies that he was tried and – found innocent.
“Innocent until proven guilty.”.
“then his innocence is accepted as a given”
No, the article stated :” insufficient to provide a reasonable prospect of obtaining a conviction ”
This does not mean that a victim for example, is lying or not believed, it means what it says.
Quicken up your brain function Caoimhín and read my comments below.
I can make it simpler for you, but it might be hard.
Caoimhín Ó Hailpín
Are you and For Connolly / Were Jammin friends?
You know, being both shinnerbots from Ennis….
He headed there because its his country and he can go/stand where he wants to stand. Simple really. As for 1972, well it was mayhem in our areas. There was no law but lots of attempts at order. illegal curfew, interment, collusion, direct lies about our community. Within our own community people were taking awful decisions at a local level daily – if not hourly. A killing like that of Joan McConville would not have been discussed beyond local level. Life was cheap & the authorities made it so.
Diarmuid yes I am from Ennis and your point is ? I recall you were criticisng others for posting personal information about people oh the irony
Lovely spot. Just figured out your the For Connolly / Were Jammin shinnertroll. Oh the irony.
Ur some gombeen if you had a brain you would be dangerous, are you going to stay there in anonymity or you got the courage of your ” convictions”
PS what is the relevance to post where i am living considering it is there for all to see unlike ur goodself of course and then you criticize others for posting in thevery same way as you do yourself
Flip back to your “For Connolly” account there shinnertroll. Lols.
@child….I unlike you have no fake account , dont judge others by your own low standards, what is your reasoning for saying I use the account ” for Connolly ” is it just that you and your other YFG trolls do the same
Again why post where I am from if you call out others for posting personal information ?
Dermo, can you explain to us mere mortals why Caoimhin would be using both his own REAL account on here and another account called ‘For Connolly’.
Wouldn’t really make much sense would it.
(Incidentally, I’ve been discussing quite a bit around here supporting PBPs Gino Kenny for my number 1 vote, and SFs Eoin O’Broin for my second preference. They’re not running in Ennis, are they? If you’re half the sleuth you reckon you are, you would have copped that rather large clue that I live in a different constituency to Caoimhin.)
Shocker, “For Connolly” shows up to defend Caoimhin. Lol.
The shinnertroll community in Ennis must huuuuuge.
For Connolly:The poor monkey Diarmuid gets so incandescent with rage at the sound or sight of Gerry Adam’s name, or SF’s that his tunnel vision becomes blurred and his brain refuses to function.
Oh and Diarmuid my account is real, you can check it if you like pet.
What’s the Irish equivalent of ‘reds under the bed’. Are you coming down with a bad case of ‘RA-eds under the bed’?
By the way, when have you ever known me to post a link without including the relevant information from said link underneath?
That was, of course, at dermo
You’re so defensive For Connolly / Were Jammin “@johnjambonennis”.
Chortle.
Dermo, have you been hitting the green bananas again?
You ” Diarmuid ” you should not be typing looking in the mirror PET we are awaiting your reasoning as to how For Connolly and I are the same person…..sounds religious mystery really but go for it explain urself
The shinner shill army never ceases to amaze me at how quickly they rise to attention to slam any anti sinn fein comments and articles.
@ I take it you are not going to share with us the basis for your fantasy that we are the on account , your failure to answer is answer enough I guess
Both events are as horrible. I don’t understand why we need to forget about any. The criminals involved in the two murders should be equally prosecuted and penalised, regardless of the social status or position. I dont believe for a second G Adams had nothing to do with this.
You are having a laugh if you think that he is citizen focused… On the other side, he is definitely Shinners’ focused
Bicho, I’ll indulge you. Why do you believe Gerry Adams has knowledge about this specific death? What evidence have you?
I didn’t say I have evidence, I just said I personally don’t believe it :)
There are people who believe the earth is flat. It’s all well and good believing something to have been the case, but at least have the guts to explain your reasoning.
As an aside, which claim do you believe to be the case, that Jean McConville was murdered for helping a British soldier or because she was an informer?
Sorry, I didn’t answer to your first question. I don’t have any problem or lack guts in explaining what I believe regardless of the consequences that might have. The reason why I believe he was somehow involved is because due his position he was pretty much involved in all the decision making process in the IRA. Even if he didnt execute the order, he surely knew about it and indirectly is as responsible as who actually committed the murder. I don’t know the reason behind why this woman was assasinated, who did it only knows. I’d say both claims would be equally as valid for the people who were involved. Dont try to compare this to those who believe”d” that the Earth is flat.
“The reason why I believe he was somehow involved is because due his position he was pretty much involved in all the decision making process in the IRA. Even if he didnt execute the order, he surely knew about it”
There’s two issues with this. Firstly, you imply that he was a senior member of the IRA. This is despite the fact that after four days of police questioning earlier in the year, there was not one iota of evidence produces to support the claim and he was released without charge. So your implication that he was a senior IRA man is based on nothing more than hearsay and rumours constantly trotted out by his direct political opponents and by a media that has always been hostile to himself and republicanism. Secondly, even if he was a senior member of the IRA, are you seriously saying that this means he was involved in/made aware of every single operation the IRA undertook? Considering just how heavily active the IRA were, and the fact that they operated in a tightly knit cell structure of typically 2/3 Volunteers, are you seriously suggesting that as even a remote possibility? Do you genuinely believe every single IRA action involved/had to be approved by one individual at the top, rather than by the OC of each cell/unit?
“I don’t know the reason behind why this woman was assassinated”
Well that tell’s it’s own tale. The only reason Gerry Adams was ever even mentioned in relation to this murder was because of the accusations of Brendan Hughes & Dolours Price that he was involved. They made these accusation as part of the Boston Tapes project, where bitter opponents of Adams invited other bitter opponents of Gerry Adams to say what they liked about him, safe in the knowledge that their claims would not be made public until after they died and could not be challenged on them. So considering that was the only suggestion of Adams’ involvement, then it’s hardly a surprise that the psni/PPS threw it out as totally unreliable evidence. So you claim that you have no idea why she was killed, but you accept that Adams was involved (claims only produced first by Brendan Hughes). The interesting this is, Hughes also rubbished the media suggestion that she was killed for helping a wounded British Soldier, and said that she was an informant who had been warned numerous times to cease her cooperation with the British Army. So why is it that people like yourself, and those in the media, are only to willing to latch on to just SOME of Brendan Hughes’ claims, (that Adams was involved), but either claim to have no opinion on whether they believe his version of why she was killed, or else willfully accuse him of lying about that part, but lap up every word of his claims about Adams? Is it selective hearing? Or is it prejudiced opinions where you only hear what you want to hear?
I wonder will that idiot Joan Burton stop using this woman’s terrible death as a political football now.
No evidence. Simple as that. None.
No evidecnce because the murderers did a ‘great’ job of hiding her remains, terrorising the family and any witnesses.
Are we surprised ?
I’m sure that there are going to be plenty more episodes of this Political Collusion Policing , on both sides of The Border , prior to the forthcoming Elections !
Disappointed but not surprised
U prefer they(PPS) falsify evidence Mr Kenny to suit your political bias ?
We’ve known this since late June, but the ‘official’ release of the news has been pushed back for as long as possible.
Well that’s a load of tin hat BS!
Incidentally, love how we’ve been aware that this was the case for months, but the official news of him not being prosecuted hits the news at 1:30pm today, the exact same moment that the media are focussing on the government launching its 27 billion vote buying jamboree.
If I were a cynical man…..
You’re just a delusional man…
“Well that’s a load of tin hat BS!”
From July 10
For Connolly / Jammin – the same poster who claims an election is being called today.
The Guy speaks to himself in his bedroom. Claims to be a People before Profit member yet never comments about them.
Guy-who-thinks-he’s-James-Connolly… part of the 4% of Irish people who believe Gerry Adams wasn’t in the Provisional IRA.
Lack of evidence does not infer innocence.
Love the jamming proclaims to hate INM and DOB, yet constantly references the Independent. Bet you buy your breakfast roll on dole day in Topaz too jamming!
It does for the shinners bud
@left left.. ah yes in any court of law it does. or can you just say anybody is guilty of whatever you like and then say lack of evidence does not infer innocence
“Lack of evidence does not infer innocence.”
The whole “innocent until proven guilty” thing must be a terrible inconvenience, but to deny it’s very existence as a concept? Bravo. Bravo.
“Love the jamming proclaims to hate INM and DOB, yet constantly references the Independent. ”
I linked to the UK independent, which isn’t owned by either INM or DOB, it’s owned by the Lebedevs.
Too quick with the smart comments to read my post, eh wesole?
tut tut
Really Diarmuid??
Well I beg to differ, considering it was published in July by the Irish News, and Then held back??
foot-in-mouth alert
Seems to me that the truth of the matter is that the powers that be, could not / would not publish this while there were potential political points to be gained both north and south, especially with the continuing scandals involving NAMA ( and by extension this government )and DUP still swirling around.
Once again Jean Mc Convilles death is being used like a political football
How could lack of evidence infer anything? Has lack of evidence suddenly acquired a reasoning brain? Who is this lack of evidence person?
No it doesn’t. Lack of evidence means exactly that. There is a lack of evidence to bring a case to trial whereby the DPP believes a conviction will be passed down. Therefore the accused is presumed innocent as is their right in our justice system. The burden of proof is put on the prosecution to prove guilt, not the other way around. Innocent until proved guilty. This person, along with everyone else is innocent until a prosecution can prove guilt, they believe they cannot.
Innocent until proven guilty…if there is lack of evidence to prive guilt then it does indeed infer innocence , such is the legal system operated in western democracies
It does not infer innocence. People infer, not words or data.
Blueshirts are big fans of ‘innocent until proven guilty ‘ they were hardly outspoken during internment now were they?
99% of people couldn’t give a shit if he was in the IRA, we have bigger problems.
Funny how the only people convicted of murder in the dail, are in the labour party..double standards Joan..or is it in the past
How much explosives was Martin Ferris convicted of trying to import into this state?
How many deaths would such explosives have caused?
Good thing he was caught and convicted of terrorism. Just life many of his SF colleagues.
Diarmuid are you saying you are okay with these people who have murdered being in the Labour Party but unhappy about potential murderous people in other parties?
Good point Sean, over to you Diarmuid. Cue, deflection.
Nah, just laughing at shinnerbots attempting to deflect from the fact that the SF/PIRA movement is responsible for tens of thousands of deaths and maimings over the past 40+ years.
Wanna call out an individual in another party? Fair enough.
Labour are not the political wing of a terrorist organisation.
Answer the question I asked Diarmuid You have a distain for murders in sinn fein do you support murders in the Labour Party?
Nope all terrorists are vile degenerates, be they republican or loyalist.
Diarmuid are you still on the campaign to have others shed their anonymity ?
Nope, just calling out the hypocrisy of your shinnerbot leader “For Connolly” to attack identifiable commenters.
No surprise you flock to his defence…
Diarmuid.
Morphed from the Workers Party and the Official IRA who shot a man in West Belfast just two weeks ago. They definitely hav n’t gone away you know. Just keep their heads down.
@Oh you remember now bless, you looked for a link elsewhere ….another dent in ur low credibility
@ Diramuid here were ur exact words dear :
“For Connolly”
What’s your name and identity shinner troll?
Bit slow I see C…. never said anything wrong with anonymous accounts, I have a quasi-anonymous one myself.
There is something wrong with an anonymous troll attacking an identifiable individual over his personal information.
I’ve never done it to you. Why do you accept it from your shinnerbot leader? Bless.
same question Diarmuid @ever decreasing credibility ….you are in dire need of looking up the words “troll” and “anonymous ” then have a look at your account and ponder on the irony (maybe too difficult for u i accept) that an anonymous account with an avatar like urs asks another to identify himself
Still pretty slow I see Caoimhín….. I was calling out an anonymous commenter for attacking the personal information of an identifiable commenter.
Have an anonymous account? Grand. Just don’t attack the personal information of someone who doesn’t.
Would have thought you would appreciate that.
Unless you are “For Connolly” of course…
” I was calling out an anonymous commenter for attacking the personal information of an identifiable commenter.Have an anonymous account? Grand. Just don’t attack the personal information of someone who doesn’t.”
Oh your hypocrisy and irony of you , You say the above on the one hand and on the other hand post personal stuff about me, and by the way anyone can see where I live unlike you dear chap unless that picture you have is really you.
” I was calling out an anonymous commenter for attacking the personal information of an identifiable commenter. ”
How can you attack information dermo? Did I try to delete his public profile on linkedin? Or did I use information he has freely and consciously made available to the entire internet to show he’s a spoofer?
Where’s your personal information “For Connolly”?
Should we just ask Caoimhín?
Your meltdown yesterday was quite funny:
http://www.thejournal.ie/micheal-martin-coalition-poll-2356478-Sep2015/
Cheers for posting dermo, you saved me the bother.
Anyone looking for an important lesson in why honesty is the best policy should click on the link above…..
You two clowns really are after letting yer selves down. For Connolly, you did it last night. I got your point but you acting the di*k doing so and diarmuid, you’re doing it today AND gave out to FC for doing it last night. Up yer game boyos, ye’re getting sloppy.
Diarmuid i am waiting and waiting i will be for your reasoning as to why i am for connolly account ?
You called out to use your own language FC for posting details about a comm-enter here last night but yet proceed to do the same today. I unlike you do not hide my identity and you calling for any anonymous account to identify themselves is a tad ironic…
I have plenty to say for good or bad and do need use ” incognito land ” to do same
and by the way Tiocfaidh ar La
Tiocfaidh ár lá, ach tháinigh ár oíche zzzzzzz
Tut-tut FC. You know exactly what you did. It’s irrelevant if someone has information on another web service. The point is you linked it here because you didn’t like what I said about your beloved SF and rather than debate the point, you went off on a pathetic excersise that just made yourself, an anonymous poster, look pathetic. Even people who would disagree with someone like me vehemently, called you out on this. You ain’t getting away with this one no matter how desperate your reasoning becomes. The only way you can claw back any credibility is if you lifted the veil and used your true identity here.
No answer from the drunk monkey i see
@Robert Cousins you may have a legitimate point there , what is your opinion on ” Diarmuid Albino Monkey avatar ” doing exactly same thing to me as he attacked FC for doing to you ?
This clown accuses me of been the For Connolly Account eventhough that account whoever he or she is supports People Before Profit
Can’t we all just get along and post as ourselves? We’re all brothers man.
@Robert Cousins lift the veil of anonymity…does that apply to just one account or all ?
I demand it apply to all.
@Robert I have been always and will continue to post as myself, I am not shy or hiding behind the door with what I have to say about any subject, I do find it ironic when one anonymous account calls out another for been anonymous and one night condemns somebody and then the following night does the exact same themslef
apologies for my spelling
Look, let’s just move on.
But now Deputy Ferris is an elected TD – now that must stick in your teeth.
Where to robert ?
Downtown?
its sad the man was killed, those responsible need to be held to account.
however the whole thing has being used a political football ………………that is arguably more tragic. down south it being used a stick by other parties to beat SF with even though there is no proof. up north its a distraction away from robinson and his scandalous dealings with NAMA.
what man? the story is about the murder of Jean Mconville!!
oh fu** i was typing and posting fast and screwed up.
So her poor family continue to wait for justice.
She and her family were used as a political football by FG and the DUP to divert for another of their little crisis.
Jamsey her family have said all along they believe Gerry adams was involved
Is someones assumption…evidence?
The PSNI have investigated the claims and have not prosecuted the man.
Not persecuted due to lack of evidence is different than not prosecuting because he is innocent.
No, I never said it was, but you won’t hear her family complain about how Gerry adams is treated or they won’t complain about people that were involved with the IRA at the time being questioned.
Jamsey’s concern for her family is at best disingenuous, comments like that are used to try and silence the issue.
Guy-who-thinks-he’s-James-Connolly
The same PSNI you refuse to believe when they state the Provos still exist?
That comment was more to do with the lengths the likes of FG/Dup will go to to score political points rather than any feelings I have for the family and the Blueshirts commenting know that well.
@left left how so. do you have evidence to contradict his innocence or what exactly are you basing your assumption of guilt on?
I know that when I read the words “Blueshirts”, or “Provos”, or any other outdated and pejorative term, that the rest of the comment will have little to offer.
I’d say the family are probably a tad more annoyed at the crowd that murdered Jean to be fair
Al Capone was never convicted of murder by I reckon he was
The same people defending the indefensible. SF will never have power in the south. Shout as much as you want. Call me names, do whatever you want. But, I’m still right.
@Jim.Many of the FG party are more than happy to proudly refer to themselves as Blueshirts and let’s face it when they start behaving as they did back in the 1930′s I’m more than happy to go along with it.
No doubt if the outcome was different then the PPS would be the subject of forensic investigation, family tree included.
When the outcome suits the agenda all is fine.
When not – different matter.
At the end of the day however, there is still a family waiting for justice and this is yet another reason why I would never, ever vote for SF.
hello monkey boy still been an failgeal coward i see
There is more than one family waiting for justice Patlyndo. However the other families dont have the same potential to be used as a political football, do they?
Al Ca the persumption of innocence is a corner stone tenet of democratic legal system. Are you advocating that it be removed for your own narrow ends?
We now await similar rulings on the current political fiasco instigated by detective Gheddes utterences on the Mc Guigan killing.
Jimmy Hill was pictured with many other celebrities, politicians etc. Rumsfeld was pictured with Saddam and so on and so forth. Your point is?
Adams was in the IRA
He flew to London in 1972 to negotiate on behalf of the IRA during a short-lived truce, along with Martin McGuiness, Sean Mac Stiofain Daithi O’Conaill, Seamus Twomey and Ivor Bell, all of whom were in the IRA (why would all these IRA men bring a non-IRA man with them to negotiate on behalf of their organisation?
Yes there are Dave – shameful isn’t it really?
@Patrick.If he was in the IRA why in the next sentence so you say he was negotiating on BEHALF of the IRA. Surely if he were IRA he would have been in a position to negotiate directly FOR them???
@Jamsey thats way too intelligent a comment for Blueshirts trolls to comprehend
Tom thats not proof to go to court.
M Bowe……I don’t get how you can read that I advocate the removal of the presumption of innocence from what I posted.
I was answering Tom Kenny’s statement about the McConville family’s assumption that Adams was involved….and so asked him since when does someones assumption count as evidence.
And please explain what are my narrow ends?
She said she knows who they are yet the PSNI don’t take her in for questioning. I wonder why?
Al ca ta bron orm, I misread your post and had lumped you with those that deny todays announcement doesnt equate to a ruling of innocence. .
*does equate
For years we have been saying that there is no evidence to connect Adams to this killing, we can now state this with absolute certainty.
Were you not certain before councillor?
What were the reasons to doubt before the PSNI concluded that they wouldn’t be able to mount a successful prosecution after such a long period of time i wonder.
Fairplay to you Councillor…funny way an incognito account keeps stressing who you are while hiding itself.
Omarta still alive and well among the IRA. #saynothingoryoullbeshot
Not sure what you’re alluding to there baz, do you have some information you’d like to share?
Baz – you are having a very bad day – could it get any worse for you ?
It must all be getting too much for you – Corruption at the highest level of Government in Ireland and your Friends just can’t frame whom they like anymore !!!
Ha. That’s laughable. The whole reason this issue resurfaced was because of former volunteers lose lips. Go and look into the Boston Tapes and get back to us when you’re better informed.
Lose lips of those now dead. Not many talking that are alive a chara
Muiris….we also have to take into account that some may tell a story to rewrite history to suit themselves or settle a score.
Nothing on the tapes can be taken as gospel…….that’s why investigations needed and evidence needs to be found and people involved brought before the courts for a fair trial.
They were very much alive when they gave their statements. Yet they died of natural causes. Not a bullet to the head.
Of course they were Muiris….their statements were made in secret with the promise of being held for scholars to read and not to be used in evidence or released to the general public let alone the police.
Loose lips of former volunteers, yes. But those running the Boston Tapes project, as well as being bitter opponents of Adams themselves, made damn sure that only those who were equally (or even more) bitterly opposed to Adams, were invited to take part in the interviews and assured them that their testimony wouldn’t be made public until after their deaths, giving them carte blanche to make up any sort of tales they desired. And didn’t they duly oblige.
Who’d have thought a handful of dissidents, each with an axe to grind with Adams would, when provided with an ideal opportunity, try to discredit Adams, eh? Shocking, I know.
Any wonder even the psni/PPS threw it out.
@ I agree Al. The Good Friday rift made Gerry & Martin many enemies from within their own ranks and from the wider Republican community in general. Their words should be taken with a pinch of salt and any judge worth his salt wouldn’t allow the Boston Tapes be used as evidence in any criminal case.
All very well to distance SF & IRA from those who have problems with Adams et al. The cult ain’t that quick to distance themselves from the Sands, Devlins or Cahill families (iconic Republican families) who are of the belief that Gerry Adams & SF sold out.
It’s only convenient when it suits SF
There Muiris…..you’ve made the point I was trying to make better than me.
Believe me, if I came across evidence of anyone involved in the death of poor Jean McConville, I would shop them in a heart beat.
@Baz
I don’t think Adams distanced himself from those people at all. In fact he attended many funerals of his republican critics, including those involved in the Boston Tapes. Your post doesn’t really add anything to the discussion though, Baz. You merely point out that there are people who disagree with Adams. The point you are dancing around though, is that those who have an axe to grind with him, cannot then expect to have their privately made accusations about him taken as gospel. Particularly when they make the accusations under the assurance that their words will only be made public after they die, when they won’t have to worry about being challenged.
P.s. You refer to the Sands and Cahill families. I find this a tad odd. Of course there are members of those families who disagree with Adams, but their connection to the Republican struggle is through Bobby & Joe, respectively. In Bobby’s case, he remained a close friend of Adams until his death, and in Joe Cahill’s case, he was an active and senior Sinn Féin member until his death and had his oration delivered by Adams. Nobody can say how either man would think now if they were alive, but since both were close friends of Adams and SF until their deaths, then why wouldn’t he and Sinn Féin speak of their pride in/links to them both.
Hasn’t Maria Cahill been looking to meet Adams for a long time and Adams running miles.
Good man Baz. A quick google will demonstrate that you are talking nonsense. thejournal.ie won’t let me post the links for some reason but here’s a selection of headlines/quotes from news websites:
BBC:
“A woman who claimed the IRA forced her to confront her alleged rapist has told of a meeting she said she had with Gerry Adams about the allegation.”
BBC:
“Sinn Féin offers to meet Maíria Cahill”
Belfast Telegraph:
“Sinn Féin MLA Caral Ni Chuilin told the BBC’s The View last night: “If Mairia wants a personal apology I think the best way to receive that apology in a genuine way is to sit down with Gerry and do a meeting.”
Baz – You are really scraping the ould bottom of the barrel now old son – you are having a damn awful day sonny boy !!!
If the Cahill family believe that Gerry & SF sold out , they must think the same of Joe. He was a main reason for the peace process working.
Muiris, according to the BBC those two had it in for Adams due to Sinn Fein wanting peace that led to the Good Friday Agreement, those 2 were ripping that Adams chose peace and not war. That was the problem and it was that vendetta that led to this.
Andrew S, Labour are a colourful assortment of criminals. From IRA membership, murderers, members of several other illegal organizations involved in bombings, murders and bank robberies, to drink driving, male member arrested I’m Phoenix park for picking up male prostitutes. Another one interfereing in a child rape trial. And then FG are more than happy to do business with them. Speaks volumes on FG standards and morality getting into bed with this lot. Their past is worse than SF by far
An inconvenient truth for the Endabots and SF haters… sorry lads..
O’Reilly, please enlighten us with this “evidence” you know of.
The people who feign interest in Jean McConville and her family and their dreadful suffering would they have the same interest if Sinn Fein were circa 2% in the opinion polls and not circa 20%
Adams is 100% correct there never was any real evidence to even question him about such a serious crime far less arrest him never mind convict him. Forget the “Boston tapes” as simply put they are not and never could have been admissible as evidence in a criminal trial in any jurisdiction. It’s hard to escape the conclusion that there always will be a degree of politics surrounding this poor women’s death but no matter how hard or how long those like Burton shout about him no culpability will attach to ADAMS
I feel your anguish baz/tap/dermo and I am pmsl…..away with ya and take a few valium.
C’mon Gerry, just admit you were in the IRA ……..
… the dogs in the street know you were
Yeah Gerry! The dogs in the street know it!! (Well, except for the detectives who quizzed him for four days on the topic, and could produce no evidence whatsoever to back up the suggestion).
Adams was an integral part of the peace process that led to the good friday agreement … he was there at the talks table talking to all the political leaders, Ahern, Blair etc, hammering out an agreement.
He was there precisely because he was in the IRA and because of his membership he had influence over them. He could talk to them and relay message back and forth from the political taks
As a non member, Blair and Bertie wouldnt have given him the time of day
Ever consider the possibility that membership of the IRA would have been a hindrance to this work? That it may have suited the IRA to have a man who was not a fully fledged member, to speak and operate on their behalf and would/could not be linked to any IRA membership/activity due to not being a member? Then again, maybe he was a member. The fact is though, that there is no proof. Another more important fact though, is that it doesn’t matter a damn. If he wasn’t a fully fledged member, he was, by his own proud admission, associated/linked to it and has devoted the last 20 years to peace building. The brits were dragged, albeit kicking and screaming, to the negotiating table to talk about equality and peace. Whatever hat Adams wore to achieve this doesn’t matter to most folk in the 6 counties. I find it condescending and a tad pathetic that those in the 26 counties, who willfully turned their back and put their fingers in their ears during the bad years, suddenly do care about him though.
patrick minford, you have the right to speak so authoratively because?
‘Gerry Adams saying he was not in the IRA is like me saying I was not in Fianna Fail’
Bertie Ahern
Ah well, there we have it. If ‘Honest Bertie’ says Adams was in the IRA, well surely that’s good enough for everyone.
… and “Honest Adams” can be believed?
Adams wrote columns for An Phoblacht, the IRA’s newspaper, under the pseudonym ‘Brownie’, and in 1976 wrote an article stating the following
“Rightly or wrongly, I am an IRA member and, rightly or wrongly, I take a course of action as a means to bringing about a situation in which I believe the people of my country will prosper. The course I take involves the use of physical force, but only if I achieve the situation where my people can genuinely prosper can my course of action be seen, by me, to have been justified . . . I cannot complain if I am hurt, if I am killed or if I am imprisoned. I must consider these things as possible and probable eventualities . . . I have no one to blame but myself
Proof for your assertion Patrick old chap, just because u say it does not make it true you know
The difference being, Patrick, that if someone makes an accusation, it’s for them to front up with the evidence. Not for the accused to prove his innocence. How can you prove a negative? That’s why in western democracies, the burden of proof lies with the accuser. And lo & behold, the evidence to connect Adams to an IRA membership charge doesn’t exist. Unfortunately for you the “cos Bertie says so” line doesn’t stand much of a chance in a court of law.
For decades now journalists have been accusing Adams of being in the IRA and yet he has never sued them …
… strange that isn’t it?
… if someone accused me of being a member of a terrorist organisation, I’d have their butt in court sooner than they can utter “Mary Lou McDonald”
So, he should just admit to an offence that carries a 5 yr sentence just to keep the blueshirts/independent news happy?!
As per usual Patrick no proof, no evidence no substance just innuendo and propaganda.
Gerry [Macavity] Adams the mystery Provo.
You may meet him in a by-street
You may see him in the square
But when a crime’s discovered then Macavity’s not there.
Maith Thu Gerry Adams,
So the 2 that said he was involved had a vendetta against Adam’s for becoming leader of S.F. but not many will report that, will they although the BBC from London did…
If everyone was done for what others said about them due to vendettas, would anyone be safe???
Arrested? No, he wasn’t. At least according to himself he volunteered himself for questioning.
And ergo volunteered to spend four nights in a jail cell. If you believe that.
Google occult significance of April 3oth..
So you’re saying he committed the murder himself or what?
These men are patriots and heroes. Nobody knows what it was like to live in the North. Nobody knows what it was like to murder an innocent mother of ten and bury her in a shallow grave. Nobody knows what it was like to lie about people after you murdered them by mistake. Nobody knows what it was like to murder and exile more of your own community than that of the ‘opposing’ community.
It’s pretty awful that these lads are considered the future when their mentality is so far in the past.
Gordon, I do hope you are consistent enough to condemn the Old IRA as vehemently, who, after all, killed a higher proportion of civilians to combatants, than the Provos did? And who disappeared over 200 (mostly innocent) people in a handful of short years, compared to the 14 disappeared by the Provos over a 40 year conflict?
Tír……is there a difference in the pain suffered by the families of each of the 200 the Old IRA ‘disappeared’ compared to the 14 by the Provo’s?
……I thought not.
I’d assume that 200 deaths would cause a fair bit more pain and suffering than 14 would, in fairness. But if we assume the amount of pain to be the same, then that wouldn’t really change my question as to whether Gordon would condemn the Old IRA as vociferously as he does the Provos.
Yes, what happened to the 1919 Protestant minority in Cork is just as abhorrent.
Murder is always murder. Nothing can excuse that. What benefit to the Republican movement did the murder of Jean McConville achieve? Absolutely nothing.
You cannot equivocate murder. It’s a bit childish to be saying, oh the Old IRA disappeared 200 people whilst the Newer IRA just managed 14. Therefore somehow the Newer IRA is better than the Old IRA just because they killed less people.
They are still murderers and they STILL continue to protect these people. Such heroes to the cause.
Well, I’m not here to justify what happened to Jean McConville. It was obscene. Where I’d disagree with you is in claiming that IRA campaigns of both eras were “murderous”. If it weren’t for the IRA, you wouldn’t have the slice of independence you currently have in the 26 counties. Mind you, at least you are consistent, unlike the average 26 county hypocrite, who would lambast the men of Bobby Sands’ era but eulogise the men of Michael Collins’ era. Enda Kenny, for instance.
Tír….to each family the pain is the same.
The murder achieved use as a political football to try and score points against a political party that poses a threat to the establishment and the gravy train it rides on. Disgusting, isn’t it?
I didn’t suggest there was but any difference in the suffering FOR the families, my point (as I think you know anyway) is there’s more pain from 200 families, than from 14.
I’d say that’s due to a class difference in the ranks of the ‘Old IRA’ and the ‘later IRA(s). The Old IRA was primarily made up of the sons of farmers. I don’t think you had that with the PIRA. I don’t honestly believe there was much of an ideology behind the ‘Old IRA’ as there was with the PIRA. That sort of came later, when everyone realised that we had the most Conservative revolutionaries in the history of revolutions.
So you are saying that your lads were better just because they didn’t murder as many innocent people?
Dave > Yeah, it’s almost like murdering an innocent mother of ten was bad or something.
Old Gordon, you asked what did the murder achieve. It achieved exactly what i said.
So they murdered her forty years ago because they knew in the future that her death would be used to tarnish the very people that murdered her? Hmmm, yeah great lad.
“So you are saying that your lads were better just because they didn’t murder as many innocent people?”
Again, quote where I said this. My point is I don’t draw a distinction, where others hypocritically do. I see both IRA campaigns as entirely justifiable. That does not mean I believe every action they committed was entirely justifiable. Show me any armed conflict on earth which didn’t have unjustfiable actions committed ffs. (Though The book Lost Lives demonstrates that around 75% of PIRA victims were active participants in the conflict, which is a figure substantially higher than for any armed group, in an conflict, that you care to mention. Including the Tan War.)
the PIRA ceasefire and subsequent peace process is less than 20 yrs old.. in that time PIRA has accepted that the tactic of disappearing bodies was wrong.. not only have they apologised but have made great efforts in recovering 11 of the 13 they were responsible for, a fact attested to by the ILVCR.. FF and Fg have been in government for 90 odd years and have never even acknowledged their past history of disappearing hundreds of bodies never mind assisting in any form of recovery..we even have Martin Mc Corry FF TD openly gloating about his role in this…
Typical dumb response from someone who posts something quite stupid and is pulled on it.
Not a shinner but I’ve more respect for them these days than any other political party.
I hear fionann Sheehan has been seen curled up in a ball hysterically crying outside the Indos offices!
Takes a special kind of hyperbolic idiot to stand out on the journal. Fair play to Baz and the one track monkey, proving that stupidity a something one can work at
Somebody got away with cold blooded murder.
There is no God or Karma. Somebody literally got away with murder.
Tom, the British army was involved in hundreds of murders in the six counties and got away with basically all of them. Only three British Soldiers were ever convicted of murder here, and each got released within a year or two, and two of the three were handed guns and their army uniform and promoted in the army.
In fact, it was British state policy that they should be allowed get away with murders in Ireland. The evidence? In 1972, 79 Irish people were shot dead by the British Army here. The vast majority of these were civilians. In July 1972, a strategic government and security meeting at Stormont Castle was held, involving the Secretary for State William Whitelaw MP, the North’s most senior British Army officer the General Officer Commanding (GOC) General Ford, the Deputy Chief Constable of the RUC, plus Lord Windlesham the British government’s representative in the House of Lords, British MP’s, and senior civil servants from the NIO. Relatives for Justice recently unearthed a document from this meeting. The document includes some striking quotes, most notable is the one which states ‘The (British) Army should not be inhibited in its campaign by the threat of prosecution”. As mentioned, that year 79 people were shot by the British Army. The meeting took place in July. That month the British Army killed 20 innocent civilians. Not one British soldier faced a conviction for ANY of these 79 killings throughout 1972.
How do murders committed by the British or anyone else mitigate the fact that someone got away with murder?
Imagine if during every murder trial the defence said “M’Lud my client should get off because of the unrelated crimes of others.”
Crimes of the British Army in the same conflict can hardly be called “unrelated”. Why are these crimes not investigated?
Tom, when you get a minute, can you stick up the quote where I said the British murders “mitigated” others. Good man.
My post merely was my reaction to your apparent surprise at the idea of a murder going unpunished, by pointing out that the British Army has directly or indirectly murdered hundreds of civilians here without punishment. As an aside, I’d have thought that since you were surprised at murders sometimes going unpunished, that you’d have been totally floored by the revelation that it was British State policy that their taxpayer funded armed forces be immune from prosecution for committing murder. But that didn’t seem to cause a flinch from you.
You’re clutching at more straws than a self abusing scarecrow….
Another libelous post the anti SF trolls are seriously rattled this evening
@ not talking to myself (at least this time ) libelous post has been removed
Jerry for teeshock
I assume thejournal.ie will have the sense to remove the post above from Alan Ball.
There was evidence. Just not enough. Police have evidence linking the leader of an opposition party in our Dail with the murder of a mother of 10. Just not enough…
What evidence are you privy to o’lielly?
Go on, give us a chuckle….
Insufficient evidence = no credible evidence to prosecute
there was “hearsay” which could not be expected to withstand the rigours of legal cross examination.. gossip not evidence. ..
when are you going to post news story about Ibrahim Halawa we really miss not having an week to week update …… is he still on hunger strike.
Adams won’t escape justice for ever lads. It’ll come to him.
Desperation in your post there , i can hear the straws you are clutching creaking
Tell us what you know there auld chap
Poor auld Gerry was never in the IRA either.
Careful troll i can here the straws you are clutching snapping
Mario Biaggi, a former US Representative and Roman Catholic of Italian descent, maintains that Gerry Adams refused any suggestions of an IRA truce in 1979, when they met in the Europa Hotel in Belfast in 1979
Why would a man who claims to have never been a member of the IRA refuse any suggestions of an IRA truce? And why would Biaggi, with no dog in the hunt on either side, lie about such an event?
Caoimhin – poor auld SF/IRA have no straws left to snap!
@Patrick nice to converse if also disagree with you, you have the courage of your convictions and do not hide behind anonymous accounts
@Caoimhin – do you expect contributors to give their actual name to an SF/IRA sympathiser? Next you will be looking for his address!!
nice try a chara, reason you hide is to hide your political affiliations, there is no such organisation as SF/IRA not in Europe anyway, but I think you know that already, paranoia is a medical condition or is it a case u still believe in trolls under the bridge ? How come other people with anti SF views have not the same ” far fetched ” reasons for posting from incognito land. Again have the courage of your convictions
Is it not time that this tragic mother was left to rest in peace instead of being dug up and wheeled out every time our intellectually challenged Taoiseach and the Hireling scribes of the status quo find that they need a Red Herring when faced with an embarrassing question from Gerry Adams.
He knows who killed Paul Quinn, Jean McConville and Garda Adrian Donohoe…and people still elected him to the dail
I know who killed J.R.
Richard if you have all that information go to the police or are you just dragging up names of people for your own political ends ?
Good man Richard. Post the evidence will you?
What about the SF guys who admit they were in the IRA. Why do they not announce who killed Jean. Some could do it under Dail privilege!
Most likely they don’t know. You don’t become the worlds most effective paramilitary group by telling everybody you know all the secrets you know. They wouldn’t have lasted a week as they were up against one of the worlds best intelligence services.
You think that after the “ceasefire” they still don’t know? Unlikely!
Du really think that after the ceasefire they sat around discussing “where the bodies are buried”. You’re clutching there bud. They were smart enough to fight British military intelligence for 30+ years, no mean feat there. You don’t become stupid overnight cos a piece of paper has some important people’s names on it.
So you reckon that people who were part of the IRA did not discuss their “campaign” afterwards. And you think I’m clutching? Of course they know but “omertà” rules in SF/IRA.
Being part of an illegal organisation and committing murder, bombings. You really think they discuss that only for omertà. Do you even know what omertà means, it’s exactly the opposite of what you’re talking about. These people were a highly organised and skilful paramilitary group fighting British intelligence. It wasn’t the ICA.
Powerabbey. Theres a bit of omerta in the old RUC Special Branch who wont co-operate with Ombudman or Historical Enquiries. I suppose you support them. Lots of murders covered up there, eh?
Larry – lovely bit of whataboutery there. Irrelevant.
Alan – you seem confused with the meaning of “omertà” Try getting an answer from your IRA friends.
No they are not confused at all they who they are, they are real people with real opinions and express them openly, oh wait sur u would not understand that in incognito there
I don’t have any IRA friends power, I’m from a small town in Limerick, we’re all good down here but nice little attempt at the mudslinging. I’ll pass although you might practice that one a bit more. It was a poor attempt.
You might need to understand omertà yourself a little better too. It means silence, as in absolute. No chatting around the coffee machine about your dastardly deeds and such. It’s really a mafia thing but as it applies to paramilitary groups, its leadership, or the people who know the secrets, are leaders because they’re good at keeping secrets. It’s a life and death thing so your notion that these people chat about it like they’re talking about what they won at the horses is kinda fantasy. Sounds like you’re watching a movie. I just watched Star Wars episode 2, I forgot how shit it was :(
So you believe that the guys at the helm in SF/IRA carried out “dastardy deeds and such”??
Good to know.
The actual definition of omerta is: “a code of silence about criminal activity and a refusal to give evidence to the police”. Sound familiar??????
The IRA were a paramilitary organisation chief, they’re not the girl scouts, what do you expect they did? SF are the political wing of said group and thank god as without them we’d still be in the middle of the troubles. I see you’re trying to be smart – try harder.
I know what omerta means power. As you can see above, I have explained it sufficiently. Good to know you needed to check it up. Yes, it does sound familiar. It sounds exactly like what the British Army, RUC, UVF et al were doing during the troubles, AS WELL AS, the IRA and INLA. You seem to be one of those commenters that’s only likes to see one side of a conflict through your narrow biased view of the world.
Alan – it would help your comments if you would check your facts before you make submissions. They might make some sense then.
Go on Power, I’m not very busy right now so I’ll bite. Do tell.
@ Power person. it seriously increases the validity not to mention sincerity of comments when people post them as themselves and not from incognito land
Typical dumb shinner response……
He does have very impressive facial hair though doesn’t he? And the teeth, what do we reckon? Dentures or real?
a lot more impressive than your input to this thread for sure
To be fair, the beard is magnificent. Also he had it before it became fashionable.
sinn fein. hahaha. Dublin Central Mary yahoo. Let’s see transfers this time
according to u Sinn Fein get no transfers anywhere, so strange comment for you to make
How could he be involved ? Sure he wasn’t in the IRA wasn’t he not ?
shinners should offer courses in whataboutary. Ye are great at it. Sure only terrorists
Gerry loves an auld cornet.
have your say