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Peadar Toibín Laura Hutton/Photocall Ireland

Peadar Toibín suspended from Sinn Féin for six months

TD for Meath West has been censured for his vote against the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill.

THE SINN FÉIN party has handed down a six-month suspension to renegade TD Peadar Toibín.

The Meath West TD decided to vote against the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill 2013, which Sinn Féin was supporting.

As a result, Sinn Féin party whip in the Dáil, Aengus Ó Snodaigh, announced just after 1am today that Toibín would be out in the parliamentary cold for the next six months.

Ó Snodaigh said in a statement:

Sinn Féin has supported the Protection of Life During Pregnancy Bill and all Sinn Féin TDs were mandated to vote for this legislation.

The decision this evening by Peadar Toibín TD to vote against the Sinn Féin position is a serious breach of party rules.

As a consequence Peadar Toibín has been suspended from Sinn Féin for six months with immediate effect.

Minister for European Affairs Lucinda Creighton also lost her party whip when she was kicked out of the Fine Gael parliamentary party for voting against the Government’s Bill. She handed in her resignation as a Minister of State shortly afterwards – she told TV3′s Vincent Browne that Taoiseach Enda Kenny had asked for her resignation and “I responded”.

These are the 31 TDs who voted against the abortion bill>
Abortion bill passes final Dáil vote>
Lucinda Creighton: I believe I made the correct decision>

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    Mute Marg murphy
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:31 AM

    Intransigence of unions. Of that I’ve no doubt. It’s what’s wrong with the HSE too but “under resourcing” sounds better.

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    Mute Gary Kelly
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:08 AM

    Irish Rail Management Lying it’s arse of again, There is not enough drivers to operate the Current service never mind a 10min service which would require 50% increase in Drivers, the Current service is been maintained by drivers working overtime, FACT.

    50
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    Mute Seán O'Ceallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:35 AM

    So more jobs

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    Mute Mill Miller
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:47 AM

    Extra 10 minutes … Means extra travel time on the trains from Belfast Dundalk an other stations not on the dart line … But look after the south side

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    Mute Sean @114
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:54 AM

    But Gary are drivers looking for a pay increase or not? If management took on a load more drivers the union would then be looking for compensation due to loss of overtime. You can’t win with these union parasites. The last thing of interest to them is the public, who, ironically, are the ones who pay their wages in the first place.

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    Mute Tom Purcell
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:14 AM

    What’s the [problem – as per IR’s proposal, new staff will be hired and trained and so provide support for all those poor overworked staff there at the momment — oh no – that would mean less overtime money…hmmmm -

    118
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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:30 AM

    Gary the actual facts are not welcome here from the sack them all I’d do it for nothing brigade.

    28
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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:00 PM

    unions can be ignored by employers, simply do that and fire all the lazy useless unionised layabouts, it really is that simple.

    59
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    Mute Edward
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:58 PM

    tommy, wow just wow, it never ceases to amaze me both the level of stupid and arrogance on the journal, but you sir have won it for today.

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    Mute Gary Kelly
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:46 PM

    Pay increase being sought is for past productivity for Which the driver’s implemented While Austerity was being blamed but Where other Grades in IR got pay increase plus 6% pay rise owed from 2007 and 1.7% pay cut 18 months ago.

    9
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    Mute NBRU
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    Mar 30th 2016, 3:19 PM

    NBRU categorically refute Irish Rail’s contention on reasons for shelving the Introduction of 10 Minute Dart Service.
    General Secretary Dermot O’Leary said :

    “blaming Dart Drivers and their Trade Unions is disingenuous in the extreme, peddling untruths in relation to the availability of newly trained drivers is complete and utter fabrication and is designed to deflect away from the fact that management at Irish Rail did not engage in the necessary advance planning for recruitment and negotiations with its staff, refusing to engage with worker representatives on issues in relation to pay at a time when passenger numbers and revenue are heading back to peak levels is neither tenable nor sustainable”
    Mr O’Leary went on to say :

    The Government as the main shareholder has a responsibility to both passengers and staff to ensure the appropriate funding is in place to run the rail service, we have written to the Company this morning advising them that in the absence of real dialogue on pay we will be left with no alternative but to accede to the clamour from our members to ballot for Industrial Action, leading to the inevitably of a summer of discontent across our railways”

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    Mute Gary Kelly
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    Mar 30th 2016, 3:41 PM

    True Paul waste of time, ignorance is alive and well 100 yes Later.

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    Mute Carl Nolan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 4:45 PM

    “The Government as the main shareholder has a responsibility to both passengers and staff to ensure the appropriate funding is in place to run the rail service”

    = give us more taxpayer money.

    15
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    Mute Marc Power
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    Mar 30th 2016, 5:07 PM

    Transport in Dublin is a farce. Toy trains and tram lines to nowhere. Busses run for the staff and not customers. Needs to be rebuilt from the top down preferably by people with a real understanding of how public transport should be organised and run. Perhaps bring in the Japanese or Chinese?

    18
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    Mute Sean @114
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    Mar 30th 2016, 5:50 PM

    To sum up the NBRU’s statement…’we want more tax payer’s money to pay our drivers a higher wage or we will wreak havoc with the rail service this summer’. Yet again the tail is wagging the dog.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:45 AM

    A fine example of the Unions telling the working ‘working class’ to go and fcuk themselves.

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    Mute Noah Wilson
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:50 AM

    You’re missing the point here.
    The unions do not oppose the idea. They fully support it.
    The unions have the safety of the public as their priority.
    The company?

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:53 AM

    LOL never ever have in the history of transport unions put the customer before their members

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    Mute Peter King
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:01 AM

    Here’s how the union’s work. Company proposes anything different regardless if it affects workers or not = Demand more money.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:01 AM

    Noah,
    I’m not missing any point here, the public want more frequent trains that are less packed, the greedy drivers want more money for driving the same amount of hours.
    Safety doesn’t come into to it as there is NO extra safety issue unless the drivers are suddenly expected to turn left, right and reverse now.

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    Mute Peter King
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:05 AM

    Look if the unions didn’t demand more money any time they feel like it you’d be working 80 hours a day in a coal mine for free. Thats just science!

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    Mute Celtic_Horizon
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:08 AM

    I’d be delighted if they ran the current timetable on time.

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    Mute Gary Kelly
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:15 AM

    Yes u are missing the point because u haven’t a clue what ur talking about, Drivers don’t want more money they want what they are owed, plus the Company want this Service operated by Current Drivers when it requires 50% more drivers to operate, and it won’t make the Trains less packed it will just make them Slower, just like the Luas one behind the other, at the moment IR don’t have enough Dart Units to Operate it Safely so try not Comment on things if u dont have a fundamental understanding.

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    Mute TTIP McGowan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:23 AM

    Unionized work forces are the reason we have a minimum wage, the reason we don’t work a 6 day week. Instead of you saying it’s a F~~k you to the working class, I feel it’s a lead by example. We’ve been done over too long.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:23 AM

    Gary,
    Are you telling me the drivers aren’t getting paid what they are owed?
    I didn’t realise that Irish Rail weren’t paying them to drive because the Union head on the radio this morning never made mention of them being left short of wages.
    Company says they already employed more drivers so are these getting paid either?

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    Mute Aging Lothario
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:43 AM

    How does the London Underground management to run trains every two mins? This is so typical of this country, where you have an average public transport system, with highly paid drivers, who expect to be paid a fortune for doing sweet FA.

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    Mute Larissa Caroline Nikolaus
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:55 AM

    @Aging, the main difference between the tube and the DART is, the tube doesn’t have any level crossings, imagine the queues at the barriers, if the DART were to run every 2 minutes, the barriers would only open between 11 pm and 6 am then

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    Mute David Flynn
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:57 AM

    You’re missing the point………I’M NOT MISSING ANY POINT…….

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    Mute David Flynn
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:00 AM

    Continues to miss the point

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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:07 PM

    unions care about their own greed and nothing else. who in their right mind would allow a union near their business

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    Mute Paul Lanigan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:54 PM

    Nosh, you’re delusional…..

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    Mute Edward
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:15 PM

    tommy macdonagh prior to unions kids worked in factories 16h days and had to sleep on the floor. Irish employers are some of the worst in the world. I made the mistake of working for one once and wont ever make that mistake again, nepotism, cronyism, no sick leave, no benefits whatsoever. You would need to be mad to work for them, Irish employers operate on pure greed, they see the money as all theirs and are unwilling to accept the fact that without their employees they would have nothing.

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    Mute Peter King
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:05 PM

    The unions of today are far removed from the unions of 200 years ago. Just because they did some good then doesn’t give them carte blanche to punish service users by constantly demanding more and more money.

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    Mute Edward
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:13 PM

    Peter that is a flawed logic, you dont get rid of laws when there is no crime. You can be sure that if there was not unions to keep employers in check greed would ensure all our lives would be miserable. You just have to look at what happened with jobsbridge as a prime example of this.

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    Mute James Darcy
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:31 AM

    Sick to death of Unions. They belong back in the Industrial Revolution. Get rid of them.

    205
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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:57 AM

    You only have rights because of unions. Without them you’d be working a 60 hour week for tiny money and could get fired on the spot. Stop listening to propaganda.

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    Mute James Darcy
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:59 AM

    No Eamon good companies in the modern working world recognise that treating employees well will yield rewards. The law is there to protect workers now. Unions belong in the past. If they don’t like their legal employment then leave.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:06 AM

    @eamon unions were required to get us to the place we are now with great employment laws, the LRC and the WRC but their behaviors in recent years has nothing to do with making life better for the average worker and is all about keeping themselves relevant, in power and on overpaid salaries for not only their members but themselves, most union reps earn 2-3 times the average industrial wage and they claim to represent the working class?

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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:07 AM

    That’s highly naive. Tesco tried to hire shelf stackers on 50 quid a week. A very well known phone Irish phone company recently gave pay cuts to their call centre staff and pay rises to their executives who were already on 6 figures a year. I can only assume you must still be in school if you think businesses are looking out for your interests.

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    Mute Aoife
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:10 AM

    People have a right to belong to a union if they want to. Unions don’t belong in the past but I’ve a feeling you’d be happy to drag us all back there if you had your way. No thanks.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:13 AM

    Fine then tell siptu to go represent tesco shelf stackers and not train drivers earning comparably some of the highest salaries in europe, again read what I said, siptu and many other unions these days are not actually representing the working class and are only looking out for themselves and their overpaid members, who will train, luas and bus strikes over pay increases impact most? The answer again is working class as these pay increases will lead to fare increases which also are already some of the highest in europe

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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:20 AM

    OK so let’s say the working class will pay Transdev’s fair increases. Would you rather see that money go into the bank accounts of the millionaires at the top of that company or would rather see it used by your fellow Irish working class to pay their mortgage and feed their children?

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    Mute Andrew Lavelle
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:21 AM

    When did Tesco do this?

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:24 AM

    LOL your describing LUAS drivers earning 42k+ as working class?

    66
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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:41 AM

    LOL. You think tram drivers aren’t working class? I’m not sure if you know what that term actually means.

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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:45 AM

    @Andrew. Couple of years ago on jobbridge. Posted a profit of £1BN but wanted our taxes to pay the shelfstackers they needed.

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    Mute Andrew Lavelle
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:56 AM

    @Eamonn I doubt they posted profits like that a couple of years ago.

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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:58 AM

    Google is your friend.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:58 AM

    I find it difficult to put someone earning well over the average industrial wage and quite a bit more than 50% of the rest of the country in the same box as someone on under 20k especially considering their job could hardly be described as labour intensive. Are you happy to do this?

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    Mute Aoife
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:03 AM

    I just shows the need for more union representatives for tescos etc. I know you disagree but the time when it was ok to pay people buttons and use child labour is thank God being challenged on an ongoing basis. There is plenty of money in the world but a lack of distribution to those who need it most. Even the richest people in the world see this such as Warren buffet who’s given his away to help the poor of the world. When some people in Ireland have so much and so many have so little with no chance of a better future is this what the volunteers fought for during 1916. To keep the status quo, they had higher aspirations than that.

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    Mute michael walsh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:08 AM

    Exactly eamonn that’s what it’s like for agency workers , poor money long hours and no guarantee or work but no one on here cares once they have cheap travel

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:12 AM

    I agree people the likes of those who are working the very lowest jobs need to be represented and Unions should be doing this, instead they are bolstering their own power bases and lining their pockets by bringing the transport systems to a halt. Again our bus dart and luas drivers are on comparably some of the highest salaries for doing their jobs in the entirety of Europe yet they will strike and demand better conditions at the drop of a hat, and again most of the time the repercussions of these strikes, ie transport cost hikes, is only affecting those of the real working class who are earning in many cases half of what these guys are on and maybe a fifth of what the union reps are. Does that honestly make sense to anyone supporting the unions here?

    Im all for fair pay and better working conditions for everyone who deserves it, i just think its hilarious when these guys who are earning insane amounts compared to a majority of the rest of the country and have benefits many could only dream of complain cus their timetable is gonna change slightly.

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    Mute Eamonn Young
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:18 AM

    Precisely Michael. Drivers want a fairer share of the €150 million contract given to this multinational 12 months ago so they can pay their mortgage and feed their children. ‘How dare they try to improve their lives. I’ll have to walk an extra 15 minutes to get to a bus stop if I plan on going to town on the weekend.’ And it’s the Luas drivers that are greedy? There’s some amount of donkeys on the journal.

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    Mute Andrew Lavelle
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:24 AM

    @Eamonn can’t find anywhere stating Tesco made 1Billion profit in Ireland. Really appreciate if you could send me a link

    27
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    Mute Teddington
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:39 AM

    He’s talking nonsense, Tesco don’t even provide a breakdown of their revenue in Ireland let alone their taxable profits. Anyway it’s irrelevant to any talks relating to Dart and Transdev where the pay scales are very transparent and in most people’s eyes quite rewarding for a job that requires only 7 weeks training and no formal education. Don’t dilute this argument by bringing the motives of big business into the equation, it doesn’t nothing to add to this debate.

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    Mute Andrew Lavelle
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:49 AM

    Agreed Ted.

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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:03 PM

    employers also have a right to ignore unions completely, just refuse to acknowledge their existence. it really is that simple

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    Mute Fran Higgins
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:54 PM

    Trains Drivers in other European Capitals Earn a lot more for Working a 35 Hour Week while Dart Drivers are expected to Work a 48 Hour Week, Work Bank Holidays be in at 0430 on the Early turn and work up to 0130 on the late turn, not a great job anymore.

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    Mute Paul Lanigan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:02 PM

    So the drivers want to improve their lives…..what college courses are the attending, what new skills are they developing that employers are happy to pay more for?…..or are they looking for more money for the same level of skill and work effort?

    19
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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:19 PM

    @Fran
    Are these the Dart Drivers earning over €60k per year, with free unlimited travel throughout Ireland on CIE transport, free ferry travel, free or heavily discounted trains throughout Europe, free GP care for themselves and their families, excellent pensions?
    Just wondering ?????

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:27 PM

    @ John
    You should really check your facts before you post. An I.e driver pension is € 179 only payable after 40 years hardly in the gold plated league.

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 8:09 PM

    fran don’t bother educating them on here most are on shite wages and have no balls to look for more and are just jealous and bitter towards workers who earn more than them and who stand up for themselves it’s a horrible way of thinking but sadly it’s prevalent on here.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 8:45 PM

    @Paul Dunne

    The head of Anglo Irish Bank had those same sentiments exactly so the DART drivers and yourself are in good company.

    “Screw everyone else cause we are ok” good man.

    @ richiecallaghan
    You disputed the most minor of my points so I assume you are happy the rest are correct?

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:17 PM

    john if your comparing seanie and drummer to dart drivers looking for the money they are owed as adjudicated in the labour court you are off your head.

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:23 PM

    No John not one of the facts you posted are correct so if you want to come on here and post miss informed statements that’s your choice.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:30 PM

    @ richiecallaghan
    They are all in fact correct because my sister benefited from some of them due to her partner being an employee of Irish Rail, over to you.

    @Paul Dunne
    If the cap fits……
    PS It’s funny how the Labour Court rulings and the Work Place Relations rulings are important when it suits the Unions and can be ignored when it doesn’t.

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:41 PM

    John I will try once more none of the facts you posted are correct but if you want to believe your sister that’s up to you .

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:48 PM

    Oh Dear Ritchie that marks you out as either being ill-informed or a liar because Irish Rail employees and their families get FREE GP CARE, FREE PRIVILEGE CARD that allows free travel throughout Ireland on Rail and Bus (some unofficial) but all free, FREE FERRY CROSSINGS on specified routes, FREE or heavily discounted TRAVEL on European train services.

    Of Course my sister could well be a thief, liar and fraudster but I think I will believe my own eyes as I’ve seen her use all the above services.

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:56 PM

    John I would advise you to go and check your facts out before you post again I would hate to see your sister get in trouble if she’s using her privilege ticket for unlimited travel

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:58 PM

    john ask your sister which labour court rulings and work place relations rulings drivers have ignored.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:00 PM

    richiecallaghan

    Oh Dear more deflection. Do you deny that Irish Rail employees get the above items?
    A straight yes or no will do, no FG political answers needed

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:19 PM

    now john enough of your cap fits nonsense if you where owed money and didn’t get it for 7 years would you do more,or look for your owed money first?

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:22 PM

    Sweet Jesus john your hard work No is the answer i don’t have unlimited free travel here or in Europe I don’t have free G.p , I don’t earn 60k a year and as I told you before i don’t gold plated pension . You have been posting wrong facts on here all day . Good luck .

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    Mute John
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:33 PM

    richiecallaghan

    My apologies, I thought ALL Irish Rail staff got a privilege card and free GP care, so it is just the ones I know then, what are the odds?

    You should look into that because that is a bigger grievance that some employees are getting treated differently than others.

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    Mute Hubba Jubbasure
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    Mar 31st 2016, 3:05 AM

    John.
    Perhaps your sister/partner was in the clerical division of Irish Rail Which have a very much enhanced package of benefits compared to regular frontline staff. GP care is NOT free but paid weekly via payroll deduction. Privilege card entitles reduced rate travel to staff. There is NO free travel throughout Ireland except for limited annual leave passes and they are not valid on bus services. I know people who work for retail outlets and receive discounts. Also those who work for phone or broadband providers who receive enhanced service, discounted billing or both so, nothing to see here so to say. I expect you get some benefits from your employer too, if your employed?
    And to be honest, if your sister/partner really do work within Irish Rail and are being honest with you, then you KNOW that the problems within Irish Rail are not down to drivers or other “front of house” staff.
    Perhaps you are genuinely ignorant of what really goes on in that company or perhaps your bilious rants are more for collecting green thumbs and a sense of self importance. I haven’t decided yet.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 31st 2016, 5:02 AM

    To answer your query, my sisters partner is an electrician of long standing in Irish Rail, and the two friends who work there are both clerical. The thing they have in common is that they have NEVER paid on a Dublin Bus or DART and I have actually travelled with two of them when I paid for a ferry to France and subsequent train fares and they travelled free on both.

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    Mute richiecallaghan
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    Mar 31st 2016, 6:55 AM

    Lord John that trip to France left you a bitter man.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 31st 2016, 7:11 AM

    Not as bitter as the DART Drivers though if they are the only staff NOT getting these freebies !!!!!

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 31st 2016, 1:46 PM

    john I see you have ignored the two points I put to you (1) point out the rulings drivers have ignored (2) would you give more before you got the payment you are owed (for 7 years) I won’t hold my breath for a reply beacuse you are talking out of your hole.

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    Mute John
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    Mar 31st 2016, 1:59 PM

    @Paul

    “most are on shite wages and have no balls to look for more and are just jealous and bitter towards workers who earn more than them”

    You already stated without prompting you are on good wages and to answer your question, the Luas employees just turned down an 18& pay rise agreed at the WRC with Transdev. It seems that the public and the taxpayer can go and fcuk themselves as far as train and Luas drivers are concerned.

    In case you missed it over the last 7 years thousands and thousands of people less fortunate than the cosseted Irish Rail employees lost their jobs, their homes their lives following a massive recession caused by wanton greed so when you say YOU ARE OWED !!! something then I think it shows just how GREEDY and ARROGANT you truly are.

    I sincerely hope you get nothing you are looking for and resent your greedy attitude, as I say you are just like the Anglo boys but on a smaller scale

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 31st 2016, 2:14 PM

    @john nice rant but you failed to point out to me the rulings that irish rail drivers have ignored, now you told me about transdev for some reason, you also didn’t answer me would you look for what your owed before doing more but nice rant all the same made no sense but it was from the heart well done .

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    Mute John
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    Mar 31st 2016, 2:34 PM

    Paul you are obviously having difficulty understanding so I’ll type slowly for you.

    1. I originally said ‘Unions’ ignore rulings when it suits them NOT ‘train drivers.

    2. You and Luas drivers share the SAME Union and same reps and I know you think the public are gobshi(s but we see how it works, (Luas drivers look for a pay rise to match train drivers and when they get it then Train Drivers look for a rise to keep pace with Luas Drivers).

    3. You are bloody lucky to have a well paid secure job with pension rights and after what the country has gone through over the last 7 years HOU ARD OWED NOTHING.

    Is this clear enough for you. Do you get it yet, you are owed nothing, not by me or any other taxpayer. You and your cosseted friends need to get a grip of reality and see that there are people a lot worse off than yourselves and IF there is any money it should be spent on hospitals, houses and schools and NOT GREEDY FCUKERS like yourselves.

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 31st 2016, 2:50 PM

    @john I could answer you point by point but it’s obviously a waste of time suffice to say Richie hubba gary and I have told you what the issue is but you won’t and don’t want to accept it for whatever reason my guess is you are just being a kaunt and you use story’s from your sisters fella to be silly.

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    Mute Jimmy jones
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:44 AM

    Just ask Brendan Ogle, Jack O Connor , Dermot O Leary or any of the other trough feeders how much they are personally earning in salary and expenses and other payments . The union greed comes from the top

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    Mute Noah Wilson
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:32 AM

    Fully support the unions on this one.
    It’s extra work.
    No one does extra work unless they are paid for it.
    Management certainly wouldn’t – why should workers?

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    Mute Teddington
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:37 AM

    How much extra work are they required to do Noah? Is it an extension of their working hours or shorter breaks or how exactly are they having to work more? I’m genuinely asking by the way, not questioning your claims.

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:38 AM

    Are the drivers being asked to work more hours? No they are simply being asked to work a different schedule to accommodate the increasing demands of the commuting public…. you know the customers the dart serves,

    If they are simply being asked to do the same job but on a different schedule then its definitely not “extra work” so please prove your assertion that its :extra work”?

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    Mute Paul
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:38 AM

    They are still doing the exact same amount of hours.

    The problem here is self serving in terms of finishung earlier and starting lather and been given hours of a break.

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    Mute offtheball
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:39 AM

    @ Noah – maybe you could outline the extra work involved please. Surely if you are employed to work for 8 hours a day then it doesn’t matter how often trains arrive/depart? Are they being asked to work longer hours for the same pay?

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    Mute Noah Wilson
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:47 AM

    It’s not simply a matter of driving faster.
    Extra drivers are required to cover the extra trains. Those drivers won’t start working until June.
    It is an increased workload for the current staff.
    The company have jumped the gun without having the extra staff in place.
    Stupid decision.
    A PR disaster.

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    Mute Juan Venegas
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:51 AM

    Its not extra work, they have a working time, they are required to work during their shift, they are not working extra hours, they just have to drive more, but this is not a physical job, its a sitting job, and if management can squeeze more extra trains wile keeping the staff’s mandatory breaks then its just too bad for the drivers. Trains and subways in Europe operates at a 5 minutes frequency during peak hours and they get paid less. During your contracted hours, the employer owns your time, as long as it doesn’t interfere with your mandatory breaks.

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    Mute Noah Wilson
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:53 AM

    @Teddington.
    If on a normal shift a driver could operate let’s say 6 runs from Howth to Bray e.g. then how is it possible for the same driver to now operate 10 runs from Howth to Bray in the same shift?
    It’s not physically possible.

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    Mute Noah Wilson
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:55 AM

    A PR disaster for the company which they’re now trying to pin the blame on the unions.
    Management are always up to these tricks.
    We all know that.

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    Mute Peter King
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:03 AM

    Have a look at the red thumbs. Very few people are with the union’s. This reflects the average opinion. How is this a PR disaster for the company?

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    Mute Ian McNally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:03 AM

    Yeah and unions never ever try and spin things either…… its always the big bad managements fault

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    Mute Paul McCartney
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:38 AM

    Yes it is…. It’s just maths, the frequency of the departures increases thus the no. of journeys possible in the ‘SAME’ shift increases. I think you’re missing the point. So long as there is no change to the work shift what is the problem in doing more driving within their regulated shift? They are drivers, that is there job. Enterprise Drivers do 2.15 straight hours driving Dub to Belfast with no break so the argument that this is some safety issue or extra productivity is ridiculous.

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    Mute David Flynn
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:50 AM

    It’s probably giving a bit too much credit to the red thumb system to say nobody is with the unions. I think what you mean is that people who spend their day setting up fake twitter accounts and think that a red thumb is something that matters aren’t with the unions. Most people in the real world probably aren’t really concerned about those people

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    Mute Damien Kelly
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:47 AM

    You can only drive one train at a time! Surely they work a set number of hours a day. Extra trains will mean extra drivers not more work.

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    Mute Hubba Jubbasure
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:02 PM

    Actually Paul your being somewhat disingenuous there. Whether you drive for 1:10 solid or 2:15 as you quote for the Enterprise driver, it doesn’t exactly compare. The workload, time and distance between stops can vary greatly as can other on track activity (legal or otherwise) and concentration and fatigue factors are very important here. Looking at some of the findings from inquiries post UK rail accidents can be helpful here. There’s a reason that the EU have tried to reduce working hours over the years throughout industry. As I understand it Train Drivers are still on 48 hour weeks (not so in other jurisdictions) but am open to correction. Also I’m quite sure there’s more to it than, as often quoted on here, “just pushing a lever up and down”!

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    Mute Phil Blanc
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:43 PM

    - It’s a PR disaster

    No. It’s not. DART management responded to customer need by offering a more regular service. It’s what good companies do for their customers.

    The unions, in their infinite wisdom, has a hissy fit and put a stop to service improvements.

    A driver can only drive one train at at time and the journey from Howth to Greystones, or wherever, will take as long as it takes now. They were not being asked to do any extra work, they were not being asked to work longer hours, they were being asked to adjust their shifts and new drivers would cover the increase in services. The unions, because they’re greedy ******* decided this was an opportunity to gouge the company (and by extension the tax payer) for a few extra quid.

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    Mute Hubba Jubbasure
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    Mar 31st 2016, 3:20 AM

    Juan.
    That’s all pretty much incorrect. Most train drivers in UK and continental Europe are on shorter working week and higher salary with better annual leave etc. Yes, for the most part it is not a physically arduous job but is very demanding mentally due to the importance of the safety aspect of the job. If you’ve seen many of the documentaries available you may get some idea. Sure, you can have management squeeze extra trains in and it’s just too bad for drivers???? Really? I’d say it would potentially be “too bad” for passengers too because this is exactly how accidents occur, fatigue is a serious problem and the human performance and limitations aspect is not receiving the attention it should, and who exactly will you be expecting to take the blame when disaster strikes? Google some of the post accident reports from the UK, Clapham etc. Increased frequency of services can happen much easier in other cities often simply because they don’t have the severe infrastructure deficiency we have here!

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    Mute Tom Purcell
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:12 AM

    The devil is in the detail – the hiring of new staff (which the unions should be happy about) will mean less need for the existing staff to work extra hours – namely LESS overtime money – as with everything else to do with these SIPTU/NBRU traitors it is all about greed and milking the system dry for its people and to hell with the ordinary working person – we are just pawns in the unions greed grab.

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    Mute Hubba Jubbasure
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    Mar 31st 2016, 3:37 AM

    Very disingenuous Tom.
    Overtime payments as you put it went 16 years ago for drivers.
    Do some research and don’t fall for the corporate spin doctoring that is being propagated.

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    Mute Cal Cryton
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:28 AM

    The only answer to this is privatization, outsourcing, contract work. Ensure the state is not employing anyone directly. This is the only way to get their wages to match the true market price of their labour (which in the case of train drivers is around the €20-25k per annum level). Enough of this nonsense.

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    Mute David Flynn
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:54 AM

    The states not employing anyone here. You’re thinking of civil servants. Anyway, I love how the Journal comments sections are always against big business and rich people AND against the workers as well.

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    Mute Cal Cryton
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:11 AM

    Are you seriously trying to claim Irish rail is not state funded? Your simple worker vs big business narrative belongs in the 19th century. There is such a thing as fairness, and you are not going to convince anyone that a train driver should be paid more than an engineer with years of university training behind them.

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    Mute Anthony Whelan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:56 AM

    Cal Badly paid engineers where? Any poorly paid engineer is obviously sh*#e at his job and should get employment at something else maybe shelf stacking. And Irish rail is not the only thing state funded your so called highly educated engineers whilst in collage their fees are partly subsidised by the ordinary tax payer. Try study and pay fees in America or England fool.

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:12 PM

    what is wrong with the points anthony is making cal your response lends me to think he is on the money and you have no answer.

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    Mute David Flynn
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:46 PM

    Follow your own argument back to its source then Cal. If people are to be paid in merit of how important somebody else percieves their job to be and you value train driver at 25k, then how much for a checkout worker? 10k a year? I think I’d rather have someone whose well paid and secure in their job, who has experience and knows what they’re doing driving my train, rather than an unskilled, under paid stressed out contractor who doesn’t know if he’ll have a job tomorrow.

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    Mute Martin Gallagher
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    Mar 30th 2016, 9:58 PM

    Come off it Cal, you’re suggesting that workers pay and conditions should depend purely on current market forces, as if that was a force of nature! To follow your logic would be the same as linking everything to the up’s and downs of the stock market?
    ‘….Trading today, shows a downturn in IT consultant earnings while there’s a huge increase in premium rates for carpenters and morticians’! Is that what you or anyone really wants? What utter economic drivel they must be teaching in universities, these days.

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    Mute njh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:35 AM

    what i don’t understand as a user of the DART everday during peak and off peak times (i’d love to know how many of the commentators here actually are regular users) is that
    a) vast majority of trains are on time and you can tell that quite easily by using the “app” on your phone. I would say less than 5% are delayed by more than 1 or 2 minutes.
    b) there are probably 3 DARTS each morning that are genuinely busy. People in Dublin don’t know what busy is. I’ve lived in other cities where you want to see a crush on a morning train. The Dublin DART is not it.

    I’d love to see the rational to increase the frequency of the trains. There are smarter ways of getting congestion down in Dublin. 1) car pooling for school runs 2) school buses 3) staggering of school/work commencement times between 8am and 9.30am. As widely discussed a lot of trains will go automated and driverless in time. I think drivers know that and are getting more protectionist as a result.

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    Mute Matty Reese
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:23 PM

    Some new metro builds are automated nowadays but it will be quite a while before the DART ever gets automated.

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    Mute James Xenophon
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:26 PM

    Because a truly efficient mass transit system doesn’t make people wait on a platform for 15 minutes for a train to arrive. Especially considering that most journeys also involves waits for connecting buses, trams or commuter trains. Most mass transit trains in most cities are not filled to capacity most of the time.

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    Mute Hubba Jubbasure
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    Mar 31st 2016, 3:34 AM

    James.
    Seriously, the infrastructure really does not exist! Try not to be taken in by the barrage of corporate spin emanating from IR. Currently you have dart frequency, outer suburban and commuter services, mainline rail services, freight services, empty train movements for maintenance and fleet positioning reasons and engineering trains to repair/maintain track and overhead electric lines. You still only have 2 tracks through the city so thats that screwed straight away! Add 1 breakdown or a passenger becoming ill or a fault at a level crossing and you may be beginning to see the idiocy behind the current plan. There are also not enough trains. The only way of increasing the frequency is to reduce each trains capacity by 50% e.g. a train that is currently 8 carriages long will become 2 trains of 4 carriages long! This is NOT what the customers want

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    Mute Pat Lally
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:08 PM

    I am reading this in donegal. I am just jealous that you have public transport. We have a bus to Dublin or Galway and that’s it. Higher wages will mean higher ticket prices and fewer customers on regional services. This will eventually close regional bus and train services. But pay parity for the well payed low skilled workers is more important than a society that would be good to live in with proper services.

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    Mute Lawrence Lynch
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:47 AM

    The unions will use any opportunity to get more pay for their workers, that is their job. So no surprise that after the cave into the LUAS drivers the DART drivers will follow suit. Yes they will need more drivers but it shouldn’t have to cost the customer more in fares, its already expensive by European standards, and i can tell you as a frequent user the efficiency and timeliness of the current service is far from European standards. You can be guaranteed a delay most times on your journey, id love to know where the stats come from of 90, 95 % on time trains , oh wait from Irishrail! Anyways nobody in the private sector gets more than 1-2 % raise per year if any at all, so why should they be any different, and in particular if there is state funding behind the operation and infrastructure they have been sheltered from the recession like a lot of public sector workers they never lost their jobs or lost their nice defined benefit pensions. The old bad habits of the Tiger are coming back…

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    Mute Phil Blanc
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:57 PM

    Super, once again the unions f**k the public over.

    They really are a blight on this country and have absolutely abandoned what they were created to do. They no longer protect workers from exploitation, it seems now they encourage their members to exploit the public.

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    Mute Brian Gunnip
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:22 PM

    How many people commenting on this actually take the DART every day? If the service increases to every 10 minutes it means an extra 5 minutes journey time from Bray to Connolly because of the already congested railways. As things currently stand there is no real congestion even at peak hours as long as Irish Rail run 8 carriage DART’s on every peak time journey.
    There is no requirement for extra DART services – as it is running a service every 15 mins is perfectly fine.
    More trains = Longer journeys – what is the point of that??

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    Mute Matty Reese
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:34 PM

    Im not sure you understand how signalling works. To increase frequency they have upgraded the signalling, probably shortened block sections to allow more trains on the line. Its not unusual for delays to occur in any rail system, even with a once hourly service breakdowns will cause problems. Are you saying we should have no trains and then there will be no delays?

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    Mute Pissy Lips
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    Mar 30th 2016, 1:24 PM

    I waited 18 minutes from 5.30pm for a Dart yesterday. As i mentioned on here before, Copenhagen, a city slightly smaller than Dublin, runs trains every 120 seconds at peak time and every 240 seconds off peak. Their 24 hour train service runs every 15 minutes from midnight to 5am … More frequent at 4 in the morning than ours at the height of rush hour.

    Transdev started the trend, but unions either need to put up or shut up, plenty of people will do the job and the country wont be held to ransom. The incoming Government needs to legislate against unions and protect the public and employer. Greedy shower, using public service as a bargaining chip, they were responsible for driving up inflation and wages in boom time and now the dust has settled they’re looking for farcical wage increases once again. This is unskilled work, a wage needs to be put on the table and you can either take or leave it, and your job.

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    Mute Ciaran Bradley
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:10 AM

    Delighted too hear it, all other rail users would have longer journey times due to being stuck in between darts.

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    Mute Irish Cottage Rental
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    Mar 30th 2016, 5:41 PM

    Demand goes up for a service – jobs become even more secure – unions torpedo a positive situation.

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    Mute Keith Gregg
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:03 AM

    Can they just run the trains faster? surely that would work

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    Mute Cal Cryton
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    Mar 30th 2016, 10:26 AM

    Keith you make a very good point about the ridiculously slow speeds of the Darts, even at the best of times.

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    Mute Paul Dunne
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    Mar 30th 2016, 11:57 AM

    keith the dart stops every two/three minutes has to wait for level crossings on the southside and howth branch and suburban services also so spedding up the darts is just impossible .

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    Mute Maria Hickey-Fagan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 2:03 PM

    Grand. I’ll be happy with an extra few carriages on the rush hour trains.

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    Mute Rachel Walsh
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    Mar 30th 2016, 5:06 PM

    Never saw that coming, how much are the unions looking for? christ!

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    Mute Niall Mulligan
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    Mar 30th 2016, 12:41 PM

    10 minute Darts? Is this like 6 minute ABS?

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