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British PM David Cameron and Scottish First Minister Alex Salmond pictured in June 2011. Andrew Milligan/PA Wire/Press Association Images

Scotland insists it has mandate for independence referendum in 2014

And it wants to hold it on its own terms, defying the wishes of the UK government in Wesminster which wants the vote to be held sooner.

THE SCOTTISH FIRST Minister Alex Salmond has insisted that his government has a mandate to hold a referendum on independence from the UK and will do so in the autumn of 2014, defying the the wishes of the UK government to hold it sooner.

While the UK says that Scotland cannot legally hold a referendum without its authority, Salmond is adamant that British Prime Minister David Cameron has “no mandate” to set the rules and suggested this morning that any attempt to do so would “increase support for independence”.

While Salmond yesterday said Scotland would hold an independence referendum in the autumn of 2014 – the 700th anniversary of the decisive Battle of Bannockburn during the First War of Scottish Independence – Cameron wants the issue to be sorted out sooner.

Speaking on BBC Radio 4′s Today programme this morning, Salmond said that Cameron had “suddenly this week decided to start pulling strings and setting conditions.”

“I thought his [Cameron's] intervention at the weekend was almost Thatcher-esque in its nature, the idea that London knows best and it is operating in our best interests but wanting to set the ground rules for our referendum despite the fact it has got no mandate whatsoever for doing so,” Salmond told the programme.

The leader of the Scottish National Party claimed the UK government’s Scottish Secretary Michael Moore had previously said the issue of a referendum was “entirely a matter for the Scottish government”.

He also denied that in potentially wanting a third option on any prospective ballot paper that he was seeking a “get out clause”.

Salmond said there needed to be a debate beyond a straightforward question of whether Scotland should be in or out of the UK as the Westminster government is keen for.

He said there needed to be a discussion about “a legitimate point of view” that there be a third option for voters, that being ‘devo max’ which would provide increased financial powers for the Scottish government but stop short of full independence from the UK.

As well as being at odds over the timing of a referendum and the ballot paper options, the Scottish and UK administrations differ on who should run the process and what the voting age should be with Scotland advocating that 16 and 17-year-olds be allowed to vote in the referendum.

The BBC’s political editor Nick Robinson has suggested that the dispute could lead to a historic Supreme Court battle between Westminster and Holyrood.

Explainer: What’s happening in Scotland?

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18 Comments
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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:04 PM

    The German Interior Minister was recently reported as saying that he reckons that there is going to be a new influx of migrants into Germany which will be even bigger than the one in 2015.Consifering that a lot of these will be from Syria it’s fair to say that a good number of them will be ex ISIS or head hacking “moderate” rebels. Will Germany be so welcoming of them this time around?

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    Mute ➕The Gray➕
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:17 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: It won’t effect the political class living in their gated communities, with armed security paid for by the taxpayers.

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    Mute Brenda Malloy
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:20 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: awful lot of conjecture based on no facts

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    Mute David Jordan
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:20 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: This is because of the imminent Turkish invasion of Syria, they are gearing up to ethnically cleanse Rojava, the Kurdish self governing region of north Syria. The Turks see them as an extension of the PKK. If there is a wave of refugees over this, time it will be Kurds, and Kurds fought ISIS.

    And here some of the 9000 Kurdish fighters and Western volunteers who lost their lives fighting ISIS:

    https://youtu.be/9HugQS0jIPI

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    Mute David F O'Connell
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:39 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: You might post the link which identifies the attackers as Syrian…

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    Mute David F O'Connell
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:39 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: You might post the link which identifies the attackers as Syrian…

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    Mute David F O'Connell
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:39 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: You might post the link which identifies the attackers as Syrian…

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:51 PM

    @Brenda Malloy: Conjecture? https://www.thelocal.de/20180313/three-syrians-jailed-over-is-sleeper-cell

    You’d want a hole in your head to think that this isn’t happening.https://www.thedailybeast.com/isis-smuggler-sleeper-cells-and-undead-suicide-bombers-have-infiltrated-europe
    Ask any clued in security, police or intelligence offical or analyst if IS and other terrorists are infiltrating Europe and you will get an affirmative answer every time.

    IS are exploiting the fold of migrants into Europe to put their people in place. Immigration officials are overwhelmed with refugee requests and so it is easier for IS sleepers to slip through the cracks. At least in Ireland, the Syrians that we grant asylum to are checked out as thoroughly as possible. Germany on the other hand just let anyone and everyone in. Some of them are even going back on holidays to the countries that they claimed they are being persecuted in! Germany is facing an increasing threat of imported terrorism and there is no conjecture about that.

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:09 PM

    @David F O’Connell: I never said they were Syrian, I said that ” a lot of these will be from Syria”. IS is made up of a melting pot of nationalities but the main nationalities in Syria/Iraq are made up of Syrians and Iraqis. The rest are from Central Asia (AF/Pak), the various “stans”, Bangledesh, along with Europeans and a handful of other countries.

    IS has a very well-financed intelligence network that is expert at producing false documents for its infiltrators. So even if someone arrives into the immigration office claiming to be Syrian, Iraqi or any other nationality the chances are that they could be from anywhere.

    Hell, in Ireland you don’t even need a passport to get in here. https://www.independent.ie/regionals/argus/news/man-used-fake-passport-to-seek-irish-citizenship-38548088.html
    “The defendant left war-torn Somali as an asylum seeker. He didn’t have a passport or documentation when he came here in 2011.”
    How did he manage to get on a flight from Somalia (min 2 stops) and waltz into Ireland without a passport or any sort of documentation? IF that’s just one guy in Ireland then how is Germany going to cope with hundreds of thousnds probably doing the same thing in the future?

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    Mute Patricia Mcnamara
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:10 PM

    @Brenda Malloy: common sense I would say.

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    Mute Peter Hughes
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:16 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: 30K people get killed in the US by guns alone every year…..so please so explain what exactly is your point?

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:33 PM

    @Peter Hughes: This story is about a shooting in Germany and you are going on about gun deaths in the US. Why don’t you explain your point?

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    Mute ➕The Gray➕
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:42 PM

    @Peter Hughes:

    60% of those would be suicide. So what’s your point?

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    Mute Peter Hughes
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:49 PM

    @➕The Gray➕: Rubbish but even if it were true it still leaves 10K…….whats your point?

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    Mute ➕The Gray➕
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:57 PM

    @Peter Hughes:
    10k, accidental & homicide. What has that got to do with this article?

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:13 PM

    @Peter Hughes: https://www.pewresearch.org/fact-tank/2019/08/16/what-the-data-says-about-gun-deaths-in-the-u-s/

    “Though they tend to get less attention than gun-related murders, suicides have long accounted for the majority of U.S. gun deaths. In 2017, six-in-ten gun-related deaths in the U.S. were suicides (23,854), while 37% were murders (14,542), according to the CDC. The remainder were unintentional (486), involved law enforcement (553) or had undetermined circumstances (338).

    Considering that you commented “Rubbish but even if it were true” the fact that you are unsure of yourself and didn’t bother to do a simple bit of research, is it any surprise that you are confusing an article about a shooting in Germany with gun deaths in the US?

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    Mute Bob Earner
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:15 PM

    I see the racists and xenophobes are out.

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    Mute David F O'Connell
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:58 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: Again, where’s the link that identifies the murderers as being IS, or immigrants..?

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 4:40 PM

    @David F O’Connell: I presume that you are totally ignoring my previous reply rebutting your assertion that I ever said that the attackers were Syrian or are members of IS. Oh no wait, you must have read it because now you have dropped your claim that I said they were Syrians and you are now focusing on IS and immigrants. So after been shown up for trying to put words in my mouth you have now put your head down and changed tack!

    Ok, lets see who might possibly have attacked a synagogue. We haven’t heard much from the Judean People’s Front for a while but I doubt it’s them. It could be neo-Nazi’s/Far-Right extremists, however, most of their attacks are arson, stabbing and pipe bombs so if it is them then this is a major departure and upscale in violence on their part. The most obvious culprits are Islamists aligned to IS or AQ.

    Whoever carried it out it’s a fair bet that is was Islamists seeing as how they have carried out twice as many attacks as FR/neo’s. It could be a copycat of the Whitechurch shootings. My money is still on Islamists.

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    Mute David F O'Connell
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    Oct 9th 2019, 5:45 PM
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    Mute Lisa Saputo
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    Oct 9th 2019, 6:20 PM

    @David F O’Connell: He sounds like a lot of the lads that post on here.

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    Oct 9th 2019, 6:36 PM

    @Lisa Saputo: Straight in with the “it must have been migrants”

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    Mute Lisa Saputo
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    Oct 9th 2019, 7:30 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: You lost your bet so. It’s a German lad.

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    Mute Brenda Malloy
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    Oct 9th 2019, 8:02 PM

    @Patricia Mcnamara: I guess you were wrong.

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    Oct 9th 2019, 8:04 PM

    @CBD Suppliers: I guess you were wrong.

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    Mute Clifford Brennan
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    Oct 9th 2019, 1:25 PM

    RIP to the victims. Other reports say that the shooting happened outside a synagogue and that an explosive device was thrown into an adjacent Jewish cemetery. One suspect has been arrested apparently. Today is Yom Kippur, the holiest day of the year for Jewish folk.

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    Mute Darren B
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:08 PM

    So much hate directed at Jews nowadays. You have a lot to answer for Mr. Corbyn.

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    Mute Patricia Mcnamara
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:11 PM

    @Darren B: ISRAELIS???

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    Mute CBD Suppliers
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:11 PM

    @Darren B: LOL. You’re blaming Jeremy Corbyn for some nutter shooting up a synagogue in Germany! Why don’t you just blame Brexit and the Russians while you are at it?

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    Mute jamesdecay
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:24 PM

    @Darren B: A good day to troll hard, it seems

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    Mute Mjhint
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    Oct 9th 2019, 2:49 PM

    @Patricia Mcnamara: interesting anti semitism. Not all Israelis are Jews. Not all Jews are Israeli. Corbyn is in part to blame but so is the rampant anti semitism in Europe which is always a sign bad things are coming.

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    Mute SC
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:15 PM

    @Darren B: You can be opposed to Israel and not be anti-Semitic. It’s not anti Christian to oppose European actions, it’s not Islamophobic to disagree with Isis.

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    Mute John
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:23 PM

    @Darren B: Ive read some tripe on here but this takes the biscuit.

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    Mute Ian Breathnach
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:56 PM

    @Darren B: You’re blaming Corbyn? You are an absolute *Insert expletive here*

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    Mute Rosie
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    Oct 9th 2019, 3:05 PM

    The Jewish people settled here after the war, they were refugees from the Camps and others. They buckled down, worked hard, mixed in, were gracious and mannerly and yet went to their synagogue. There was never any ‘Jew hatred’ for them.
    They went on to be some of the biggest clothing companies employed hundreds of Irish people of all religions. What’s the problem ? corbyn is not an anti semitic.

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    Mute ➕The Gray➕
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    Oct 9th 2019, 9:24 PM

    @Rosie:
    His Hezbollah and Hamas friends would disagree.

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