Anyone here know what the words for ‘HUMANITARIAN CEASEFIRE’ are in Arabic? Maybe one of the Irish dhimmi can translate and transmit to Hamas.

It’s hardly Israel’s fault that Hamas can’t restrain themselves for firing rockets for two hours.

The only solution I can imagine is that the citizens of both countries come out and form a human shield of both cultures …will that happen ?
War exists because “men of peace” are by and large people who are either too far removed from the political machinations or too busy worrying if the next bomb will fall on their kid’s heads.

Dermot, I normally red thumb your comments but you’re making a lot of sense tonight.

Fog, that didn’t stop the IDF resuming bombing despite ambulances being inside gaza

How many Jewish kids killed by them its like fighting a pen knife vs a gun. You think after holocaust Jews would understand doing this to the Palestinian people is wrong

I’m not anti Jewish just anti pointless slaughter

‘How many Jewish kids killed by them its like fighting a pen knife vs a gun.’ So you’d imagine Hamas would do the rational thing and accept the ceasefire wouldn’t you?

While the world looks to blame Russia for shooting down of a passenger plane, America backed isreal kills people at will in Gaza. What a world we live in, anyone else get the feeling that plane was just shot down to distract us

Anybody who wilfully joins an army is signing themselves up for possible death. I have no sympathy for such people. Fundamentally, it’s these bozos who enable wars. Countries that conscript people should be targeted. Doesn’t make business sense though.

Thanks Mark … I am sure I will get over whatever is wrong and normal service will resume ; cheers dude !

Mark ; it only makes business sense to those who profit from war ….. It makes no sense to me who is paying more for petrol because there is “conflict” in the middle east.
the figures put forward for America’s cost of Iraq vary but I imagine if America had kept those “trillions” on their space programme or on medical research and found the cure for cancer for example …. I’d say they could make a fortune out of that cure , as an example, and buy all the oil in Iraq and if Saddam didn’t play ball they just leaflet the Iraqis and let them know that Saddam won’t buy the cure for cancer from the friendly caring americans. Saddam would fall and this “American dream” of democracy and equality might actually become a reality if that is what’s best for everyone !
Or to put it very simply every american bullet kills a potential customer !

Oh come on Fognostical and Scipio! Everyone here knows that I am usually an Israeli supporter. But this is disgusting me. I recognise Israel’s right to exist and defend themselves. But what is happening now is pure slaughter. It’s disgusting and barbaric. Yes, I know Hamas are pure evil. But the majority of the people (women and children especially) being killed have nothing to do with this.

Mark, spot on, I don’t think there is a better way to put it. Conscription should be banned in human rights charters though, we can not consider ourselves free if our freedom can be taken at any moment in the interests of others, that’s feudalism.

@ cosmos creamer …. actually it is going on for the last 3 years just 100 miles up the road from Gaza 175, 000 dead and 27 people were blown to pieces in Baghdad yesterday inside 10 min, but hay, no one gives a flying f**k funny! no real mention, because Israel didn’t do it!

The greatest genocide in history happened to jews, every nation around Israel wants to obliterate them….. The dumb here is incredible….. All you intellects really think you are intelligent…. Really pathetic.

@Taxi Bill
Who planted the car bomb in Baghdad? Would you like to defend them? Similar to Assad/Sisi/Chad/CAR I don’t think you would find anyone who would spend their entire day, as many on here do, justifying the horrific actions of morally bankrupt groups and nations. Why? Maybe because Israel isn’t involved..

@ Graham: “The greatest genocide in history happened to jews,”

No, the greatest genocide in history happened to the Native Americans. The greatest ACT of genocide in history (and greatest crime) was the Holocaust, which happened to jews. It is not disrespectful to the victims of the Holocaust to acknowledge what happened to the Native Americans.

Dermot the cure for most cancer has been found but it does not suit the big pharmaceutical companies as they will lose billions as all their drugs will become obsolete watch this doc

Watch “Dr. Burzynski: Part I – Cancer Is Serious Busines…” on YouTube
Dr. Burzynski: Part I – Cancer Is Serious Busines…: http://youtu.be/iqJ_709pL5Y

Any human that pulls a trigger that results in the needless death of any child is wrong…absolutely wrong, and there is no exception or good reason. There is no right in this situation… Both sides are categorically wrong. But the thoughts of an innocent child, probably not even old enough to learn about their heritage, losing their life is heartbreaking, and I don’t care what side of the divide they live on, stop this madness

Fognistical & Ron. Well said. What is the matter with Irish people when it is written in black&white that Hamas broke the ceasefire and both your accurate comments in relation to that have been majorly disagreed with. Heads in the sand with blinkers on. It’s bizarre……

If my son was laid out on a slab with half his face blown away I’d head for the nearest rocket launcher… Do people really think that Palestinian people were born with rocket in their hands? If I kick our family dog long enough I know he’ll bit the leg off me… Of all the people on the planet I thought the Jews would of known what it was like to be wiped out.. They can not use the Holocaust as an excuse anymore..

Don’t think @Graham Kavanagh knows how long or why Israel has existed.

They don’t want to wipe out a nation. They are destroying the tunnels which are used to attack them. They are safeguarding their country from escalating terrorist attacks. Make no mistake if the power was reversed there wouldn’t be one Jew in Israel.

Israelis have become as bad as their former oppressors, I agree with that.

@ Marcus O Connor, I have no idea who planted bombs or any of the other HUNDRED in the last few years, resulting in thousands of deaths in busy markets where people are just doing a bit of shopping.

My point as I have made many times here is the utter hypocrisy of so many on these threads, THE ONLY DEATHS THEY EVEN THINK ABOUT ARE PEOPLE KILLED BY ISRAEL OR THE US. None of the probably few million warrants a protest ,let alone a march in London, Dublin or Ennis, which would lead any sane person to say, they dont give a F**k about the casualties they just care about who the perpetrator is,

This same hypocrisy is not a new thing and has gone on at least as far back as 1967 (probably farther) when the arab countries did their best to DESTROY ( and make no mistake they would have destroyed the country completely and butchered the Jews in their tens of thousands) Israel.

@ Gillian Foale… That is their stated aim ( as they teach their little kids on TV “KILL ALL THE JEWS” look it up! . followed fairly quickly by “getting rid of all “infidels” (Christians Druse etc) from the middle east!

Just heard that an Israeli soldier has been captured by Hamas. Expect to see his name and photo carpetbombing the world media for the next 24 hours. There shall be no such coverage for the 2 year old blown to pieces in Beit Lahia earlier today.

The toddlers name was Nagham Mahmoud al-Zouaydi. At least their name will appear on one western news site thanks to this post.

thanks Richard ; cancer is being looked into as well by an irish filmmaker Nicky Larkin ; it concentrates on a man who changes diet to reduce acidity I think working off memory …

Red thumbs for a cure for cancer I really do have a fan club

Problem with all these conspiracy theories is that they never take into consideration the vast numbers of people who would have to keep quiet. What about the guy who could be the the most famous/richest person in the world? Amazing how intelligent people get involved with this nonsense.

No taxi it was done by another US backed terrorist group. Paid and armed by the US. Same as Israel. The war is Syria is paid for and armed by the US. The war in Ukraine was paid for by the US. Anything else you wanna say Taxi? Now go and crawl.

R maybe u will come out from your ridiculous trolling avator

Bull Gillian. You talk as if this has gone on for a few weeks. Its been going on for decades. The exact same cycle.
Cop on, there is a lot more to this than finding a single point with which to justify thuggish actions.

No reply from these tin foil heads, the usual. Ignore anything that’s logical. Wahey

Everyone!!! Have we all lost sight of the fact that innocent children are being killed… The madness has to stop… For no other reason except nobody can condone the killing of children… Both sides are messed up… And completely wrong….instead of arguing the rights and wrongs… Could we make an effort to stop children being killed..

Where do you get the impression that I think this has been going on for a few weeks? Where do you get the impression I justified thuggish behaviour? This has been going on since the building if the pyramids. I made my comments knowing the full history, on both sides.

@Taxi Bill

I’m sorry that you feel it is hypocrisy but who exactly are you referring to as “they”? As in the ones who don’t care about other deaths. I have seen millions of people turn out against austerity and in favour of civil rights, yet they are not as serious issues as what was happening in Darfur or the Congo, do you mean to say that people should not be allowed to protest what they want? That one could not give out about pylons going through the Midlands if they weren’t also worried about the provision of electricity in Calcutta.

You make a very curious point and a rather ridiculous correlation. That because I am opposed to the horrific actions of Israel and Hamas and want to end the slaughter by all in Gaza that I must not care about anything else whatsoever in the world, as if I cared even one iota for 400 people I should spread all my attention over 7 billion people and if I don’t I’m a hypocrite.

Just for fun I will accuse you of the same thing. Why do YOU care so much about the situation in Gaza? Why aren’t YOU doing more for the Muslims in Burma or to end the stratospheric inequality in Equatorial Guinea? Why would anything anybody says about Israel matter to you considering it is such a relatively insignificant portion of the world’s population?

@ Gillian

“They are destroying the tunnels which are used to attack them.”

Have you actually seen the pictures of Israeli tanks launching thousands of shells indiscriminately into densely populated areas? They are on every news site and probably seem innocuous enough, but as those shells have a wide variation in where they land (they’re not rockets) this means that the reality is that they are quite literally hurling thousands and thousands of projectiles into an area which they know full well will result in overwhelmingly civilian casualties.

It of course seems logical that they want to destroy Hamas’ tunnels, they can sell that idea to anyone but in buying that do not believe that they are justified in the wanton slaughter of women and children.

Taxi Bill, nail on head. They only care when the perpetrators look a bit pale and/or are American allies.

Mark Kelly, I know very well the plight of the Jewish people and eternal struggle for a settled homeland, despite your attempts at being smart. I also know both sides are wrong, and also the fact that whether we like it or not, Israel stands in the way of extreme Islamic ‘spiritual murderers’ being at Europes doorstep. Do you think they would stop at Israel? Hamas have an agenda, extinction of the Jewish race. Jews have an agenda too, right to survive and to live peacefully. It was not jews that launch mortars mindlessly into civilian areas. Also, what started this latest round of violence was the kidnap and butchering of a teen Jew. But the response has been over the top.
@ werejammin, granted, but I do not think they expected that to unfold the way it did, but disgusting nontheless.
Many here think they are clinging to a cause, but look so fvckng stupid.

Mark if we look at the conflict in the North then keeping quiet a lot of people worked very well in light of the evidence that is coming to light now.
the role of mass manipulation of the masses is something that has being going on since man decided that a king or leader was a good idea…the hieroglyphs in Egypt etc. to monarch’s heads on coin.
confusion is often enough to prevent corrective action . Another thing about humanity is that it is only truly tested when it comes into their own backyard…… the power brokers of the world know this.
I could suggest that Hamas has been infiltrated by Mossad and point out that it suited the superpower in the region to agree to the ceasefire and thus extend the “right to defend”. I could draw parallels with the Smithwick tribunal in Ireland relying totally on MI5 information for the narrative and so forth…
Another thing you have to remember is that if the overall plan is kept secret by the few then people can be working away on a “death ray ” thinking they are in fact building a motor for a new wheelchair – as an outlandish example.
Every super power has Secret Files and top secret files so how many really know what conspiracy or what hidden agenda is being adhered to.
The only thing I would say is that politicians are very adept at talking in circles of smoke and for many of their loyal supporters that’s enough because they are too busy getting on with the mundanity of life and following traditional patterns; going to church , going to work etc.
I have thought about conspiracy theory for a long time and the only conclusion I can come to is that Evil holds very powerful reins in the world today ; it is the only conclusion I can come to!
What that means I do not know and I could be wrong but conspiracy theory keeps getting proven correct..

Marcus nothing justifies the killing of innocent civilians. Be it men, women or children. Likewise nor does using women & children as human shield or barring women from shelter. But the fact that Israel have set out to destroy those tunnels is just that. Fact. They didn’t just wake up one morning and decide to knock lumps out of Gaza. Sitting at a table hasn’t worked for decades. Half of the time Palestine wouldn’t even come to the table. They pulled out of Gaza 9 years ago. Yet, 450 rockets have been fired at them this year. This is boiling point for Israel and they mean business. What would you want your government to do if terrorist rockets where being randomly launched in your direction? It’s horrific to see the images and footage from Gaza, all I can say is the best we can hope for now is an intervention that brings about some kind to resolution between these two.

Murdering innocent women and children is despicable. If it was your children you would have a very different view!

You are trying to justify murder. Sick!

A very different view? As opposed to what? Where have I suggested otherwise, exactly?

What are you on about Joe? Everything in my comments refers to actual events. The facts of the matter. The reality of it. Sorry if that offends you!

The genocide of the jews in europe was nowhere near the worst atrocities in the last century, it just happens to be the only o.e we are reminded constantly of. What about the 20,000,000 chinese butchered by the japanese? Or the 27,000,000 russians butchered by the germans? It beggars belief why we must appease the israelis because they control the media….its time the world woke up to this disgrace that we have to accept what the z ionists do to further their agenda with impunity but ignore facts from our past. The israeli government have learned well from the nazis on how to carry out genocide while deflecting blame and we as citizens of the world allow them to keep murdering and butchering innocents and then cry about the holocaust when some people criticize them. Shame on them and shame on us

Gillian, the pulled out of where? Take a look:

http://whatreallyhappened.com/IMAGES/mapstellstory/jews_stealing_palestine.png

Israel are an occupying force, as such, they are the terrorists.

20 mil chinese butchered, 27 million russians butchered, OR left to die by own people or forced to face German tanks by ‘superiors’, both not systemic elimination of an entire race as Hitler tried. Again, I said none of this is right, but there are two sides to this. Palestinians are suffering at the hands of Hamas, who are mainly Lebanese terrorists, not Palestinians.

I’m familiar with those maps Michael but I fail to see how they relate to anything I’ve said regarding the build up to recent events since ’05 at least. Hamas need to stop launching on Israel. They aren’t equipped to fight them. That is both my opinion and the as I’ve said already, the reality of it.

So by your rationale the chinese and russian deaths are not as important as the jewish deaths because you feel they were “left ” to die by their own people? You think that to kill 20,000,000 people over 5 years was not systemic ? Like it or not the way we are fed the history of world war 2 to believe that the holocaust was the only war crime is bulls@#t. The 6,000,000 jews slaughtered was terrible but in perspective it was still only a fraction of the civillian casualties. They are not a greater loss than those of china or russia or any other victims for that matter. A jewish life is worth no more or less in my eyes, so the holocaust should not be allowed to be used as an excuse for the ethnic cleansing of another people

IDF chief of staff + Netanyahu should be charged with war crimes because of what they are doing to poor little children.

What are u on about mark in the grand scheme of this article and the posts that followed? Israel does enforce conscription to their army.

Israeli murdering skum

It has to be Mark or we will all stop “happening” !
“I don’t know what weapons will be used for World war 3 but world war 4 will be fought with sticks and stones !” ……….Albert Einstein.

Very well said…you are absolutely right.

Silent Majority…my comment was supporting your view.

I don’t disagree with you btw, Silent Majority. One of the few people here I normally agree with.

I know you weren’t mark, and your reply was correct. Unfortunately it just vindicated the last sentence of my initial post. It’s still a sad conclusion to have to come to all the same.

Eh no it’s not

Jenni, have a look at what sky news won’t show http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=06d_1405859690 I think you of all people here need to have a look.

If you steal my land, bomb my homes, kill my children, don’t expect my hand of friendship.

I’d give readers a bit more credit than that, and assume that most people do read most of the article.

Its a direct quote from bibi – I think intention of using it as the headline is for the reader to question the credibility of the statement, not to get behind Israel.

To be fair derek I read it with the commas. They suggested to me that the quote was from a brainwashed genocidal Israeli politician.
I think the journal has sometimes been lazy but it insults the intelligence of people who do actually read to say that a headline like this is irresponsible.

I read the full article and Derek makes a fair point. I have never seen a quote from Hamas upfront…

Shame on the Journal!! There are bodies strewn in the streets as a result of the massacre today and the Israeli PM has the nerve to say he cares about civilians?

Hamas might aswell bury these kids themselves. They know exactly what the consequences of firing rockets into Israeli are. Like taking on an assault rifle with a pencil. And before anybody says otherwise, I don’t support either side.

It’s a deliberately misleading headline… It’s what the western media are good at when it comes to Gaza, nothing to do with the journalists, it’s a systematic problem and it comes down to big money corrupting the media because of vested interests….And innocent kids die because of it.

If you really care about Palestinians then stop supporting Hamas and the other Islamofascists who are grinding them down and stealing their money not to mention their lives.

Totally agree. Journal shame on you.

I agree that this is a seriously biased headline. Why didn’t you ask Hamas for a quote about how they think Israel wants to kill them?

Oh, I know, it’s because Israel have silenced and imprisoned the whole of Gaza.

Why aren’t we seeing journalists in Gaza? Oh right, because Israel doesn’t allow them in.

If you can’t get similar access to quotes from Hamas and the Palestinians then you should not allow the Israelis free reign to control the message.

Are you sure about that Mark?

The problem is that you should have been more responsible with the wording of the headline Christine. Very misleading. You cant excuse it by saying ‘read the article’.

I’m not trying to excuse it, Brian. The article makes it very clear the context in which the quote was said. Given that there are a few people unhappy with it, I’ll change it though.

Thanks Christine.

I don’t think you should have felt pressurised to change the headline Christine. The Journal’s coverage on Gaza has overall been very balanced, and this article is certainly not biased towards Israel.

After this complaint are we now to believe that any headline which quotes Putin has a pro-Russian bias, any headline which quotes Obama has a pro-US bias, any headline which quotes Enda has a pro-FG bias etc. etc. etc.??

This really is an insult to the intelligence of the Journal’s readership.

Featherstone – such a generic question. What?

Israel doesnt target civilians because they are the “good guys” in Americas and Europes view……..

Your a liar Jenni and you continually come here spouting the Israeli propaganda. You are an apologist for the slaughter of the innocents. You’re hands drips with the blood of children and you come in here spouting your one sided peace shite. I’m sure the Israelis and US look after you well..

@jenni. Even if Hamas is doing the things you say it does not absolve israel of its obligations under international and humanitarian law. You are defending war criminals.

@ Sean

You keep raising the same point and I keep saying that although
I disagree with war, I would assume that “factoring civilian death into the equation” is quite a normal thing to do in war.

We may not like it but it would be worse if they didn’t factor it in as my guess would be that the death toll would be a hell of a lot higher.

If the IDF really wanted to kill all Palestinians, they’d have done it by now

@ Gerry I’m a liar? Disprove me then

@ wj I never said it absolves them

i think the rate the IDF are going its a possibility…do you agree with the IDF using flehette shells as reported in todays guardian

Stunning how much people put 2 and 2 together and assume they have all parts if the equation.

@ Sean no I don’t

@jenni, I am getting sick of these lies repeated ad nauseam by you to justify the Israeli campaign of terror. Tell me, where are these people supposed to go to??? THERE ARE NO SAFE AREAS IN GAZA!!! Israel disgrace themselves once again in the eyes of the world. As a parent of two children, I would never EVER condone a side I supported carrying out these murderous acts. Yet you do repeatedly… Tell me, who is the one that supports terrorism here?! Il give you a clue, it’s not me!!

PS tank shells are not laser guided. Only a ragime hell bent on collective punishment would use them in such circumstances. Was it due to the fact the 13 invaders were killed last night that made Israel obliterate women and children?

@ Tony – I assume you’re talking about me? I actually know a huge amount about this conflict and unlike some I read books and proper articles about it rather than just accepting the perceived truth.

My comment was to Nigel who has also been posting on this topic for 10 days and made a comment with the attempt of being sensational. It was a silly comment that deserved a silly reply

Jenny, care to recommend any books?

@Jenni “IDF advise civilians to leave these areas” LOL. How many kids have to be blown up deliberately by your IDF buddies before stop supporting what they’re doing?

Jenni – According to others, Hamas have concrete bunkers to protect themselves… but not their weapons?

You have consistently maintained that Hamas should not put weapons in civilian areas. Please answer the question, WHERE in your opinion should Hamas be storing their weapons?

Jenni you are either naive or dump. Where else would you suggest they store there weapons. Maybe the should hide them in the sea. Do you know that Gaza is populated by 1.8 million people. Where in Gaza do you think that Hamas should try to defend there people from, maybe the sea, forgot Israelis control that to. . I honestly don’t believe you that you support the war crimes commuted upon the Pakistan people. But your comments come accross as if you are defending the murder of nation. Can you defend this, can you blame these people for there own deathhttp://youtu.be/ztoyLM40_mY

@ Chris I constantly say that:

I support peace.

I do not agree with war.

I do not agree with innocent people dying.

I support Israel’s right to exist.

I support a Palestinian state.

I am sick to death of hearing the same lines and accusations from you over and over with no solutions.

None of the anti Israel activists on here will answer my question because rather than be constructive, it’s more sensational for you to post things like “you support child murder”, “Israel is ethnic cleansing”, etc. So Chris … Please tell me. If you were in a position of power, what would you do ????

You ask me where should the people of Gaza go?

They should march on the Egyptian border to demand that the Arab league step in and stop Hamas. They should demand refugee status in Jordan to allow the UN to come in and demilitarise Hamas. They should then pressurise the PA to enter peace talks to once again start a 2 state solution. They should be given billions of aid money to build their economy and infrastructure up so that they can prosper in peace.

Please have the manners to answer my question.

@Jenni

“If the IDF really wanted to kill all Palestinians, they’d have done it by now”

Wow, just wow.

Kris you wouldn’t read them so what’s the point?

@ Allen we’ve had this conversation before. If they are “my ” IDF buddies then you may want to have a chat with “your Hamas buddies “

@ RH if a legitimate party was put in place if Hamas (ie a party who actually want a peaceful 2 state solution) there would be no need for weapons at all

Sorry bpa until you answer my question I’m not answering yours. I don’t speak Arabic so your video is kind if useless. It shows dead bodies. Will I send you pictures of dead Israelis from the suicude bombings back in the early 2000′s. Will that help solve the conflict ?

@ Allen … Taking my words out if context. Wow just wow

@jenny, name your books, I will name you mine, no problem. What are you afraid of??

@jenni You want the Palestinians to leave for the borders and demand refugee status in other Arab country’s and while they are gone the Israelis can bulldoze the whole place and build nice little settlements for themselves.. Stay classy!!

Without going into ancient history how did this current conflict begin?

@jenny, I find it hard to believe that you support peace. I find it hard to believe you when you say that you don’t believe in war. Your comments over the last few days lead me to question that. This is just the same Hasbara line reiterated by Israeli spokespeople as they are pulverising women and children at the very same time. Nethanyahu is for peace isn’t he?? He would certainly say so..
If I was in power I would engage peacefully with Hamas through diplomatic channels. I would not kill over 450 people in a war that neither side can win. Negotiate! How Gazans march to the Rafah crossing when the area has been declared a war zone by your beloved IDF???!!! Where many women and children were killed over the past few days by tank shells, by shells from the sea, by missiles from the air??!! And why should a people that exercised their democratic right to vote for Hamas now go to a border (a declared war zone) to call for the people that they elected to be “stopped”. Please try and think constructively and realistically. The PA have absolutely no credibility even in the West Bank at this stage, yet you think that they will enter into “peace talks” without Hamas. BS!!

Lastly. For you to propose that an already dispossessed people go to Jordan, to be dispossessed once again just shows your true Z1onist belief and ideals. Implement UN resolution 194, they have every right to return to land that Israel won by conquest. And get the hell out of the West Bank. It is PALESTINE!

@Jenni
What so Bombing the crap out of them is a solution?

@ kris no probs … The 4 found the most helpful are:
The case for Israel – Alan Dershowitz
From time immemorial – Joan peters
The six day war – Michael Oren
Gaza in crisis – Noam Chomsky
Apart from Chomsky, there was another pro Palestine book but I can’t remember the name

@ John that’s not what i said

@ John Burke … Do u mean current as in 10 days ago, 6 months ago, 5 years ago, 10 years, 40 years, 69 years ? This isolated conflict can’t be taken out if context

@ Chris ( maybe you’ll start spelling my name correctly too?) I genuinely am
interested in yours.

Jenni (sorry! Spelt your name right this time), you should have saved your money and just bought one book. As the case for Israel and from time immemorial are the same book!! Alan Dershowitz disgraced himself as I am sure you will agree? I would highly recommend “Beyond Chutzpah” by Norman finkelstein. It explains all of this in minute detail. I would also recommend “pity the nation” by Robert Fisk. Or one to really open your eyes “the ethnic cleansing of Palestine” by Illan Pappe. There are more obv but these are ones I would specifically recommend.

Jenni, Nethanyahu said this week , there will never be a Palestinian state, how can you believe his government have any intention of a two state solution when they continue to build illegal settlements and annex land where this Palestinian state is supposed to be formed. Israel has moved hundreds of thousands of its citizens onto the West Bank since the Oslo peace accords all the time creating’ facts on the ground’, breaking its commitments ignoring deadlines and constantly moving the goal posts of they demands from the Palestinians before negotiating , they must recognise Israels right to exist , when this is agreed , you must recognise Israel as a Jewish state, even though a fifth of its population are non Jewish. We cannot speak to the PA because they do not represent all of the Palestinians , when they are divided, and we will not speak to them when they unite because Hamas are terrorists. The occupation is destroying Israel , try reading Uri Avernys columns for a real peace seeking view from the Israeli side. They amount of troops they are losing this time will not be tolerated for long in Israel , that is why they left South Lebanon in 2000, Hamas will only get stronger ,their rockets can reach all parts of Israel , they have used drones for the first time and are using tunnels to enter Israel, all unheard of before now, Israel needs to make peace now from a position of strength based on the 1967 borders before even the US abandons it and it becomes a complete pariah.