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Chief of Staff of the Defence Forces Vice Admiral Mark Mellett. Irish Defence Forces

Outgoing head of Defence Forces says Government cuts to military have caused 'frustration'

Vice Admiral Mark Mellett is set to retire in the coming months from his role as Chief of Staff of the Defence Forces.

OUTGOING CHIEF OF Staff of the Defence Forces Mark Mellett has said that Government cuts to military resourcing have caused “frustration” in the Defence Forces.

In an interview, Vice Admiral Mellett said that there have always been tensions between the military and the Department of Finance when it comes to financing the Defence Forces, with the Defence budget falling as a proportion of spending over the past decade. 

Mellett is set to retire in two months’ time after four decades in the naval service and six years as the top leader in Ireland’s military.

This week he sat down in the Naval Base in Haulbowline with The Journal to talk about his career and the challenges faced by the men and women he leads.

In a wide-ranging interview Mellett spoke at length about funding difficulties, his role as a military advisor to Government, the threat of misinformation and cyber security, and the future for Óglaigh na hÉireann as the State celebrates 100 years.

He spoke passionately of advocating for the serving members of the military but also accepted the frustrations experienced by members in the cuts environment of recent years. 

The Defence budget as a factor of Ireland’s GDP stands at 0.27%, a significant decrease from 2009 when it was at 0.6%. In 2019 it was 0.29%.

Mellett said that the ‘churn’ rate – the percentage of people leaving the Defence Forces prematurely -  is around 10%, and as high as 14% in the Naval Service alone. Both figures are significantly higher than the generally accepted rate of 5% for military personnel for Ireland.

Cuts to Defence

The Journal has reported extensively on the funding problems in the Defence Forces with recent articles on the shortfall in staff at the CIS Corps, a unit tasked with cyber crime, and the inability of the Navy to put ships to sea.

Asked about the impact the cuts and resulting retention crisis have had, Mellett spoke about the pressure on him from all sides. 

“I know the tensions that are there. I know the actual environment that is there, the politics, and I know the pressure I get from the men and women of the organisation who would say [that] I need to do more.

“I know the pressure I get from the politicians who say, I’ve done too much, (that) I’ve overstepped the line, and you know, if I’m being hit from both sides, I know I’m probably getting it just about right,” he said.

Mellett said such attacks go with the territory.  

“Of course, it translates into frustration. Should I change my strategy at this stage? I’m not going to change my strategy. I will retire in two months time,” he said.

Mellett said that the pandemic and the 500 days of work carried out by the men and women of the Defence Forces during it have shown the value of the military to the Irish people and the Government.  

He noted that there was a significant tension between the Department of Finance and the needs of the Defence Forces, not just in recent times but throughout the history of the State.

53rd-infantry-group-exercise Niall Carson Niall Carson

He said his role is to offer advice to Government but said there had been “challenges” for him in making the case for more funding. 

“It (Government) prioritises its resources against the broader playing field in which it looks at where the challenges are.

“I think there’s a litany of [examples] since the foundation of the State of that tension that exists between the Defense Forces and in Finance, for instance.

“And that’s a simple reality whereby the Defence Forces is seen as a cost centre, that it consumes resources, that may well be allocated better elsewhere.

“And that is a challenge for me in terms of making the case [for more funding],” he said. 

Retention Crisis

In regard to the retention crisis, the Chief of Staff said that because of the churn effect there wasn’t an “efficient” return on the investment in training of members.

He accepted the arguments made about pay, that higher wages would insentivise people to stay in the military, but believes that the crisis goes deeper than that. 

He spoke about the problem of losing institutional knowledge as new members leave, taking the lessons learned with them which in turn increases risk.

“But the issue is not about the starting pay, the issue is about the actual retention and the attractiveness of of remaining in the organisation where individuals can go to their bank and get a mortgage, and that they can actually have that security of tenure in the Defence Forces,” he said.

Mellett said he believes the new Minister for Defence Simon Coveney when he says he is  committed to better financing Oglaigh na hÉireann.

49320376168_09b44cecdc_o The LÉ Eithne with other naval vessels on exercise. Irish Defence Forces Irish Defence Forces

Castlebar to Haulbowline

The Castlebar man joined the Naval service in the late 1970s, and has made a steady and purposeful rise through the ranks since he was commissioned in 1978. 

He joined the navy in 1976 in Haulbowline Naval Base in Cork Harbour having been introduced to sailing while in the Reserves (known then as the FCA). He trained in the Curragh and then with the Royal Navy before returning and starting work as a junior officer onboard a naval vessel.

His naval career is a whistlestop tour of some of the most extraordinary events in recent Irish history. He worked in Bantry Bay at the Betelguese disaster as divers searched the sea bottom for bodies.

He was onboard the LE Eithne mapping the debris field above the Air India disaster site – watching on the sonar as the beacon of the black box sounded.

Mellett says he is a firm believer in the use of naval vessels as a tool for diplomacy and to bring Ireland Inc to the world, and he has travelled on board the LÉ Eithne to the US and South America over the years in that diplomatic role.

His first command was on the LÉ Órla, which had a previous life as a coastal patrol vessel in Hong Kong.

It was during this period that he developed a tactic which would play a major role in fishery protection work and drug interdiction. It involved keeping the naval vessel hidden over the horizon and two rigid inflatable boats would monitor the target vessel.

That tactic was used to launch surprise boarding of vessels so that fish catch numbers could not be faked but also proved very effective when Mellett and his crew made a giant haul of drugs in operations targeting organised crime smugglers.

In July 1993, off the Kerry coast, two tonnes of cannabis resin, worth €25 million, were found after a boat was intercepted by Mellett and the crew of the LÉ Orla.

The naval boarding party found a computer on board that brought about the demise of a British linked organised crime group.

He describes being part of a NATO mission, when he was dispatched to Afghanistan to help make the elections in the country free and fair, as one of the highlights of his career. 

In taking over the role as Chief of Staff of the Defence Forces Mellett believes that was a sign of a shift away from the traditional army dominance of the Irish military apparatus.  

30450615625_9c797f6edf_o Vice Admiral Mellett with troops on a training exercise. Irish Defence Forces Irish Defence Forces

Future

He believes that the future for the Defence Forces does not rest alone with the infantry on the ground but the new battlespace of cyber.

He believes the current Commission on the Defence Forces will recommend a hybrid command structure that will enable the Defence Forces to meet that threat. 

“This is not about just creating a cyber defence capability for its own sake, this is a resource that gives us a strategic response with depth.

“And it could be built around a mixture of the permanent Defence Forces, and the Reserve Defence Forces.

“It would need a Cyber Reserve whereby you could create this resource that can be in the time of extremists and respond to the threats to the State.

“A link to that, obviously, is the professionalisation in terms of an intelligence service within the Defense Forces, which is something we’ve advocated for, and also an intelligence school,” he added. 

Mellett’s successor will be Major General Seán Clancy who is currently Deputy Chief of Staff (Support). 

Mellett said his advice to Clancy is: “He will have all those (critics) gathered at the rows who will be looking on and with a view on everything and an opinion on everything, but they neither have the responsibility nor the authority nor the understanding. At the end of the day, he will draw on his decades of experience and bring that to bear in the context of his day to day activities.”

And for Mellett himself, what does the future hold?

The Vice Admiral holds a PhD in environmental governance and is likely to pursue his interest in that area.

He referenced, a number of times in the interview, that Cork Harbour and the surrounding coast was set to see a boom in renewable energy with massive off shore wind farm.

“(It will be a) counter stroke, to the potential impact of climate breakdown.

“In short, the whole renewable industry, the maritime renewable industry in particular, and given that I have an understanding of the Marine, I have the education in terms of ecosystem governance. And I understand the actual opportunity in terms of renewables, that that’s the space that we’re born into,” he explained. 

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31 Comments
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    Mute Ann-Marie Wallis
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:13 PM

    Ah lads,does every church related story on this site have to include snide comments? the items were stolen and now they’re back where they belong. Lets leave it at that!

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    Mute michael cuthbert
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:26 PM

    Yep. We can rest easier in our beds tonight…

    44
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    Mute Jay funk
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:41 PM

    Apart from the fact to some ( not many I agree) the church is a terrorist organisation.

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    Mute Ann-Marie Wallis
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:18 PM

    When the Church has done something wrong,I’ll definitely criticize them. But in fairness,the objects were stolen from them and if the thieves are like the ones robbing old priests and parishioners in my area over the recent few months, they couldn’t give a damn about religion or what the Catholic Church has done to anyone in the past,out for themselves!

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:10 AM

    Well said Ann-Marie. They’re always very bold these lot. :-)

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    Mute Ann-Marie Wallis
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    Jan 18th 2012, 10:07 AM

    Oh they’re unbelievable, Réada! ;)

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    Mute franco
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:23 PM

    having had cancer i found that the power of prayer did work for me , believe me when you are at your lowest and you have someone to talk to being it here on earth or spiritually belief is a wonderful thing so please dont knock it till you have tried it.

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    Mute Irish Mule
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:27 PM

    Glad your doing better now Franco wish you the best.

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    Mute Ann-Marie Wallis
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:40 PM

    Best of luck Franco!

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    Mute Randy savage
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:56 PM

    oh dear oh dear did nine people just thumb down Francos very uplifting comment, what sort of deranged people are out there. my apologies on their behalf Franco. Best of luck

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    Mute Tim McSweeney
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:58 PM

    I wish you the best Franco but surely we should put our belief in science which is actually endeavouring every minute of the day to find a cure for these awful diseases..?

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    Mute franco
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:04 PM

    thanks tim you are right science during the day and prayer at night works wonders ..

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    Mute John Murphy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:18 PM

    While I don’t believe in religion and lash at the Roman Church at any opportunity where I think they deserve it I also think peoples beliefs should be respected and good news is scarce and welcome. I’m delighted that these historic items have been returned and hope your recovery franco will have the same happy outcome.

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    Mute Jay funk
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:42 PM

    Tried it and all it did was harm

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    Mute Rommel Burke
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:47 PM

    I hear you franco and wish you well.

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    Mute michael cuthbert
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:39 PM

    All the best to you Franco…

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    Mute michael cuthbert
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:40 PM

    Randy, you’re a star. Sittin’ there with a dangerous weapon and “will be killed” on the wall behind you. Class…

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    Mute John Murphy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 9:09 PM

    Watch the straw boater Michael! Looks a target from here!!!

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:15 AM

    Franco. Nothing wrong with prayer, whomever you pray to. The stillness won’t ever do harm. Best of luck.

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    Mute Brian Lyons
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:07 PM

    The return of these relics “demonstrates once again the power of prayer”… Oh, so that’s what God was busy doing while those children were dying of AIDS in Africa.

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    Mute Conor Oneill
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:15 PM

    It was the cops not the power of prayer. Also they should be sold and the money given to the poor. Think Jesus said give all your money to the poor. The Vatican doesn’t follow that teaching!!!

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    Mute Paddy O Donnell
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:04 PM

    great news.

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    Mute Paddy O Donnell
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:25 PM

    the nine thumbs down most be the peoples who stole the relic’s!!!!!!

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    Mute jerry slattery
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    Jan 17th 2012, 9:05 PM

    I do love the 23 negative comments for Great News it does fuck up all those marketing people

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    Mute Dylan Dublin
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:07 PM

    The power of prayer . . . . And the good work of the gardai ! ! ! ! He forgot about them – they didn’t just stumble upon them after all the prayers ! !

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    Mute Sheila Murphy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:23 PM

    my thoughts exactly Dylan; tho in fairness i was giving 100% of the credit to the Garda ;-)

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    Mute Jay funk
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:40 PM

    I heard the tooth fairy also helped god get the gear back.

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    Mute Lennart Sham Thomsen
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:17 PM

    to add to the rest of the wealth the church has collected down through the ages just look underneath the Vatican

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    Mute Eileen Gabbett
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:27 PM

    That’s good news and thanks to the work of the Gardai who got them back to the Abbey . Well done !

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    Mute Mark Rodgers
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:06 PM

    Whaaaaaaaaaaat?????? Do you mean we should start selling everything we have in the National Museum of Ireland and auction all of the gifts that have been provided by visiting Heads of State.
    Why not raid all homes in the post Christmas period and confiscate anything that Santa gave so that it can be sold to help our National debt position.
    Let’s grow up first!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!

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    Mute Jay funk
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:47 PM

    I think that’s a great idea, sell all on Ireland’s art get say 1bn give 10m to living Irish artists to restock then use remaining 990m for hospitals and other vital needs. A painting has never helped a starving child

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    Mute John Murphy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 9:05 PM

    Hold on Jay! You reckon that if all the art in the museums and the Vatican, for that matter ,were sold the money would reach the mouths of starving children??

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:21 AM

    Mark, seeing as you wish to sell state assets to pay the bank debt I wonder why you don’t want to sell everything from the national Museum too. That will be next. They won’t stop until the whole island is sold off. Btw I wouldn’t sell them either. :)

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    Mute Donnchadh Redman Ryan
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    Jan 17th 2012, 11:48 PM

    I come from Holycross. I was raised there. To be honest I’m not at all religious but I do take pride in my home place. When those guys stole the relics they weren’t just stealing some old artefacts, they were stealing our name. The entire village and community is named Holycross after the relic. I actually “whooped” when I heard the news.

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    Mute Mark Rodgers
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:45 PM

    Most of us would allow the inaccurate and ignorant comments of Lennart just slide by but I’m not in that kind of mood tonight.
    The Vatican State receives gifts from other States in exactly the same fashion as those we exchanged a short time with Her Majesty the Queen of England upon her State visit to Ireland.
    Lennart suggests that this comprises wealth and the inference of mis misguided comment is that somehow all should be sold to the highest bidder.
    Even better we could smelt all Down to base metals and precious stones to avoid anyone accusing us of behaving badly according to his pathetic standards.

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    Mute Darren Swan
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:24 PM

    abbey days :-)

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    Mute Maurice Danaher
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:28 PM

    How do we these are relics of the true cross ?

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    Mute Michael Hegarty
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:49 PM

    How dare you question authority!!! ;-) the True cross must have been 50ft tall and 25ft wide, going by the amount of true cross chips doing the rounds!!!

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    Mute Tim McSweeney
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:52 PM

    Much like the foundation of all major religions I imagine it’s based on nothing more than anecdotal ‘evidence’

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    Mute Mark Rodgers
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:47 PM

    PS……….The Vatican museum is at ground level and not beneath the Vatican……….!

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    Mute Maurice Danaher
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    Jan 17th 2012, 6:55 PM

    Yes but it’s vast !
    Once you walk through it you will never give another penny to “Peters Pence”.
    They could raise billions selling just some of the collection once the recession is over.

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    Mute Paul
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    Jan 17th 2012, 7:27 PM

    There’s also the other part of the museums, the backstage bit showing all the props, old bibles and such, not so much art, more like gore and fetishism -teeth and fingers and even a bust of one of the saints made of gold formed around his actual skull. It’s weird how much the catholic version of god apparently loves gold and jewels though, surprising he didn’t make more of it if he’s such a fan

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    Mute John Murphy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:07 PM

    I think it is right that the Vatican retains and displays the artifacts of it’s history as it is right and proper that similar artifacts which form part of the rich history of this country also be retained and displayed in the abbeys and churches where they rightly belong.
    Like it or not most works of art, music, architecture, sculpture etc. were commissioned and inspired by the belief in and the expression of the exuberance of religion. If we can only look upon religious practice and belief with the view that it should be broken down and it’s artifacts dispersed and devoured by maw of the commercial and economic greed so that the treasures of this country and others decorate the mantelpiece of some stockbroker or bond trader, oligarch or despot then we loose.

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    Mute Kevin Smyth
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    Jan 18th 2012, 9:50 AM

    “They could raise billions selling just some of the collection once the recession is over.”

    You’re forgetting about the big fat Swiss bank accounts and all the land they own. They preach about not being materialistic and then you see the Pope, Bishops, Cardinals all with more bling than 50 Cent. ??
    Followers just accept this. “Ah sure, t’is fine, leave them alone.” ??

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    Mute Ciaro
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:54 PM

    Will the holy stone of clontibret be returned?

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    Mute Cyril Butler
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    Jan 17th 2012, 9:38 PM

    If true prayer made god scratch his chin and make the thieves return the relic why did he make them steal it in the first place or was that the work of Satan taking advantage of god sleeping on the job?

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:25 AM

    You’ve got to try to get over this Cyril. You really do. I knew I’d see a comment from you here. :D

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    Mute Cyril Butler
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    Jan 18th 2012, 7:57 AM

    Reada when the religious decide to leave their wishful thinking out of our schools, politics and courts, when our media allows a sceptical analysis of religion itself then I will consider it time to call it a day. Unfortunately that will be an equally predictible outcome and as long as it is I aint going anywhere.

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 10:46 AM

    I was only teasing Cyril. It was late. Hadn’t hit the bottle or anything but maybe “la Luna” was having an effect. :-)

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    Mute Dave Fingleton
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:27 PM

    I suggest an experiment. Leave the valuables on a table in the middle of the church with the doors open. We all pray, really hard, that no-one comes and takes them. Let’s see the power of prayer in action. On yer knees, everybody!!

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:23 AM

    We’re already on our knees. Do you want us to prostrate ourselves?

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    Mute Dave Fingleton
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    Jan 19th 2012, 7:50 PM

    yes please, Reada! Lots of prostrating, prostrating with prayer, face first onto the cold floor with a prayer on yer lips and a song of praise in yer heart! But…mostly prostrating!!!

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    Mute Réada Quinn
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    Jan 19th 2012, 8:29 PM

    Sorry Dave. I’ve stood up. Not on my knees so no chance! :-)

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    Mute AlMar
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    Jan 18th 2012, 10:02 AM

    Have to say that I am always amazed at the incredible ignorance shown by many commentators when it comes to anything to do with religion. So many commentators know absolutely nothing whatsoever about what the Church teaches, about its history and about what it does in the world today. An example are the predictable comments about selling Church property to feed the poor (the Church is already one of the biggest charitable institutions in the world) or about the size of the cross given all of the relics (the relics are normally tiny fragments and there actually aren’t that many). It seems that a lot of people see fit to dismiss the Church (and worse, to dismiss ordinary believers) without ever having engaged with what the Church teaches at any serious level at all. (“Catholic” schooling in Ireland is a complete joke and does not constitute engagement with Catholicism by the way).
    Is there scope for criticising aspects of the Church today? Yes, of course there are. And you will find no better critics of the clergy and bishops than Catholics who actually know what the Church actually teaches. But that criticism is nuanced and subtle and informed, unlike so much that we find online and in the media in general.
    Of course, the Church in this country deserves a lot of the blame because of its lack of intellectual culture and general incompetence, especially when it comes to communication. It’s hard to blame people for ignorance when most of the clergy in this country has never done anything to correct that ignorance.

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    Mute Kevin Smyth
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    Jan 18th 2012, 11:16 AM

    “Pope Benedict XVI condemned unbridled “pagan” passion for power, possessions and money as a modern-day plague Saturday as he led more than a quarter of a million Catholics in an outdoor Mass in Paris.”

    But…this is from the Mr Fancy Pants in silk clothes with gold stitching who lives
    http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2008/09/15/vatican.jpg

    Give me a good reason why I should not even question this.

    The church really has aMASSsed their massive portfolio of property, gold bullion, priceless art and lots and lots of cash, through helping the poor. Is there an irony here?

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    Mute AlMar
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    Jan 18th 2012, 11:37 AM

    My friend, I never said to shouldn’t question things. Catholics are not against questioning matters despite myths to the contrary. But questioning also implies being open to answers…
    The Pope personally has no money. He lives in relatively humble apartments. In fact, when Pope John Paul II died, the entire apartment he lived in had to be gutted and refitted before the present pope moved in. The pipes leaked, only one ring on his cooker worked…It is well known that his underwear was repatched and repaired again and again to the point of falling apart. It is possible to live amidst splendour and still live with personal poverty and detachment.
    The simple fact is that the Church is one of the most significant charitable organisations in the world (if not in fact the biggest). it is also possible to point to many many individual Catholics who have given up everything to serve the poor. If we are prepared to condemn the Church on the basis of what we perceive to be faults then we should also be prepared to praise it when we see manifestly good things. Unfortunately many people are either unaware of the good things or do not wish to see them.
    The Church, strictly speaking, does not need its art and buildings. But the Church believes in beauty (you wouldn’t think it based on the church in Ireland though…). This beauty inspires us, and this inspiration is a good thing for the human spirit. If it was all sold off, it would feed poor for a while (who are already being fed by the Church by the way) and then what? Great works of art and beauty would be hoarded by private collectors and investors and humanity would be worse off.
    By the way, there is a hostel for the homeless in the Vatican. Most people do not know this.
    Also, the Vatican finances were depleted on various occasions in recent history because of the charity of the popes to the poor of Rome during various crises, specifically during WWII.

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    Mute Mark Rodgers
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    Jan 17th 2012, 8:12 PM

    Wow!

    I think we’ve really lost it…….can I get off the bus please………

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    Mute Richard Fennessy
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    Jan 17th 2012, 11:37 PM

    piece of the cross mother of f@#$ do people really exist who believe that

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    Mute ponythegringo
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    Jan 18th 2012, 7:22 AM

    Yawn.. Big diddy.
    Sell the vulgar crap and compensate the raped, buggered and abused… End of.

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    Mute ponythegringo
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    Jan 18th 2012, 12:04 PM

    @ almar. ……. Too little too late, read your history , 1 homeless shelter and giving less than 0.1 % of your annual income to charity will never make up for the horrors inflicted on ordinary Europeans over the last couple of thousand years, all that land accumulated from dying desperate folk hoping for entrance to heaven, the children of Ireland of which my grandmother was one horrifically abused her 2 sisters 1 in the mental asylum for the rest of her life because she kept showing any visitors that came to the convent the unmarked grave where the nuns put the body of her sister after they killed her, the teachings of the church are a complete and utter fallacy . The church is at the bottom of the dirt. I don’t care if the pope had holy knickers or not.

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    Mute AlMar
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    Jan 18th 2012, 12:31 PM

    @ponythegringo – I am very sorry for your family’s sufferings. It is beyond doubt that there have been many corrupt people in the Church. They have more guilt than those outside the Church because they should have known better. The crimes of the clergy are indeed much worse than the crimes of others precisely because of the position that they hold.
    That said, there are many inaccuracies in your post. One example is in relation to the homeless shelter. Yes. there is one in the Vatican (which is a very small piece of land).. But there are tens of thousands of them around the world that have been founded because of Christian teaching. And let us be clear about what that teaching is – it is Love. Unfortunately, many people, including many in the Church, do not follow that teaching. But there are still those who do, and they do a lot of good in the world.
    Ireland was never really a Catholic country, at least not within the last few hundred years. Yes, it was a clerical country and a Jansenistic country, but they are aberrations of Catholicism. One of the downsides of this is that we tend to equate the behaviour of priests with the teachings of the Church. This is wrong because many priests behave in ways that are contrary to the teachings of the Church. But even though there are many who ignore them, those teachings about love remain, and they are still an inspiration to many.

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    Mute Kevin Smyth
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    Jan 18th 2012, 8:29 PM

    From the Bible.
    Blessed is the one who grabs your little children and smashes them against a rock.
    - God
    Psalm 137:9

    If a man is caught in the act of raping a young woman who is not engaged, he must pay fifty pieces of silver to her father. Then he must marry the young woman because he violated her, and he will never be allowed to divorce her.
    - God
    Deuteronomy 22:28

    However, you may purchase male or female slaves from among the foreigners who live among you. You may also purchase the children of such resident foreigners, including those who have been born in your land. You may treat them as your property, passing them on to your children as a permanent inheritance.
    - God
    Leviticus 25

    Show no mercy; have no pity! Kill them all – old and young, girls and women and little children.
    - God
    Ezekiel 9:5

    When a man sells his daughter as a slave, she will not be freed at the end of six years as the men are.
    - God
    Exodus 21:7

    There are more lovely quotes.

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    Mute ponythegringo
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    Jan 18th 2012, 12:55 PM

    ” many inaccuracies ” ? You mean 1 about the shelter? And let us be clear the teachings of the church are not about love , they are about fooling gullible people into parting with their money . Pre-Christian teachings were about love of everything on this planet . Christian teachings are all to do with the human ego and how believing in a disgustingly Fallic fairytale will make humans feel better about themselves while they rape the planet in pursuit of coin.

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    Mute AlMar
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    Jan 18th 2012, 2:18 PM

    @ponythegringo: Yes, the Church is about love. I am sorry if you have never met anybody who has explained this to you before. The Church in Ireland is so decrepit and in need of reform that it is unsurprising that this message has never been received.
    As for pre-Christian teachings and their love for everything? Well, I’m afraid you need to go back to your history books. What about the cruelty of the Romans? The cannibalism of numerous pagan tribes and civilisations? How well did the Aztecs love all of creation? The reality is that the civilisation that we take for granted – the basic human decency and regard for others – rests largely on Christian love. A review of the history of the early Christian period makes it clear that it was the love and the decency of the early Christians that helped them to grow in number so rapidly. And remember, they grew in number rapidly despite persecutions; despite the fact that being a Christian could mean death at the hands of Roman soldiers or death in the mouth of a lion! There was surely something compelling that caused an impoverished sect with no political or financial power to grow exponentially despite the huge risk of death. It is clear that Christians loved others and treated people better than the prevailing ethos of the pagan world. That is what Christianity is about.
    Have there been many priests, bishops and even popes who have pursued the coin? Sure! There were many and there probably will be many in the future. But they are the minority. On the other hand there were (and still are!) many great Catholics who literally laid their lives down to serve others, and did so without ever calling attention to themselves. That is the message of Christianity when lived properly, not in the half hearted way in has generally been lived in this country.
    Specifically, in terms of raping the planet in pursuit of money, well despite your proclamation to the contrary, there is nothing in Christian teaching that would make such people feel good about themselves.
    When you think about it, it doesn’t make much sense to abandon the goodness of Jesus because of badness of Judas…

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    Mute Séa Graham
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    Jan 18th 2012, 7:50 AM

    that Jesus guy must have been huge. All the bits of his cross put together would get you to the moon.

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    Mute ponythegringo
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    Jan 18th 2012, 8:54 PM

    You are obviously a Jehovah’s witness or a Mormon
    You will never convince me of your pro Christian nonsense . Now have the last word if you must……

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    Mute ponythegringo
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    Jan 18th 2012, 12:46 PM

    I commend your superior theological intellect. Happy now?

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    Mute jona mulens
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    Jan 18th 2012, 3:31 AM

    Would these be considered class relics so?

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    Mute Strongbow62
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    Jan 18th 2012, 7:21 AM

    I think we should all say a prayer.. Ok Journal folks… To make the bailout go away.

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