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The Daily PollMINISTERS NOONAN AND Howlin will deliver Budget 2016 in just over a month’s time – and already the lobby groups are busy with their submissions and suggestions.
Ash Ireland – the anti-smoking group – wants the government to slap an extra 50 cents on the price of a packet of cigarettes in next month’s announcement.
This would send the price of a pack of 20 well over the €10 mark, to around €10.50. 40 cent was added in last year’s Budget.
What do you make of the suggestion?
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If they hike the price up anymore everyone will be heading down to Moore St. to get cartons of Murlborro Litez
Yep and people will automatically press the “should be higher” option cause they’re bred stupid these days.
I pressed the should be higher option because I’m not stupid enough to deliberately give myself cancer and also because I don’t want myself or other people and young children to have to inhale second hand smoke
Second hand smoke John, can we have the evidence that its harmful and its going to give you and your children cancer?.
Cigarettes might not be good for you but there has been so many incidences of people who smoked heavily and lived to ripe old age.
As for smoking related diseases?, this is a real catch all, if you smoke and you get coronary heart disease its because you smoked, but if you’re a non smoker and you get coronary heart disease they can’t call it smoking related now can they?.
Studies have shown smoking is grand.
Second hand smoke has been proven to be one big lie, try as they might not one study can verify their lies.
So if we can’t prove it then what next?, yes of course lets demonise and victimise smokers every chance we get
“What do the studies on passive smoking tell us?
PHILIPPE EVEN. There are about a hundred studies on the issue. First surprise: 40% of them claim a total absence of harmful effects of passive smoking on health. The remaining 60% estimate that the cancer risk is multiplied by 0.02 for the most optimistic and by 0.15 for the more pessimistic … compared to a risk multiplied by 10 or 20 for active smoking! It is therefore negligible. Clearly, the harm is either nonexistent, or it is extremely low.
It is an indisputable scientific fact. Anti-tobacco associations report 3 000-6 000 deaths per year in France …
I am curious to know their sources. No study has ever produced such a result.
Many experts argue that passive smoking is also responsible for cardiovascular disease and other asthma attacks. Not you?
They don’t base it on any solid scientific evidence. Take the case of cardiovascular diseases: the four main causes are obesity, high cholesterol, hypertension and diabetes. To determine whether passive smoking is an aggravating factor, there should be a study on people who have none of these four symptoms. But this was never done. Regarding chronic bronchitis, although the role of active smoking is undeniable, that of passive smoking is yet to be proven. For asthma, it is indeed a contributing factor … but not greater than pollen!
The purpose of the ban on smoking in public places, however, was to protect non-smokers. It was thus based on nothing?
Absolutely nothing! The psychosis began with the publication of a report by the IARC, International Agency for Research on Cancer, which depends on the WHO (Editor’s note: World Health Organization). The report released in 2002 says it is now proven that passive smoking carries serious health risks, but without showing the evidence. Where are the data? What was the methodology? It’s everything but a scientific approach. It was creating fear that is not based on anything.
Why would anti-tobacco organizations wave a threat that does not exist?
The anti-smoking campaigns and higher cigarette prices having failed, they had to find a new way to lower the number of smokers. By waving the threat of passive smoking, they found a tool that really works: social pressure. In good faith, non-smokers felt in danger and started to stand up against smokers. As a result, passive smoking has become a public health problem, paving the way for the Evin Law and the decree banning smoking in public places. The cause may be good, but I do not think it is good to legislate on a lie. And the worst part is that it does not work: since the entry into force of the decree, cigarette sales are rising again.
Why not speak up earlier?
As a civil servant, dean of the largest medical faculty in France, I was held to confidentiality. If I had deviated from official positions, I would have had to pay the consequences. Today, I am a free man.
-Le Parisien”
wether passive smoking is harmful or not, it’s not the main reason I prefer smoke free pubs and restaurants. It’s the smell, it’s disgusting. why should anyone have to smell your exhaled smoke when trying to eat there dinner or enjoy a pint?
I have bad habits but my habits don’t affect the health of others around me. It is one disgusting habit. They should be banned as far as I’m concerned.
Thats your prerogative John Doe just pointing out that all these bans were introduced through hysterical lies and some of the flimsiest evidence ever produced.
When you hear these fanatical anti smoking lobbyists on the media the bullshit detector goes into overdrive.
idiot.
google Roy Castle.
Whats your bright idea to stop people smoking then?
Whats your bright idea , lower the price? Are you a smoker?
Give me a break Ken, Roy Castle a non smoker who decided on his own steam to blame his illness on passive smoke from the smoky jazz rooms he was playing in, oh lets see any non smoker that ever visited those Jazz rooms are now all dead from lung cancer?,.Non smokers develop so called smoking related diseases too you know?.
Of course the fanatics of the anti smoking lobby jumped on this like flies to sh!te, using Castle as a cynical tool to push their agenda.
How about leave smokers alone Brian, there is any amount of information out there on the dangers of smoking, I’m just pointing out that smokers are not walking Chernobyls and are not a danger to non smokers.
The anti smoking lobby are quick to attack the tobacco industry lobbyists and their agenda, but the anti smoking lobbyists run a sinister campaign of lies and exaggerations in their relentless assault on smokers.
Patrick Macnee Steed in the Avengers smoked 80 fags a day right up to his death at 93 years of age of natural causes, damn they couldn’t even blame a smoking related disease.
I apologise William, my comment was actually directed at Derek Durkin and his nonsense quote that people are “Bred stupid these days” because we think that its the logical next step to try and get people to quit?
Giving isolated incidents of smokers who lived a long happy life is absolute rubbish by the way. My granny smoked all her life and is now 86. Unfortunately you’re dealing with percentages here and the fact is for every person like them there’s 2 other that will die before they’re 60 so I’m not entertaining that.
I get a 50g pouch every week for €15 and it does me for the week. I haven’t bought tobacco in a shop in over a year. The tax increases over the years has made the black market for tobacco explode and it’s quite funny that no one in government could foresee this.
As long as you stay away from those asbestos filled Jin Ling ones in the yellow box.
They should add a levy to lobby groups.
Smoke rollies myself. Amber Leaf.
Was getting it on black market 14 quid for 50 grammes. Now I get Thai and Filipino friends to bring back duty free for me. 45 euro for 10 50g packs.
Have 50 now, a year’s supply. 225 quid, saved a grand. Car insurance for a year up front 300, tax for a year up front 220, four new tyres 180, 300 left over, short holiday somewhere.
Price of tobacco in Ireland is madness, average 7 euro in rest of Europe, 24 quid here.
And they want to put the price up?
Ah uncle monty don’t believe the tobacco industry propaganda all cigs r poisonous theres r no better then Jin ling. cheaper to buy tobacco then asbestos pure spin
It’s real Amber leaf. I wouldn’t touch that fake shite.
How any smokes fake stuff is beyond me. Choke to death. I’m glad I’m off them 3 years
Anyone who smokes fake tobacco is a fool.
Find a good supplier who is linked into a continental trucker and there’s no problem.
Tommy, you haven’t saved a grand, you’ve wasted €225! Plus whatever other health costs you’ll incur.
anybody who buys black market tobacco should be sentenced to a slow painful death… oh wait !!
Tommy ya didnt take a pic of urself smoking for this article did ya??.I hope its just coincidence. :0)
No, Tommy usually uses pictures of young handsome boys smoking as his profile picture.
Hope you don’t smoke in front of your daughter, Tommy, or all those young children you coach.
Dammit he makes smoking look so cool and sexy though. That’s why they don’t like to show people smoking on the TV any more, because everybody wants to look cool and sexy.
They can raise the price but people are still gonna be buying them.
You do astrological readings Sam?
Your right Sam
Not true. I quit because they were too expensive. I’m 3 years off them now and 2 years off the electronic cigarette.
You’re one person Stephen. Not everyone will quit if the price goes up.
My mother and father quit for the same reason. Threes a crowd :p
even if 3% of smokers quit because of the price hike I’m sure it’d be seen as a success. not to mention the extra 50cent per pack the government take from the remaining 97%.. win win.. except for the remaining smokers who have pay more for their future poor health loose loose…
Smokers forego buying food for ciggies, hike em up all you want, they’ll still buy them
Next it’ll be alcohol. Sure aren’t we all filling our trollies!!
Every town has at least one shop that’ll sell to under age kids who don’t know any better. They should be targeted more to prevent ppl from starting on cancer sticks in the first place.
I’m a smoker and I want to quit. My biggest problem is when I’m having a drink, always my let down in the end. How about limiting the times you can get cigarets to 10pm just like alcohol. If I choose to have a glass of wine or a pint at 10 I then can not simply walk to the shop and get a pack of death sticks
A curfew on cigarettes? What about taxi drivers & people who work nights that smoke? Stop being such a sheep needing the state to act as your parent.
Or just man up and take some personal responsibility.
How about exercising some self control instead of taking the choice away from others?
The cost does not deter me to be honest, I know they are bad for me, I have tried all methods to give up but I have mental illness and the act of smoking feels like it calms me down when the reality is its raising my anxiety. I’m of working class but the cost does not bother me I would go hungry for a pack of cigarettes. The addiction holds that much over some people.
Get Allen Carr’s The only way to stop smoking permanently. It is a long read but it will work.
If Ash publicised this book it would do far more for stopping people smoking than raising the price ever will.
that makes no sense at all because if you’re going out for a drink then you always make sure you have your cigs with you , if you’re serious about giving up cigs then stay away from the drink for a while !
As a smoker who tried giving up a few times. I would love to see some of that tax go towards nrt. I can’t believe the price of nrt when there is so much tax collected of smokers and they apparently raise the price so people give up.. If that’s so why is there vat on Nicorette etc.. It’s just raising taxes that’s all it is..
Try e cigs mate
Invest in a quality one.. Cost around 60 70 euro. Save you money and should help you quit for good
Can’t win either way.. If you higher the price it makes way for fake more dangerous cheap ones. If you lower the price or keep it the same it will encourage people to keep smoking.
Don’t think people keep smoking government sanctioned cigerettes. Smokers buy cheaper cigarettes elsewhere. Look at the CSO stats. 40% of all cigerettes smoked in Ireland are not Irish Government stamped. Push the price up and the problem gets worse. #BlackMarket
Ash Ireland can go Fu.. themselves
They don’t even sell hurls! Fu..ers!!
What’s never made sense to me is that if I try to give up smoking, but have a craving then I have to buy a box of 20 fags. Would it not be easier to sell them singularly from a chemist or something?
Imagine the possibilities ” I’ll have a bottle of Vicks Vaporub & 2 Silk Cut Blue. That should clear the lungs.” Jesus wept.
I remember when you actually could get a ” loosey ” for 10 pence !
Supernova’s exactly right, raising the price of cigarettes makes it more appealing to people (especially retirees and the unemployed) to purchase illegal/fake cigarettes which cause more problems than they solve. Until that’s dealt with, the price of cigarettes should be kept the same.
That said, maybe the government should be thinking about raising prices on sugary/fatty goods? A tub of chocolate spread that’s 1.20 here in Lidl is 7.80 in Copenhagen, the *same* tub. Adding an extra tax could kill two birds with one stone, more taxes meaning more income for the government, and more taxes meaning people will think twice before buying sugary foods over their more nutritious counterparts. We have a massive obesity problem in this country that needs solving, and heart problems are on the rise. Divert your attention elsewhere, Noonan.
And then you’ll just create a sugary/ fatty food black market.
I’m in love with the cocoa!
so glad that as a healthy person I can look forward to getting fleeced for the occasional treat because some lardarse eats junk for 3 square a day.
why should they increase the price if people want to smoke let them.
Smoking damages your health and your wallet and unless your blowing it into people’s faces your still only harming yourself. Alcohol on the other hand causes much more trouble in my opinion. You go to any town at the weekend and see all the trouble caused from consuming alcohol. You don’t see fights break out and gardai called over smokers.
But you should read reports on second hand smoke and the damage it does to kids.
Lol! Someone at the Journal thought: “Hmmm! Let’s see how many of our readers are smokers?!?!”
All they are doing by increasing the price is increasing demand for black market tobacco, I don’t even smoke but man I couldn’t afford to if I wanted to here!!!!!!
The tax on them is crazy, I bring back about 7 r 8 sleeves from hols few times a year at 10e a sleeve over there sell easy for 30e here pays for my flights happy days cheers Enda
Leave it alone.
The poor man’s friend.
Just smoke Cuban Cohiba cigars, a box only cost 600 or 700€
I know many many people who have been forced to buy on the black market because they cannot afford the current price levels. They should and want to give up give up, but can’t. The only winners in this are the organised crime dealers. FF/FG/Labour laughing all the way to the bank.
Smoking is LEGAL folks. Remember that. Piling tax on this legal habit is totally un democratic. Tax paying adults and the poor are well aware of the dangers so should be allowed excercise their right to partake in this LEGAL habit. If the government truly wants to reduce smoking, ban selling them in pubs and sweet shops. Pharmacies only by prescription. But they won’t do that they’ll continue to tax them out the gate.
it doesn’t stop people smoking but there me be less food in some households if it’s raised again. If kids have 10 euro to spend on cigarettes in this climate that’s another issue.
I don’t smoke. I think the price is getting extortionate. The government can’t keep putting up the price without some sort of revolt from smokers. More will turn to smugglers. Taxes are too high. Cut taxes on cigarettes and then smokers will have more money in their pockets for health insurance and GP visits.
Tax the air we breathe, FG/LAB. Do they know anything but taxation…
Already on the cards :) https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=au9OS94feMU
If the money was going back into the health system maybe but sure it’ll just be spent on some politicians expenses or back to the EU for the bailout etc </3
It wouldn’t make difference, if your addicted you still pay the 50c or get them on the black market, I was off them for two years and went back on them before the summer and now I’m off them 2 weeks, the best thing to with the horrible things is a complete ban on them in shops and the only way to get tobacco is on prescription basis to help people gradually off them because it would have helped me stay away from them
Meh. I just buy mine abroad and bring them home.
They are about £8.50 here in the UK so thats about €11.50.
I sure hope the ciggies don’t burn a hole in your leather pants. Or worse. Your plastic paddy panties.
Very mature as usual Corky.
Think lowering politicians expenses & wages would be better for the Irish well being
There should be a litter levy on them, Collected and then distributed for local street cleaning staff and equipment. I drive an awful lot for my job and the amount of people who just flick their butts or even wrappers out the window is disgusting. And when you flash them or gesture to them for doing it 95% of them will give you the fingers. Our attitude stinks when it comes to keeping our country clean and presentable. The next time you are travelling on a national road, keep your eyes peeled for a km or two on the roadside. I guarantee you will spot either fast food bags or rubbish f*<ked in the ditch.
I’m a smoker and I would never dream of buying cigarettes in this country. All mine come from Duty Free- either if I’m abroad myself or a friend/family member is abroad. The result is that I probably smoke more because I have hundreds dying around as opposed to the odd pack. They could raise the price to €30 a pack and people would still smoke ,as is the sad nature of addiction.
Put a euro on them people may cop on then , disgusting habit….
So you don’t drink either?
No I don’t drink
Well there goes my argument.
Carry on
You smoke or drink Sam?
You are Sam aren’t you.
*fifty percent
An excusable typo.
These smoking people are a real problem in our world today. I think we should take their houses and passports and money and give it ( via government sponsored body like maybe Irish Water) all ( minus a government levy) to the refugees i.e. the put upon parents seeking accommodation for their oh so talented spawn near griffith college………….. I wonder if ruinua need a policy adviser………
Think if they up the cost of cigarettes then the same should apply for alcohol. I’m not a drinker or a smoker both will kill you in the end.
Alcohol is good for you in small quantities. Every cigarette does you damage. That’s the difference.
Who are this bunch of fascist freaks Ash sticking their beaks into other people’s business?
Fcuk right off you lot.
So glad I never took up smoking .. Dodged a bullet there! / inhales
but then the makers put extra cigarettes in the packets to make a 24 pack for €11
vaping is the way to go
They just keep taking and taking and taking bounce of robbers the price of addiction now days
A specific health levy should be imposed on legal cigarettes.
Illegally imported cigarettes should be treated as an illegal serious drug.
Selling illegally imported cigarettes should have a mandatory minimum prison sentence.
Being found in possession of illegal cigarettes should carry substantial fines or prison in lieu.
Annual tax income to Irish government from cigarettes €1.1 billion, annual cost of smoking to Irish health care system €500k – figures reported today on national radio.
Your health levy is being paid for already, twice over.
Smoking is an unhealthy habit and people are foolish to do it but they are not a financial burden on the country.
*500 million not 500k
It’s a point that most people overlook unfortunately.
The tax raised by cigarette sale is FAR higher than the cost incurred by the healthy service.
Studies have also shown that prices have in fact reached the point at which tax revenue may be harmed by forcing people to the black market.
What Irish has government has ever paid attention to facts though?
Smoking is utterly disgusting, boys and girls. You don’t look cool! And if you think you do you need therapy. Not to mention the mayhem it causes to your lungs and wallet. Get real.
Sfag will ya??
Don’t smoke. Don’t like it, But that’s my choice, half the cigs in the country are illegally imported, meaning big profits for the black market and no tax. The government should halve the price of cigs so that its not enough of a price difference to buy black market. meaning all the cigs sold would be tax paid (the same amount of revenue). the country would also benefit from the influx of tourists from the u.k day trippers and weekenders. the towns on the border would expierence a welcome boost in trade. people who smoke would have more money to spend on other goods. it would be a win win for the country all round, this makes sense and so the government will increase the price.
What difference does it make you can have them delivered to your home at half the price they charge in the shops .
I may dabble in a little bit of both.
Last time I checked I was Sam.
Not Sam.
Sam.
Sorry, you just reminded me of someone I used to know.
What?
The same Sam who’s always here. What you smoking?
Amber Leaf.
What’s it dipped in? Bleach?
You usually don’t make any sense but this is strange even for you.
Apologies, my mistake. A case of mistaken identity.
The other Sam was a nice person.
just arrived back from overseas and the amount of people who smoke is horrible, should be nasty pics on packets and higher price…electronic ones should be banned indoors also
please leave again, dope.
f***heads in this country like u iv no problem leaving
Forty five years after public health messages first appeared, people will still rationalise about smoking.
My favourite person on Facebook is a friend of mine who rants about flouride in the water but smokes. He, like all smokers, is as dumb as dirt.
Here’s an idea. Let’s fine people for smoking in public. Go home and smoke there all you want, as nobody else gives a shite. Instead of walking around, where people who walk past you, have to walk through your stinking cancer cloud that surrounds you. Nobody likes it, and it stinks. Go home, where we don’t have to smell you. Thanks.
exactly
You can get a good idea of the button pushers here. Everybody with half a brain knows that smoking is bonkers.
Now read the general tone of the comments here. Ladies and gentlemen, I give you thejournal.ie comments section.
Should be banned everywhere. Cant stand getting a facefull of some pig ignorant cancer stick user’s filth smoke when walking by them, and just outside shops and restaurants.
Upping the price solves nothing. Like upping the price on alcohol to stop people being alcoholic. It’s an addiction, like alcohol is for some people. Policies to treat and cure the addiction should be the focus. NHS in England has proven ecigarettes are only 5% as harmful as regular cigarettes. That’s 95% safer than tobacco. All the talk of highly dangerous chemicals etc in them has been scientifically disproved. How about a government policy to encourage cigarette smokers to move to ecigarettes…95% of smoking related diseases and deaths could be eliminated in ten years if it happened. Billions per year would be saved by the HSE . Upping prices does not adequately tackle the underlying addiction….it’s a proven fact. A quarter of the population still smoke. And with alcohol the majority pays rip off prices for a few drinks at the weekend, and it fails totally to address a minorities alcoholism.
People have the right to smoke if they wish. They’re already over a tenner, you can’t buy packets of 10 or smoke indoors. The EU and cheap flights makes it very easy to buy them cheaper anyway. If the gov really wanted to make a significant change it should be effected at EU level – It’s purely a revenue raising exercise in the name of incentivising societal behavioural change if prices increased again at home. Electronic cigarettes have probably made the biggest real-terms difference in behaviour in recent times.
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