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AN APPLICATION HAS been lodged with Dublin City Council for permission for a major new development atop the Jervis Street Shopping Centre that would include 127 co-living spaces.
The proposal would see the demolition of part of the retail area and car park of the city centre location to make way for the mostly 18 square metre co-living spaces that would have common areas, lounges, a gym, kitchens, laundry and an “amenity open space”.
This planned development on the north side of Dublin city is one of a number of co-living planning applications made in recent times, with other proposals met with strong opposition and described in some quarters as Dickensian. Appeals have been lodged against similar planned developments, such as in Rathmines and Tallaght.
Speaking to TheJournal.ie, Sinn Féin’s housing spokesperson Eoin Ó Broin said the last planning application is “further evidence why [co-living developments] should never be permitted under planning law”.
“That last thing we need in the city is co-living,” he said. “We need affordable accommodation for people who live and work in the city centre.”
Minister for Housing Eoghan Murphy faced criticism last year for his comments on co-living developments, after telling a conference that such blocks offer an “exciting” choice to young workers.
He also told Newstalk Breakfast that co-living was “more like a very trendy, kind of, boutique hotel-type place” after it was put to him the conditions were more akin to a prison.
Jervis Street
Planners for the Jervis Street proposal said in documents to the council that it would create “an exciting, vibrant mixed-use development that will supply attractive facilities to patrons and will contribute positively to the continuing enhancement of this part of Dublin’s north inner city, both in terms of footfall and improving the visual amenities of the area”.
The development would involve three uses, all located above the existing shopping centre.
The first would see a two-storey development above the corner of the centre bounded by Jervis Street and Abbey Street Upper. This would contain 20 one-bed apartments and four two-bed apartments.
The second proposes to demolish part of the retail and car parking floor area on Mary Street and to construct in its place a six-storey building to be used as a co-living development.
The co-living unit would be spread over six floors, with the minimum sizes for single rooms at 12 square metres and for double rooms at 18 square metres.
Planners said that a “key feature of successful co-living schemes internationally is the provision of wider recreation and leisure facilities” as part of the development. Under these plans, each person would have 11.8 square metres of communal space.
The third part of the plan would see the roof no longer used for parking and plant, and instead three floors of offices built around a central internal atrium.
Ó Broin said that under these proposals two people could be sharing 18 square metres, leaving them with just nine square metres each. “This is unacceptable,” he said.
“Co-living is bad for the people forced to live in it. If people were given the choice, they wouldn’t. And, at times when people are facing isolation and have to socially distance, none of that can be achieved in co-living. It serves no one.”
The Sinn Féin housing spokesperson said he feared that a government involving Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil wouldn’t scrap co-living developments, and said it may lead to a number of similar developments in cities in the future.
“It’s really bad for the city,” he added. “What we really need is accommodation for working people in Dublin 1, 2, 7 and 8. Any new minister for housing will have the power to scrap co-living, and I believe he or she should do that.”
The last date for observations to the council on this proposed development is Wednesday 10 June.
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So called “Co-Living” (read: tenements with fancy furniture) is where we must draw a thick red line with vested interests. We can’t afford to let these vultures dictate that working people should stand for lowest common denominator housing that will stunt the growth of future generations while enriching the very few.
@SkepticalHippoEyes: absolutely. Whatever happened to the bedsit? “Co-living” is bullshit, especially now! Seriously, what are they thinking?
@Drunk in Dublin: paint it up as a fancy idea and eventually some people will believe it. These kind of developments are nothing more than overpriced hostels.
@SkepticalHippoEyes: Co-living is used in many cities and is successful. Ignore O Broin looking for another sound bite.
@SkepticalHippoEyes: Co-living, short for “Corona Virus Living”. If we learn anything from the current crisis it’s that such types of accommodation must be completely removed in updated planning laws.
@Drunk in Dublin: The bedsit was regulated out of existence, all bedsits/studio apartments had to be upgraded thanks to SJWs, as a result cheap long-term rentals disappeared.
@Seaimpín na nDaoine ⚽️: Yeah, to he’ll with those people sick of living in damp mouldy kips. I’ve seen good and bad bedsits, regulation isn’t a bad thing.
Getting people to live in the city centre to reduce car traffice and the need for public transport is good, getting them to live in big cells with a common area is starting to sound like dystopian science fiction.
@Conall: True but unfortunately we’re so against building up in this country or building on anything green (the controversy by Saint Anne’s Park for example) that we don’t have so many options left.
At least this will be 127 people who aren’t living miles out from the city centre in suburban houses & those houses will now be freed up for families to move into.
@Podge: how is it any different to living in a Hotel room?
@rosetheone: Access to a kitchen & living rooms really. How is this any different from living in a shared house (besides the number of people)?
@Podge: because it’s all about the number of people
@EillieEs: my girlfriend lived in a two bedroom house with 6 people. Is this not better? I’ve shared small kitchens & living spaces with many people. If this is proportionately larger it’s better than that situation.
People need to face the reality of the situation & even if it’s not the optimal solution realise that it’s better than the current situation.
@rosetheone: The hotels are all empty atm for a reason, planning something like this now when we don’t have any idea how long the pandemic is actually going to last or if it will ever really end? too early for this.
There are 200’000 vacant homes in the state. The FFFG want to help developers, bankers and hedge-funds through artificially keeping house-prices and rents high, they won’t do that by flooding the market with vacant homes or adequately providing for social housing needs.
@Sean Byrne: maybe true but they are they in the right places. Also are people turning down perfectly good houses because they are not perfect size perfect location etc. I think they should publish those numbers.
@john s: Under the Urban Regeneration and Housing Act, 2015 each local authority is obliged to introduce a vacant homes register. Many councils refuse to comply with this act because they have not been compelled by the Government nor by a legal case to do so yet.
@Sean Byrne: i dont get what the issue is with these co living entities. if it accomodates more people in same amount of space and people are happy to live there isnt it a good thing? it sounds like it serves a demand for yound professionals/students who want to live in the city and not share some house out in the suburbs and commute…reading about these in other countries it seems to suit that particular market. once pricepoint is reasonable any additions to the housing supply helps being down rents for everyone.
@Phil Quinn: Living in tenaments with Covid 19? Doesn’t sound like a bad idea? These style of accommodation should be banned. We’re going back in time and not progressing as a country. All with FFG at the helm
@Sean Byrne: Rubbish. There is not 200000 vacant houses in Ireland.
@Phil Quinn: People aren’t happy to live there, they’re being forced to live there through economic necessity. It’s not of an acceptable standard and it’s a lazy planning on where is it cheapest and most convenient to file away the poor. And by poor I mean the average earner.
A condition of sanctioning them should be living in them, it would nip the conversion in the bud fairly sharply. It is accurate to describe shared living as 21st century tenements with brightly coloured plastic and ikea furniture.
@Sean Byrne:
Absolute rubbish. Making up stuff to suit your nonsense.
@john s: They do
@john s: provide a proper national public transport infrastructure and anywhere could be the right place in Ireland we are not a large country with vast distances to travel to cities for work
@Locojoe: I’m an electrician, I know a family that have 4 houses sitting there vacant one of them a 6 bedroom in Harolds X the other 3 are all 3 bedrooms.
@Phil Quinn: People *aren’t* happy to live in these, people want proper apartments. The only people who will live in these glorified prison cells are people who are forced to because these will create a new floor price and push the price of everything decent up even more.
Such a good idea on paper. Such a bad idea in reality.
Right across the road from Jervis there is an acre of space that has been empty for over 20 years. They’ve only started developing it in the last two years or so, and it appears the work has stopped. Who owns this prime real estate in city centre, and why has it been allowed to lie fallow for so long? There is plenty of space to build near Jervis, it doesn’t have to be on top of it.
@Drunk in Dublin: Presuming you mean the site across the Luas tracks from the back of M&S at Jervis?
Marlet is developing that site into a 270-room aparthotel & 200-room hotel. There’s also a hostel being built on a small adjacent site by another developer. Work has only been halted due to lockdown – before that they were laying the foundations.
@Drunk in Dublin: Apart from that site there’s no empty sites without about a 1km radius so definitely not “plenty of space to build near Jervis”.
How will you social distance in these, when you have to share kitchens? I am sure that the tenants will pay high rent, as much as a one bedroom flat
@Kevin Thompson: All the units are required to have kitchens too under rental regulations just they’d have access to a communal large kitchen / dining type area on every floor too.
@Kevin Thompson: people can’t social distance in current accommodation. There’s a lot of people sharing bedrooms in Dublin let alone a kitchen so this would be a step in the right direction for them if they could get one of these places.
Covid Hell holes more like
So Tenements then yea?
Outrageous to propose building co-living developments after the experience of a pandemic. This is in no one’s interest but the developers. Under recent Ministers for Housing we have had reduction of size for units, no storage space, poor inspection that has led to fire hazard, shoddy dangerous builds, lack of car spaces, no effort to control rents of new builds, building in parks & playing fields, all in the interest of filling developers pockets. Housing has deliberately not been managed to facilitate profiteering.
@Claire Quinn: I wouldn’t use the word ‘after’ just yet Claire. I think ‘during’ a pandemic is still appropriate, and may well be for a long time hopefully not though.
Sounds better than sharing a grubby three bed semi-d with strangers you don’t get on with. And a striking number of young people don’t do their own cooking anyway, what with all the cheap eateries in the city centre.
If you work in town and spend more time out of your digs than in, this sounds like a good idea.
So let them build it, and if nobody wants to live lke this, then the scheme will fail and only a developer will lose money, right?
@NotaWarder: no wrong. As more of these are built it will become the only type of accommodation available to people. It seems the only type of building currently going on in the city is hotels and student accommodation and now we’re adding upmarket hostels into the mix.
@EillieEs: Nonsense. There is more variety now more than ever. What should be built in the city centre, semi-d’s with a driveway and back garden? These amenities can’t always be provided and not everyone needs them anyway.
Like I said, if nobody wants these, then nobody will buy them.
@NotaWarder: What should be built is proper apartments with a decent amount of living space and private cooking facilities, not glorified hostel accomodation.
@Patrick FitzGerald: there are lots of apartments in the city centre, some with more amenities than the occupiers need or use.
Again, not everyone needs or wants cooking spaces.
I can’t imagine that the young high earners this is aimed at will be happy working from home in their bedroom. Many of the big tech companies will be recommending this for the foreseeable. Covid restrictions mean that students may not be allowed into student halls next year and we’ve been advised not to permit non members of our household into our houses from this week as they could spread the infection by touching door handles, toilets etc. Anyway, it’s all a bit academic at the moment as there won’t be short-term migrant workers for a long, long time
@Anne Marie Devlin: it’s always confused me too.. if the rent on these glorified hostel rooms was significantly lower than the average rent across Dublin I’d understand the appeal but realistically if you can afford one of these “luxury bedsits” or whatever they’re calling them you can afford somewhere more spacious I don’t exactly understand what demographic these are aimed at as few “Young, high earning, professionals”even the ones living semi nomadic lives or working for “the tech industry” would opt for less living space shared with more people for the same or nearly same price?
The migrant workers in Singapore live in hostels and guess where the second sure of Covid-19 happened.
No to fancy names for tenement buildings
If these “co-living” spaces had a much more reasonable rent then I think they could actually work in a way. Proposing people pay circa €1,300 a month per room is outrageous. Half that at least, and you could see the appeal for some people.
@Seán Ó hAnnracháin: if we increase supply they won’t get away with charging €1,300 a month for rent. The rent is a current reflection of the housing market. It’s not like landlords arbitrarily choose the rent – they charge what they can get away with.
I bought my own house and “co live” with 3 others as I wouldn’t be able to pay the mortgage on my own. So I share kitchen, living room etc with initially strangers. So what’s Eoin o Broin saying? Until I can.afford my own living space how am I going to get one?
@Joe: if you are depending on others to pay your mortgage then that’s not a great position to be in. If your 3 “co-livers” decide to leave in the morning you could be left in a very vunerable position.
@Derek Lyster:
I don’t remember the commenter asking for your opinion on his living arrangements. Perhaps best just to comment on the article instead of ill considered comments on someone’s circumstances.
@Joe: so you rent space in your home to cover mortgage payments how exactly is this even remotely similar to pay an astronomical sums to some vulture fund slumlord for the pleasure of living in a cell- sized room??call it what you want but if are were paying a mortgage on a home -regardless of how you make those payments-you will someday own it…its an investment rather than money thrown down a hole like most of “generation rent” so in effect you’re a landlord…
Shouldn’t have demolished the Ballymun blocks. A major refit whether council or by private investors would have made thousands of accommodations available for families and singles
@Paul: That what they were built for an failed. They were past the workable life anyway
@Paul:
You haven’t a clue what you’re talking if you seriously believe the towers just needed refurbishment. Unbelievable stupidity.
@Doug: I lived in Ballymun so I might just have an inkling. I was also visiting up to and including demolitions in the area
That’ll work out, I’m sure.
* “Open kitchens”. FFS
Don’t they have “pods” in Japan? Is that where we’re heading? Rent by the sq.inch – time to kick back!
@Celtic Kid: they’re just for people that have gone out for a few beers after work and missed the last train home…
These Co living ghettos should be stopped in their tracks from being built have we learned nothing since the covid 19 pandemic how could live isolating in one of those they should be banned
They’re not for everyone but it’s good to have a mix of accommodation types & there are many people in worse accommodation at the moment because people won’t face the reality of the rental market from their own properties. And I’ll welcome any increase in the housing supply as it will eventually lead to my insane rent being reduced or increasing the possibility that I can buy my own place someday.
@Podge: how will it lead to lower rents? Investment firms are happy to learn units sit idle rather than reduce rental prices.
@EillieEs: rents are high as there’s a lack of supply. Increase supply & see rents fall (provided there’s not a bubble to offset this).
Investment firms let buildings sit idle rather than rent them out because they’re trying to flip the property. They’re not in it for the long term. They buy a property, wait, & sell as the market has grown significantly. This won’t be the case if property market prices slow down or stagnate.
@Podge: So what you’re saying is, you’re happy to see hundreds of your fellow Irish people forced to live in horribly cramped conditions with no living space or privacy because it’ll benefit you in an indirect way? Your attitude is everything that’s wrong with modern life. Throwing your fellow humans under the bus so that your own life can improve a little.
Looks like a fantastic development. In the current situation, we need a strong private sector. The Government should fast track this through planning.
@Con Truise: A strong private sector caused the meltdown in the first place. With a pandemic that last thing you need id to build more cluster sites for the next one.
Could you imagine the craic in this place of a weekend……..
Has this current crisis taught us nothing???? These are exactly the types of placed Covid would run rampant.
The O’Brin chappie is absolutely right, don’t you know. One must have more extensive quarters if one is to entertain with a seafood extravaganza.
Although it could work for working type chappies.
In a post covid world how is this a good idea???? If this virus is going to be with us a while, imagine trying to self isolate……
Might work for short term rentals or AirBnB
Will, the majority of the proposed developments or even those granted planning permission, be built now?
While I fundamentally dislike the idea of co-living, I dislike crazy extortionate rents that generation rent have paid for years! In the short term these developments located in the city centre would alleviate some of the housing supply problems. Once we finally start delivering reasonably priced homes we can but a break/ban on future co-living developments.
Co-living spaces are quite common in the US, especially in the San Francisco Bay Area. It’s usually phd students, start-up and tech workers that share these places (in Bay Area anyway). Some are along the lines of what is being proposed in Jervis Centre and others are large houses with a mix of private and shared rooms. Communal working/study areas etc. It is aimed at people just starting out their first job usually and establishing themselves in the area, building friends and contacts etc. Most move into their own apartment after a while. Can be a good transition option.
I think this pandemic has shown to us that co-living is not viable.
Sounds like hell
Atop is something u wear, ON TOP is where they are…
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