Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
THE ONLY PARTY whose members favoured a No vote, according to the RTÉ exit poll, was Fianna Fáíl.
Why is that significant? The parliamentary party itself is split on the issue, and it shows there is a gulf between the soldiers of destiny and wider public opinion.
A breakdown of the supporters of political parties and how they voted is as follows:
While Fine Gael led the way in terms of being aligned with the public vote, followed by Sinn Féin, Fianna Fáil’s 50% is at total odds with the 66.4% Yes vote nationwide.
Fianna Fáil, which has spent decades in power since the foundation of the State, appears to have lost touch with the public mood.
The party pinned it’s colours to the mast on the issue of abortion last year when party members voted overwhelmingly to protect the Eighth Amendment at their Ard Fhéis.
Then there was a Citizens Assembly, the Oireachtas Committee on the Eighth Amendment, and it soon emerged that the party had a problem on its hands.
As the referendum campaign geared up, 31 Fianna Fáil TDs and senators gathered in Dublin’s Merrion Square holding ‘Vote No’ posters.
That’s more than half of the parliamentary party.
Those 31 politicians had an opinion different to their party leader, Micheál Martin, who came out early on in the campaign. A u-turn – he now favoured repealing the Eighth Amendment.
It has done Martin no harm though. Before yesterday’s results were revealed, there was a lot of talk about “mutterings” in the party about his leadership, with some speculating that his dissenting view was working against him.
Today, it’s clear he backed the right horse. His leadership can’t be challenged by those who did not. And those on the front and back benches will have to join him in the battle to drag their party into the 21st century.
It will be no easy task for the Cork TD. Despite deputies telling TheJournal.ie that after this week’s vote the party will come together again, that is easier said than done.
There is a bigger issue too. How did so many of them get it so wrong? Usually the party of populism, TDs who said they were against repealing the Eighth said they were doing so as they were representing the views of their constituents. From yesterday’s overwhelming Yes result in all counties, bar one, this is clearly not the case.
Standing out on its own, the party, in comparison to others, has judged the mood of the people utterly wrong.
In an interview with this website, Martin said that as a legislator, he had his own views on abortion, but his job is to represent the people that elected him, and do what is right for society. He urged his party members to do the same, but the message appears to have fallen on deaf ears.
As we approach the final Budget in the three-year deal between Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil, speculation will pick up about when there will be a general election.
Leo Varadkar is doing well in the polls – so some believe he would be wise to go to push the button now. Others state that this ‘Theresa May’ move will result in him being punished by the electorate.
And then there is Sinn Féin. Mary Lou’s Sinn Fein. With a leader who has just received a boost in popularity (passing out Martin and trailing slightly behind Varadkar), the party is a real threat to Fianna Fáil’s position as the main Opposition.
But can Fianna Fáil realistically knock on the doors of voters now? Eamon Ó Cúiv believes it won’t be a problem.
It doesn’t seem to affect things on the ground. There’s interesting precedent of that from the past… what happens in a referendum doesn’t seem to have any impact on general elections. If you ask me if I am quaking in my shoes that my seat’s gone then not particularly.
“The other thing is this, if you take a five-seater, I presume 30% in Galway West voted on the no side – that’s two quotas.”
Solidarity-People Before Profit’s Ruth Coppinger isn’t convinced, telling TheJournal.ie that Fianna Fáil is “living in a different timezone”.
“I think the fact that one of the biggest parties in the State has shown itself to be so removed from the population, with over half of its TDs coming out for a no vote and actually getting involved in a quite reactionary campaign – I think they have serious questions to answer. The Dail in my opinion is a bastion of conservatism in my opinion in comparison to the population, but Micheál Martin has a particular problem.”
Martin previously said that TDs that voted No would back the legislation, if it is the will of the people, and that is exactly what Fianna Fáil TDs were out saying yesterday, with the deputy leader, and No voter, Dara Calleary, saying he would vote for the legislation to proceed through the Houses.
Mary Butler, one of the strongest voices on the No side, also said she wouldn’t harm legislation or filibuster during the process.
Cork South–Central TD Michael McGrath, who also campaigned for a No vote, said he will not block the Bill on the termination of pregnancy.
“I don’t intend to oppose or block the legislation,” he said. “The people have spoken emphatically. It’s now going to have to be given effect in the Oireachtas.
“While it may not have been a vote directly on the Government’s Bill, people voted in full knowledge of what the bill contains. I think in effect it is an endorsement of the Government’s bill,” he added.
“We are seeing old Ireland shedding its skin,” Coppinger said yesterday. Whether that skin is Fianna Fáil, we’ll have to wait for the next election.
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
Customers???? What have IW to sell to anyone.
@Dave Doyle:
Delivery and maintenance of the water system
@Nick Allen: Maintenance of water infrastructure should always be a state’s own responsibility. No company should ever be allowed profit from this.
@Joe Phillips:
If a third party company could maintain the water system more cost effectively than the government while still making a profit would you object to that?
The problem with national assets is that they without question the Irish people / government needs to maintain ownership and the assets should never be allowed to be sold to the highest bidder. However, the government is not skilled and and has demonstrated superbly well that it cannot mange these assets correctly. We need to find a solution where we still own it but outsource the management to specialist professionals. For example, TransDev manager the LUAS and by and large deliver a good service while making a profit yet the state still owns the LUAS. We need this type of public / private partnership which is a genuine partnership and not just a cover to sell of the assets or allow a private organisation to try an maximise profit from it.
@Nick Allen: ‘Delivery and maintenance of the water system’ IS and WAS already paid for.
Anything extra should be taken the same way or that should also be refunded.
We are sick and tired for paying twice and three times for everything with still the underlying issues being left unfixed.
@eastsmer:
You need to move on from that idea. There is a finite pot of money to pay for our services to be delivered and we need to pay more into the pot. It doesn’t matter what u think u have paid for nor what you have paid for we still need money to pay for our water system.
@Nick Allen: = Neo liberal lemon
@Nick Allen: IW are no more than a glorified billing company. They do nothing to maintain a system or deliver one drop of water to anyone.
This “customer” stupidity is no more than a euphemism used in an attempt to change who people think about IW.
The DSP are trying the same stupidity on people.
@Nick Allen:
Except Irish Water has already cost the taxpayer billions and has provided absolutely nothing in return.
@Nick Allen:
Yes we need to pay for our water system
But Irish Water needs to be closed.
It is a billing company set up to privatise a natural resource,.
It has absolutely no legitimacy and not a penny should ever be paid to it.
@eastsmer: The issues are very fixed now. The Water Services Bill 2017 has seen to that.
Water will be privatised. It will go the way of the ESB.
We have been royally shafted by FG/FF.
The bill was disguised as a means to pay the “refund”.
The detail, which has been kept very quite, has laid the ground for privatisation.
@Colin Morris:
Where did I say or suggest that IW was the right organisation to deliver this?
@Setrakian:
Do you know what an internet troll is? How is my comment trolling? It is simply expressing my view which is directly related to the article and the comments I replied to.
Its funny how people resort to name calling and factual inaccuracies when they don’t know enough about the subject matter nor have the ability to debate it on its merits. And it is you who offers me sympathy, thanks for that but I do feel guilty as it is you who is more deserving of sympathy
@Colin Morris: Wicklow County Council take care of the maintenance of the water system here as they always did. Only now it’s under contract to Irish Water. Every other city and county council must be the same. The only difference is there is now a third party call centre you call and they in turn call the council…… How this is more cost effective to pay over a billion euro to set up a quango to collect cash is beyond me.
@Nick Allen: you are on the journal throughout the day – every day fully supporting everything your rotten government is responsible for including the Irish Water scam. Apologies for the late reply – I’ve been busy working. You are a troll & going by most comments in response to your ignorant posts – a complete numpty. Hope that clarifies for you Nicky.
@Nick: You are flogging a dead rat mate, it’s already paid for.
They sent the bills to the correct address I’m sure they can send the refund cheque to it too
@Michelle_Herbert:
You are making the assumption that nobody has changed their address since they initially provide it to IW. Do you really think this is likely?
@Nick Allen: I bet you paid them extra.
@Justin Barrett:
Why? because I highlighted that some people have changed address over the last couple of years. Interesting logic there.Ah, well, if I did pay extra then no doubt I will get an even bigger refund, I wonder what I will treat myself to this xmas with the new found windfall.
@Michelle_Herbert: I got my cheque on Monday. It’s only if your address changes that you need to inform IW.
@Michelle_Herbert: they need to refund back through the same channels that payment was made. In general if people pay electronically, then their refund should return to their account, electronically.
People with no bank accounts cannot cash these cheques. Those people paid in cash in post offices. They should get refunded by the same method.
@Father Hody Commody:
They only need to refund back to the original payment method if the original payment method was a card payment
@Michelle_Herbert: There is also a percentage of us that had no choice and had to pay IW or the sale of our house could not be completed (the government made it law in January 2016) obviously we are no longer at that address so IW has to be informed.
@Father Hody Commody: you’re an idiot. Not true dumb fcuk
Irish Water? Never heard of it.
And once this money has been repaid I assume that Irish Water will be closed in its entirety and all its staff made redundant.
it is a truly toxic company that served no other purpose than as a billing company set up to privatise a natural resource.
Irish people (who already pay for water through taxation) need to pay for water – but not a penny must EVER be paid to Irish Water.
By the way any correspondence from Irish Water must be automatically binned.
@Colin Morris: The issuing of cheques to people that paid cash enables this ‘company’ to obtain bank account details where the cheques are lodged. That’s why they issue cheques.
@Father Hody Commody: They only need your address. No one needs bank account details to issue a cheque.
@Father Hody Commody: Its actually the other way around. To issue by cheque you do not need the bank account details, to do an electronic funds transfer then you do need the account details.
As a matter of interest, in your conspiracy theory what it the benefit to Irish water to have your bank account details? Unless you give them explicit permission to withdraw funds then they cannot do so.
@Father Hody Commody: you haven’t a clue. Back to junior infants with ya
Geez and here,s me thinking a customer is someone who willingly does business with someone else.
@Derek Poutch: Exactly. They had no business acquiring our details to begin with.
Is this the real Irish water or that fake one, sounds like those scams.
I recently moved house and phoned IW to change my details. They were unbelievably unhelpful demanding crazy information and making it as hard as possible to change my details. I sensed it was a deliberate attempt to not refund me
Be very careful of phishing.
The chancers tried to get my PPS number.
I’m sure they’d have their details if they were supposed to pay and hadn’t.
Would have made a nice Christmas bonus..had I been a big enough mug to pay in the first place.
Hearing a lot of spin about this, yet as someone who paid charge and has a water meter at my gate i haven’t heard a peep out of IW. Are they doing anything other than issuing press releases i wonder????
@eimsley:
You can go onto their website and enter your account number and WPRN number and it will tell you the size of your refund and the date they expect to post it to you
@Nick Allen: think he means if they have done any actual infrastructure maintenance that isn’t just reactionary and more preventative. Bugger all in 3-4 Years I think at the cost of billions.
They would know where you live if they were after money .
No and they never will.
Happy to say I got my cheque in the post and bought 4 Superdraw tickets with it
Got my cheque this week, donating one third each to FG, the parish church and to the pro life campaign. :)
They have mine even though I never gave it to them. They still haven’t responded to my query as to where they got my details.
People 1 irish water 0
Some other right here
I paid with Post Office how do i get my refund
have your say