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LAST UPDATE | 11 Dec 2023
A DRAFT DEAL at COP28 will not be accepted by the EU unless significant changes are made, Minister for Climate Eamon Ryan has said.
Countries have been negotiating for nearly two weeks at a UN climate conference on major decisions about efforts to try to thwart climate change, including the need to cut fossil fuel use.
But the deal is at risk of falling apart, with former US Vice President Al Gore saying the conference is “on the verge of complete failure”.
The latest version of a decision text, which has gone through several drafts as countries tussle over how far they will be expected to go, has deleted language in previous drafts about phasing out fossil fuels.
Instead, the current draft recognises the need to reduce emissions and calls upon countries to take actions that “could include” “reducing both consumption and projection of fossil fuels, in a just, orderly and equitable manner so as to achieve net zero by, before or around 2050 in keeping with the science”.
A previous draft had set out three options for what the final version might include around fossil fuels. One was a call for an “orderly and just phase out of fossil fuels”, while another was for “accelerating efforts towards phasing out unabated fossil fuels and to rapidly reducing their use so as to achieve net-zero CO2 in energy systems by or around mid-century”. The final option was that no item would be included on the matter.
The distinction between phasing out or phasing down has been seen as highly important as it means the difference between a specific call to fully cut out fossil fuels, or a vaguer one that puts much weaker obligation on countries.
However, this latest draft text sidesteps that debate entirely by referring only to “reducing” fossil fuels.
Minister Eamon Ryan, who is on the ground at the conference — though not a lead negotiator on this text, which is known as the Global Stocktake — said that he does not expect this text will be accepted.
“We have to get an agreement but it won’t be on the basis of this text,” Ryan said.
He said the use of the phrase could include’ — meaning there would be no real obligation on countries to cut fossil fuels — “kills everything”.
“Even beneath that, down the line, it’s not strong enough. It raises real problems in a whole range of different ways.”
In the area of climate finance, he said there is “much missing” and “no real opening up of the possibility of wider sources of finance and reducing harmful sources of finance”.
Asked whether he would walk away from the deal if the text is not amended, he said: “If this doesn’t change, yes, it will not be accepted as the text.”
COP28 is now on the verge of complete failure. The world desperately needs to phase out fossil fuels as quickly as possible, but this obsequious draft reads as if OPEC dictated it word for word. It is even worse than many had feared. It is “Of the Petrostates, By the Petrostates…
— Al Gore (@algore) December 11, 2023
EU climate commissioner Wopke Hoekstra said this afternoon that there are “a couple of good things in there, but overall it is clearly insufficient and not adequate to addressing the problem we are here to address”.
As the COP meets, many parts of the world are already facing devastating impacts of climate change.
If global average temperatures rise by 1.5 degrees, the world “faces unavoidable multiple climate hazards” in the next 20 years, according to the Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change.
Exceeding a 1.5 degree rise, even temporarily, would lead to “additional severe impacts, some of which will be irreversible”.
Along with the EU, small island states and the US have called for the final deal to have more specific demands on fossil fuel use.
Chair of the Alliance of Small Island States (AOSIS) Toeolesulusulu Cedric Schuster said: ”We feel our voices are not being heard, while it appears that several other parties have enjoyed preferential treatment, compromising the transparency and inclusivity of the process.”
A US State Department spokesperson said that the “mitigation section, including the issue of fossil fuels, needs to be substantially strengthened, and the finance section contains inaccuracies that must be fixed”.
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Ryan a green agenda leader who believes everything he’s told about climate, but look let’s get real we never drink out of rivers and streams directly because wild life does their toilet there.
The mushroom industry has Teagasc running experiments to find an alternative to peat because the green agenda shut this down.
We’re paying carbon tax since 2010 to save the ice caps while these fossil fuel funded countries do not pay and are leaving the ice caps melting.
If Ryan and the greens were seriously considering saving the planet the why have we no adopted the Danish solution of giving free solar panels, heat pumps and ev chargers to towns and villages. Could it be all about the money because currently Ireland going no where near nett zero. The plastic bottles are going to be a disaster with the 15c charge considering most already put them in the green bin.
It’s all about the money and nothing to do carbon reduction or carbon capture.
@Liam Foy: Return plastic bottles… They will only accept the ones with the special logo. The bog standard ones will not fall under the scheme.
Smart!!!
@Liam Foy: This government will never give out free solar panels to homes as the current energy providers business model would be destroyed, we would be selling them our excess electricity and buying a lot less of them. It suits the government and big corporations to install massive wind and solar farms, the big business can keep on selling the electricity to us at sky high prices and the government can keep taxing us on the electricity we buy..
@john dennehy: I always thought it strange that it doesn’t matter the source of my electricity I still pay the same price. Surely with all the carbon taxes it would be cheaper to use renewable?
That man and his party are costing the hard pressed citizens of this country a fortune in every green tax he can think of. However flies around the world at our expense and comes back empty handed. Pratt.
@John Flanagan: he is an Ar$ewipe
@John Flanagan: and you would achieve what, he is not coming back empty handed, the EU negotiating team may be.
@Éamonn OKane: I’m sorry eamonn. What he comes back is more expense for the poor people of this country. Who like lt or lump it don’t give a crap about him or the greens. These people are interested in the cost of living and how to put food on the table for there families. You I would think don’t have those problems. Lucky you.
He spent two weeks out there & came back empty handed!
@Jippo Nolan: thank God he’s empty handed. Can only imagine the deal that fella would be happy with
@mainmsam: Irish politicians don’t like a deal for the electorate, I’m sure a handful of multinationals will do well tho
@Jippo Nolan: That’s wrong of you to say that. Hasn’t he a good tan.
@Jippo Nolan: Is he back in Ireland? He’s also not a lead negotiator.
@Jippo Nolan: Great stuff .
@Jippo Nolan: his gullibility would be preyed upon -easy pickings for the salesperson at these shindigs,as most Irish representatives..look at the td in cork who bought wooden boxes for a few hundred grand and eighty grand a year service that do the same work as 4 trees,ya couldn’t make it up
@Jippo Nolan: Except he hasn’t come back. Negotiations are on-going.
@Jippo Nolan:
AT OUR EXPENSE!
The Cabbage Heads in this government have my pocket emptied and I am a pensioner.
The little comforts we have planned for our retirements have been picked from our pockets by this unscrupulous Coalition.
Let the electorate speak in the next election!!
@Jippo Nolan: Anyone who uses their vote for this spoofer should really have a long look in the mirror
@Ollie Fitzpatrick: well said Ollie, the people on the street get fleeced and big business makes a fortune. We get it from every angle
@Pato: In fairness, his and the Greens own actions bring on that warranted abuse.
@Jimmy Wallace: he might see it as right. But he is so so wrong
@John Flanagan: really? Can you put us all right?
@Jimmy Wallace: maybe he should go with the do as I do approach rather than the do as I say approach. Maybe if he actually tried to make a difference instead of hitting the pockets of the working and lower class people might actually listen to him. Open your eyes ffs
@Jimmy Wallace: If the Greens really wanted us to reduce fossil fuel usage then
1) they would not support all those data centers
2) they would tax the actual producers of fossil fuel sourced energy not the consumer, most of which can do little to nothing about it
2a) they could then allocate the revenue collected from 2 above to actually help the consumer reduce their ff usage
Based on their actual deeds, The Greens have no ‘conviction’ other than try to screw the consumer for the benefit of the corporation.
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: if they don’t support the datacentres then there is no revenue to collect from them. I agree with the taxation of the producers of fossil fuel because they make plenty of money from that.
@John Flanagan: on what scientific basis?
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere:
Exactly! Rather than bring things in gradually the wade in blindfolded. We are being pistol whipped by environmental issues on a continuous basis and it is really not good for the mental health of our nation!!
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: Basic economics means that if you tax the producers, they will just pass it onto the consumer and the net result is the same. Fyi, they do already tax producers.
@Éamonn OKane: people don’t give a crap about science. They do not want to pay taxes that are made on the hoof by eamon and his green friends.
@Mick Duvanny: Not if you tax the *profits* of the producers.
And ensure that tax grows if they try to increase profits.
@hans vos: Unless those data canters produce 20% of the revenue for the state then they are a burden, and best done without.
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: Very niave comment!!
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: My comment at the top of this thread was a response to a comment by Pato, which has since disappeared.
There was nothing in the least offensive or objectionable about that comment (except that it was in support of Eamon R).
Why was that comment removed?
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: Unbelievable that we support this parasitic technology sector to such an extent. Basically it’s because the government is technologically illiterate and can’t evaluate the pros and cons of data centres and their insatiable energy consumption.
It’s all about the money.
@macdara powell: Everything is. We’re going nowhere until it’s not, that and religion. Gotta go.
@Thesaltyurchin: you’re right. It was interesting when the golf deal was done last week. Usual bs here: wouldn’t you take the money?. The real question is: can you imagine a world in which the choice is not between money and morals.
There is nothing to stop the EU and the US from unilaterally phasing out fossil fuels.
Except that they know there is no immediate alternative to fossil fuels for the foreseeable future.
@Peter McCormack: They could immediately embark on a massive programme to expand nuclear power. Instead, the likes of Germany have shut down their nuclear power plants, and what happened? CO2 emissions and energy proces have shot up. The climate activists were the very ones who wanted the nuclear power plants shut down, the only cheap, clean and non co2 emitting form of energy we have.
@Tom D: I’d be all for that except could you trust our current bunch of gombeens to run it properly. Would take us 20 years to build it, and we’d find it obsolete after 5.
@Peter McCormack: well considering the dollar is backed by oil and not gold, the USA will be the last country dragged kicking and screaming to stop using fossil fuels
We’re doomed as a species. We will absolutely be the cause of our own demise. Greed seems to prevail all of the time.
@Ian: replace greed with common sense Ian and you’re 100% right
@Ian: Yup. They’re addicts, just like a smak head looking for the next fix.
@mainmsam: you’re part of it if too.
Ryan had better realize and understand that he is dealing with a different type of animal in UAEs , he will not impose his own will of them bucks . He is used to getting his own way with Varadka and Martin . He has a different sow by the lug out there , and he is sure to loose .
See the way this ‘cop’ jolly for 2 weeks is only an annual thing……….. mmmm…a fortnight in Dubai on taxpayers euro??? Why not make it BI-annual???…… couple weeks in summer & then another fortnight before santa. Let’s be honest all these ‘ cops’ follow the same script….:
express outrage.
Promise more funding / taxes.
Agree to ‘do more’ at next ‘cop’
Argue about text of something
Argue more about text of something
Bang the table
Express even more outrage
Hold ‘talks’ through the night ( as if )
Argue some more about text.
Agree text
Issue statement about ‘best cop’ ever
Every climate activist should be asked two questions : Do you support nuclear power, and if so, what have you done to advocate for it?
@Tom D: it cost Ireland 4 billion to build a hospital. It would cost 10 times that for nuclear. Hell they’d probably just spend 4 billion on consultants.
The head on ‘em
He has,nt the power he has here
How many bombs dropped on Gaza?
It is like using 50 million a day of toxic fireworks. They could build a new Gaza with that money rather making genocide plus ecological crisis in Occupied Palestine.
@Ham Hat: After Israel is finished, Gaza will be empty. In 10 years time the Israeli settlers will arrive..
@Ham Hat: Climate change doesn’t need to be injected into every topic. Your comment makes no sense
@Peter McCormack: in ten years time, in that part of the Earth, there will be significant drop in water table levels and masses of humanity will be on the move as the soil will be too hot to grow food, just as it will be too wet here to harvest or grow food, which has already begun here this year and in the Middle East, there is a 40%drop in water levels already.
So griping about having to begin to make the absolute necessary changes in the use of fossil fuels and reducing our consumption is equivalent to the metaphor of Nero fiddling while Rome burned.
Lead negotiator they rewarded him with in Europe,they will regret it
Deleted a heap of comments from earlier – The Journal.
The Party told you to reject the evidence of your eyes and ears. It was their final, most essential command.
Damn right he and his allies should be playing hardball here. Petrostates and fossil fuel companies have lobbied hard to water down any commitment to phase out fossil fuels. These and the climate denying ideologues (i.e. journal.ie commenters) seem to be okay with the horrible future that 99% of scientists predict.
Even if you are too stupid to believe that climate change is real, perhaps think as to why petrostates want to preserve the status quo: they like the money and power that fossil fuels bring them. Money and power that they take from us.
@Name not provided: Those petrostates may have less power than they think.
What would they do if the consumer nations simply stopped using?
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: saudi control the global economy and its faith by its continued support of the petro dollar. the US know this. as soon as the saudis stop supporting the petro dollar, the US economy goes belly up and brings the rest of the world down with it.
@Niall English: its why the US allow them to literally get away with murder of a US citizen.
@Name not provided: Of course you are incorrect, it is Our Government that takes the money from us in Excise, VAT , and any means they can think of to tax it more. Oil is relatively cheap on the world market . Don’t forget the Ryan closed up out peat briquette factories and started importing dirty briquettes from Poland .European Countries are hardly taking this crap serious,I think Germand are still producing coal . Ryan is a nutcase .
@Name not provided: Read the literature instead of engaging in alarmism. There are various computer models based on projected temperatures increases over time with various probabilities for expected effects. The highest probability outcomes converge on mild to moderate outcomes with a mix of positives (high crop yields in northern latitudes) and negatives (more frequent climatic events), etc. The consensus is NOT a catastrophe, as the climate cultists would have you believe. There is a danger of unknown threshold effects but considered low probability. The models don’t account for climate change mitigation and technological innovation, including new energy sources.
@Tom D: Where are you getting this information? Sounds like you actually haven’t read ‘the literature’.
@Niall English: There is still little that Saudi can do if we were to be able to make the transition to renewables.
In fact, it might be the best thing to happen this world from an economic and political perspective too.
A global climate change hosted by an oil producing country: what could possibly go wrong?
Green Party are the new Labour… No ones ever voting for them again!
Oh dear god, don’t get me started. I mean, not so long ago, they got people to change from petrol to diesel & and the latest is electric! If fact they want everyone on bikes. They gave out million in grants to install wood burners & different methods of heating & now want them banned! They chopped down beautiful cherries trees on my road where the kids could play for parking spaces! ah, the whole thing is ridiculous. But the main point should be , if we’re on the brink of a disaster, then WHY aren’t they worried??
The simple answer is nuclear power folks. Phase out fossil fuels over a period of time, but construct and commission these plants. Regarding recycling etc, build incinerators. And for those who shout incinerators pollute the atmosphere, please actually check out how an incinerator works. What’s the net result? Jobs, and not only jobs, but technical jobs. Jobs that will make an economy drive. Sure build wind turbines solar farms etc…who doesn’t want clean air clean water etc…but taxing John and Mary for lighting their fire to stay warm is only punishing the everyday person when it’s been government failure…create courses in University on Nuclear Power etc
Looks like no deal eamon still you can always come back here and add a few more silly green taxes offer us more so called cheap loans to try and save your retrofit failed campaign then of course you can tell us how organic honey is made by bees only going to organic flowers imported slurry from conventional farms to organic farmers doesn’t contain chemicals when it is spread on organic farms
Ireland has a maritime climate that will not change. That leaves a well-known subculture where most here are victims.
Instead of seeking to discover the mean or medium point, around which oscillate, in apparent independence of forces, all the phenomena of the external world, this system delights in multiplying exceptions and seeks, amid phenomena and in organic forms, for something beyond the marvel of a regular succession, and an internal and progressive development. Ever inclined to believe that the order of nature is disturbed, it refuses to recognise in the present any analogy with the past and, guided by its own varying hypotheses, seeks at hazard, either in the interior of the globe or in the regions of space, for the cause of these pretended perturbations.” Von Humboldt
@Gearoid O’Ceilleachair: Ireland’s climate will almost certainly change.
What happens when there are no ice caps?
With no density difference – due to the salinity of sea water versus ice – will the Gulf Stream shut down?
And if the Gulf Stream shuts down, what effect will that have on on climate?
It could be much more like Newfoundland.
@ItWasLikeThatWhenIGotHere: 20000 years ago that happened and the North got a new ice age
COP out 28!
Next article “social welfare cuts”…€140 per month not week…do you not fact check before you publish?
We are beyond fkd! The path we are on leads only to collapse! So it goes I guess.
It could be that we will thank Eamonn Ryan and be grateful for the work he is doing at COP28
Doesn’t really come as a surprise when you look at the location of this COP, it’s president/ chair and the way he denied the science & shouted down Mary Robinson, demonstrating all that is bad about the Arab Petrostates : greed, misogyny & a big f**k you to the rest of the planet.
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