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FactCheck: The truth and the lies from the final Leaders' Debate

TheJournal.ie’s GE16 FactCheck has pulled out all the stops for the last-chance, high-stakes battle at RTE last night.

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Updated: 3.38 pm

AS PART OF our GE16 FactCheck series, we’re testing the truth of claims made by candidates and parties on the campaign trail.

If you hear something that doesn’t sound quite right, or see a claim that looks great, but you want to confirm it, email factcheck@thejournal.ie.

Tonight was the big one – the final Leaders’ Debate, hosted by RTE’s Prime Time, with just two days to go until the election.

Here’s a comprehensive rating of all the truth and lies from the final, high-stakes battle.

primetimedebate RTE RTE

CLAIM: Almost 1,000 people take their own lives on the island of Ireland each year – Gerry Adams
Verdict: Mostly TRUE

First, a correction. In the liveblog last night, we incorrectly rated this claim as FALSE. Without the benefit of a replay, we misheard Adams’ claim as 5,000 suicides per year in the Republic of Ireland.

These things can happen in the context of a live event, and we’re happy to correct the record at the outset of this article.

What was said:

There are almost 1,000 people every year recorded as taking their lives through suicide across this island.

The facts:

According to the CSO, there were on average 505 suicides a year in the Republic of Ireland, from 2007-2014.

According to the Northern Ireland Statistics and Research Agency (NISRA), there were on average 279 suicides a year in the North, during the same period.

That’s a total of 784 on average, throughout the island of Ireland. So the Sinn Féin leader’s claim is Mostly TRUE.

Housing & Homelessness

90406950 RollingNews.ie RollingNews.ie

CLAIM: 1,000 social housing units were built by local authorities last year – Joan Burton.
Verdict: Very, very FALSE.

What was said:

Confusion was rife during this section of the debate, so let’s clear a few things up. Miriam O’Callaghan and Joan Burton had this exchange:

MOC: Last year, your government built just 28 local authority social and affordable houses. Isn’t that a damning statistic?
JB: Well I think your statistic is not quite correct, it doesn’t show the full picture, because if you look at how many families and individuals got social houses through the local authority, there was actual over 4,000 social houses given out via local authorities.

Now, 1,000 of those were new builds. I don’t know where you got your figure from…

The facts:

socialhousingcompletions2015 Dept of the Environment Dept of the Environment

O’Callaghan correctly insisted that the figure of 28 came from the Department of the Environment’s own statistics, but data is only available for the first nine months of the year, and 28 is the number built by local authorities alone.

Including voluntary and cooperative housing, there were 246 units built up until September.

So Burton’s claim about 1,000 new local authority houses is FALSE by a very large margin.

Burton also stated that before Christmas, 22 social housing units were built in her constituency, and another 22 were built “in the first couple of months of this year.”

Assuming this is correct, the 22 built before Christmas would not show up in the official statistics yet, because they don’t cover the fourth quarter of 2015.

The 22 built since January would obviously not factor in the numbers for 2015, so this is something of a moot point.

O’Callaghan then claimed that social housing construction “ground to a halt” under Fianna Fáil. There’s no precise definition of “grinding to a halt,” of course, but this seems a slightly unfair description.

ALLsocialhousing

Between 2008 and 2010, as mentioned by O’Callaghan, local authority social housing construction did fall by 73%, from 4,905 to 1,328.

Including voluntary and co-operative housing, the decrease was 69% – from 6,801 to 2,081.

But in absolute terms, Fianna Fáil’s last period in government (2007-2010) saw almost six times more social housing construction than that of Fine Gael and Labour (2011-2015), namely 20,380 as opposed to 3,512.

Indeed, as we have noted before, local authorities built 1,328 social houses in 2010, Fianna Fáil’s last year in government. That’s the same number that has been built throughout Fine Gael and Labour’s entire tenure.

For full details on this issue, check out this article.

CLAIM: 2,300 ghost estates have been opened up since 2011 – Joan Burton
Verdict: Almost entirely TRUE

What was said:

When we came into government there were thousands of ghost estates, and we have actually refinished and opened up 2,300 ghost estates…

The facts:

ghostestates Housing Agency Housing Agency

According to the Housing Agency’s December report, the number of unfinished housing developments going into 2011 was 2,876, and the number going into this year was 668.

That’s a reduction of 2,208 – just short of the 2,300 claimed by the Tánaiste.

CLAIM: 1,000 families left homelessness last year – Joan Burton
Verdict: Very likely FALSE

What was said:

Last year, Miriam, and I’m happy to say this in one way, 1,000 families left being homeless…

We had thought this might have been a misstatement, conflating “families” and individuals. However, the Labour leader followed up later on in the debate, specifying:

…Last year, 1,000 families left being homeless, that was almost 2,000 people.

The facts:

The Department of the Environment’s Social Housing Report for 2015 found that 2,000 people had left homelessness last year.

There is no breakdown of how many of those were families, and 1,000 probably overstates the case quite significantly.

Since a family contains more than one person, the figure would, by definition, have to be at the very least 2,000 people for the claim of 1,000 families to be accurate.

We know that the average number of persons in a family in emergency accommodation, for example, is 3.45, so the likely maximum number of families in that figure of 2,000 would be 580.

And since single adults would also have been among those moving out of homelessness, the number of families would be even lower than 580, which makes Burton’s claim very likely to be FALSE.

CLAIM: In 2015, 13,000 families were provided with social housing – Joan Burton
Verdict: Half-TRUE, she may have misspoken.

What was said:

Last year, we housed 13,000 families, the majority of them through social renting.

The facts:

The Tánaiste appears to be using “families” liberally again, here.

In 2015, according to the department’s social housing output report, 13,141 tenancies were agreed.

Again, no breakdown of families or individuals is offered, but it is safe to assume there were at least some single adults placed in social housing rental, meaning Burton’s claim can only really be regarded as Half-TRUE.

Economy & Tax

CLAIM: Gerry Adams appeared to think someone earning more than €100,000 would pay only 7% in tax under Sinn Féin’s plan – Miriam O’Callaghan
Verdict: TRUE, but he may have misspoken.

The Sinn Féin leader firmly disputed this one, so let’s examine it.

What was said last night:

MOC: Gerry, I heard you talking to Sean O’Rourke on the radio the other day and you seemed genuinely confused, and thought that someone earning €100,000 paid a tax rate of 7%.
GA: No I didn’t say that. You listen back…I’m very very clear that we are going to introduce a new rate of tax individually, for those citizens who earn over €100,000, and we will add seven cents on every euro extra that they earn.

The facts:

You can listen to Adams’ interview on RTE Radio One’s Today programme here.

Here’s an excerpted transcript of the relevant section, which starts at 11:25.

GA: I am conceding the point that an individual earning over €100,000 will pay no more than 7 cents in the euro, for every euro earned. He only starts to get taxed above €100,000…
SOR: No sorry, you seem to be suggesting that every cent, or every euro you earn above €100,000 will only be taxed at seven cent in the euro. That is not the case.
GA: That is the case, Seán. That is the case, that has been carefully worked out with us, because we want to be fair in all of this.

As you can see, Adams did indeed stipulate that the individual earning more than €100,000 “only starts to get taxed above €100,000,” and that they would only be taxed at 7% above this margin, under Sinn Féin’s plan.

Both of those claims are false.

The “seven” that keeps recurring here relates to Sinn Féin’s plan to increase the top rate of tax by 7%, from 52% to 59%.

Adams’ claim tonight that the party would add “seven cents on every euro extra that they earn” is accurate. But this is not what he asserted in conversation with Seán O’Rourke, and so Miriam O’Callaghan’s claim was TRUE.

Adams may have misspoken, but was given an opportunity to correct his assertions, when challenged by O’Rourke, and refused, insisting “That is the case.”

CLAIM: Sinn Féin introduced a bill to abolish the USC – Miriam O’ Callaghan
Verdict: TRUE

What was said:

In the first of O’Callaghan’s two claims on shifting stances towards USC, she told the Taoiseach:

In December 2014, your Finance Minister Michael Noonan said that the USC was never intended to be a temporary tax, that it was a necessary measure to widen the tax base, and that it plays a vital part in meeting the many expenditure demands on the exchequer.
And now you’re planning to abolish it.

The facts:

On 16 December 2014, Noonan wrote, in response to a PQ from Fine Gael TD Brendan Griffin:

noonanUSC Oireachtas.ie Oireachtas.ie

CLAIM: Sinn Féin introduced a bill to abolish the USC – Miriam O’Callaghan
Verdict: TRUE

What was said: 

O’Callaghan addressed this one to Gerry Adams:

On March the 29th 2011, your party – through a private member’s bill, sought the abolition of the USC. Your finance spokesperson Pearse Doherty described it as little more than a tax on the working poor and a grossly unfair tax.

The facts:

On 29 March 2011, Doherty did indeed introduce a private member’s motion to “abolish the Universal Social Charge.”

He said it was “little more than a working poor tax,” and called it “unjust” and “regressive in the extreme,” although he didn’t refer to it as “grossly unfair” in that particular debate.

You can read his remarks in full here.

Health

90405102 RollingNews.ie RollingNews.ie

CLAIM: Today’s trolley count is the highest on record – Micheál Martin
Verdict: FALSE, but he was probably not speaking literally

What was said:

…the trolley count today is the highest on record…

Gerry Adams was more specific, adding later in the discussion on health:

Let me remind you that today, 511 citizens were on hospital trolleys.

The facts:

According to the INMO’s daily Trolley Watch figures, there were 511 patients waiting to be seen, on trolleys or in wards on Tuesday 23 February.

Technically speaking, 379 were waiting on Emergency Department trolleys, but the overall figure is generally referred to as the “trolley count” because, as the INMO says, it “provides a picture of whole hospital overcrowding.”

Since the trolley count was 539 on 9 February, for example, today’s figure is clearly not the highest on record, and so Martin’s claim, interpreted literally, is FALSE.

However, he may well have been alluding to the overall trend.

It’s important to note that trolley counts can fluctuate significantly from day to day, and politicians on all sides have a tendency to cherry-pick points of comparison to suit their arguments.

For example, Health Minister Leo Varadkar did just that during tonight’s debate:

From those figures, there would appear to have been a 14% reduction in the number of patients on trolleys over the course of the current government’s tenure in office.

However, if we look at the INMO figures from February 2011 (below), we can see that there were in fact 391 people on trolleys on yesterday’s date in 2011, not 443, which is actually the number for 22 February 2011.

feb2011trolley INMO INMO

And if Varadkar had gone just one day further back, to 21 February 2011, the number would have been 338. That would indicate a 12% increase in the number of patients on trolleys, during the course of the current government’s time in office.

To avoid this selectivity and distortion (of which all sides are guilty), you have to look at the overall trends, which are recorded by the INMO here.

Since the INMO added wards to their trolley watch in 2013, they show annual increases in numbers of:

  • 21% from 2014-2015
  • 37% from 2013-2015

CLAIM: The government has recruited 750 more nurses and 300 more hospital consultants – Enda Kenny
Verdict: Half-TRUE

What was said:

We have recruited 750 nurses, 300 consultants…

The facts: 

90407005 RollingNews.ie RollingNews.ie

We previously addressed the claim about nurses, which Kenny made during RTE’s first Leaders’ Debate.

According to the HSE’s Health Service Employment report for December 2015 (the most recent available), there were 35,353 nurses employed across the health service that month, which is 844 more than the same time in 2014.

So on a year-to-year basis, the Taoiseach’s claim is almost entirely TRUE, and in fact slightly understates the level of nursing recruitment in 2015.

The same report found 2,724 consultants employed by the HSE in December 2015, an increase of 89 from the same month in 2014.

So on a year-to-year basis, the claim of 300 extra consultants is FALSE.

However, there was an increase of 297 consultants between December 2010 and September 2015 (i.e. over the lifetime of the government), according to the HSE’s Health in Ireland report last year.

Then, there were 2,412, and in September 2015, there were 2,709.

So if the Fine Gael leader was referring to his party’s period in government, his claim about consultants would be almost entirely TRUE.

But if the same criteria were applied to nurses – change in numbers over the course of the entire government – that would show an overall decrease of 1,150, from 36,503 in 2010 to 35,353 in September.

Since the Taoiseach appears to mixing two vastly different periods of comparison, and the claims are true by one measure, and false by another, we rate the overall claim Half-TRUE.

CLAIM: Ireland’s life expectancy increased higher than any European country in the last decade – Micheál Martin
Verdict: FALSE

What was said:

Have you looked at the lifespan, which surely is the most important indicator of investment in health having an outcome?
Ireland’s lifespan, over the last decade, went up higher than any other European country…

The facts:

90384840 Elizabeth Dempsey from Sandymount in Dublin celebrates her 105th birthday RollingNews.ie RollingNews.ie

First, a clarification. Life span is, technically, the maximum age attained by an individual within a particular group or species.

Life expectancy – which is what we assume Martin meant – is the age a person can expect to live to, based on the statistical average at the time of their birth.

Eurostat, the EU Commission’s statistics directorate, tracked life expectancy within the EU and Europe from 2002 to 2013.

We’ve analysed the figures from 2003-2013 (the last decade) and found that the European country with the highest increase was Estonia, where life expectancy went from 71.9 to 77.5 in that period.

Ireland ranked joint 15th, with an increase of 2.9 years, from 77.7 to 81.1.

Of the more advanced EU nations (EU-15), Luxembourg ranked first, and Ireland ranked sixth.

After this article was published, Fianna Fáil contacted us to provide a source for Martin’s claim – the OECD’s annual Health at a Glance statistics.

They stated (correctly) that from 1998 (Fianna Fáil’s first full year in power) to 2008, Ireland ranked first among advanced European countries for our increase in life expectancy.

Among all European countries, we ranked second, behind Estonia.

From 1998 to 2011, Ireland ranked second among advanced EU countries (behind Portugal).

Among all European countries, we ranked fourth.

However, let’s examine the period stipulated by Martin last night (the “last decade”), and check the OECD figures for 2003-2013 (the most recent year available.)

Among all European countries, we ranked 11th, and among the advanced EU countries, we ranked sixth.

There are figures from two different organisations here – the OECD and Eurostat – several different time periods, and two different categories – advanced EU nations, and all European nations.

By the most generous possible interpretation – life expectancy growth among advanced EU nations from 1998-2008, as recorded by the OECD – Ireland did rank first.

And among all European countries, we were still second.

In his claim last night, Martin stipulated the last decade, and did not stipulate advanced European countries, so we are still rating this claim as FALSE.

CLAIM: People under 50 are more likely to die by suicide than by cancer, heart disease, or car crash – Miriam O’Callaghan
Verdict: FALSE, More die from cancer than suicide

What was said:

During a conversation on mental health – the first substantial such conversation in any of the debates so far – Miriam O’Callaghan stated:

If you’re under 50 in Ireland, your greatest chance of dying isn’t heart disease, isn’t cancer, it isn’t a car crash, it’s actually by suicide.

The facts:

According to our analysis of CSO figures for 2014, deaths of people aged 49 and under fell into the following breakdown:

  • Cancer – 524
  • Suicide – 293
  • Heart disease – 165
  • Transport accidents – 105

Cronyism

endamcnulty The Taoiseach stumbles while answering a question on the appointment of John McNulty to the board of IMMA. RTE RTE

CLAIM: During the debate, Enda Kenny admitted, for the first time, appointing John McNulty to the board of IMMA – Gerry Adams
Verdict: TRUE

What was said last night:

You have a scoop here. You mightn’t know that you have an exclusive. This is the first time that the Taoiseach has admitted that he appointed John McNulty.
He never admitted, under questioning in the Dáil and elsewhere, that he actually made that appointment, and he did make that appointment.

The facts:

At the time of the controversy surrounding the appointment of John McNulty to the board of the Irish Museum of Modern Art, before his nomination for the Seanad, Enda Kenny avoided saying he appointed him, or directed Arts Minister Heather Humphreys to appoint him.

For example, during an interview with RTE on 26 September 2014, he “accepted responsibility” for the debacle, but also stated that Humphreys had made the appointment.

I wouldn’t say it was my finest hour, and I take responsibility for this having evolved to what people might imagine it is…
I take responsibility here, I’m the leader of the party. The Minister for Arts and Heritage made her appointment on the basis of the credentials of John McNulty…

In response, Micheál Martin questioned the nature of the Taoiseach’s responsibility for the appointment, asking “what exactly is he apologising for?”

And during a Dáil debate four days later, Kenny declined to clarify in detail the nature and extent of his involvement in the appointment, and even seemed to suggest he was not “informed” of how it had come about:

Secondly, I accepted responsibility for taking my eye off this situation when I should have been more diligent about seeing it through. I have already said that publicly…
I am not happy about the situation as it evolved in the Fine Gael process, nor was I informed of that situation. For those reasons I feel it is beneath the standards that I have set myself.

This reticence is in contrast to the statement Kenny made during last night’s debate, during an exchange with Miriam O’Callaghan.

MOC: …You said at the time, you let your own standards and integrity down. What did you mean by that? What did you do?

The Taoiseach stumbled somewhat in his reply, then stated:

What I did was make an appointment that did not need to be made.

However, in a short press conference after the debate, it was put to the Taoiseach that he had said he himself appointed McNulty.

He appeared to take a step back from the clarity of his statement during the debate, saying:

The appointment was a line appointment by the Minister [Heather Humphreys]. I accepted responsibility for it in the Dáil.

There will no doubt be more said and more written about this particular issue, but regardless of any further statements made by the Taoiseach, he did firmly appear to admit making the appointment of McNulty himself, during tonight’s debate.

Since that is the first time he has done so, Adams’ claim is TRUE.

Originally published: 7.27 am

Send your FactCheck requests to factcheck@thejournal.ie

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97 Comments
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    Mute pjm
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:19 AM

    Burton with mostly lies last night yet again. I’m praying that the people of Dublin West do the right thing on Friday.

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    Mute Beano
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:47 AM

    They shouldn’t be allowed call it a debate. Being asked pre-determined, previously seen questions one by one with very little opportunity to make your point, discuss or even argue, is not a debate.

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:11 AM

    Since when does 784 equal almost 1,000?

    Last time I checked it’s almost 800.

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    Mute stopit
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:48 AM

    It’s some rounding up for sure

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:58 AM

    Gerry’s maths again.

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:59 AM

    And why include the norths number by him saying “the island of Ireland”. Anything else he’d like to use the north’s numbers for? His budget figures maybe?

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    Mute watersedge
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:32 AM

    Maths might not be his strong point, who cares? Enda and the rest of them are not exactly superior to him in that regard. It is the finance spokesperson you look to for clarification and detail. Adams to me has a clear vision for the way he wants to see this country going forward and how all of our citizens should be treated equally and looks to bring about a more socially just society.

    This is a quote from Vincent Browne on him

    “But it was Gerry Adams, who, more than any other single person, was responsible for delivering the most significant political achievement of Irish history for generations: the peace agreement on Northern Ireland. In terms of achievement, no other figure in Irish public life rates even close to him.”

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:41 AM

    Nice selective quote there watersedge. You must have missed the rest of VB’s article in which he said there’s no difference between the shinners and FG/FF except for a marginal increase in minimum wage.

    He said the shinners wanna be like FG – established and centre right.

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:43 AM

    Same article;

    “Now all they venture is to increase the minimum wage to €9.65 an hour. There is some decent analysis of social conditions in the Sinn Féin manifesto, but the thrust of the manifesto is so cautious and “responsible” one wonders why they don’t they just merge with Fine Gael, along with the Labour Party, Fianna Fáil, Renua and Shane Ross?”

    http://www.irishtimes.com/opinion/vincent-browne-do-not-worry-about-gerry-adams-and-sinn-f%C3%A9in-1.2545703

    17
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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:54 AM

    “We all know Gerry Adams was one of the leading figures in the IRA for a long time and it is no surprise he denies that, for to do otherwise would leave him open to criminal prosecution and, probably, civil suits.
    We also all know of the complicity of Gerry Adams in legions of IRA atrocities, atrocities that probably would have happened anyway, with or without him.”

    29
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    Mute For Connolly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:55 AM

    Correct Watersedge. From the questions you could swear that a sitting Taoiseach personally does the calculations himself on budgetry matters. I don’t put too much stock into Gerry Adams not being able to regurgitate numbers somebody else has come up with as well as the other leaders.

    Speaking of questions, its a general election debate where leaders set out their partys stalls. First question was about his alleged IRA membership. Once he gives his response, it then moves onto enda kenny who immediately makes a smarmy remark about Mairia Cahill.

    You couldn’t make it up. Hopefully its as blatant to undecided voters.

    Miriams face was priceless when he asked her about her own salary though.

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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:15 PM

    “Maths might not be his strong point, who cares? Enda and the rest of them are not exactly superior to him in that regard. It is the finance spokesperson you look to for clarification and detail. ”

    Surely if this applies to Gerry Adams, then it must equally apply to all parties?

    Comparing him to Enda and the rest of them, but giving him a “pass” because it’s not his area – but yet no such pass to the rest of them?

    Every leader of every party who wants to be in Government should have their figures correct – if they are all crap, then they are all crap.

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    Mute Ciaran McCann
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:34 PM

    Trolley count is down because people are committing suicide or people are emigrating so they are not using our health care system!!!!

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    Mute Shinnerbot GE16
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:51 PM

    CLAIM: Gerry Adams is the Irish Nelson Mandela.

    Verdict: Fact.

    51
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    Mute Robert Emmett Birrell
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    Feb 24th 2016, 1:07 PM

    Many suicides are recorded as misadventures or accidents, so 1000 is realistically nearer the truth.

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    Mute Tony Ornery G
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    Feb 24th 2016, 1:32 PM

    Yes, sadly many suicides are recorded as misadventures. A friend in a palliative care unit remarked how in a macabre way they term many of them the “single car collision department”.
    I hope, whatever Fridays outcome, we remember in the next Government to address our mental health services. http://trickstersworld.com/2016/02/23/the-reformation-will-not-be-televised/

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    Mute Mick Hannigan
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    Feb 24th 2016, 1:53 PM

    Don’t think any of the parties maths are good, they have all got something wrong somewhere, it would be great to see an overall TRUE / FALSE for each party now, it might show us overall who is telling the truth or not, also show who knows what they are at least taking about to some degree

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    Mute Shane O Leary
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:33 PM

    So Gerry Adams was singularly responsible for the northern Ireland’s peace process?? That’s news to Albert Bertie Hume and numerous other players no doubt…

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    Mute watersedge
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:58 PM

    Shane, just putting up a quote by someone. It is Vincent Browne’s opinion. Adam’s was a key player in the peace process, there is no doubt that Hume etc also were. It was a huge achievement by all of those involved.

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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:59 PM

    they should get baron adams on tv more, its hilarious watching the dithering excuse for a statesman

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    Mute Catherine Mc
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    Feb 24th 2016, 4:13 PM

    Ciaran you don’t commit suicide, you die by suicide, by using word commit you suggest a crime. Suicide is no longer a criminal offence in this country.

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    Mute Gerard Fenniman
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:11 PM

    he said across the island, 279 in the north and 784 in the republic, read the article,

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    Mute John cullen
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:18 PM

    Oh shut up yah bleedin idiot.

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    Mute John cullen
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:19 PM

    Q

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    Mute Chris Kirk
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:30 PM

    I always thought that the nature of politics in this country was listening to half truths, especially when you hear politicians talking about the ‘dogs on the street’……lies, lies and more lies.

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    Mute Juan Franc
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:49 PM

    Tommy macdonagh/Diarmuid……..Gerry Adams….blah bah blah Gerry Adams, Britain must leave the European Union Gerry Adams blah blah. There you have it in a nutshell,your tuv manifesto sorted for the upcoming Strormont election.

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    Mute Dan Smasheen
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:56 PM

    Is the fact check on the basis of within 25% of being a fact?

    That just perpetuates the bs.

    If he saved 216 lives would he round it down to none. Both scenarios are equally unbelievable.

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    Mute mickmc
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:27 AM

    I didn’t watch it. The X-files were on RTE 2. Much more creditable than the lies and spins that was on RTE 1.

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    Mute John Scott
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:44 AM

    Have to say what a pity Steven Donnelly was not there a shame. Royal family was much better gave me alaugh. So thanks no thanks.

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    Mute Rob Cahill
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:48 AM

    That ending though

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    Mute Paul Mc Manus
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    Feb 24th 2016, 4:39 PM

    The truth is out there. Just not in Ireland.

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    Mute mr magoo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:30 AM

    Imagine saying to another person “are you a worthy person “? The sheer arrogance and hypocrisy of saying to someone else are you a worthy person ? Especially in light of the other people Gerry Adams was standing with. Did she ask the leader of the country who defends a country where you can die on a hospital trolly in a corridor and people cannot find somewhere to live. The sheer hypocrisy is sickening., Miriam o Callaghan is firmly ensconsed in the establishment and earning a fortune, with a brother in FF. Why would she want SF to get into power, nothing to do with morals just faux outrage. Very hypocritical, devious and manuipulative, what else would you expect from the cosy cartel in RTE.

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    Mute Keith Gregg
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:44 AM

    She admitted she earns over 100k, too

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    Mute pjm
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:58 AM

    He should have thrown it straight back at her, asking was she suitable for this debate seeing as her brother is running for FF.

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    Mute Alien8
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:42 AM

    keith, she was technically incorrect as RTE pay her company the (actually multiples of) hundreds of thousands. she pays herself a director’s emolument. like everyone in the room, they all cost the state over will over a€100 each – how they receive it, and what they do with it is different, but you are looking at well over a million a year going from taxpayers directly to the performers in this “debate”. shocking.

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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:44 AM

    Yes, it’s a wonder Gerry didn’t attack Miriam because of what her brother is doing? Hmmm, why oh why did he pass that opportunity?

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    Mute brian magee
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:02 PM

    PJM Gerry was not going to bring brothers into this, his brother is serving 16 years for rape , which apparently he knew about.
    http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/courts/gerry-adams-brother-jailed-for-16-years-over-rape-of-daughter-29789593.html

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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:52 PM

    its cringe listening to the baron talk economics and numbers. that clown wants to run a country??

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    Mute Rob Cahill
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    Feb 24th 2016, 5:18 PM

    There’s a bigger clown running it now. Maybe that’s here he got the idea.

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    Mute Chris Kirk
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:38 PM

    Gerry Adams makes a play in debates at trying to embarrass interviewers asking if they earn over 100k.
    What he really means is that he would screw RTE if he ever gets into government……

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    Mute Rob Cahill
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    Feb 25th 2016, 10:59 AM

    You say that like it’s a bad thing Chris. If RTE had to stand on it’s own two feet it would be gone in 6 months. Sub par programming and sub par ridiculously over paid presenters. If they knew what they were doing and gave people what they wanted in a national broadcaster they might generate enough to be self sustainable. Maybe even attract some actual talent if the numbers were up.

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    Mute Setrakian
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:30 AM

    Enda admitted to deceiving the Dail with regards McNulty but that’s ok because that’s blueshirt politics – dirty & dishonest. Enda even if he could perform and have any modicum of leadership quality has zero credibility. He’s the grand spoofer – really hope the electorate wise up this week & vote them out.

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    Mute For Connolly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:17 AM

    Setrakian, did Kenny mislead the Dail on the subject? That’s the big question this morning. We also have a minister for finance in iding 2 days out from a general election, due to information emerging over an extremely serious matter.

    But no doubt we’ll have another 24 hours of ‘Gerry Adams ate my hamster’ crap.

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    Mute Not_Rod_Ten©
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:35 AM

    SF must only be shown i a good light, anything else is a witch hunt.

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    Mute David Murphey
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:47 AM

    “have a minister for finance in hiding”

    Noonan was on the Six One news last night.

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    Mute tommy macdonagh
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:55 PM

    porr shinner are getting desperate now, all that nose diving in the polls is taking its toll :D

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    Mute Beano
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:30 AM

    The debate showed last night how shockingly bad the leaders of the big parties are. Time to give someone else a shot….Social Democrats have my vote and they weren’t even at the debate last night

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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:06 AM

    Fully agree Beano, if anything, the debate showed the need for a new injection of new politicians and parties. I disliked the format of the entire show.

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    Mute Anne Marie Devlin
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:23 AM

    My God, Beano. I’m surprised at that. You do know that the SDs don’t intend to sterilize the unemployed and that they have a humane view on homelessness? I really thought it would go against your principles to give a vote to a party that would spend your tax money on things like that.
    Didn’t watch last night. It was obvious what was going to happen. The short lead in to the election is not conducive to 2 debates featuring the same characters. The only interesting debate was the 7 way one.
    It’s a sad indictment of the state of politics here when Michael Martin came out as the only leader of a main party who is articulate

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    Mute Tony Barry
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:27 AM

    I agree it is time to give somebody else a shot. I am voting SF because somebody else needs a shot. Social Democrats Stephen Donnelly voted for the eviction bill that’s why I couldn’t give him a vote. Only thing with SF is Gerry Adams needs to step down I think Pearse Doherty would be the right person to have in charge

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    Mute Search Eagle
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:35 AM

    After how well put together last week’s debate was this debate was just shoddy all around – from a set that was falling apart, to the inconsistent, disconnected lines of questioning (e.g. jumping from cronyism to climate change) to the weak, tired responses. I echo others in saying it really missed the other candidates. I hope Social Democrats and Renua pick up some votes.

    It’s also getting very tiring hearing Adams go on about “the establishment” when he has been around since the dawn of time, and is in government in Northern Ireland, implementing the very same taxes and cuts he describes as “mean-spirited” in the Republic.

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    Mute Micheal S. O' Ceilleachair
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:27 PM

    I thought the IRA called the shots!!!!

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    Mute Rob Mills
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:00 PM
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    Mute Fiona deFreyne
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:46 AM

    It was upsetting seeing how poor, how evasive, how mealy mouthed and how lame all four “leaders” were.

    Burton did less moaning than usual and tried to conduct herself but still displays how vacuous she is.

    Catherine Murphy, Stephen Donnelly and Roisin Shortall are all vastly superior.

    The irony of a tiny party fielding 14,candidates and 3 excellent leaders ( as well as decent and enlightened policies) against the dross and drivel of the rest.

    Sadly, Irish voters may vote for the same tired parties, with the same tired policies and same tired leaders expecting different results. Human nature!

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    Mute Rochelle
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:14 AM

    Yep and everyone will continue blaming those “leaders” for being poor rather than the people who continuously elect them. Can’t blame the politicans for making a living off a society who are happy to continuously reward cronyism, incompetence and broken promises with high paying jobs and pensions.

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    Mute Diarmuid
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:56 PM

    While I agree completely with you Fiona, it is important to remember this is not a presidential election.

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    Mute ian110664
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:39 AM

    Doesn’t inspire confidence in the office of Taoiseach when you see the quality of the candidates….

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    Mute James Lyons
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:27 AM

    Burton looked like she was planning for her retirement next week. Gerry Adams was comical dipping questions about what he’d do with the health service. He just kept pointing out what’s wrong. We all know what’s wrong!

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    Mute up3bs9LF
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:13 AM

    If you’re unhappy with the selection, vote for others, it’s that simple. There has been no delivery of reform as was promised what so ever!

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    Mute de la Rey
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:58 AM

    Dan, how about a summary of the fact checks? E.g. Joan 10 porkies, 5 half porkies, 3 facts. Would be interesting to see who has been spinning the most/least

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    Mute Celtic_Horizon
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:26 PM

    That would be very good winner for each debate and grand master for most porkies

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    Mute Fiona deFreyne
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:49 AM

    I wouldn’t elect any of the 4 of them to be chairman of a local charity or County Council.

    So much choice but zero quality from the big four.

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    Mute Fiona deFreyne
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:52 AM

    Looking at the shower of four last night, it is time for a real change. Sadly, the Irish voters may prefer the same tired out familiar and predictable lame ducks.

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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:08 AM

    Not often we agree Fiona, I can’t argue with any of that, I think their absence was very noticeable and that may play in their favour.

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    Mute Fiona deFreyne
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:56 AM

    FG and Labour are about to address all of the problems of the last 5 years if only can get another 5 years.

    FF wants to fix all of the problems although it cannot accept its role in the causing of the problems.

    SF knows that there are problems but it does not have the competence or capacity to start figuring out how think about fixing the problems.

    All 4 parties are led by inept and vision less leaders.

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    Mute Craig Barry
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:34 AM

    Well said Fiona

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    Mute Peter Mc Hugh
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:04 AM

    Burton did better in this one by keeping shtum and not saying as much. Kenny dropped a clanger with the McNulty admission. Adams still doesn’t know his own policies at all well. Martin spoke well, as usual, but wouldn’t have won many over with what he was saying. All in all, I expect support for the four parties to drop.

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    Mute Kevin O'Sullivan
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:30 AM

    No fact check to see if a person by the name of Senator Cahill existed? Adams hadn’t a bulls notion who Kenny was on about (whatever about not knowing his party policies, he’d surely remember Ms Cahill!).

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    Mute pjm
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:59 AM

    Well seeing as rte news, newstalk and plenty of other tweeters were saying Kenny said Sandra Cahill they hadn’t a clue what he said either.

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    Mute Paul Lane
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:54 AM
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    Mute Niall Donnelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:48 AM

    It looks like a like Gerry is the only one telling the truth on these debates

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    Mute Alan Cooke
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:28 AM

    When the UK vote to leave the EU there will be a loud cry from the shinners effected financially………Brits in!!!

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    Mute Alan Cooke
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    Feb 24th 2016, 7:25 AM

    Gerry’s teeth were very squeaky last night.

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    Mute Craig Barry
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:35 AM

    That squeaking noise last night was Joan Burton’s hip

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    Mute Lee O'Sullivan
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:12 AM

    I’m pretty sure the squeaking noise came from her mouth.

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    Mute Danny Gormley
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:31 AM

    Social Democrats it’s is so Ted

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    Mute Peter Mc Hugh
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:39 AM

    Would be great…except they have no one running in my area.

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    Mute stopit
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:53 AM

    They will soon enough. I’ve decided last night their candidate in my area is getting my first.

    I’m only starting to get to know him but I’m not voting for him but for the totality of the party. I don’t agree 100% with them but they are smelling good to me

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    Mute Shakka1244
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:14 AM

    Same here. The cosy cartel of FG/FF/Lab needs to be killed.

    SD’s No.1 for me. No transfers ever again for the “what’s in it for me” brigade that between them have ripped this country apart socially and economically.

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    Mute Al Ca
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:33 AM
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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:43 AM

    Really good article. VB, telling t like it is.

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:53 AM

    Yes. He says SF are no different to the rest in their aspirations of becoming an established right wing party. Spot on.

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    Mute Tony Ornery G
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    Feb 24th 2016, 10:42 AM

    Terrific to see proper and fair analysis of what I’d loosely term a debate. Challenging what our “leaders” say is critical if we are to emerge from the current Chumocracy and regain some representative democracy. Only by moving on from the politics of cronyism, corruption and nepotism can we build a fairer society.
    The best outcome from an electoral standpoint would be a Fianna Fail/ Fine Gael Government that leads to a United Left Opposition. If Friday puts to bed the faux civil war politics we might end up with a genuine political divide. A Left/Right divide that could open a real debate about the type of society we want. Will we continue with Boom and Bust of Failed Right Wing Capitalist policies or will we try a different route?
    http://trickstersworld.com/2016/02/23/the-reformation-will-not-be-televised/

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    Mute SilentFugitive
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:35 AM

    Biggest winner last night was the creaky floor board.

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    Mute John Ward
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:11 PM

    It seems that more truth comes from Gerry Adams than the three fascist amigos!

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    Mute Patlyndo
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:30 AM

    But the others don’t have the money behind them, they don’t get the publicity or advertising because of the lack of funds.

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    Mute Ken Hickey
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    Feb 24th 2016, 9:42 AM

    How is 784 almost 1000????

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    Mute RossMcEntegart
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    Feb 24th 2016, 2:20 PM

    I’ve only read the first claim so far, but I have two things to say:
    1. 784 is NOT “almost 1000″, so the claim is FALSE, not true.
    2. Gerry, you’re running in an election in the Republic of Ireland. I know you don’t like it, but that remains the case. NI stats are irrelevant. Adding them to ROI stats and quoting them as a total is even more irrelevant.

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    Mute Gavin123
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    Feb 24th 2016, 4:59 PM

    People voting SF see Ireland as one country. Your opinion is irrelevant as you’re not likely to be voting for him.

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    Mute Grace Jeaney
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    Feb 24th 2016, 3:19 PM

    Debate? They aren’t able to debate, shockingly inarticulate. There seems to be no level of expertise which warrants the massive salaries and expenses these people are paid. Ireland is a small country barely moving out of recession, yet our politicians are still on salaries that the ordinary person can only dream of.

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    Mute Luke Kelly
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    Feb 24th 2016, 11:49 AM

    @Dan (Author)

    According to a quick google the suicide rate has increased in the north in the last few years with the highest rates in Gerry’s ex constituency.

    Can you confirm that sucide rates have increased in the north since SF took office,

    And there’s this too – “The research team from the Bamford Centre for Mental Health and Well-Being at the University of Ulster has examined the link between conflict-related events and suicide attempts in Northern Ireland.

    Their analysis of data from over 4,000 people – collected in 2008 for a World Mental Health Survey initiative – backs the suggestion that traumatic events associated with the Northern Ireland conflict are associated with suicidal thoughts and plans.

    Professor Siobhan O’Neill, who is leading the research, said: “Suicidal ideation (thoughts) and behavior are important public health issues, not least because they give us an insight into the factors associated with death by suicide.”

    http://www.irishcentral.com/news/education/Suicide-death-rate-in-Northern-Ireland-almost-equal-to-Troubles-deaths.html

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    Mute liam ward
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    Feb 24th 2016, 12:35 PM

    The journal is obsessed with d leaders debate last night thank f I didn’t waste my time in watching it and thank f I’m selling my 2016 vote to d highest bidder that’s how I feel about d lot of them only in it for d easy state pensions

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    Mute Neuville-Kepler62F
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    Feb 24th 2016, 8:38 PM

    3 Amigos take the LPT from pensioners Medical Expenses Refunds when they cant keep up the tax payments
    …. Grey Vote Boycott for the 3 Amigos!

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    Mute Anonymous Man
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    Feb 24th 2016, 5:40 PM

    Gerry seems to be the only one who tells the truth, but not when it comes to questions about the IRA.

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    Mute Donal Carey
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    Feb 25th 2016, 9:33 AM

    The only one that told the truth was Jerry Adams the rest of them lied true there teeth about every figure that was mentioned .Everybody knew about the 7% that was silly by the opposition trying to score brownie points .

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    Mute Coli
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    Feb 24th 2016, 2:06 PM

    I thought MOC said people under 15 are most likely to die from suicide, not people under 50. Would make more sense IMO

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