TONIGHT’S DEBATE MAY have started as a slow burn, but it wasn’t long before things heated up when Aontú’s Peadar Tóibín said what the audience was thinking:
“It’s incredible, we are about ten minutes in and no one has been able to give us a straight answer.”
The debate was frustrating to watch in parts. With ten party leaders vying for airtime it was an unwieldy format.
One of the most notable things from tonight’s programme, where the debate was largely dominated by the leaders of the big three parties, was Aontú leader Peadar Tóibín’s success in cutting through and getting airtime where the other six candidates struggled.
During the initial segment which focused on possible coalitions, Tóibín was resolute in ruling out a potential coalition with Fine Gael or the Green Party.
His preference would be Fianna Fáil, but not because they align on policy.
“We feel that Fianna Fáil is an empty, hollow husk,” Tóibín said, adding that it would be “easier to direct Fianna Fáil in a government.”
Fianna Fáil’s Micheál Martin was also clear on possible coalition partners, again ruling out a partnership with Sinn Féin.
People Before Profit’s Richard Boyd Barrett on the other hand urged parties of the left to rule out coalition with Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil, a notion endorsed by Right to Change TD Joan Collins.
Apart from coalition options, the first half of the programme also saw questions on waste in public spending, the Children’s Hospital, a statutory Covid inquiry and the cost of living.
Fine Gael leader Simon Harris was also asked to address the controversy surrounding his Louth candidate John McGahon. Harris continued to back his man: “He is a democratically selected candidate and he has not been convicted of a criminal charge.”
Simon Harris responds to questions about Louth Fine Gael candidate John McGahon, saying he was selected to run by local members, so will be the candidate.#rteupfront | @RTENews pic.twitter.com/IjU61fcDPp
— Upfront with Katie Hannon (@RTEUpfront) November 18, 2024
Likewise, Sinn Féin leader Mary Lou McDonald was asked to defend her handling of recent crises in her party.
“I dealt with those matters speedily and resolutely,” she told Hannon, adding that she is “big enough to say sorry”.
McDonald didn’t miss an opportunity to take a swipe at Fine Gael with a thinly veiled criticism of Harris’s continued support of McGahon.
At this point Harris interjected to remind McDonald, but mainly the audience, of comments made by the teenager who received inappropriate texts from Sinn Féin’s former senator Niall O Donnghaile.
The teenager told the Sunday Independent that comments made by McDonald felt like a “mental stab”.
“Mentally stabbed!” Harris repeated tonight. Multiple times.
Things also got fiery between Micheál Martin and Mary Lou McDonald, in probably the most heated moment of the debate.
After Boyd Barrett spoke about “ending 100 years of Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael rule”, Micheál Martin said this “narrative” that was being proposed by “Mary Lou McDonald and Sinn Féin takes some nerve”.
“Where have you been for the last 100 years,” the Fianna Fáil leader asked McDonald, referencing her party’s decision not to sit in the UK Parliament or the Dáil, where Sinn Féin had an abstentionist policy until the 1980s.
Referring to Sinn Féin’s links to the Provisional IRA he added:
“And you murdered gardaí and soldiers as well for the last 100 years.”
McDonald responded by saying you could hear “the entitlement writ large”, adding that “all that has changed”.
Simon Harris also interjected to accuse McDonald of “airbrushing the past”.
"If people vote for Sinn Féin to lead the government, that's their choice, but my party does not wish to be a part of any such government..."
— Upfront with Katie Hannon (@RTEUpfront) November 18, 2024
Simon Harris on who Fine Gael would, and would not, consider entering coalition with...#rteupfront | @RTENews pic.twitter.com/r9ebsU3gsV
Another standout moment from tonight’s debate came when Mary Lou McDonald took the opportunity to criticse Fine Gael’s proposal of a saving account with €1,000 or €1,500 for every new born baby.
McDonald said she was “astonished” to hear Harris talk about saving funds for children that are not yet born when we have children living in homelessness and children with scoliosis languishing on waitlists.
“I think this faux concern for the future of children needs to be called out,” McDonald said.
“Wow. How dare you, how dare you accuse anyone of faux concern. I mean who do you think you are?,” Harris snapped back at her.
The Taoiseach went on to claim McDonald was shouting over him and made the point that no one has a monopoly on empathy.
McDonald agreed but said he and Fianna Fáil have had a monopoly on power.
The conversation then turned to Sinn Féin’s failure to publish a manifesto ahead of tonight’s debate.
McDonald quipped that Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael’s manifestos were like a list of the things they haven’t done.
“At least you can read ours, we haven’t been able to read yours,” Harris snapped back.
Fianna Fáil leader Micheál Martin argued Sinn Féin “clearly don’t want any scrutiny” of it, a claim McDonald denied, adding that other parties can steal ideas from it when it is published tomorrow.
When asked if their parties would support a statutory Covid Inquiry, all were in agreement that they would, apart from the three outgoing Government leaders.
Green Party leader Roderic O’Gorman said his fear is that it would become “adversarial” like in the UK.
Simon Harris agreed but added if Anne Scott, the head of the Covid evaluation, wants more powers, she should get them.
Aontú’s Peadar Toibín was again successful in cutting through during this discussion arguing that any inquiry needs to have teeth.
Micheál Martin’s response was: “Peadar’s on a witch hunt, clearly.”
The second half of the debate then focused on climate change, Gaza and the Occupied Territories Bill, housing, and immigration.
During the debate on climate change, things got (even more) tense between pretty much everyone, but largely between Fianna Fáil and the Greens.
Micheál Martin told Roderic O’Gorman: “part of the issue with the Green party is the attitude you took: It’s your way or no way, that’s the sense that’s out there”.
This was a narrative supported by Simon Harris and Independent Ireland leader Micheal Collins, who both argued the Green Party has not been fair to farmers.
O’Gorman was less direct in his criticism of his former coalition colleagues, simply stating it “hasn’t always been easy”.
He did however, lay the blame at the feet of Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael for the gvoernment’s failure to roll out more significant retrofitting programmes.
The section on climate was arguably Social Democrat’s deputy leader Cian O’Callaghan’s strongest part of the night.
Mary Lou McDonald and Richard Boyd Barrett both got some criticism from Labour leader Ivana Bacik when it came to their opposition to the carbon tax, with Bacik saying it is hard to take parties serious on climate when they don’t support the tax.
"Why don't we tax the big polluters, the corporate polluters?"
— Upfront with Katie Hannon (@RTEUpfront) November 18, 2024
"It's not either-or, Richard..."
Ivana Bacik and Richard Boy Barrett clash over the carbon tax. pic.twitter.com/l5yZPBYEaF
Elsewhere, things also got heated between the leaders on the Occupied Territories Bill.
All were in agreement that they would support a ban on trade with illegal Israeli settlements, but the Government parties were unsurprisingly heavily criticised for failing to enact the Occupied Territories Bill.
Boyd Barrett accused Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael of speaking out both sides of their mouth when it came to it, arguing that they had five years to pass it and didn’t.
Micheál Martin pushed back on this, arguing that Palestinians are “very appreciative” of what Ireland has done.
Mary Lou McDonald was having none of this though, saying that the legislation has been “cynically blocked” by the outgoing government.
“You went to the White House and you bottled it,” she told Taoiseach Simon Harris, referring to his visit to Biden last month.
"No sanctions..." laments Mary Lou McDonald, on the issue of Israel and Palestine.
— Upfront with Katie Hannon (@RTEUpfront) November 18, 2024
"You're more interested in exploiting the issue for political gain..." says Micheál Martin.
"You're trying to divide this country," Simon Harris says of the SF leader.#rteupfront | @RTENews pic.twitter.com/8hj04cJX7O
Overall, there was no clear winner or losers from tonight’s debate. Tóibín, McDonald and Martin all came out strong.
Simon Harris, known as an unfavourable debating opponent, didn’t appear to be on his usual form. His best moment of the night was delivered to the press as he entered the RTÉ complex ahead of the debate.
Harris was asked to respond to comments from McDonald on John McGahon. He told the media scrum: “Her press officer is in prison tonight for being a paedophile, John McGahon was found not guilty by a criminal court.”
The Taoiseach was referring to the jailing earlier this month of former Sinn Féin press officer Michael McMonagle, who was sentenced to nine months in prison for child sex offences.
Back on the debate stage, for the rest of the candidates, there were no major mishaps.
But whether they did enough to change the course of this election, that will be for the viewers to decide.
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