Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
LAST UPDATE | 7 Dec 2021
STORM BARRA IS making its presence felt across the country, with the strongest winds being experienced in the southwest this morning where Status Red warnings are now in effect.
Good morning, Daragh Brophy here. Welcome to The Journal‘s rolling coverage of today’s extreme weather – we’ll have travel and transport news throughout the morning and will be covering all of the day’s developments as they happen.
The effects of the storm are most keenly being felt in the counties already under the Status Red warning – as this video from Stephen Murphy of Sky News from Kinsale shows.
At the other side of Co Cork, this was the scene in Bantry last night as locals took precautions against the impending extreme weather:
While we’ve had indications that this spell of less-than-clement weather was approaching since Friday, Met Éireann’s Head of Forecasting Evelyn Cusack made the nation sit up and take notice properly yesterday when she took to the airwaves to describe the incoming system as a ‘weather bomb’.
“It’s what the Americans would call a weather bomb,” is what she actually said – also managing to throw some oblique shade at US weatherforecasters as she went.
In its updates today Met Éireann said that mean wind speeds had been increasing along southern and western coasts since early this morning.
In a tweet within the last few minutes the weather service added: “Sherkin Island has recorded a gust of 113 km/h in the last hour, along with a gust of 98 km/h at Roches Point”.
To summarise what’s going on right now:
You’ll find more detail on this morning’s main points here.
Liz Walsh of Met Éireann has just been in Morning Ireland giving the latest picture. Here are the main points:
Norma Foley, the Education Minister, was on Morning Ireland straight after Liz Walsh.
She said (unsurprisingly, I suppose) that the decision to advise schools to close in Status Orange as well as Status Red counties was made for health and safety reasons.
Asked whether schools would have remote learning in place today, she said decisions had to be taken in schools at short notice yesterday so remote learning was “not a requirement” as far as the Department was concerned – although it will be in place in some schools.
It’s expected schools will be open again tomorrow, she said – but the situation will be monitored as the day goes on.
There’s flooding in Cork city this morning, where we’re just at high tide.
Wandesford Quay (pictured below) is among the streets closed. There’s also flooding on South Mall and on Pembroke Street, according to the city council.
There are reports of trees down in more rural areas around Cork.
Spokespeople from various agencies have been popping up on Morning Ireland with the latest in the last few minutes.
Superindendent Liam Geraghty of the Garda Press Office said the advice to those in Status Red areas is to stay safe and stay indoors.
If you are out and about driving anywhere in the country today reduce your speed and prepare to encounter fallen debris and other obstacles, he warned.
If you come across a fallen tree do not attempt to move it yourself, he said, report it to your local Garda station.
Barry Kenny of Irish Rail said all services are still operating on all routes but that delays can be expected in worst-hit counties. Reduced speeds are in operation between Mallow and Cork/Tralee.
There’s flooding being reported across Kerry too now, where the tide (thankfully) is now receding.
“Flooding in Tralee at Godfrey Place, Prince’s Quay and Ballyard Road Pumps in place since 5am,” Kerry County Council tweeted.
The Pier Road/Bell Heights area of Kenmare is impassable, the council says – effectively blocking the route south towards the bridge. So if you need any further advice not to drive from Kenmare towards Glengarriff this morning, well, don’t.
Michelle Hennessy here taking over the liveblog from Daragh.
Let’s get an update on the power situation.
ESB Networks Powercheck is showing a significant number of outages, with at least 12,000 homes without power this morning:
ESB has said crews are out working to restore power in impacted areas as soon as possible.
You can log a fault online or by calling 1800 372 999.
An Post has confirmed all post offices in Cork and Kerry will remain closed today and there will be no mail deliveries or collections in any part of the counties Kerry or Cork today.
In Clare, postal deliveries services will operate as normal until 2pm, and post offices will remain open for business as usual until 2pm.
Any Child Benefit payments due today will be paid at post offices tomorrow.
Letter, parcel and post office services will operate as normal in all other counties today.
An Post expects services to resume tomorrow, but will continue to monitor the situation.
Spare a thought today for the news reporters deployed all over the country to stand outside in the wind and rain – ankle deep in floodwater – and tell you that the weather is bad.
Newstalk’s Kacey O’Riordan has this report from Cork City:
We’re hoping she’s back inside now with a cuppa.
Up in Donegal there’s a blanket of snow at the Barnesmore Gap:
The Barnesmore Gap in Donegal this morning @MetEireann @donegalcouncil @RTENationwide @barrabest @TeresaMannion @WeatherRTE @iweatheronline @DonegalWeatherC @deric_tv @OceanFmIreland @DalysDonegal #StormBarra #StaySafe #Sneachta pic.twitter.com/e4qFvnagcM
— Cllr Marie Casserly. (@Marie_Casserly) December 7, 2021
Met Éireann’s Evelyn Cusack had a message for people on Morning Ireland:
“Follow all of the warnings all the local authorities’ and emergency services’ advice, don’t go out, don’t do anything stupid,” she said.
She said the threat of flooding for Cork has now receded and has shifted instead to the east coast, particularly Dundalk and Drogheda.
Evelyn said there will be poor conditions at different times in different parts of the country today and this evening.
There are, as expected, some disruptions to public transport due to storm damage. However alternative arrangements are being made for passengers:
Update: Northbound DART services are suspended between Dalkey and Dun Laoghaire due to a tree on the line. #StormBarra Dublin bus is honouring rail tickets in the area. Update to follow. -CL https://t.co/JnZhoPKySC
— Iarnród Éireann #StaySafe (@IrishRail) December 7, 2021
A quick update from ESB Networks, they’ve just told us there are currently around 33,000 customers without power.
Don’t forget, if you’re without power you can check for updates on the Powercheck website.
Hello. It’s Órla Ryan here, taking over from Michelle Hennessy.
Thanks for staying with us for all the latest weather updates this morning.
I hate to be the immediate bearer of bad news, but bus transfers are in operation between Waterford and Kilkenny train stations due to flooding in Waterford.
Due to flooding on the line at Waterford Station bus transfers are in operation between #Waterford and #Kilkenny Stations until further notice #StormBarra #WeatherWatch pic.twitter.com/sD6qOjtvu4
— Iarnród Éireann #StaySafe (@IrishRail) December 7, 2021
Some rogue trampolines are making their presence felt around the country. Are there any loose ones near you?
Send weather photos to pictures@thejournal.ie
A KCLR listener shared this image from the Castlecomer Road in Kilkenny today. A rogue trampoline causing chaos with power lines! pic.twitter.com/fGZgXznGDn
— Eimear Ní Bhraonáin (@eimeardeschemer) December 7, 2021
In terms of flight disruption, here’s the latest information:
Aer Lingus has cancelled flights in and out of Cork Airport and Shannon Airport today.
At Ireland West Airport, flights are currently operating to schedule.
People have been asked to contact the relevant airline if they have specific queries about flights due to operate today.
A Delta airlines flight en route from New York to Dublin was forced to divert to Amsterdam after failing to land twice due to high winds.
As of 9.45am, more than 59,000 electricity customers were without power across the country, ESB has confirmed.
ESB Networks “will be making safe faults throughout the day and restoring supply remotely and on site when safe to do so”, a spokesperson said.
People have been asked to check estimated restoration times or report an outage on Powercheck.ie
The ESB statement notes:
“Gale force winds associated with Storm Barra, with gusts of over 130 km/h, have caused damage this morning to the electricity network affecting more than 59,000 homes, farms and businesses. The damage is mainly attributable to fallen trees on overhead lines as a result of the high winds.
“With the storm still crossing the country, more damage and interruptions to supply can be expected. ESB Networks reminds the public that if you come across fallen wires or damaged electricity network, never, ever touch or approach these as they are LIVE and extremely dangerous.
“All internal resources are on alert and will be deployed to respond to all electricity outages once it is safe to do so. With a red weather warning in the Southwest in effect until tonight, this may mean our crews may not be mobilised on the ground until the worst of the severe weather passes.”
Some advice on how to stay prepared in advance of #StormBarra. In case of electricity related emergencies call us on 1800 372 999. Always #StaySafe and #StayClear of electricity wires. To log a fault or check for estimated restoration times visit https://t.co/VMtxFrW7FY pic.twitter.com/HOPvNCjLwS
— ESB Networks (@ESBNetworks) December 6, 2021
ESB also shared this important public safety message: “If you come across fallen wires or damaged electricity network, never, ever touch or approach these as they are LIVE and extremely dangerous.
“Please report any damage to electricity infrastructure by calling 1800 372 999. Customers should have their MPRN available to access recorded information specific to their location.”
ESB Networks is reminding customers of the precautionary measures to take in the event of a power cut:
Storm Barra is also having an impact on Covid-19 testing with some facilities rescheduling appointments due to the bad weather.
The latest updates on the impact of the storm on Covid testing and other HSE services can be read here.
UPDATE: the following COVID-19 vaccine centres will be closed tomorrow due to #StormBarra:
— HSE Ireland (@HSELive) December 6, 2021
📍Simonstown, Co Meath
📍City Hall, Co Cork
📍Kerry Vaccination Centre
📍Bantry Vaccination Centre, Co Cork
📍Sligo Racecourse
All appointments for tomorrow will be rescheduled. pic.twitter.com/3JsjCKI2T4
UPDATE: the following COVID-19 test centres will be closed tomorrow due to #StormBarra:
— HSE Ireland (@HSELive) December 6, 2021
📍Tralee, Co Kerry
📍Dunmanway, Co Cork
📍St. Raphaels, Co Cork
📍South Douglas Road, Co Cork
📍The Lee, Co Cork
All appointments for tomorrow will be rescheduled. pic.twitter.com/XbdtyfLdQb
Those with appointments today for additional COVID-19 testing facility at Carlow Youth Centre, Green Lane, #Carlow being contacted to change their appointments to same time tomorrow Wednesday.
— HSE/South East Community Healthcare (@SouthEastCH) December 7, 2021
Those due to attend at the St. Dympna’s site in Carlow today Tuesday not affected. pic.twitter.com/fHQmTtykft
In relation to the Carlow test centre closing, a HSE spokesperson said: “The Cork-based National Ambulance Service (NAS) team which was due to open this pop-up centre could not travel today due to the red weather warning. All appointments have been rescheduled to tomorrow.”
An Orange wind warning is now in place for #Leitrim and #Sligo tonight and #Donegal early tomorrow as #StormBarra brings widespread strong and damaging winds to Ireland.
— Met Éireann (@MetEireann) December 7, 2021
⚠️Red, Orange and Yellow warnings in place elsewhere.
Follow local safety advice ℹ️ https://t.co/XGJxZFd5UU pic.twitter.com/jBZuKriK85
Met Éireann has updated some of its weather warnings.
A Status Orange wind warning has now been extended to Sligo, Leitrim and Donegal.
The warning will be valid in Sligo and Leitrim from 8pm today until 8am tomorrow.
The warning in Donegal will be valid from 2am until 2pm tomorrow
The current Met Éireann weather warnings are as follows:
Status Red – Wind warning for Cork, Kerry
Southwesterly winds later veering northwesterly will reach mean speeds in excess of 80 km/h with severe or damaging gusts in excess of 130km/h. Due to a combination of high waves, storm surge and high tide, coastal flooding is expected. Disruption to power and travel are likely.
Valid from 9.34am to 9pm today
Status Red – Wind warning for Clare
Valid from 4pm today until 1am tomorrow
Status Orange – Wind warning for Clare, Cork, Kerry, Limerick, Waterford, Galway, Mayo, Wexford
Southeasterly winds, later veering northwesterly will reach mean speeds of 65 to 80 km/h with severe or damaging gusts of 100 to 130 km/h, with localised stronger winds likely, with severe gusts on coasts. Due to a combination of high waves, storm surge and high tide, coastal flooding is expected. Disruption to power and travel are likely.
Valid from 9.34am today until 6am tomorrow
Status Orange – Wind warning for Dublin, Louth, Wicklow, East Meath
Valid from 9.34am until 1pm today
Status Orange – Wind warning for Leitrim, Sligo
Valid from 8pm today until 8am tomorrow
Status Orange – Wind warning for Donegal
Valid from 2am until 2pm tomorrow
Status Yellow – Wind and rain warning for Ireland
Storm Barra will bring widespread mean speeds of 50 to 65 km/h and gusts of 90 to 110 km/h with localised stronger winds likely. Heavy rain will also bring risks of surface flooding and, due to a combination of high waves, storm surge and high tide, coastal flooding is expected. Disruption to power and travel are likely.
Valid from 9.34am until 6pm today
Northern Ireland Warnings
Yellow – Wind and Rain Warning for Antrim, Armagh, Down, Fermanagh, Tyrone, Derry
Strong winds and heavy rain bring a risk of some travel disruption and flooding
Valid from 6am today until 9am tomorrow
At a press briefing about Storm Barra, Keith Leonard, Chair of the State’s National Emergency Coordination Group, said the storm has caused significant disruption with trees down and power disruptions across the country.
He said people have taken public advice on board but warned that today is going to remain “hazardous” and “difficult”.
Eoin Sherlock, Chief Hydrometeorologist at Met Éireann, said the coastal risk has spread from the south and west to the east coast now.
Later today, the risk will again develop in parts of the northwest such as Galway.
Evelyn Cusack, Head of Forecasting at Met Eireann, said the strongest winds tomorrow will be over Donegal.
More from my colleague Orla Dwyer who is tuning in to the press briefing:
Claire Quane from the ESB said 59,000 customers have been impacted by power outages today. She said there was a significant outage in Donegal, but a lot of these customers have since been restored.
Met Éireann’s Evelyn Cusack said there are “still some very severe conditions to come” as the storm continues throughout the day.
Another one for the rogue trampoline collection. This time near the Sugarloaf in Co Wicklow. Thanks for sending in the photo, Cat.
Send your weather photos to pictures@thejournal.ie. And remember, stay safe and indoors where possible!
The road from Kenmare towards Glengarriff in Co Cork was one of the many routes flooded this morning.
More from Orla Dwyer who is watching the press briefing: Keith Leonard said a meeting will be held this afternoon to assess risks for schools tomorrow with a decision on any recommendations to be made to the Department of Education at around 5.30pm today.
Tom McGuinness from the HSE said any cancelled Covid-19 tests or vaccine appointments will be rescheduled.
He said some temporary structures at test and vaccination centres were risk-assessed yesterday and, where appropriate, these structures were taken down. They will be re-built tomorrow, weather permitting. As a result, services may still be disrupted at these centres tomorrow morning.
On climate change, Evelyn Cusack said: “Last time we had a storm here in Ireland was Storm Aiden … We’ve gone through an unusually very quiet period of weather.
“With climate change, we are in a warming atmosphere so severe weather events are more likely,” she said, adding that storms like this are not unexpected.
Wexford County Council’s Emergency Management Team met again this morning to review the early impacts of Storm Barra across the county.
There are no major incidents to report.
While tides are high along the coast, flood defences in New Ross, Ballyhack and Arthurstown have performed extremely well, with no flooding to report in these areas, a statement notes.
The council’s public safety messages remain the same:
Here’s an update from Cork County Council:
Cork county remains under a Met Éireann Status Red wind warning until 9pm with severe and damaging wind gusts in excess of 130km/h expected.
River levels are also being monitored with flood barriers erected in Mallow and Fermoy on Monday.
The council’s Severe Weather Assessment Team and Crisis Management Team met this morning to discuss the situation.
At this time the worst affected area in Cork County is Bantry. Flooding also occurred on Back Street in Youghal which is now receding. There are multiple reports of trees down and roads flooded throughout the county.
Cork County Council continues to ask members of the public to stay at home and avoid any unnecessary activity. Council offices and facilities will be closed for the duration of the Red warning, however services will continue to be delivered from staff operating remotely.
Issues such as fallen trees, flooding and road damage should be reported by calling 021 4276891 between 9am and 5pm or via the council’s emergency out of hours number 021 4800048.
The strong winds may give rise to localised power outages. In the event of a disruption to power supply, please contact ESB Networks at 1850 372 999. Fallen or grounded wires should be avoided and the public are advised to call ESB in assisting with the identification of fallen wires.
In the event of a disruption to water supply, please contact Irish Water at 1850 278 278.
In the event of an emergency call 999 or 112 and request the Fire Service, Ambulance Service, Gardaí or Irish Coastguard as appropriate, the council advises.
Staying in Cork and a tree is down outside Kinsale on the Bandon Road.
Thanks to Sean O’Callaghan for sending us this photo.
Send your weather photos to pictures@thejournal.ie. And remember, stay safe and indoors where possible!
It’s not just wind and rain some areas are experiencing, there is snow in Donegal.
Its snowy in Donegal today. This photo was taken by Gardai in the Barnesmore gap.
— An Garda Síochána (@GardaTraffic) December 7, 2021
We are asking the public to be extra careful when traveling through these Weather conditions. #StormBarra #Staysafe pic.twitter.com/47G643SC3m
ESB teams are “restoring supply remotely and working on site when safe to do so” as tens of thousands of properties remain without power.
We apologise to the 59k customers without power, following the damage caused by #StormBarra. ESB Networks is making the network safe, restoring supply remotely and working on site when safe to do so. Safety of public and crews is critical. https://t.co/yO4OWzANxj pic.twitter.com/tq1HGuTdCo
— ESB Networks (@ESBNetworks) December 7, 2021
The Wicklow Fire Service said a motorist in Newcastle had “a lucky escape” after a tree fell this morning.
A lucky escape for a motorist at Newcastle this morning pic.twitter.com/xO23DYl9Gd
— Wicklow Fire Service (@FireWicklow) December 7, 2021
Housing Minister Darragh O’Brien said Storm Barra is a “very severe weather event” but has caused “minimal damage so far”. However, he added: “The storm is not over.”
In terms of some Covid-19 testing and vaccination appointments being rescheduled because of the storm, O’Brien said a day or two of disruption will not have a major impact on the rollout of the booster programme.
The latest HSE updates can be viewed here.
Some good advice from Dublin Fire Brigade:
Storms can bring power-cuts, and for that reason it is vitally important that your Smoke Alarms have working batteries.
— Dublin Fire Brigade (@DubFireBrigade) December 7, 2021
When you press the test button on your alarm that is one feature the test is checking.
Check yours today!#TestItTuesday #StormBarra pic.twitter.com/cb44P87mmp
Thanks for staying with us so far today. I’m going to wrap up this live blog but my colleague Hayley Halpin will keep you up to date here.
Stay safe!
Jaysus, isn’t he just great altogether. But don’t listen to me, just read what he’s written about himself above.
@Chris Linehan: eh he did several tours of the Leb, he’s got bigger balls than you
@Inanimate Carbon Rod: By the sounds of it, you’ve had quite a good close up of those balls of his. To be clear, I wasn’t trying to undermine or disrespect his service or the research he did, but you can’t deny he paints a very good picture of himself as the embodiment of a professional, intellectual amd ethical officer.
@Chris Linehan: he is all those things you mentioned. Your problem is?
@Chris Linehan: why wouldn’t he paint that picture of Himself?, wasn’t it He who did the research, and done the interviews and gathered all the information required to complete the story. They did not know what would be uncovered, that is why they key him continue, but then when the whole thing came together it was not acceptable . It would destroy the Organisation, so try and discredit him and his research. Fair play to him, it is probably a better place to work now.
@EillieEs: Maybe he is all of those things. I myself am highly professional, an intellectual among my peers and have actually written the ethical standards which my chosen industry upholds. I’m also humble and so wouldn’t tell people those things about myself.
@Chris Linehan: they’ll write songs about you.
@Eugene Comaskey: My comment had nothing to with his research or service. Fair play to him for both.
@Hanzee: No need. I’ll write my own songs about myself.
@Chris Linehan: Sounds a lot like jealously to me Chris . Only a small minded man would belittle this man ‘s actions at great personal sacrifices to himself and his family . He has gone above and beyond to serve his country and made a huge difference to the defense forces in Ireland .
@Mary Mc Carthy: Who belittled his actions? Like i said twice, his service and research are to be commended. I was making light of his ‘farts don’t stink’ opinion of himself.
@Chris Linehan: and rightly so he did the research and the hard work with drive, conviction and immense respect for his position and that of his colleagues. He is only getting what was long overdue for him.
The other uninformed services could take advice from this.
@Chris Linehan: ‘cept a humble person doesnt tell anyone that they are.
@Chris Linehan: why cant u just be happy for someone who has endured so much both professional y & personally that he has come thru the other side ? Gives hope to us all
@Chris Linehan: u were saying about humility?
@Chris Linehan: would you get the massive chip on your shoulder looked into Chris, good man.
@Neil Ryan: what chip is that exactly? I made a quip about the clearly cocky tone of the article, as others did. The Journal melts interpreted that as an attack on his research and military service.
@eileen boles: that was my point.
@Chris Linehan: come again?
@Inanimate Carbon Rod: something tells me chris or someine close may have too….He was a brave man,forced to stand up for those women, force by what he heard,and unable to follow orders to bury it ….wouldnt Collins be disgusted with those officers….
@Chris Linehan: yes you were,now grow a pair and expand as to why….!
@Chris Linehan: did you have your life and character destroyed fior trying the truth that would eventually lead to transformational changes in the industry you worked? His sacrifice has led two better lives for thousands in his old work place and this sacrifice is finally being acknowledged yet you want to belittle him?
I have experience as a contract employee of several and diverse branches of the public service.
The service is riven with political patronage and the basic philosophy prevailing on matters of right and wrong is “don’t rock the boat”
that’s enough about me -let’s talk about you- what do you think about me ;-)
@Dave Hammond: the article is about his experience as a whistleblower, why on earth would he talk about other issues?
@EillieEs: lighten up Ellie
@Dave Hammond: says a narcissist
@Dave Hammond: ur a nonce?
Magnificent telling of a terrible story that’s had magnificent ending recently. (I found it very moving) – Tom Clonan is a national Hero who deserves presidential honour
@Paul O’Mahony (Cork): a presidential honour for doing his job? Whaaaaat??
@Da Vid: Go back and read the story again and then you might just get it !
@Da Vid: For doing his job? For being a brave whistle blower who forced others to do their jobs! He and people like him should be given a special pension for every year they were left out in the cold!
@Da Vid: its grt to know that the auld begrudgery still alive & well for some wasnt just doin his job btw.
@Paul O’Mahony (Cork): I don’t believe he did for glitzy awards, he did because it was the right thing to do. He took some amount of grief for doing so but stuck to his guns and was proven right for doing so.
@Da Vid: doing his job? Her got ran out of the service for going above and beyond his job! He was attacked personally and professionally in a smear campaign as was his family in an attempt to discredit his research. He suffered all this why? Because he told the truth, was he the only one “doing his job” why was nobody else bringing this to national and international attention? Probably because they were looking after number 1 unlike Tom
Probably not the ideal time to point out to a national security analyst, that a former Irish female soldier is due to return from Turkey in the next 24-72 hours and may well have passed information about our own armed forces to a terrorist organisation – something I think highly likely.
As for the content of the article, well I’m glad things have gone full circle for you. I bought your book when it came out initially. I’m also glad the military seems to have made substantial progress on equality and diversity.
@Perlum Sprite: So long as she hasn’t told them that we are running at less than 90% of our required numbers, that we have very few mine proof, armoured vehicles, small numbers of aircraft, very tiny navy, no primary air search radar, no counter submarine capability, a handful of drones and thus a limited reconnaissance capability, one of the largest oceanic territories in north western EU and the smallest military budget in the EU, nor where the keys to the target shed are, im sure that we’ll be fine.
@Ros Aodha: Well said.
@Perlum Sprite: im SO glad that u re glad
@Perlum Sprite: what military secrets could she tell them about our armed forces? We are a neutral country so don’t need much of a seen armed presence
Well done Tom. While I vehemently disagree with your pro NATO stance, I think your work on this issue deserves a lot of credit and admiration.
Still very much ongoing Tom.
Irish Air Corps recently bullied a long serving whistle-blower out of the service. Same whistle-blower had highlighted the ongoing unprotected toxic chemical exposure of personnel including pregnant females. He should have received a medal but instead was vilified.
Not only does the Air Corps punish whistle-blowers but they also are ACTIVELY bullying personnel injured by chemical exposure and treating such sick personnel as malingerers.
Hopefully the Vice Admiral will acknowledge the contribution to chemical Health & Safety made by Air Corps whistle-blowers…if he’s allowed. :)
While I had my reservations about the impact Tom’s report had on training recruits/ cadets, it is a harsh environment they are being trained for and harshness in training methodology needed to be exercised. The DF took it to heart and unfortunately it created other problems, some soldiers would complain about the simplest of commands given by an authority figure. It reduced effectiveness in a lot of case, as it meant that an NCO would have to institute disciplinary procedures against the individual instead of tearing them a new one there and then. Having said all that, it did remove the rampant bullying by certain personnel against those weaker members of the DF, who could then go on to become successful soldiers, sailors and air crew.
@Rob67: a good leader/manager can lead without humiliating people otherwise they shouldn’t be leading. Dont be making excuses for inexcusable behaviour.
@eileen boles: if you read my point, I don’t condone bullying in any shape or form. However, a soldier will undergo stress at some point and it is important to push the recruit to a controlled limit to get them to work beyond their normal level, be stressed and still be able to function in a clear and consistent manner. That is what you get from good training. Bullying undermines the individual and therefore is not good ground to build someone up, which good training will do. I don’t know if you ever served, but if you did and had a bad experience as a result, I can only offer my support and understanding, I’ve been at the wrong end but lucky enough to work my way through it and now lead my own team using everything I learned in the DF, including how not to be a bully but a leader.
@Rob67: u should re read your own post.
@eileen boles: I will pretend that I am utterly inept at subtlety and ask you to be a bit more specific.There is a fine line between pushing someone to the limit and bullying. A good NCO/ officer will always know the difference. I have trained people since I was 20 years old and still do to this day, I am happy to say that some of those I trained became NCO’s and in two cases, commissioned officers, I consider that some of my greatest professional achievements. My point was that the new reality in training led to a situation in some cases where Ptes were being treated with kid gloves because NCO’s were afraid to apply pressure. You need pressure to test the limits. Bullying is where an individual does not know or cares what the limit is and causes damage, that could not be allowed to continue. If you perceive that as condoning bullying, then I cannot help you in that regard.
Self praise is no praise.
@SF Knee Knockers: it’s better than none at all
@SF Knee Knockers: He is recounting his own personal experience . You just don’t recognize a good man when you see it
@SF Knee Knockers: but nowhere has he done so
If any organisation had treated me like that and then come back later to ingratiate themselves with me, I like to think I would tell them to get stuffed.
@Richard Barrett: im sure he gave it some thought & rightly so
Fair play to Michael Smith, I wouldn’t have been the biggest fan but had a lot to do with helping sort the deafness claims and now this, which I was unaware of his involvement initially. Compare that to recent behaviour by ministers etc in relation to whistle blowing elsewhere in certain services. Be interesting to hear Tom’s thoughts on this now he’s gone full circle.
He’s not really what one would call a whistleblower, he apparently didn’t witness these things first hand and report them, he wrote about conversations he had with the alleged victims, all of them he spoke to it appears, it begs the question ‘should women serve in the Military if they suck this shit up without aggressively resisting’? I sure as hell wouldn’t have had it nor would I have allowed it to occur to anyone in my presence when I served.
@Kieron King: A bit like Julianne Assange rotting in a high security prison in England. He didnt witness the murders carried out by the US army. He reported on them and is now waiting possible extradition to the US along with possible death penalty. Whistle blowers dont need to be first hand witnesses.
@DaMoons: Nowhere near the level of Assange, someone I respect, Assanges’ disclosures spoke for themselves, none of Clonans victim statements were subjected to any sort of scrutiny to ascertain their veracity, apart from his fellow academics saying it was great stuff. I won’t even begin to comment on his Lebanon memoirs.
@Kieron King: how do u know whether they “agressively resisted” or not?
@eileen boles: Because I served during that period, appears to have been the best kept secret of the day, I served at home and abroad with outstanding female Officers and Enlisted Troops, most of whom would have had ripped your tongue out of your face or your arm out of your socket depending on what type of grief you were giving them. Not quite sure who he spoke with, guess I didn’t know many of them.
@Kieron King: I have had the distinct honour of serving with some brilliant female soldiers, one of whom is now a general, she can definitely “suck it up” and can give as good back. She got there by being the best at what she did and deservedly so. In times gone by, some training NCO’s went too far, blinded by their animosity towards women in the army. Like any similar organisation, you had good and bad from both genders but some women were subjected to some of the worst kinds of bullying, which is well documented. Please remember, it happened to men too. It should not have happened but it did, the DF tried to rectify it and in some cases went too far and disrupted the balance needed to create proper military personnel.
@Rob67: I agree completely Rob, most of the bullying and bullshit that went on unchecked was gender neutral, I believe his submission is seriously flawed and was endorsed by academics who in reality had no idea how the arena he was assessing operated. I feel he did a major disservice to the majority of outstanding female troops that I know who stood their ground on equal terms with their male counterparts by portraying them as hiding in the corner keeping their mouths shut little fragile things. That is not a reflection of the female troops I served with at home and abroad. But hey, it made headlines.
Jesus some of the comments here be ex servicemen show that they still don’t care what went on, circle the wagons and try to discredit were the tactics used at the time to discredit this man’s work and they were that effective that they are still alive and well. One guy was saying he served with loads of women and never saw anything that wasn’t gender neutral. Well I went to mass every Sunday and served with many boys but never saw any child sexual abuse so by that man’s logic it just couldn’t have happened? Get your head our of your rears ex servicemen and show this man the respect he deserves for shining a light on the depraved conditions some female (and I’m sure male too but that wasn’t the point of hus reasearch) were forces to work in.
@Dino: with respect Dino I would suggest that you are the one with your head up your arse, had Clonan done his questioning five years before women had been allowed to serve in the Defence Forces with the equivalent amount of male subjects he would have come up with the same results including the rape allegations. To suggest that everything he ‘discovered’ only applied to females in the Defence Forces is nonsense, it was how things were done long before women were allowed to serve. But hey, his one sided unsubstantiated investigation was endorsed by ‘Academics’. Jog on.
So, is the Defence Forces going to say sorry to us females that endured sexual harrassment?
@Karina Molloy: the DF hierarchy have a tendency to never apologise for past wrongs no matter who was in the wrong, sadly. Having said that that, if a wrong was committed against, you should seek redress against the individual(s) and the Dept concerned. It would be even better if a group of female soldiers, who had been harassed and abused, got together and took their cases to the courts, the evidence of an issue exists in Tom’s document and I am sure there would be evidence elsewhere within the Dept.
So Tom, are you going to get the Defence Forces to apologise to all the females thhat were harassed??
@Karina Molloy: all u can hope is that theyll do the right thing & set an example to society. Tom did a grt job highlighting the problem.
It looks like a trip on the feminist Bandwagon. Canny move for an aspiring academic.
@John Lynch: u keep feeling sorry for yourself along with the rest of the delicate flowers.
So, Tom, are you going to get the Defence Forces to apologise to all the females that were harassed?
have your say