Saves A LOT of resources and A LOT of time and maybe even more lives than the ones immediately in peril…

And if a disaster brings the networks down, and there is no more than rudimentary communications through say the two way radios of ESB linesmen or the local police? Loc8 codes are very valuable in this instance. What if you want to report a hazard, but don’t need to dial 999, the utility company/local authority will still need a way to quickly locate the hazard before it does cause injury.

You also need a system that works with autopiloted vehicles that are now beginning to go live, and you need a system that you can use with drone delivery systems. Loc8 is the only system fully compatible with these systems.

Not forgetting of course, a proper postcode system will also make it much easier to navigate even in the absence of technology. People who grow up around loc8 codes will NEVER get lost in Ireland because the layout of the codes inside each 3.5km block will be identical to every other 3.5km block.

The best systems work with or without technology. Your technology base system is useless if the technology fails for whatever reason. A lot of people will not and cannot use smartphones.

We need a system that is absolutely foolproof. Loc8 codes truly is all things to all men.

How would a Loc8 code help if someone was lost up a mountain??

one tap – Loc8code – simple.

Not much good if you have no idea where you are.
If you have a gps phone you already have your lat-long, and if you have a handheld gps you also know your grid ref – that’s all the rescue services need.
I can’t see what Loc8 would bring to the party.

if you have a smart phone and are not familiar with lat/long the free Point8 app will generate a Loc8 code via on-board handset GPS even if you don’t have a data signal. This is the advantage of an algorithm based GPS code compared to a database code like Eircode. Just have it on you phone BEFORE you go hillwalking.

Loc8 codes are simpler and easier to communicate to rescuers than Lat/Long which has a number of different formats and are many digits long. Also there are now two existing parallel Irish Grid Refs and have been for a number of years.

There are a lot of people taking to the hills without proper GPS. Loc8 codes can be marked at intervals on existing sign posts along way marked trails so people without a smart phone can just call it out to rescue services for a precise fix to a casualty.

What two Irish grid ref systems are there?? Emergency services are familiar with grid refs and lat-longs, they’re hardly rocket science.

@alien8 I think the latter part of this article addresses the point you raise. Eircode has no role but location tech/apps and a dedicated Public Safety emergency response code are required. Loc8 has proven itself for that purpose over the past 6 years! http://disloc8ed.com/blog/2016/08/01/eircode-public-disservice-announcements/

Loc8 works over every inch of the island North and South

Answer is in the latter part of this article http://disloc8ed.com/blog/2016/08/01/eircode-public-disservice-announcements/

ITM is second Irish Grid since 2001 as GPS showed up old grid inaccuracies. Main benefit of Loc8 is to let ordinary punters share their location simply and accurately in both emergency & non-emergency situations. Emergency services can still use all their existing navigation techniques to direct teams to the casualty although dissemination of location becomes easier.

ITM is a separate format. Climbers, walkers and mountain rescue teams all use grid references based on Irish Grid. Mountain rescue teams also regularly use lat-longs (particularly when working with rescue helicopters), and rescue helicopters themselves generally use lat-longs but can convert to grid references if required (and vice versa).
These two systems work well in practice – why would introducing a third system serve any useful purpose or bring added advantage?
There is certainly an argument that Loc8 carries some advantages over Eircodes in urban settings, but this doesn’t apply in remote or wilderness areas.

Avina you are missing the point. Loc8code lets the casual walker notify others of their location simply, accurately and with error checking built in. Many many people do not know or understand lat/long nor the many different formats involved. As you infer grid ref & lat long work great for rescue professionals & knowledgeable amateurs but many if not most joe soaps know very little about navigation.

ITM is the same visual format as IG and very easily confused. ITM is an option for electronic maps purchased from OSI and is actually the most accurate grid system for Ireland. Many State agencies have fully adopted it and all should have except the recession got in the way. All who use grid should be familiar with it and be able to tell one from the other so that they do not mix them up. When I run courses for hillwalkers to land surveyors we practice both. The point is though, that these systems can be derived from many sources and therefore the untrained population cannot be expected to know what’s what. This is why an unambigous system is required for the casual un trained user – that’s what Loc8 does;- and if they pass it on you know what source it came from. Few in this country know Grid or Lat/Long and in my decades of experience I have found that those who think they do, very often do not and certainly are not aware of all the possible options an untrained user may present to you;- causing confusion. Techology and apps make all these optipns available in a non standard way and add to the confusion. Someone sent me Lat/Longs of coastal features recently done using an app;- all at least 1 degree (60NM) in error…. I rest my case your honour!

Most hillwalkers are more than capable of reading off a series of digits from a phone or GPS to a call taker, and rescue services are more than capable of interpreting them whatever format they’re in!
The Coast Guard also has a system to ‘ping’ a callers phone and get an automatically generated map location too – you’re overthinking this!

Provided all parties know which digits they are! Think you are a bit hazy on ITM yourself. Even Irish grid is presented in at least 3 different formats that I have come across and in my experience. Most hlllwalkers believe Irish Grid consists of a total of 6 digits. But of course there are many who know and do all as required but preparing for public safety response is about preparing for the lowest common denominator. As for the Coastguard, they received a lot of criticism for their attempts at phone tracking system for vessels as NO international rescuse/maritime standards agency recommends or supports the use of mobile phones for safety of life at sea!

Gary, I think you’re a bit confused yourself as to the role of the Coast Guard. Of course mobile phone ‘pinging’ isn’t used for vessels at sea – coverage ends only a short distance offshore – but Coast Guard co-ordination centres have a huge role in inland incidents (both waterways and mountains etc.), and this is where the phone locator system is predominently used.
As to grid references, most hillwalkers do indeed use six figure refs when working from a map ( and realistically there’s seldom if ever a need to pinpoint an incident location to a greater degree of accuracy than 100m x 100m) but eight figure and ten figure references are frequently used when a GPS is involved.
When you run your ‘courses for hillwalkers’ I hope you teach them to set their GPS to ‘Irish Grid’ format (which is the universal format for walkers and climbers) or lat-long, and not ITM.
The system isn’t broken so I don’t see why you’re trying to fix it by introducing a new element that offers no advantage over lat-long or grid refs.

A full Irish Grid Coordinate is 12 digits. A 6 digit version (3 east and 3 north) does not define to 100m accuracy but to 1m on a particular map – as long as you know which map! On courses I highlight BOTH systems as many work with ITM by direction of the Gov dept they work for . Only by being aware of both systems is a user properly trained! As for phone based rescue systems they have their place as I have pointed out in the article Ive posted here several times. Can I request that you might read it as I think you might well agree with what is said on apps. When planning emergency response from a State persoective there is a duty of care to plan for the worst case scenario with a full understanding of the subject. Emergency response has many elements and participants and all must be taken into account, with failsafes built in. No problem if you dont agree, just my informed opinions.

Can you advise who you are/who you represent – better for an open discussion?

Well pointed out, like bandages they are not going to help you find home either and what good would a map be if ya can’t read it. Tut tut

No one is saying the system is broken but there is a need for a reliable way for non technical punters to call in emergencies accurately & quickly be it a mountain rescue, a rural RTA or a heart attack in an urban park. Loc8code offers advantages far in excess of the dumb random Eircode and should be embraced by emergency services for initial casualty alerting.

There already is: lat-longs and grid references!!
Rescue helicopters – in common with the aviation world in general – use lat-longs in all their systems.
Mountain Rescue Teams – in common with other walkers and climbers – primarily use grid references (although they can also provide lat-longs to a helicopter if required).
If Loc8 codes are provided all it means is that the services will then have to perform an additional conversion to bring them back to grid ref or lat-long format! This will hamper, not assist, a rescue operation!
As I have already said, I think there’s a very strong case to be made that Loc8 codes are far more logical and intuitive than Eircodes in terms of locating addresses etc., but it does your case a disservice to start making a spurious case for non-existent benefits in mountain and wilderness emergency scenarios.

I think anyone who decides to dictate what is good or bad in relation to emergency location ID should at first show some real knowledge on the subject. I think your clear misunderstanding of Irish grid and its variants and the presence, format and use of ITM demonstrates that you are not in that space yet. Regrettably also that you are not prepared to identify yourself. Loc8 gets converted to/from Lat/Long and all forms of Irish Grid routinely across Ireland. ECAS are already trained to use it and major emergency planners have Loc8 Codes in their response plans. Irish Water Safety recommend Loc8 on ringbuoys and Garmin convert Loc8 to Lat/Long in their satnavs since 2010. 1st responders use Loc8 on the point8 app and Garmins on a routine basis. Finally, it is hard to have a serious conversation with someone who not only has shown themselves to be suspect on detail but whose profile suggests that he/she is only having a laugh after all!

Since you are in the budiness of having a laugh here’s one for ye https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/what3words-confusion-suitable-emergency-response-gary-delaney

Luckily, the Loc8code guys have a video you may care to watch that deals with your comment.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Alprw378ZE

Luckily, the Loc8code guys have a video you may care to watch that deals with your comment.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Alprw378ZE

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Alprw378ZE

With respect Gary, I have a lot of first hand experience in remote rescue situations – I know what I’m talking about. Clearly you do not, given your suggestion that the Coast Guard only deal with offshore incidents.

Perhaps you can also tell me which mountain rescue teams, coast guard units or indeed recreational walkers and climbers use ITM co-ordinates?? Whether you like it or not, Irish Grid (in combination with lat-long when required) is the standard format for these groups.

The combination of grid references and lat-long co-ordinates works well in practice in remote areas – there is no requirement for Loc8 codes or any other co-ordinate format in this situation.

The only time there is confusion or difficulties locating a casualty is generally where the casualty/caller is unaware of his/her precise location and has no access to a handheld GPS or GPS enabled smartphone. In this situation Loc8 codes will not make a blind bit of difference, unless you’re planning on setting out a grid of physical markers the length and breadth of the country.

ps. you also stated that “A full Irish Grid Coordinate is 12 digits”. Well that’s not really true either – it can be 10 digits, 11 digits or 12 digits, depending on whereabouts in the country the location is.

Well if you exclude leading zeros that’s true but try enter that into a handheld without allowing for the leading zeros or locate on a map without considerng them and see where that gets you. And of course that’s not to mention 100km letter square to be handled also. Fact is 12 is the norm, work with less and you must know something is missing and how to deal with it. Grand if you know but not if you dont and most dont! No one is suggesting that lat/long or grid be dispensed with ( I make my living from all of them) but the average Joe public has no interest in them, has no idea of all the variations and possibilities for error and does not want to be reading out protracted lists of numbers on a poor line over the phone whist in distress. If the trained rescuers use grid thats fine – that’s not who we need to consider and we also need to consider that the nearest rescuer may be someone untrained very close by. Why do I say this, well over 35 years in the positioning business I have seen all the errors that are made and made by all from professionals to first-timers. Very aware that the Coastguard works inshore – the phone app you related to them is what I spoke about. In the first article I linked to here I referrred to phone app/tech which does not require the user to read out anything. This is fully supported. But I also referred to the fact that realtime GPS derived location may not be always accurate enough for the geography no matter what coordinate it’s expressed in. This is where Loc8 on signs buoys or waymarks comes in and relaying it over the phone is shorter and easier. The article I just linked to you shows that its not me that threatens you but people in back offices in Dublin who would have you use 3 random words rather than any of that we have spoken about here. Database jockeys and political hacks are the ones that believe they can dictate what is best for those in the frontline in emergency response. You would get no choice, just be told unless someone takes responsibility. Have a read of it and pass on to your fellow responders so they can react to it officially themselves here it is again: https://www.linkedin.com/pulse/what3words-confusion-suitable-emergency-response-gary-delaney

You pull out your smartphone with the point8 app installed and you do this: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5Alprw378ZE

Again avina this is NOT for the rescueers this is for the casualty for reporting their position. Same for reporting a rural RTA, same for reporting a broken down car to the AA, same for reporting a fallen power line to the ESB, same for reporting a dangerous pothole to the council. It’s a simple, unambiguous, easily communicated way of indicating a location verbally or electronically.

Emergency services, helis whoever can use what method they currently use to navigate to casualty….once they know where he/she is.

But Eircodes, you seem to be trying to make out that there’s a problem that needs to be solved, when there really isn’t.
If someone has a gps enabled phone or a handheld gps, all they need to be asked to do is to read off a relatively short set of lat-long digits which can then be passed directly to the responding emergency service.
Of course there is a small potential for human error when transcribing the digits over the phone, but the same would apply to a Loc8 code. In practice this is virtually never an issue – the system really is not broken!

Repeat NEVER said system was broken. You are short sightedly looking at mountain rescue only and assuming everyone carries a GPS when mountaineering which isn’t the case. Thousands of ambulance, fire brigade and other emergency services call outs will benefit from an easy consistent easy to communicate way of identifying a casualty location. Or perhaps my fireman buddy in North Kildare is lying when he recounts numerous REGULAR instances where they cannot locate non dwelling incidents. Every reliable proven system that aids timely access to casualties should be embraced.

I feel like I’m hitting my head off a brick wall here. The topic of this story is mountain rescue, and that’s why I’m predominently referring to mountain rescue!
If someone doesn’t have a GPS or a GPS enabled phone, a Loc8 code won’t make a blind bit of difference if they’re lost!! That is my point.

I know the feeling. A Loc8 code written on regular wayposts like on Wicklow way would mean in the event of an emergency without a GPS or smartphone they could still call in their position accurately. I’ve been on the top of Galtymore when a woman appeared in a summer dress & wooden clogs. Don’t for one minute think everyone who hits the hills is prepared. Also Loc8 is already used to find people lost in forests in the west, not for the punters but for deployment of search teams, I’m sure Gary has the full details.

Lucky they had a data connection.

As for the now scrapped broadcasting tax, does that mean that I don’t have to buy a TV licence if I have no more than a screen, an android box for example, no tuner, no antenna and no satellite dish in my house.

No tuner, no dish, no charge. Wonder will Capita PLC get gifted the TV Licence collection considering AnPost have been making a balls of it for years?

Point discussed here http://disloc8ed.com/blog/2016/08/01/eircode-public-disservice-announcements/