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THE WORD ‘CONFLICT’ can arouse instant fear in many of us – and although it isn’t necessarily about being in battle, it can feel that way sometimes, especially if it’s about a long standing issue.
Conflict arises from difference; whether it’s a conflicting need between two parties, clashing beliefs or attitudes, or behaving in a way that may be okay and reasonable for one but undermining and offensive to another. Many people will admit that they hate conflict and in fact, given the opportunity they’d run a mile from it. Who could blame them as it usually has some foundation in fear? The fear itself can be facing an issue and possibly making it worse.
In the context of a more intimate relationship, it might be a genuine concern that could somehow result in a couple breaking up. To avoid this they keep quiet and try to ignore what’s happened. And yet, according to author and psychologist Michael Batshaw “Engaging in conflict isn’t going to end the relationship, it’s avoiding the conflict that might.”
Long term avoidance of things that really need to be talked about can fill you with resentment, especially if you feel you’re on the back foot and have no power in the relationship. Maybe you’ve tried to air it and been given the brush off or the other person just didn’t ‘get it’ really. However, it’s not uncommon to find that the appearance of resentment over the longer term brings the disappearance of sexual desire which is an important form of communication between many couples.
Communication is such an important factor in resolving conflicts in relationships. It can also be a root or contributory cause of conflict, with 85 per cent of all cases dealt by us in Relationships Ireland reporting issues with communication between partners being a key reason why they came to us for our help.
Conflict is inevitable because no two people are the same and sooner or later their differences will surface. If most conflicts are unresolvable because they are a result of perpetual difference, what will matter to intimacy (closeness) is how it’s dealt with.
Communication is about expressing yourself with a view to being understood. It’s equally about listening to what’s being said. This can be very difficult if you have been defensive with each other and the tendency might be to interrupt whilst the other is speaking to correct them. Let them finish.
Men will often find it easier to talk about difficult topics while they are doing an activity even if it’s just going for a walk (side-by-side), whereas women may be more comfortable sitting at the table talking it out. The simple use of ‘I’ statements (and avoiding the use of the word ‘You’) can soften blame/criticism and give the speaker a chance to say how things really are for them. For example ‘I was hurt when I didn’t get a text back because I felt ignored’ – much easier to hear than ‘You never answer me, you just don’t care’.
As you are listening to the other speak, find something in their story that you can relate to (eg ‘I can see how you would be bothered about something like that’). This gives them a message you have heard and identified with them. They are far more likely to listen to you when it’s your turn.
You can deepen your understanding of your partner by trying to identify the underlying feelings. This will be helpful for both of you and is really effective for reducing tension.
Sometimes with the best of efforts between you, feelings can get heightened and no-one is listening. Ask for a 20-minute break to cool down and figure out what happened to you that may have contributed to the argument (forget about what the other one was doing). Did you hear something you didn’t like or that scared you and may have caused you to shut down or get angry?
Don’t bring in other issues. Although you might feel a sense of ‘while we’re at it, I may as well bring up…’, it is pointless because there’s nothing surer than strong emotions to cause confusion. Both of you may well be left with a sense of ‘what’s the point of talking about anything?’
For some issues, there is a solution and it’s always worth asking ‘is there middle ground here for us and what can we both do that’ll help?’ There are times when you might feel that you’re the one making all the effort. Ask yourself why is that? Did you somehow make it your job because you were the best person to do it? Or was it circumstances at the time? Or was there an understanding that was either implicit or explicit between you?
Finally, never underestimate the words ‘I’m sorry’ – not to get you out of a tricky situation (usually the other one will know what’s genuine and what isn’t) – but maybe you are sorry that you’re fighting, and maybe you are sorry if feelings get hurt.
Lisa O’Hara is a counsellor for Relationships Ireland.
Relationships Ireland offers confidential counselling and support services that offer you the opportunity to understand and resolve difficulties in your relationship. For more information or to book a consultation you can contact 1890 380 380 or email info@relationshipsireland.com.
Nothing wrong with free speech but those promoting paramilitary activity in this country should be subject to the full force of the law. Could they not have been arrested under our terrorism laws?
@Tweety McTweeter: I don’t think wearing a green jumper is a terrorist activity
@White Rabbit: Its well documented what that organization stand for. They represent the political wing of the Real IRA, an illegal terrorist organization
@Tweety McTweeter: Terrorism laws shouldn’t prevent marches, sorry.
That’s a slippery slope. These lads are thugs, no doubt, but they have the same right to assembly, guaranteed by the Constitution, as the rest of us, no matter how vile their motives.
@White Rabbit: are you always a dummy?
@ihcalaM: yes, maybe the right of assembly, that doesn’t mean it shouldn’t have consequences. Would you agree with Daesh members marching in our streets based on the same constitutional right?
@ihcalaM: Tweety here is creaming himself with a justified outrage opportunity and losing sight of the bigger picture.
At least when they’re marching, you know where they are. You can identify and capture them if they step out of line.
@Nial D: Are you 6?
@Tweety McTweeter: brilliant idea Tweety and let’s not stop there! Burn books, ban films, and there are other members of society that don’t agree with you lock them up.
@Jack: No, I don’t agree with terrorists and don’t believe they should be allowed promote and recruit young idiots. Do you?
@Tweety McTweeter: You don’t believe in not trying to twist people’s words and fit them into your little boxes either.
There’s a very big difference between agreeing with terrorists and saying anyone whose ideas you don’t agree with is a terrorist.
You’re more of a broad, sweeping strokes kind of person. That’s great for you. Useless in any meaningful conversations though.
@Joe Phillips: So, tell us “the bigger picture”, wise one.
@Tweety McTweeter: let them match. At least they are out in the open and can possibly be identified and kept under surveilance.
@Tweety McTweeter: I don’t either Tweety but marching down a street isn’t a terrorist act I am as outraged as anyone but we left witch hunts behind us 200 years ago.
@Dave Barrett: march.
Can we let them march one more year for the craic maybe organise tennis balls or sliotars?
@Tweety McTweeter: If you really need it spelled out for you… prohibition of anything does nothing to change the mindsets of people who were for whatever’s been banned.
This new group might think they have more support among the public than they do. Let them see that very few people share their vision enough to join their marches. Or are you afraid people will fall for their charms and soon you’ll be outnumbered and surrounded by green jumpers?
Stop thinking you’re the moral authority on what everyone should and shouldn’t do. I’m sure you have other things to do
@Joe Phillips: 100% correct, and well put.
Just like banning Holocaust denial in Central Europe didn’t get rid of Holocaust deniers (just drove them underground and made them believe the establishment was out to get them), banning these losers would do nothing to address the actual problem, in fact it would just embolden them. They’re itching to have a cause to fight.
We don’t need the law to protect us from bad politics. I trust the Irish people to see these frauds for what they are, apparently some people don’t…????
@ihcalaM: Exactly! Although, of course it suits Leo and Simon and all our other righteous guardians to spend the week condemning and re-condemning the same thing, then hoping someone will say something about doing that so they can jump on them for their ‘despicable’ ‘defence of a terrorist organisation’ that means they probably want to bomb schools and give back rubs to Nazis. Like Tweety here.
@White Rabbit:
@Tweety McTweeter: so marching is a crime?….
@ihcalaM: They have NOT the same right to assembly. Paramilitary displays are by their very nature by people who hold violent extremist views seeking to violently overthrow the democratically elected government. No place in a democratic country!
@Tweety McTweeter: Do you agree with the economic terrorism of the banks and vultures?
@John Mc Donagh: Have you ever seen the Westboro Baptist Church picketing a funeral?
@Tweety McTweeter: I do not find there march offensive, free speech has to be respect also its the media linking all this together makes me wonder…..
@Tweety McTweeter: An unsanctioned army marching down the Main Street of our capital city, 48 hours after they murdered an innocent during one of their operations? I wonder what our official Irish army would make of them.
@Tweety McTweeter: Membership of, or support of, the political wing of an illegal organisation is not enough by itself to prove membership of that organisation.
@Tweety McTweeter: The old IRA were fighting for Irish freedom
@White Rabbit: nobody suggested it was a terrorist activity.
@White Rabbit: The letter C is a fairly ordinary letter by itself, apart from being an international symbol for temperature and, in physics, the speed of light. U is much the same but has gained some popularity as the text representation of ‘you’. N has more going for it as a major compass point and also a central role in mathematics. T is pretty boring and doesn’t mean much by itself. However, if you bring those letters together and start screaming them in people’s faces unnecessarily, they become extremely offensive and will stimulate great anger in most people.
Let’s be honest and stop pretending they were just wearing green jumpers.
@John Mc Donagh: This administration has no popular mandate. Clandestine confidence and supply ‘arrangements’ keep Leo in power while ongoing secret meetings deny the people elections. None of this is democratic and all of it is unconstitutional, which is probably why paramilitaries feel obliged to march in the streets.
Unless they are actually breaking any laws I don’t see why or how they should be banned.
@Luke Lee: It shouldn’t. Typical reactionary idiot people
*They
@Joe Phillips: I’ve long thought provocative marches like these and the orange marches a real starting point on tensions. Wounds won’t heal until they are dealt with
@The observer: i agree with you. I don’t think they should exist, these marches. But banning them isn’t going to make the ideologies go away. It’s a stupid, short-sighted measure that just says “shut up, we don’t want to hear you… go and be hateful in silence”
@Joe Phillips: certainly the right to protest issues shouldn’t be an issue ever. But public displays of a private Militia have no place in a Republic. Surprised they weren’t banged up for that alone.
@Luke Lee: Leftie free speech unless it disagrees with them. I don’t support them but they’ve as much if not more right to be there than Love Ulster
@Luke Lee: is impersonation of real soldiers a crime? I guess that’s what they are trying to do to give their crime gang an edge.
@Luke Lee: the only thing their guilty of is never doing an honest days work in their life!
@Martin Critten: __ People walking around wearing military surplus doesn’t constitute a militia. If they happened to be armed, that would be a different story. They’d only be prosecuted if they wore Irish military uniforms.
@Luke Lee: maybe fashion police should have been alerted lol
If ffg had their way all protesting and marching would be band along with free speech whats left of it
@Humphrey Harold Haddington: So, terrorism organizations should be allowed to march under the banner of free speech? Does that include the likes of ISIS and The Taliban?
@Tweety McTweeter: Saoradh is not a terrorist organisation.
@Luke Lee:
Hahaha hahaha hahaha
@Humphrey Harold Haddington: but the thing is they do have their way and they haven’t done that.
@Luke Lee: grand , I’ll set up a new group tomorrow, call myself the political wing of ISIS, throw out a few empty words saying I’m not a terrorist and by your logic I should be able to walk up and down o Connell street dressed in black with big back flags. A lion by any other name is still a lion. Get a grip.
@John fitzpatrick: You can do whatever you want. Unless Saoradh is a recognised terrorist organisation that has being found guilty of crimes then I’m sorry, but you cannot just ban them. It sets a dangerous precedent. It could be You may not understand that but that’s not my problem.
@Luke Lee: and I would not be setting up a terrorist group either. I’d come out and say I was not ISIS. That would be enough right? As long as I say I’m not it’s all good. Maybe whilst I’m at it I’d set up an ould UVF group and say I was not a terrorist also . All grand in the name of free speech. Toxic logic.
@Luke Lee: Your logical fallacy is; slippery slope, because A happens, I am certain B will happen with no evidence whatsoever.
@John fitzpatrick: Can you show me where it’s written down in law where Saoradh are a banned terrorist organisation? The UVF are Recognised as one. So are ISIS. I believe Saoradh are not and until they are, they are entitled to march. I don’t support them in any way but i do support the idea of freedom of expression. You may not like that but its actually an important part of living in a free society.Like I said, you can do whatever you like. Nobody is stopping you.
@Tweety McTweeter: yes no group should be banned from marching as long as no laws are broken. Only rule should be no covering of faces. Let the authority’s see who is marching and watch them in the future. Great intelligence gathering opportunity
@Luke Lee: can you not cop what I’m saying. I’ll be setting up groups and I will be saying I’m not involved in terrorism. As long as I say it , it’s ok right?. The real IRA are a terrorist organisation, along with ISIS and the UVF. This group are the political wing of the Real IRA. But as they say, if I’m explaining I’m losing . Sounds like your as sharp as those knuckle draggers that paraded.
@Humphrey Harold Haddington: Explain please. Only about 65% of registered electors vote at any election here. You can’t have it every way.
@Luke Lee: Saoradh’s link to the Real/New IRA are clear. I’ve no doubt that the PSNI have more than enough evidence to establish it. The issue is the Irish state not keeping on top of which newly formed groups need to be added to the list of proscribed organisations. They should have been added years ago.
@John fitzpatrick: You can do or say whatever you want John. As long as it’s within the law. I’ll even support you. This is a legal matter. Not a feelings one. Until Saoradh are a banned organisation they are and should be entitled to march.
@Tweety McTweeter: Unfortunately it’s the price of freedom of speech and expression. It’s not a very expensive price price. When you really consider the alternative.
The problem with curbing free speech. Is where dose it stop.
Ex: do we ban all protests
Do we ban any news article or protest thats critical of the government, the state, the church, the police. What about books/movie.
@John fitzpatrick: everyone has copped on to what your saying John but it’s your right to express that on this form,and I for one am delighted you can express that freely.
@Tweety McTweeter: Humphrey is a troll. Its posts cover a range of contradictory positions, so clearly it only wishes to provoke, not offer anything useful.
@Humphrey Harold Haddington: these marching protesters don’t allow for free speech with their intimidation. How was the STOLEN ATM MONEY spent???
@Thomas Maher: there’s no free speech at the point of a gun.
@John fitzpatrick: The DUP have already done that.
@Luke Lee: they are the mouth piece of a terrorist organisation
@Tweety McTweeter: yes, whoever wants to March, if we don’t allow free speech then force is the only other way to be heard. If all those kids had been marching all day they would have been too tired to riot.
@Tweety McTweeter: Recent statements by Loser Leo and Simple Simon on the automatic right of return of ISIS collaborators / sympathizers and the unsustainable influx of questionable immigrants would suggest that we might need a real deterrent at some stage.
@Dónal O’Flynn:
You forget that the former deputy head of the PSNI is now in charge of our security system.
I very much doubt that he has no contact with his former colleagues, as the recent incident in the Phoenix Park confirmed.
@Luke Lee: How deluded
Was not too long ago FG were marching around the place in their blue shirts . How quickly they forget
@Nigel Cronly: You really comparing FG to an organisation that just came out supporting the “volunteer” who shot and murdered an innocent journalist the other night. FFS man.
@Nigel Cronly: not too long ago using the same time frame , women could not work after marriage, could not vote, priests could molest little kids with the risk of punishment . But you know what things move on and this is not the norm today. Live in the world we live in where these terrorists are not accepted.
@Nigel Cronly: Only about 80 something years ago, was a real run on Blue coloured shirts in Pennys that day…
@Tweety McTweeter: FG have killed more people than any terror organisation in Ireland. They’ve killed all hope and aspirations of our young people ever having a home and discourage any working class person from bettering themselves by ancillary taxes and that god forbidden USC remember the temporary Tax? The rivers of Ireland see too many people ending up in their waters each week.
These individuals are simply criminal thugs. Yes they should be banned. I am a republican and proud of being one. My unionist friends and I have many respect my beliefs, as I do theirs. We should not dignify these thugs by attaching the term ‘republican’, dissident or otherwise in describing them. Refer to them as what they are, criminal gangs.
@Deaglan Macgiollaphadraig: This is what happens when dopes learn their Irish history from listening to Luke Kelly albums.
@Orla Smith: I assume you mean the Wolfe tones and not Luke Kelly.
@Orla Smith: Luke Kelly? Oops. Think you’ve been sleeping on the aul Irish history yourself…
@Fr.Todd Unctious: Wolfe Tones is correct, although Luke did write many a wonderful rebel song.
@Orla Smith: somebody is ill informed
@Deaglan Macgiollaphadraig: Think about this. Thanks to their March.and all that pesky video footage and those photos the PSNI and the garda can go. We now know who you are.
@Orla Smith: how embarrassing for you Liam
@Deaglan Macgiollaphadraig: to be criminals they have to have broken a law of some description, usually paramilitaries are born out of an unhappy and unjust society, if you live on certain estates in this country it would be very easy to feel youve been let down by various policies, that nobody cares and therefore be open to idea of different ways forward, everyone needs a purpose in life and young men especially, just look at the suicide rates in the different demographics you will see a trend, so its really no surprise to seeing this march happen. Ban it and the numbers will increase sharply.
@Orla Smith: haha you are some dope!
@Orla Smith: never seen you say one intelligent statement on this…..sad
Why ban them, such laws would be used to hinder other freedoms of expression. Also the intelligence services love these events as a way to update their records.
March to your hearts content.
@LUCY Thomas: I initially voted to ban them, however having thought about it, had the same thoughts you did. The problem with it is that it hinges upon the belief that we actually have an intelligence service, something along the lines of the UK’s MI5. And, unfortunately, that’s where this idea begins to falter.
It would have been a perfect opportunity for an intelligence agency to capture data on all these people, to pay some of them a “quiet visit”, to kick some doors in, to identify those involved, who they associate with and who the leads are. From there, plant electronic surveillance on them and, over time, gather enough information to destroy the entire organisation.
Without any significant intelligence service a terrorist organisation can march, in uniform, up our capital city’s main street in broad daylight with impunity safe in the knowledge that nothing will be done. They even had a band leading them. Can you imagine that in any other city in the world? The London branch of al-Qaeda having a similar march through Kensington or the the French branch through the Champs-Élysées in Paris, they wouldn’t even attempt it. But here, they’re safe.
@Arch Angel: other than marching what crime did they commit…?
@Arch Angel: How do you think anyone gets convicted of terrorist offences in this country, and who do you think does it?
@David: It is illegal in this country to be a member of certain proscribed paramilitary and terrorist organisations. However let me ask you what the world would think if similarly dressed men and women were to march up 5th Avenue, New York in what is, lets face it, a threatening display. If they flew the Confederate flag and declared the American Civil War to be “ongoing” and not a single police officer raised a hand to stop them. If they defended the murder of an innocent journalist just days earlier. Do you seriously believe that would be accepted, or even allowed to happen in the first place?
@Joe Bloggs: I know we have a Garda and Military intelligence unit, both have different roles. The Garda intelligence service are tasked with electronic surveillance and paying informants, however to put this into perspective, their budget was increased last year by 25% – to €1.25m. The budget for MI5 alone in 2015 – 2016 was about £2 billion, so I think it’s fair to say we do not have a significant intelligence service in this country. The bulk of our ‘intelligence’ is dependent upon paying informants.
@Arch Angel: bubblegum
@Arch Angel: you should be feel privileged you inhabit a country where you are free to express your views whether or not the majority agree with you and persecution for doing so, paramilitaries are born out of social unrest, an unjust society or disregard for human rights, there are obviously other issues too. Young men in particular need to fulfill a purpose and if they feel society has marginalised them then its not surprise this march has happened, the bigger picture here is not terrorism its equality, if people are leading happy fulfillling purposeful lives they have no need to be part of paramilitary organizations.
@Arch Angel: That would absolutely be allowed in the US actually, their 1st amendment is there to protect exactly that…
@David: Point taken, I can see your point regarding living in a society, free to express our views and, to be honest I’m against censorship except in extreme circumstances. That said, I think it’s something of a stretch to claim paramilitaries are born from social unrest and, if young men in particular are not living happy, fulfilled lives they’re somehow prone to become terrorists. Sorry, that’s a little too much for me, there’s absolutely no indication of that here. Where exactly did all those men, and women, let’s be gender equal, get the money to buy those nice uniforms, the black berets, the sunglasses, the green military jumpers, belts and boots complete with black leather gloves and boots? They don’t sell that lot 50% off for would be terrorists in Pennys and I’m damn sure the entire package doesn’t come cheap. It doesn’t fit with the image of the poor, marginalised, socially disenfranchised would be terrorist.
@ihcalaM: You could be right, among other things the 1st amendment gives “right of the people peaceably to assemble”. I have no doubt however that, should a group try it, every agency would watch them like hawks – and they’d know it, which is why they wouldn’t do it. And that’s why it could be done here, because there’s nobody watching, and they knew it.
@Arch Angel:
How can you possibly compare the budget of a small nation such as Ireland, which has no military or strategic interests outside its own borders, with one of the leading warmongers in the world, Britain, which of necessity requires a huge military and intelligence service to protect and further its interests in territories which are of strategic interest to it.
Truly an infantile post!
@Arch Angel: you cant compare a bunch of Aldi rag heads with the republican movement.
I fully disapprove and disagree with the marches held in both Dublin and Cork. But I am equally opposed to any laws infringing upon free speech or freedom of expression.
@Kian: The European Convention on Human Rights protects our rights regarding freedom of expression, however, it contains very well-placed legal restrictions when it comes to; “The exercise of these freedoms, since it carries with it duties and responsibilities, may be subject to such formalities, conditions, restrictions or penalties as are prescribed by law and are necessary in a democratic society, in the interests of national security, territorial integrity or public safety, for the prevention of disorder or crime, for the protection of health or morals….”
This is not the United States, we do not have a 1st Amendment which is a free for all, I can’t believe how so many people are completely ignorant of Irish & European law. Sheep bleating; “FREE SPEECH, FREE SPEECH, BAHH!”
@Orla Smith: Just because there are restrictions on our speech in this country doesn’t mean all those restrictions are valid – are you making the claim that because EU/Irish law allows it, it’s inherently a just thing to impose these restrictions?
The debate is about what the law SHOULD say, not what it does say. Title of the poll.
@ihcalaM: And we take everything on a case by case basis before enacting amendments to the law, not some fatalistic ‘right or wrong’ approach.
@Orla Smith: Orla, if you can’t see the blatant ambiguity in what you’ve just copied and pasted and the problems that that presents, than you’re far stupider than I originally though
@Orla Smith: If you put political speech in the hands of the Oireachtas and, by proxy, populist whims (see: this article) then there’s no point in protecting it in the Constitution in the first place.
We don’t need free speech guarantees to allow us to say “I love football” or “steaks are deadly”. It’s only when vile people challenge our sense of morality that these freedoms are actually tested…
@ihcalaM: That’s why European Law supercedes the Oireachtas, checks and balances my friend.
@Orla Smith: European law is just as susceptible to populism and bad politics as any other legislation, plenty of bad law there as it is. Or do you reckon EU law will always have our constitutional rights at heart?
I doubt it. The point of a constitution is to give us inalienable rights. Vague ‘restrictions’ for ‘public order’ or ‘morality’ are prone to abuse.
I wonder how many of them have a real job. Very few I’d say. Criminals.
Maybe stop reporting on them so much. Ironically just ignoring them will get of them quicker than doing anything else.
I don’t like them but no they shouldn’t be banned, they should have the right to march it’s a free society
Arrogance. How is the ATM STOLEN money being spent?
It’s just a bunch of losers who had no friends growing up, parents didn’t love them enough, can’t find a girlfriend etc. who now think they’re ‘patriots’ and join a little boys club to fill the vacuum in their lives. Similar to Trump supporters who medicate loneliness by spending their days in dark rooms on 4Chan, Reddit, and QAnon boards.
@Orla Smith: profiling Orla??
@Jack: There’s a large body of research going back decades dedicated to profiling of people with psychopathic tendencies who carry out atrocities. Use today to educate yourself on them (sorry for using big words).
@Orla Smith: This group is an extreme leftist group, they’re distasteful and rightly have very little support, however, they should be allowed to march, Ireland seems to be sailing very close to the wind when it comes to cracking down of civil liberties.
People should be universally calling for them to have their right to march. If you don’t like them organise a counter protest next time they march
@Orla Smith: don’t worry Orla I’ve a packet of crayons here! And while were profiling the journal seem to be your life go out and make some friends.
@Orla Smith: Nice imagination
@Orla Smith: You mean like the genocide perpetrated world wide by a murderous British empire. Personally I would not agree with the views of Saoradh,, but the danger of legislation being introduced by the blueshirts could be a catch all for all other protests. Blueshirts had no problem in wearing para military uniforms under O’Duffy. Of course they don’t like it when this is mentioned.
@Orla Smith: You need help
Sorry, but you can’t have ‘free speech’ and call for democracy and then outlaw stuff you don’t like. People are entitled to their opinions, whether you agree with them or not. There isn’t a single person that voted Yes to this poll who has some opinion on something they believe is right but others will disagree with. It’s all part and parcel of being in a free society.
Would this legislation affect the right to protest depending on how a the govt decided to label your group. Eg an ultra right govt could just label a kids climate protest as paramilitary and shut it down?
@Eileen O’Sullivan: No, it’s protected by the ECHR.
@Orla Smith: Says who? The ECHR provides for restrictions on free speech, in the public good, remember (you just cited it above). What if a panel of EU judges ruled a climate protest was disruptive to the public good? There’s absolutely nothing enshrined in law to prevent them from doing that, as you say – no US 1st Amendment, which would always protect such a protest.
This is why messing with fundamental freedoms and leaving them in the hands of the judiciary is not always a good thing.
@ihcalaM: What if my aunty had balls…
@Orla Smith: It wouldn’t surprise me
They couldn’t bring in laws to jail white collar criminals during the crash, but want to bring in laws handy to stop these dress up marches, and no doubt sneak in wording about other types of protests or leaders don’t like either……sorry but it’s hard to think that this sudden urge to stop clowns playing ra dress up won’t be tweaked to help out with political protesting which our leaders don’t like as well
If they are claiming to be the legitimate army of the Republic then they should be banned.
Are paramilitary organisations not illegal?
@Evert Bopp: They are, but attending a march in support of such organisations is not sufficient to prove membership of them.
Long may this type of March/Protest continue. This March was a wonderful opportunity to gather intelligence on members of this organization. This has always been the case, throughout the troubles since the early seventies. As of yesterday morning, all of those wearing the fake Raybans and army surplus ( plus size ) jumpers will have been identified by the Special Branch and Army intelligence.
A lot of them will eventually be targeted with a view to recruiting them as sources for use in the future.
Although it does have a paramilitary element to it on regard to inciting hatred and violence its no different really to orange marches in NI . People have a right to free speech and freedom of expression ive seen marches from orgs such as Hari Krishna marches and climate change and LBGT. The real purpose of ministerial outcry yesterday is to minimise potential SF votes in GE
@Mark Mooney: Their stated official goal is the forcible implementation of a 32-county Ireland.
Right to protest, yes.
Right to disrupt other people’s lives, no.
Right to protest wearing anything that could be construed ad similar to the uniforms odd the official military or authorities of thr state, absolutely not
No. Keep them out in the open and let the full force of social media ridicule them and tear them a new one. The last thing we need is to be handing FG an excuse to curtail the right to march and protest. However, protecting women from harassment trumps the right to march and protest.
Lets not forget our past. A lot of blood was shed for our freedom.
The real mistake was that the media photographed and filmed these stomping their way down O Connell Street and then gave them disproportionate publicity. The marchers should be identified by the Gardaí. Marching in military regalia claiming to be the military wing of an illegal army should not be lawful.
Its a very close call between the march on saturday and the bunch of idiots in gov who’s gov policy is to sell houses to companies for profit resulting in thousands going homeless.
Resulting in more people dying of homelessness than from paramilitiary activity in the country.
@Adrian: bell end. You want free handouts to all. Don’t bother with school, tough on those who work hard to educate themselves and get up for work week in week out to pay for their modest house way outside the city. And pay through the nose too. Let’s all do what your crowd want. Stay in bed, claim all round us on the social and blame everybody else for it.
@Rubber Head: i don’t want free anything. I want fair prices for everything, which is not gonna happen when the idiotic gov is allowing foreign companies buy up all the housing. And this idiotic gov are dead happy with your argument pitting the haves against the have nots, shifting blame away from the gov, while they inflate the price of houses.
Just ignore them. Done
They want to provoke a reaction to get themselves arrested. The ones that walk around in their gear from army bargains are the bar stool warriors. The ring leaders of these organisations are lurking in the background being well watched by Garda SDU or PSNI Special Branch up north
Paramilitaries have always been expert’s at propaganda and will try goad authorities into having to make an arres t say how they’re being persecuted by the “Free State” or “Crown Forces”
So let them have a walk around but just turn your back and go about your business if you see them.
Anything banned or outlawed does not go away. It goes underground then expresses itself in dramatic and often harmful ways. The handling seems to be for media to ignore them, but media only reports and what they believe it’s people want to read and view and that satisfies their advertisers.
In the end its about what we choose to take notice of rather than pass the buck and ask for a law to take it away from our sight. Use our will to ignore it, then it goes away … because these marches are for one thing … to get our attention, both love and hate.
They should have all been arrested
“First they came for the socialists, and I did not speak out—because I was not a socialist. Then they came for the trade unionists, and I did not speak out— because I was not a trade unionist. Then they came for the Jews, and I did not speak out—because I was not a Jew. Then they came for me—and there was no one left to speak for me.”
@Peter Buchanan: sure being left alone when everybody else was gone wouldnt be much fun
Just in relation to free speech ‘The Journal’ keeps banning my comments even though the ive not used any offensive language, perceived as toxic 2.8 green yet it gets censored, this a funny auld democracy not expecting this to get posted!
@David: That’s Goliath for you
It is brainwashed idiots. Violence is not the answer ever. Have we not learned from our past.
@padar: this is why history I’m schools is very important.
If you create a generation who don’t understand their past properly they are doomed to repeat the same mistakes. This group glorified the horrors of the troubles… While almost everyone else saw that talking was the way forward to peace.
@Barry Somers: It’s wishful thinking to believe 14 year olds would take those sort of life lessons out of being forced to learn about conflicts from half a century ago.
@Barry Somers: History in our schools is censored so as not to offend our neighbors, show where it tells us about the half hanging and quartering of the Irish or the ethnic cleansing of up to 1/3 of our population by Cromwell, used to be there in my time but the school history books have been rewritten.
A moment of caution here. The natural reaction here is to say yes ban it but then we have to depend on that dope Varadkar to put in a law for the people and not his ilk. They could very easily put a law together giving them permission to stop any march they choose.
Up the ra
@chris c: The belly on you, you should cut down on the wine
I often wondered how the British allowed the IRA to parade para military-style around Dublin prior to the rising..
People became so used to it then that they were caught off guard when on the actual day of the rising volunteers began shooting policemen and motorists, citizens that would’nt give up their cars for a barricade at College green…..people must have a first thought this was all just another para military-style parade or re-enactment.
@Pádraig Ó Braonáin: it wasn’t the ira. They were the irish volunteers and the irish citizen army. Check the bureau of military records, download witness statements and have a good read. Neil Sharkey has a wonderful tale of his friend who worked at the post office.
No matter how disgusting these marxist paramilitaries are, the great thing about living in Ireland is that none of have to give a sh*t.
And until they openly call/incite violence, the right to free speech and protest must be respected.
If these people marched down O’Connell St wearing Garda uniforms, then it would be regarded as impersonating the police so why is wearing military uniforms not impersonating the military?
Republicans can march under peaceful symbols such as green ribbons etc.
The GFA is at risk because of Brexit and these para-military shenanigans just exacerbates that.
@Moorooka Mick: your point exactly, if they wore Irish army uniforms they would be stopped, they are wearing their own strange scary get up that no one could confuse with Irish army. They look like a mid life crisis not an army.
@Moorooka Mick:
Sure the guards would also have to arrest all the men wearing the camouflauge jackets and pants that are all the rage now!
Stupid poll.
They were out in front of the GPO today playing dressy up green soldiers ….. waving their colourful flags and and banging their little drums
I feel a party re branding incoming…. Fianna Fáil wink wink nudge nudge!!!
Move on with the times , let bygones be bygones and leave the past in the past. All it causes is hooliganism .
Paramilitaries?? They are a bunch of jokers. They march like they just pissed themselves. The “sergeant” calling the marching order was most likely ex Irish army private,thrown out,who now thinks he is a big shot with these numptys
Maybe the lad photographed just has a penchant for marching, doesn’t he take part in all the LBGT marches wearing hotpants & a dog collar?
ps anyone know the number for witness protection??
They looked like something from a Benny Hill movie over weight Muppets who probably spend far to much time down the pub spouting shite then training to fight . Social media shows them up to be what they are
We dont these para-military people/parades – period!
Did anyone tell them that its British Army pattern camouflage that they’re wearing? Idiots.
Stop them wearing sun glasses when it’s pissing rain
The 29% who didn’t vote yes need their heads checked out.
Deleting my reply to a comment journal.ie? Not cool guys.
No, these people who marched are misguided idiots, fools, fossils call them what you want. It is not up to the state to put our objections to such minority organisations for us. Asking the state to do so is just pawing off responsibility and as a result removing freedoms. If you object to these or any protest, go there, shout your objections, block their route, hold up banners stating that they do not represent you or us. Take responsibility and stop expecting the state to wipe your ass. Enough people show up to object these and their like will soon crawl back under their rock.
Jezez and prove to the world we really are snowflakes. Let people see the idiots they are.
They should be free to parade as an organisation but not while wearing paramilitary garb. They wouldn’t get away with it in the North, so why so in the Republic.
I fear Ireland is heading to a dark dark place again. You can feel I’m in the streets in the pubs and people are talking about it too. Personally they should be dealt with very quickly.
@Honey Badger: I totally agree and fear for the future. Why do they suddenly feel the need to raise all that cash by doing the atm jobs? With the uncertainty of how brexit will affect the situation in North of Ireland they have to get prepared I think
Anyone consider what Lyra’s position would have been on their right to assembly? Could it also be possible that if the Police in Derry left them off to have their parade at Easter, there might not have been a shooting on Thurs night and no one would be talking about them now?
Belonging to a proscribed organisation is illegal in NI, I don’t know about the South. That covers people marching in such a fashion and makes it an illegal act. There may be a lot to improve with our Parades Commission but there are elements of best practice worth looking at
@Sheila Fitzgerald: So it’s ok for the jaffa to March on July 12th. While chatloics like my self are held at gun point to leave them March down s nationalist road very slippery road indeed.
@john:
Civil rights for chocoholics!
Absolutely not. The right to assemble is a fundamental right, no matter who does it. If any of these groups do anything criminal whist on the marches, laws are already in place to deal with them.
Whether you like the idiots or not.what their commemoration is the same thing Michael D & Leo were doing yesterday only they have bigger toys like airplanes.
The same people trying to stop these idiots would be falling over themselves to have the orange order march down O Connell st.
@matthew o reilly: Why not let the orange order down O’Connell street Lead by example, show them we are not the biggots most of them are!!! And then which is the only way a United Ireland can come about they might vote for it unlikely for a generation but still the only way
@Ben:
Something like that was tried before ……. didn’t go too well!
@Michael Kavanagh: he’s only 11 sure on here. Most are
Never stopped IRA before GFA. Anyway who notices these twits.
It should be a crime for them to wear British army surplus uniforms!
Yes ban them immediately, idiot thugs with their narrow views and even narrower views. The hatred will never leave the shores of this country as long as these idiots keep passing on the hated to the next generation
I’m not much of a fan of these types of groups, but if we ban them, that’s just a first step towards increasing the oppression of freedom of speech.
Mandatory suspended sentences
I agree that marching in semi-military costumes is not acceptable in Irish towns. If these people had marched in plain clothes there would have been no problem.
After all Orange Lodges are allowed to march in many Irish towns, and while they don’t dress up in military costumes they do represent the foreign ideology of Unionism, which is the hatred of everything Irish and loyalty to everything British.
Perhaps that should be banned too.
@Shedonny: Lots of bands march in semi- military uniforms every st patricks day.
and the Orange order do wear military uniforms – not camoflage , but military uniforms all the same, especially the marching bands.
Well seeing as our govt is welcoming former ISIS employees back to Ireland I don’t think they have any rights to stop home grown marches…
We a
I am not a supporter of this group but I do support their right to fancy dress and parade the streets of Dublin. Freedom to have a peaceful assembly and free speech must always be protected even if we don’t agree with those expressing their rights.
No .
Same rule should apply to the delirious orange men dinosaurs on the 12th of July! I recently find the media I’m the last 18 months to a year has been very pro British!
Same rule should apply to the orangemen on the 12th of July!
have your say