Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
THE NATIONAL ASSOCIATION of General Practitioners has criticised efforts to remove patients across the country from hospital waiting lists, saying there is no medical reason to do so.
Calls have been made for the government to reform the waiting list system after a surge in the number of appointments that have been cancelled in recent weeks.
The HSE has been contacting patients across the country by post to ask them to confirm whether they still require an appointment.
However, those who don’t reply in writing within 10 days are deemed to no longer require their appointment, and their doctor informed that they have been removed.
The move has been described as a “national disgrace” by the NAGP, who say it is an attempt to manipulate waiting lists to make them appear smaller.
Over 700,000 people were on hospital waiting lists at the end of June, but the NAGP says it has heard from a number of GPs whose patients have been removed after not replying to the HSE.
NAGP President, Dr Maitiu O’Tuathail told TheJournal.ie that some doctors were receiving up to 100 letters a week asking them to validate their patients’ appointment.
He said: ”Normally GPs receive one or two validation letters a week, so to receive over 100 in a week is incredible.
“Many patients are also coming in to us in a panic because they worry that the letter isn’t going to reach the hospital on time.”
Dr O’Tuathail added that the move was disproportionately affecting the most vulnerable in society, including the elderly, those with visual impairments, and homeless people.
He said: “It’s pretty clear what this is about. There’s been a clear increase in the number of validation letters sent since waiting list figures hit over 700,000 a few weeks ago.”
Age Action also expressed concerns that older people would miss vital appointments because they cannot reply in writing in time, and urged the HSE to provide a dedicated phone number for older patients.
Meanwhile, the NAGP has called for a meeting with the HSE and the Department of Health to address the issue.
In a statement, the HSE said that validation exercises were carried out to help improve the overall use of resources and access times for patients.
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
Utter disgrace this is. Who’s idea was this? Who’s authorization did it take? Who carried it out? We need accountability NOW
@Spiderman: so you think nothing should be done to tackle the 13% of no shows that are costing the HSE 12million. Other patients could be taking these appointments. Its about time they did this. Now they should roll it out to other areas with no shows, like drivers licences, and bring in punishments for these people.
@John Buckley:
Rubbish. You cannot blame people for no shows if it was an honest mistake. Don’t forget, most appointments are unacceptably nanny many months in advance when somerimes, tragicalky, its too late.
In a properly run, caring health system, there would be no waiting lists.
And to blame patients for the ineptitude an indifference of hospital administrators is wrong.
@Spiderman: it is accountability. What you are proposing is populism. Too many no shows happening.
@Spiderman: put an adolescent inexperienced journalist in charge of the HSE snd this what you get. Harris should be fired, useless little yes man.
@John Buckley: My special needs son is waiting over 2 years for services we get at least one of those letters every other week. And I have enough to do with one appointment after another from one end of the bloody country to another, that I don’t have time to become an unpaid secretary for the HSE’s incompetence. How many of those 13% no shows are elderly people or disabled people that may not be able or understand that they need to reply. What kind of punishment should these people receive or what kind of punishments should be given to the HSE’s and all other government bodies that fail the citizens of Ireland on a daily basis.
@Bat Daly: there were 135,000 no shows for new appointments and 343,000 no shows for reviews in 2016. You think these are 478,000 honest mistakes in one year. You absolute clown. If someone really needs an appointment they will make sure they are there. These people can’t be bothered as there is no punishment and they are taking appointments that could be used for nearly half a million other people. The money wasted in dealing with these people would hire nearly 500 new staff.
@John Buckley: it’s all very well saying that but part of the issue is the short period of time given to reply. 10 days snacks of the purpose. If it takes three days to get the letter, as long as it hasn’t been misdirected, then three days to get back. That leaves a window of three days or so to write back if your lucky!!!
@John Buckley: No shows are a serious problem no doubt but this is a cynical and unethical way of dealing with the problem.
@Will: Something has to be done. If people showed up for their appointments it might clear a lot of waiting list meaning future cases are waiting less and less time. Instead, nothing has been done about it which is adding to the suffering of genuine people waiting on the list. Loads of people are criticizing the method of dealing with no shows but I don’t see anyone coming up with an alternative method.
@John Buckley: It’s up to the HSE to devise a method to remove people from the lists who do not need to be on them. The method they chose was wrong from the get go. There are many reasons why people might miss this 10 day deadline.
Obviously management in the HSE don’t care as long as numbers are reduced but the ends do not justify the means.
Accountability, the HSE dont know the meaning of the word. What if the person receiving the letter has literacy problems and perhaps lives alone, its a disgrace. I got one for my son who has profound intellectual disabilities .
@John Buckley: I was part of that statistic. I was waiting 57 weeks to receive an appointment. When I received my letter I dutifully rang to confirm. The lady I spoke to confirmed I was booked in. 4 weeks later, the day before my appointment, a Monday, I received a letter stating that I hadn’t in fact confirmed and was therefore discharged back to my GP. With the deadline to confirm and the letter dated the previous Friday I highly doubt anybody else got my appointment. So yeah, basically these statistics are complete BS. I rang, I confirmed, I needed that appointment, I was on the waiting list again within the week and a year on still waiting. I sent this confirmation back in the post but I was still classed as a “no show”
get a letter asking you if you wish to remain on the waiting list,you reply by phone and the person ,a few days later you get another letter saying as you have not responded to previous letter you will now be removed from the list,you ring up again anf a different person was a mistake and will be fixed,a couple of weeks before the appointment you check to make sure that your appointment is secure only to be informed as you did not reply to previous letters,,,it goes on and on no one cross checke to see if it has been cancelled or not,or the person dealing with this matter is on holidays
@John Buckley: Some of these appointments are sent 12 months in advance,and it is very easy to forget an appointment,son=me doctore send you a reminder,about two weeks which is grand,as regards the no shows,people are waiting so long they pass away,others who do not bother to show up for no reason should be removed from the list ,and should have to go to their GP to get another appointment,
Was waiting 2 years for a specialist appointment to then recieve a letter cancelling it. Not a reschedule, just cancelled.
@John Mitten: Not that simple I’m afraid. I had been attending a clinic in a particular hospital for many years, during that time the consultant left and was replaced a number of times. Such is the way of the HSE these days. It would be common during my visits for my next appointment to be sent out in the post and I’d file it away in my usual manner, on the fridge.
After a number of months had gone by I realised I hadn’t received my next appointment for this consultant and called the hospital, it was probably an oversight, I was eventually passed to his secretary who asked if I still wanted to see him. I explained that as I’ve been attending this clinic for over 30 years and I haven’t been discharged, yes I’ll continue. Sh then told me the consultant had left and been replaced again, and I sort of had been discharged. Huh, come again, exactly who made that clinical decision. It seemed I missed an appointment that I hadn’t received so the secretary made the clinical decision that I was dead, cured or no longer interested. After a heated debate (a significant argument) the secretary conceded that quite a few appointments, not just mine, hadn’t been sent out, despite this I was now a “new patient”.
Over approximately the next 8 months the hospital have written to me 4 times so far asking if I still wished to see this consultant, and I’ve replied 4 times that yes, I’m not dead yet. Each time I’m told I have 7 days from the date the letter is sent to reply, which is usually 2 – 3 days. The impression I get from this is that they would prefer that I make a mistake, and go to the back of some sort of queue or genuinely die while waiting. As I’m in hospital quite a lot it’s a very real fear that I’ll miss one of these letters and so I ensure my mail is checked frequently during my stays. I can only imagine the stress and anxiety this must cause to an older person living alone when the obvious purpose of these letters is to cause a patient to make a mistake. From the outset these letters, and by extension the hospitals and the HSE, set out to place the responsibility of the error upon the patient, they entrap them. For me that is an unforgivable act for an allegedly caring, compassionate body to carry out.
Gov failing on everything so they’re resorting to desperate measures, taking names of the homeless figures, hospital waiting list figures and quite possibly unemployment figures too.
@Adrian: You cant blame the government for the waiting lists,they are not in the hospitals,so they cant be responsable
This has always been a huge problem
They send you a letter then when you contact them the reception puts you through to the required outpatient department who somehow never seem to answer your call
And what about the elderly or in fact anyone that might be on holidays now at this time of year and don’t receive their post until they get home. What a disgrace. The HSE really don’t care at all.
@Emer Daly: I think that was the plan
Another attempt to hide the Real facts.
FFG spin machine…
Disgraceful behaviour , Joke of a Health Board .
I’m surprised they didn’t try and Fax them , seeing as they seem to think that’s the most efficient way to send critical information .
Im on waiting list almost 2 yrs now. I originally got a letter stating that I was on a list, to go on a list AND if I had any upcoming holidays to inform them so they can give my place on the list to someone else incase I was to get an app and not be able to make it. Im still almost 2 years waiting on the app and I got a letter to say due to failure to reply to a letter, I never got by the way, I have now been taking off the list. So no I dont think this system is practical at all and they ought to come up with a better plan than this!
I wonder if this is happening to private patients who can afford medical insurance?!?
@Mark Trudgeon: yes, you get a call or text reminding you, as I do from the hospital, if you are a no show there is often a charge
@Mark Trudgeon: what also happens is you get one of these letters asking if you want to stay on the list and reply if you do. What often happens (for those fortunate to be in position) is the recipient has paid for the procedure 2-3 years previous. This shows absolutely zero I.T integration between private appointments and wait Iist schedules.
Blame the patient……how ridiculous and utterly indefensible…..why aren’t people showing up…..because
A) they’ve died whilst awaiting appt
B) They’ve given up and gone private (which is the entire point of the long waiting list.
C) Genuinely overlook appt or forget it…eg…I got an appt for a consultant…a mere 4 years away…chances are I cud forget it
D) appointments are rather confusing….some you need to ring and confirm you will attend…some you ring to say you won’t attend…no uniformity.
It’s laughable that they are now trying to blame the patient as opposed to the Management’s ability to manage the damn system
The system is a disgrace, you are put on a waiting list with no idea when you’ll be seen or how serious the problem is. You are left on a list to see if you’ll cough up €200 to pay to see the consultant privately. I’ve been on a list since September ‘16 and I’ve been informed that I won’t be seen until 2020 at the earliest.
so perhaps the reason I’m not getting my physiotherapy appointment. I got a letter, i scanned it and managed to get a number off it and rang it to confirm i still needed an appointment. Its not accessible for vision impaired people, why they can’t offer the communication in Email is beyond me.
Hot on the heels of announcing the executive director of Slaintecare; re using crutches and massaging waiting lists numbers. If this is our govt’s idea of transforming the health care system in this country, we are in big trouble.
The FG approach to a transparent and accountable health care system ,well folks you did give them your vote at the last election .
@Anthony Gallagher: FG lead a minority government propped up by FF. Our lukewarm democracy is a bit of a joke really.
So, what percentage of the electorate actually voted for a secret Confidence and Supply arrangement instead of a nominated candidate?
FG….The party who care……about manipulating the figures on a grand scale to make their fraudulent government look good.
Agenda 21 is alive and well but not for anyone who can afford Health Insurance.
That is the plan.
Run down the Health services for children..the old…needy and the sick.
Boywonder Harris and Leo the useless with the full support of Flip Flop FF who got us into this “Price on Health” Quango called the HSE.
zzz
Back in 2013 I had an accident and broke my nose. Took 10 days to see a specialist who confirmed that I need a surgery.I waited for 2.5 years to see a plastic surgeon, who tried to talk me off the surgery, despite admitting that it is necessary as I can not breathe properly. He then said, the surgery should be performed within 2-3 months.
Ever since I have been receiving letters to confirm that I’m still interested in the appointment. Finally 5 and a half years later the day came. I secretly hoped it’s the date of the surgery, but I was wrong. When I called the number, I was told it will be another consultation (3rd one) and not the actual procedure. I had to take a holiday from work to attend the appointment. The plastic surgeon was not there, I was seen by some other doctor who said, the doctor is busy to see me. I was then told there will be NO SURGERY at all. No surgery at all. After 5 and a half years of waiting, the doctor just decided not to do the surgery, because he’s busy – at least this is what I was told. The doctor also explained what exactly is wrong with my nose and admitted that I need the surgery, but it won’t happen. I was dumb enough to leave without any written letter/statement, but I will call them tomorrow and request a written form that will explain why will I not get the necessary treatment. I have been lied to all those years. Not being able to breathe trhough my nose. If I was told back in 2013 that there will be no surgery, because the doctor prefers private patients and not some eastern European loser, I would have get it done abroad and paid it myself. Could anyone tell me, please, if this is normal? I’ve lived here over 13 years, I work and pay my taxes. Do I, as a patient have any rights? Can I see some legal advice? Because I don’t think this is legal.
The healthcare in Ireland is worst in whole Europe.I am so angry now, still not being able to breathe, but there’s literally nothing they can do, according to the doctor, because there are other patients.
Back in 2013 I had an accident and broke my nose. Took 10 days to see a specialist who confirmed that I need a surgery.
I waited for 2.5 years to see a plastic surgeon, who tried to talk me off the surgery, despite admitting that it is necessary as I can not breathe properly. He then said, the surgery should be performed within 2-3 months.
Ever since I have been receiving letters to confirm that I’m still interested in the appointment.
Finally 5 and a half years later the day came. I secretly hoped it’s the date of the surgery, but I was wrong. When I called the number, I was told it will be another consultation (3rd one) and not the actual procedure.
I had to take a holiday from work to attend the appointment. The plastic surgeon was not there, I was seen by some other doctor who said, the doctor is busy to see me.
I was then told there will be NO SURGERY at all. No surgery at all. After 5 and a half years of waiting, the doctor just decided not to do the surgery, because he’s busy – at least this is what I was told. The doctor also explained what exactly is wrong with my nose and admitted that I need the surgery, but it won’t happen.
I was dumb enough to leave without any written letter/statement, but I will call them tomorrow and request a written form that will explain why will I not get the necessary treatment.
I have been lied to all those years. Not being able to breathe trhough my nose. If I was told back in 2013 that there will be no surgery, because the doctor prefers private patients and not some eastern European loser, I would have get it done abroad and paid it myself.
Could anyone tell me, please, if this is normal? I’ve lived here over 13 years, I work and pay my taxes. Do I, as a patient have any rights? Can I see some legal advice? Because I don’t think this is legal.
The healthcare in Ireland is worst in whole Europe.
I am so angry now, still not being able to breathe, but there’s literally nothing they can do, according to the doctor, because there are other patients.
5 and a half years of waiting for nothing!
Well done!
Could anyone give me some advice, refer me to someone, where I could seek some help? I’m desperate.
If you are on the waiting list,you are there for a reason,to try and see a specialist ,you wait for months for an appointment,on getting the appointment you could be two to three hours before you see the specialist,then to be told to make a further appointment in 6 months time,in the meantime you get a letter asking you if you wish to remain on the waiting list,you phone and tell them you want to remain on the list,,thinking thats it you wait for the coming months,only to get another letter stating ,as you failed to respond to a previous letter you will now be removed from the list,,another phone call and you tell them you had responded to the previous letter,and they say it was a mistake but from a different person,and to just turn up for the appointment,Again you keep the appointment and are told after a two minute meeting with the specialist,and to make an appointment for 6 months,and so it goes on and on
Back in 2013 I had an accident and broke my nose. Took 10 days to see a specialist who confirmed that I need a surgery.
I waited for 2.5 years to see a plastic surgeon, who tried to talk me off the surgery, despite admitting that it is necessary as I can not breathe properly. He then said, the surgery should be performed within 2-3 months.
Ever since I have been receiving letters to confirm that I’m still interested in the appointment.
Finally 5 and a half years later the day came. I secretly hoped it’s the date of the surgery, but I was wrong. When I called the number, I was told it will be another consultation (3rd one) and not the actual procedure.
I had to take a holiday from work to attend the appointment. The plastic surgeon was not there, I was seen by some other doctor who said, the doctor is busy to see me.
I was then told there will be NO SURGERY at all. No surgery at all. After 5 and a half years of waiting, the doctor just decided not to do the surgery, because he’s busy – at least this is what I was told. The doctor also explained what exactly is wrong with my nose and admitted that I need the surgery, but it won’t happen.
I was dumb enough to leave without any written letter/statement, but I will call them tomorrow and request a written form that will explain why will I not get the necessary treatment.
I have been lied to all those years. Not being able to breathe trhough my nose. If I was told back in 2013 that there will be no surgery, because the doctor prefers private patients and not some eastern European loser, I would have get it done abroad and paid it myself.
Could anyone tell me, please, if this is normal? I’ve lived here over 13 years, I work and pay my taxes. Do I, as a patient have any rights? Can I see some legal advice? Because I don’t think this is legal.
The healthcare in Ireland is worst in whole Europe.
I am so angry now, still not being able to breathe, but there’s literally nothing they can do, according to the doctor, because there are other patients.
5 and a half years of waiting for nothing!
Well done!
Could anyone give me some advice, refer me to someone, where I could seek some help? I’m desperate.
have your say