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LAST UPDATE | 19 Jan 2021
THE GOVERNMENT HAS abandoned plans to re-open schools for special education this Thursday, after unions earlier said they opposed the move.
In a statement, Minister for Education Norma Foley and Junior Minister Josepha Madigan said that partially re-opening the schools will “regrettably not be possible owing to a lack of co-operation by key staff unions in the primary sector”.
The Irish National Teachers Organisation and Fórsa had urged the government to postpone the partial re-opening.
In a joint statement this evening, the unions said that fears raised by parents and staff had led to their decision to call on the government to revise its plans.
School buildings had been set to remain closed until the end of the month at least, but the Department of Education had indicated that it wanted to see a return for students with special educational needs prioritised.
Both unions want to see further discussions with government that will lead to improved safety measures in schools.
The INTO executive said it heard concerns that many parents whose children have special educational needs and additional underlying health conditions don’t have confidence in sending their children back to school at this time.
It wants the department to revise the re-opening plan to ensure that these children would continue to be supported remotely.
Fórsa said its workers were genuinely fearful that a return to school was unsafe for students and staff.
It said there was a discrepancy with the national Covid-19 stay-at-home advice and inconsistent advice about schools on safety was at the root of staff anxiety.
Fórsa’s head of education, Andy Pike said, “The government hasn’t won the support of special education stakeholders. I’m sure this was not the intention, but we are in a desperately sad situation where rushed efforts to prematurely reopen schools have pitched the special needs community against itself.
“It would be for the best if all parties would focus on a general reopening of schools as soon as possible, once there is an established downward trajectory in the number of Covid-19 cases and fresh public health advice that it is safe to do so.”
INTO general secretary John Boyle said there as conflicting health messaging which had left staff unconvinced a return to work was safe under current decisions.
He said: “We are calling on the Government to avoid a confrontational approach that forces a reopening on tens of thousands of fearful staff who want to follow public health advice. Instead, they should continue to work with us to ensure that schools are safe for students and staff.”
The unions added that they were calling on the government to step back from forcing the re-opening of schools, which would “create conflict at the height of the pandemic”. They are due to meet again tomorrow.
Government statement
In its statement, the Department of Education said that “unprecedented engagement” has been held with stakeholders and “ it had been hoped that a shared objective to support children with special educational needs return to in-school learning, could be reached”.
The department said it had set out for unions how it would address its concerns around the health and safety, childcare provision, flexibility to work remotely and to carry out duties where they are not in person contact.
It also referenced a webinar held by deputy chief medical officer Dr Ronan Glynn yesterday to address public health concerns that had been raised.
The department said: “In this context it is considered that schools could reopen for priority groups such as special needs children who are unable to engage in remote teaching, as school closures has significant impacts on children with special educational needs. While the general advice is that people stay at home, this does not apply to essential workers providing an essential service.”
It also said that guidance issued by the department to stakeholders outlined how schools could continue to support children remotely and for in-school provision.
Minister Norma Foley said: “This is the first time that unions have refused to accept the advice provided by public health specialists. We have provided guidance on how special schools can operate at 50 per cent capacity, to offer these students a return to learning, knowing that the vast majority of these students cannot engage in any way with remote learning.
“We have provided guidance and flexibility in relation to staff members who are at high risk of Covid-19, to ensure their safety. We have put in place flexibility for schools to manage this situation and return to in-person learning over the coming days, to organise and manage their staffing in this context.
The government has sought to agree an approach balancing the need to support our most vulnerable children while addressing the concerns of staff. We will now need to consider how best to proceed in the interests of children and their families. The needs of our most vulnerable young people are at stake here, and I will continue to pursue every avenue to ensure that they can be restored to the in-person learning that they need as immediately as possible.
The Minister also said that Ireland was an outlier in the EU in not having in-person provision available for students with special educational needs at this time.
Foley also said that the INTO represents teachers here and in Northern Ireland, and that “many schools in the North are currently providing in-person teaching to children with special educational needs”.
“It is regrettable that similar cannot be achieved here,” she added.
Opposition
In a statement, Sinn Féin’s education spokesperson Donnchadh Ó Laoghaire described the situation as a “profound failure of government”.
He said: “The government’s entire approach to this has been characterised by chaos, miscommunication, a failure to properly engage and most of all – a failure to plan and to prepare.
“Twice in as many weeks a mess has been made of this. It is utterly unacceptable.”
Labour’s education spokesperson Aodhán Ó Ríordáin was also critical of the government.
He said: “Despite the many missives from the Minister, the re-opening of SEN schools and classes on Thursday is now impossible. Children with special needs are regressing rapidly, and their parents are at breaking point. This is just not good enough.
“This is a mess entirely of the Department’s own making. Through mismanagement, they have damaged the partnership approach that has worked since September. While everyone’s ultimate wish is to resume in-person special education, this is only on the basis that it is safe to do so in agreement with the unions. Given the dire situation we now find ourselves in, I’m calling on the Taoiseach to intervene and rapidly rebuild the trust between groups that the Minister has forfeited.”
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Norma Foley and her department will do everything to make sure the public and parents of special needs children put the blame on unions, teachers and SNAs.
What has actually happened was total and utter chaos, incompetence, lack of thorough planning and lack of communication and discussion from the department of education. At no point did Norma Foley address the genuine concerns teachers and SNA’s had. At no point did she provide practical solutions to the logistical and operational nightmare of opening on Thursday at such short notice – and without acquiring any sort of medical grade PPE.
Everyone wants schools to open – teachers, SNAs and parents, but safely and when community transmission is significantly lower.
@Bríd: Nail on the head.
@Bríd: This is what happens when we vote in people as TD’s who couldn’t organise a piss up. The whole thing needs to change as candidates that are put forward to run.
@Bríd: I agree BRID to a point, they should never have promised it in the first place. However these classes are up to 5 in a class. A school I’m familiar were going to work at 50% capacity and most have moderate to severe disabilities. No zoom classes for them. Parents are literally on the edge here. I work with these children in a respite setting. We have been working all the way through this. No cases in staff or children. It can be done safely. Mental Heath of these parents and children is the cost here.
@Bríd: all of this should have been discussed behind closed doors without been released to the public . Bord of education should have contacted schools parents of special needs children got the feels of how many of these parents want their children to go to the schools and if the snas and teachers could work. All that has been done now is pit parents against parents, parents against teachers and snas. I was contacted by my school today asked about my son I gave them the answer why couldn’t this have been done before anything was released by the media . Instead let’s release a statement about schools without actually doing any research and see how much of an uproar we can cause as well as dealing with a pandemic
@clare mcguigan: what about some special needs schools where staff are engaging and doing online teacher has spent a week in google classroom and not one pupil logs in . parents are contacted no one answers daily calls to parents about their children but one did reply and said they couldn’t be bothered . I’ve seen it also with mainstream one of my sons class only 6 out of his class have signed up to google classroom . Teachers are working people are quick to blame them but not too quick to blame the parents
@Deirdre Meredith: do you really think that it’s possible to teach children with special needs online?
@Critical Thinker: yup I have a child with special needs and I’m doing online I’m not saying all children with special needs can be taught online and I believe some children should be in school . but as I said above nothing should have been released to the public untill all avenues were covered . If this wasn’t released to the public about opening special needs schools we wouldn’t be having this conversation
@Bríd: so how come teacher unions in the north have agreed to continue teaching special needs classes? I think shop workers should refuse to serve teachers, on the basis that drastically reducing the numbers of people allowed to shop in person would create a safer working environment for the low paid essential workers. Teachers being such a nervous bunch should be delighted to be confined to their homes 24/7
@Joan Murray: well if that’s the case teachers should refuse to teach shop workers children then . What a ridiculous statement and I am not a teacher
@Deirdre Meredith: by virtue of the fact that it is SEN schools we are talking about, the children are not of a mild learning difficulty. Parents of these children are at their wits end. A lot of the children don’t respond well to a change in routine and are regressing. If everybody had the same attitude as these teachers and sna’s, there would be no one working in hospitals, shops, gardai etc. And on your point about virtual classroom- most schools are putting up work on a daily or weekly basis. If it takes the teacher an hour to put it together and at a push 2 hours to read/ look and comment on 30 kids work, that is only 15 hours work a week on full pay.
@Joan Murray: and actually shops should be looking into allowing families into doing their shopping four and five at a go before commenting on teachers
@Deirdre Meredith: shop workers arent trotting out “health and safety” excuses in order not to go to work, despite being exposed to a wider range of ages and bigger numbers of people on a daily basis
@Deirdre Meredith: teachers are refusing to teach shop workers’ children. Ridiculous, I agree.
@Deirdre Meredith: I’m talking moderate to severe ID. There is no online teaching that can support these children. Some barely sleep at night, two or three siblings in a house with ID in some cases. Behavioural issues,high care needs. Believe me these parents would take ANY help they can get. Get SNAs out to take the child out for an hour for a walk if they won’t go to the classroom. These families are at breaking point. I see it every day.
@Joan Murray: are they well maybe some should actually engage with online learning because a few I know can’t be bothered
@clare mcguigan: fair play to you
@clare mcguigan: and I agree with you but the government had a year to put something in place but teachers are there to teach and sna are there to assist the teacher . Respite is there to give parents a break but that’s the government department not the teachers or sna
@clare mcguigan: and the government are to blame for lack of resources for these parents not teachers
@Bríd: what do you mean by medical grade PPE?? Is it the N95’s the ASTI took a vote on back in October??
@workhorse of health: I’m a teacher and to say that I’m only working 15hrs a week is an insult. I have been up till 2 o clock at night making videos etc for the kids the next day. 2 hours correcting work is an insult too. I look through every child’s work and type up individual response s to every child’s work, explanations of what they have done incorrectly and what to do better next time. I started work and interacting with students at 8:30 this morning and sent my last correction back at 10 tonight. Please do not comment on what all teachers are doing. I am doing my best for the children I teach and for the parents that have the children at home. I have a 5 and a 7 year old at home and totally understand that parents are finding it tough. So please, do not insult my working ethic.
@Deirdre Meredith: and if they had school support to rely on then they could manage. Can’t expect the hse to clean up dept of Ed mess
@Joan Murray: I’m not disrespecting the work you do I respect any workers working atm I also have two of mine working throughout this unfortunately the government have got what they want people ripping each other to shred putting out stuff in the media unfortunately every job is different but in schools they do not class positive cases as close contact they don’t inform the school I wasn’t contacted till three weeks after there was a case in my son’s class
@Deirdre Meredith: well maybe they are too tired after working all day to supervise online lessons …or maybe they can’t afford a laptop on the low wages of an essential worker who has continued to work throughout the pandemic, maybe they dont have good broadband, or maybe (in the case of some schools) the online lessons are rubbish. The funniest thing I read was that one of the demands of the (failed) negotiations was that the children of special needs educators would have to be provided with school places set aside for health workers. And yes, I know, you’re not a teacher.
@Joan Murray: funniest thing I read was that the parents were too tired after working and needed a break from their kids and needed their kids in school so what time of the day did they spend time with their kids
@clare mcguigan: well look to the hse that have all their services cut because they are outsourced doing covid testing speech therapy and all the other services that have been cut don’t hear anyone complaining about them
@Caroline Redmond: well said,, keep up the good work.
@Deirdre Meredith: I would think that a child with special needs would find the concept and use of a zoom meeting frightening snd disorienting. They are used to face to face teaching and any changes csn set them back. Its the parents that should have the last say. It’s they snd their children that are the users of the service and it should not be about the tail wagging the dog. Teachers can’t live in a risk free bubble which is what they want. Perhaps next time they go shopping they might care to reflect on the risk they are exposing themselves to of contracting covid and put it in context.
@clare mcguigan: in my special school we have 13 in a class up to 18 years of age and no
requirement to wear masks. Every special setting isn’t the same.
@Joan Murray: totally agree. My daughter works in retail and unfortunately contracted covid which we as a family of five then caught. I’m not seeking the immediate closure of all shops and that they all provide online shopping. That would be equivalent of the ridiculous stance of the teachers. I don’t suppose that Christian thinking might eventually come into this rather than the current bout of selfishness / me feinism.
@Bríd: well they all have shown that not one of these sectors care too much .. they care only for themselves. .. they are all getting fully paid and as such these educated teachers and unions could have come up with a plan.. talk about calling people who comply Sheep?? But no ! teachers have lost all my respect , that’s for sure. Some of their fears are worth dealing with , but with a will and determination they could do it! but they won’t , the teachers and their unions are like other parts of this country…. you can guarantee they will always say No.. why did they become teachers.. the only losers here are all the children and students.. come on, DO the job you are being paid for.. educate the children, give them a chance for further education and training.
@Nigel Barlow: not all children with special needs find zoom frightening my son dosent so your happy to send your child into a classroom if your child’s teacher has been exposed to the virus even if they caught in a shop because I tell you you won’t be contacted because contract tracing dosent exist in the school setting
@workhorse of health: 15 hours per week?! An hour to put the work together and two hours to look and comment on it? Will you stop. Teachers are working harder now than ever. You’re never off. We’re marking work and making recorded lessons at all hours and up in the morning for the live lessons as well.
@Finn Bar Regany: Thank you.
@Patricia O’Reilly: what sector here in this country foreen this virus blame the teachers blame the sna but before this virus children we’re losing big time only education they were getting was from teachers ask any parent before covid hit how long they were waiting on services from the hse all the while their children were been taught by teachers and snas while waiting a year or two on services from the hse but that has been forgotten
@Bríd: if the muinteoiri were on PUP they wouldn’t be long about going back to school
@Sean O Callaghan: thing is why should they need to be on pup they are teaching online same as if you were working from home
@Bríd: What about the e300 Million Gov. Put into the schools! & Education! The General Public are not at all impressed with how this has panned out! Blaming Norma Foley is ridiculous!
@Deirdre Meredith: Don’t know any child who has been subjected to a full day of schooling on line. And on line teaching doesn’t work for all children. Get back to
work and stop the posturing.
@Caroline Redmond: sorry, not buying it. If it were true, the teachers unions would be screaming for double pay.
@M: welcome to the real world ! It must be a shock to the system. The only crowd shouting and looking for special treatment , is the teachers. Every group of workers, some with essential and difficult jobs, have pulled together and got on with it.
@Joan Murray: omg i actually laughed reading your comment, incase you haven’t noticed shops have a limit on the amount of people allowed in the store at any one time. Government said you cant have more than 10 at a funeral regardless of how big church is and mass would approx 30 mins. asking people if you can work from home to do so, but u can have up to 30 children plus an sna and teacher in small classroom for 6hrs where’s the logic. And no teacher special ed or mainstream was being supplied with PPE in actual fact some sen teachers snas not able to wear masks because of nature of the needs of kids. So the staff could potentially pass on covid to the children
@Patricia O’Reilly: The likes of you just uses teachers to babysit your kids. I’m more determined than ever not to go to work Thursday. Why would any teacher want to work with any child you might have after this? Unbelievable. You would risk your own kid’s life because you can’t cope. So sad for your child.
@Deirdre Meredith: what an absolutely disgusting comment. You should be ashamed of yourself especially as you identify as someone with a child with special needs. You should be well aware of the struggles some face.
@Sean O Callaghan: actually if you read any of my comments I am not a teacher but it’s actually a waste of time talking to some people
@Sos: which comment is that
@Joan Murray: I don’t think you realise there’s a bit of a difference between shop workers contact with customers and teachers /SNA contact with SEN students. The length of time spent in contact is certainly different varying from a few mins in a shop to a 6/7 hours in school. Contact is closer in school as is the type of contact. What teachers and SNAs don’t talk about at all to their credit. There’s feeding, ensuring adequate food and fluids are taken. There’s helping children do their daily physio exercises so that they retain the use of their already compromised limbs. There’s changing nappies a few times per day and cleaning up diarrhoea, urine and sometimes vomit and wiping bottoms after visits to the bathroom.
@Joan Murray: In addition, shop workers generally don’t have to put up with physical abuse, the daily physical onslaught of biting, scratching, hitting, spitting and being screamed at. A lot of the behind the scenes work in a school is conveniently wrapped up in the bow of ‘personal care’ in particular for the SNAs. Is it any wonder that Forsa and the INTO are looking for some extra safety measures for their members in particular when this virus is so rampant in our communities.
@Joan Murray: this is just teacher bashing. For one thing you completely fail to say shop workers should refuse to serve SNAs who are at the heart of the refusal to reopen on Thursday. Then you fail to distinguish between special needs teachers and all other teachers in INTO national schools. Finally you failed to allow for second and third level teachers who aren’t even part of this discussion. No it’s just hit out at all teachers. It sounds as if you have been brainwashed to think that all teachers should put themselves at risk because you don’t care for their safety. The minister for Education has a legal duty to Keep School Safe for adults in the employment of the state but she ignores that fact. Stay at home in a pandemic. It’s not rocket science. 93 dead yesterday.
@workhorse of health: and what if you teach 200 a week like I do?
Safety is paramount. I support our teachers.
@Seán Óg: The experts have said schools are very low risk. Teachers and their unions are not immunologists or epidemiologists. What is their scientific basis for saying it’s not safe? What do they define as safe?
@Seán Óg: The experts have said it’s safe (not just in Ireland, lots of other countries have schools opened to a limited extent). So why is that going against “safety is paramount “?
@Thomas O’ Donnell: don’t you know that they taught these fine immunologists and epidemiologists……
@Thomas O’ Donnell: The experts have said that schools are safe ONLY is community transmission is low. Our infection rate was the highest in the world a few days ago so I’m betting reopening now would be a mistake.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: The experts continue to say STAY AT HOME. FAN SA BHAILE is on my TV screen right now. I wonder which of the three words they do not understand.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: The experts have said that reopening schools is safe ONLY if community transmission is low. We had the worlds highest infection rate only a few days ago so I’m guessing it would be prudent to keep them closed until our numbers come down.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: The experts have said STAY AT HOME. FAN SA BHAILE is on my TV screen right. I wonder which of the three words people do not understand.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: maybe when the hospitals are not overflowing and our numbers are lower than “ the highest infection rate in the world”
@Peter Roche: we have the highest infection rate in the world at present
@Thomas O’ Donnell: The experts say schools are safe when community transmission is low. We’re not there yet.
https://twitter.com/MobikaStewart/status/1324983806667927553?s=20
@Pat O’Looney:
@Peter Roche: I think third level education did that. Secondary education is broad and non specific and provides the skeleton on which third level education is attached.
@Pat O’Looney: why do I keep seeing people and moving cars outside? I guess stay at home is qualified with exemptions? I’d have thought teaching was an essential service and so should continue. Otherwise why not let’s be illogical and close one other essential service – the hospitals because they’re rampant with covid snd other diseases
@Nigel Barlow: less people getting buses I’d say. Bit of a nightmare in the morning when a half empty bus keeps passing by because it’s full.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: Only 23 ICU beds available across the country, close contact testing has been stopped, three new strains (that we know about) out there now, community transmission through the roof and people getting fined for travelling outside 5km without essential reasons. What expert said it was safe to reopen schools in this environment?
It needs to be recognised that no extra protection was being offered to these workers, who, along with childcare workers are more exposed than most.
@lyndon: Extra protection was offered – drastically reduced class sizes. What about the much greater danger of regression of children with special needs?
@Thomas O’ Donnell: Drastically reduced class sizes would have been a bi-product of a large number of parents deciding that they didn’t want to take the chance of sending their child back into that setting and not a measure which would be implemented by the Department.
In relation to your point on the regression of children with special needs – That is a huge regret, but the consequences of contracting Covid are potential death for family members etc. The Government had long enough to prepare a plan of action for this exact (and highly probable) situation. Extra PPE would have sorted this issue by now and the Department couldn’t guarantee that during today’s discussions.
@Thomas O’ Donnell: Truth be told, people who have no contact with special needs people do not care. People who work with special needs people should care and I’m sure majority do. People with special needs kids, brothers, sisters understand and agree with you.
@lyndon: wear a mask, wash and sanitise your hands. What more does the teachers want ? Medical grade masks? The clue is in the name. Teachers are not doctors/ nurses
@Thomas O’ Donnell: special needs children need more than just SNAs. Where are the rest of the supports that they lost at the start of the pandemic? Working from home
@lyndon: so supermarkets and groceries need to be shutdown until their staff get the vaccine … is this your point? Because this is the point of the teachers Union, jumping the queue by boycotting the government and the education of our children … If the teachers would have done their job, classrooms would be a safe environment as children and their families would have acquired the hygiene behaviour to prevent the infection by Covid. At this stage families wouldn’t have been the core of the spread during Christmas and now … flouting the hygiene guidelines
Lack of routine and education is a bigger threat to special needs children. Shame on the unions for denying these unfortunate kids. If covid outs a particular teacher at serious risk, they should get a doctor’s certificate. Otherwise help the special needa kids.
@Random_paddy: agree paddy, this group has had the most militant, competitive group of unions for years. So this was predictable. The result is terrible for the children and families affected. Lets hope enough people involved have both the humility and interest to ensure the kids are put centre stage now and that some agreement is agreed as quickly as possible.
@Kenneth Finn: these schools are open safely in Tyrone. The teachers took charge.
@Random_paddy: we’re the only country in Europe that is not providing for children with special needs.
@Random_paddy: 100% agree Paddy. These parents will break under this pressure
@Random_paddy: Teachers and their family’s have needs to,
The need to be safe
@Des Doran: but couldn’t you say the same about nurses, doctors, paramedics? Not to mention other essential services. Sometimes the risks don’t outweigh the benefits and this hurts the most vulnerable of our children.
@Des Doran: i work in disability services. I wish we had the choice of going to work or staying home on full pay. But we don’t and our families don’t.
This just show cronyism at it’s best Norma Foley got elected for the first time in the last election without even making the quota in Kerry. she then proposed Michael Martin as Taoiseach in return he gives her the position of minister for education. Never before holding a ministerial position. So now looking after the future of the children in our country is a woman with no experience in any senior government position and all she seems to be doing is sending mixed messages to children and worried parents all over Ireland.
@Brendan Murphy: Nonsense. I’m no fan of hers but 1) she was elected 2) Martin is her party leader so that’s how it works 3) Are you saying nobody should be minister without experience so if so what if SF and friends were in government, how would anyone become a minister? Nothing but a flawed populist comment
@Anto Curran: 1)she was deemed elected without reaching the quote. 2) why would she a first time TD nominate him and not a more senior member of the party. 3) if SF or friends were in power (which I hope not) they have sitting Dáil members that could fill the senior position just like FF should have used senior TD for ministerial positions and new TDs like Ms Foley for the junior position to gain experience and the skills to hold such important position at a later stage
just walking into a job like that without any experience is a PR disaster for her and you can see it in the media is this her 3rd back down since Christmas I don’t think there is two many senior TD of any party that would happen to. By the way I gave her my number 3 in Kerry so that’s what I get.
So should teachers, SNA’s etc now be re-defined as non-essential workers and moved to PUP payments or at least salary adjusted for the on line support they provide…
@Doodles: certainly SNAs should as they are not working. However teachers are working remotely since 11th Jan.
@offtheball: well my son’s sna has been in touch with my son online .
@offtheball: My daughters SNA is working, she has been in contact with her every day since 11th January and I’m sure many others are the same
@Doodles: What an amazing point!
If anybody happens to see a help sign in my garden can somebody jump out of a parachute and save me please lol…my boy is goin backwards again after the months since Sept all the hard work to now ripping worksheets up or just scribbling all over them. Bought great stars projector light yesterday for his room, he love it, until this morning wen he had a melt down after asking him to go online to his sna, so he went and broke up the light, frustrated, why, so out of routine, his little head is chaos,to hurt me like he is hurting only I can use my words better!
@Doodles: Hi doodles and the many others suggesting that teachers go on pup.
Can you confirm what ‘ U’ in pup stand for?
UNEMPLOYMENT.
I as a teacher am not unemployed so why would I go on pup?
I am on google meet (look it up!) every single day with children in my class. Live.
From 9am.
I work with them in smaller groups and they are assigned work in between their live classes which they then Upload to seesaw (look it up) and I correct it and send it back to them.
Technology is fabulous, they do their reading with their parents (who can record it on video or just audio) and also send it on to me.
I have non teaching friends who are working from since last March and nobody has asked for them to be put on PUP.
@Doodles: Salary adjusted…I started at 8am and was still correcting work and making videos at 9:30pm as are the majority of my colleagues. Cheers for the pay rise!
@offtheball: every sna has been in every single online lesson in my childs school. They are online all day for every subject, in a DEIS school. Laptop was provided to us. There is no more than 2 recorded lessons each day and the sna assists with that work too.
@TheReacher: it is fantastic to see replies from teachers, SNA’s and parents who are working and working hard but I’m not convinced it’s standard based on my personal experience.
In retrospect I should have phrased it like that. For example, 30 mins of an unorganised Zoom does not equate to a days work.
@Doodles: Dont agree that they are not essential.
We are dealing with a national health crisis, & we need our public servants to play their part. All public servants.
They cannot be allowed to go offside, & disrupt government policy.
If they withdraw service, then they are not entitled to any pay, not even pup.
Of course ,a number will have particular health concerns & can legitimately be unfit to attend, but the majority need to step up to their responsibilities to the public.
@William Kelly: No service has been withdrawn, teachers are working.
As a godfather to an autistic 4 year old who I spend a lot of time with to help my sister, I can see both sides of the argument, I lean towards opening the special schools. I would class it as essential.
I know some teachers on here say it’s education not healthcare but just through my insight they go hand in hand with these kids. They are far better when they have had the structure and routine of school.
I’ve spoken to people in same boat and there are views on both sides. Some are fearful of the virus others accept the risk as key to their child’s welfare.
No easy answer here but the parents need to be brought into the decision making with teachers and DOE to see if there is any middle ground.
The schools have to open at some point, remote working is a temporary stopgap only
@Richie: as you know, online schooling for children with special needs is impossible. Children need to be in some sort of educational environment where there are specialists in a wide range of areas. You cannot do that via a screen.
Parent of kids with additional needs here. I especially need people who aren’t parents of kids with additional needs to please listen to what I have to say.
So this month our family’s (and others like ours) desperate need for additional help and services has been used as a tool to score political points by Norma Foley and her pals. Teachers are not to blame here. They are being asked to risk their health for our children to return to education when really what our children need is consistent occupational, physio and speech therapy and access to psychology services and respite.
We have come to rely on school to make up for the failure of our health service to provide therapy and respite to our children. That’s not what school is and that’s not the job of teachers and SNAs.
If we are at breaking point because our children can’t go to school, well we need to take a moment and appreciate that teachers are filling more than just the role of educators in our children’s lives.
This is a stress test. The HSE have always failed our children. Disability services have never been good enough. Respite has never been good enough.
Please don’t let them shift blame to the teachers. We’ve been fighting for services in court for years. This isn’t a new problem.
Wonder what teachers would say if they went to the shop and it was closed because the workers didn’t feel safe. Absolute joke
@David O’Rourke: shops by in large are closed. Supermarkets are a totally different environment to a school, which has circa 32 students, without masks, in a small room for 6 hours a day. Can’t compare school environment with any other environment that is currently open. It’s lazy to do so.
@Jonathan Regan: we’re talking about special needs classrooms which have 5 or 6 children. Day care centres for adults are open without any issues
@Critical Thinker: When you say Day Care for adults I assume you mean adult ID services? In any case they have all been significantly reduced in both operating days for the users and onsite capacity. But still they operate, why can’t schools follow the same protocol is beyond a joke.
@Coady Connor: my partner works in a day centre and also a care facility for people with ID. The day centre has reduced but not as much as one would think. They care facility currently has staff out with Covid, leaving the remaining staff work 9 days straight on 12 hour shifts. No extra pay or holidays….. Imagine if they went on strike and hid behind the unions. I agree with schools being shut but the special schools and facilities should be back up and running.
@CMT: I’m a teacher. I agree. But no one asked me. There are other problems though. They didn’t address issues around SNAs who can’t socially distance or medically vulnerable or pregnant staff. If staff decide to take sick leave or unpaid leave rather than go to work then that class simply can’t open. There are NO subs. They also didn’t address the problem of parents not sending their kids in. I rang parents on Monday to tell them the school would be opening. Most were not going to send their child in. Some because they were isolating, some were too scared, some felt it would be a stigma. For the school to ensure those children would still be supported with remote teaching would actually mean going against the government’s all or nothing directives to the school. I’ve no idea what the Unions actually want but I’d like schools to be allowed to sort these issues out themselves. But again.. no one is asking us.
@Lorraine Mac Rory: And you as a teacher took the initiative and rang the parents. Blind leading the blind you might say. IMO it’s just not feasible to open schools as they wanted to, but the consequences for special needs pupils are far to great to just accept that. Was / is there any outside the box solutions suggested or is that even on the table?
@Coady Connor: I certainly didn’t “take the initiative”. Teachers do as they are told and my employer instructed schools to open, senior management decided how this would work and then instructed teachers to make the necessary calls. Only then did we discover that Fórsa hadn’t agreed yet to the opening. Why the department instructed schools to open before agreement was reached I don’t know but it’s the second time they’ve done it.
Schools could individually work out how to open safely. The logistics would be difficult and there isn’t a one size fits all solution. That’s the biggest issue – schools wouldn’t all be able to do it the same way. For example, while one school might be able to open without requiring a medically vulnerable teacher or SNA to give face to face classes another school might not. One school might be able to accommodate all SEN kids another might not.
Then of course staff and parents would complain about being treated differently. There are already solicitors being consulted by both sides.
With an all or nothing approach we simply haven’t enough substitute teachers for “all” so here we are again with nothing.
Does this mean it’s the union there made the decision to keep the schools closed for special needs pupils?
@Kim Steen Hansen: That’s what Norma Foley wants you to believe. She’s trying to divide and conquer while trying to cover up her own incompetence.
@Denis Moynihan: I do not disagree with you, it still looks like the unions are utilise their power to get what they want, and it’s not the first time. The government could do so much better.
@Denis Moynihan: but isn’t that exactly what’s happened? The unions said no.
Meanwhile the list of ‘essential’ services is as long as your arm……but special needs education for kids that need it most is not on it! Unions and their teachers should be ashamed.
@Brendan: ashamed of what exactly? Boxing their concerns through their union? Which they pay an annual fee for? Which was ultimately established to voice the concerns of their membership?
@Brendan: I’m laughing that you are naive enough to think teachers have had any say in the opening of schools since March. Blame the incompetent department, blame the unions but surely you can’t think this is the fault of teachers??
@Karen Murphy: you voted for it
@Karen Murphy: you voted for it
@Karen Murphy: you voted for it
@Karen Murphy: you voted for it
@Brendan: Why should a teacher feel ashamed of feeling vulnerable and not wanting to expose their family? Why should they be ashamed of not having protection against infection?
@Karen Murphy: the teachers are too busy planning strategic pregnancies so they can have more time off
@Brendan: To be fair its not the teachers fault, if the governent wasnt so spineless this wouldnt be the shambles it is.
It wouldn’t surprise me if the unions started pushing for increases in teacher salaries.
@Jimmy Bennett: they are pushing for pay equality and have been since 2011.
@Jonathan Regan: that’s the same pay equality that the older teachers voted against in 2011… Teachers after 2011 were shafted by their colleagues and union.
@Jimmy Bennett: Just wait until Easter when their annual get togethers come around. They will be looking for extra money for “working” from home where they are not monitored for things like heating, electricity, wear and tear of tables, extra house insurance, house rent on the time spent at home allegedly “working” to give but a few ideas.
@Jim Connolly: level 6 will be ongoing at Easter. So there’ll only be virtual get together
@Jim Connolly: I think that’s already claimable as a small tax credit.
Time line
-Children are asymptomatic superspreaders
-Schools close (along with most business)
-Children are NOT spreaders at all. Schools are safe. Schools reopen.
-Schools are safe x 50
-Pubs close, ‘non essential’ shops close, schools stay open as they are safe
-Schools close
-Immediate calls for special needs schools to open
-Confirmation that these schools will open
-Immediate retort that they will NOT OPEN.
This is an unqualified disaster from every single angle.
@Jim Lingk: Least we forget to complete scandal with the Exam Calculations. The minister for education appears out of her depth with a lot.
@Alan Wright: Yes, I did forget that. Another nonsense. And they are still in the dark about this year’s exams too.
How is a school a safer environment than Leinster House ?
@Marg FitzGerald: In Leinster House, you can get infected in your sleep.
Norma should hold her head in shame! She is ineffective and has done zero planning since last summer for any education setting. Shame on her
Bertie Ahern has a lot to answer for, ever since he brought in benchmarking, public sector unions in this country have taken successive governments for the proverbial ride. If teachers or any other public sector workers are not prepared to work, put them on the PUP and they might just change their minds!!
Another predictable U turn from Norma. Next one will be all other schools not going back on Feb 1st followed closely by a u turn on holding an “established” leaving cert. It’s time for this minister to step down and let someone competent take charge of the situation.
This is devastating news for families of our children with Disabilities. They can open in Northern Ireland so why not here
@Eamonn Tierney: We had the highest infection rates in Europe only a few days ago, that’s why.
The won’t be too fearful to take their full salaries though, even though people working in shops and the hospitality sector have to survive on the pandemic payment.
@Michael MC Evoy: Well, you should have all become teachers then. You should have paid out the 50,000 I paid to get through college and buy resources. Begrugery has always been a habit of some people in this country. If teachers didn’t have good unions, we would be walked all over by the haters. Absolutely disgusting comments here by some. I’ve been upset all day because of this whole debacle. And, it’s not the teachers at fault.
Teachers need to remain in their bunkers, we will call ye when it’s over…
@Jim73: You need to stay in your box!!!!
Who’s running the country, the unions or the government, the government should start taking charge
@Louise Fitzpatrick:
If the Unions told the Government to jump, The Government would say how high.
But creches and after schools are totally grand to open
If i refuse to work, I don’t get paid
The voice of the parent and child have been completely ignored. Apparently teachers are now qualified public health officials and know better than each child’s mother. If as a parent, we decide our child’s classroom environment is safe and vital for their development then why are we not allowed to make this judgement? This is nothing more than an attempt for ransom by teachers. Disgusting
@Clare Rose: good woman
@Clare Rose: good woman
@Clare Rose: good woman
@Sandra: misinformed women
@Clare Rose: I’m so glad most of the parents I deal with are not like you. Your attitude towards teachers is disgusting, and yet you have no problems letting your children be taught by teachers.
@Clare Rose: Teachers are not your slaves. You are unqualified to make any judgements.
@Clare Rose: I’m glad I don’t teach your children.
@Jo Hay: I was not aware that going to work to do the job you are being paid to do meant you were a slave.
All public sector workers not actively working should automatically go on PUP. Solidarity with the rest of the workers who pay their wages. Might focus their kinds on doing their jobs. Wear a mask, wash your hands and do your bloody job
@Christopher Byrne: I’m a teacher and actively working at the moment. I pay for your wages too, at a higher rate of tax.
If the teachers got more money then they would go to work. Their unions are in control of education. The govt. Is spineless. A politician of the calibre of Ronald Reagan who stood up to the air traffic controllers would sort them out.
How can it be safe to open schools, just listen to the news about hospital numbers, message stay at home and give them a chance to battle this. Norma wants you to blame the unions as she hasn’t a clue what’s she’s at. We had kids in school during the last lockdown reporting home about absent classmates, but these numbers where reported as community transmission, even the principal of the schools weren’t informed. One person who,s friend reported positive , travelled in the same car to school was not even contacted and decided themselves to self isolate. So don’t believe the school numbers, they are a lot higher.
@martin: Exactly the same situation in my daughters school. A girl she sat beside informed her of a positive test result days later. There were 3 other kids in her year that received a positive result in Christmas week. The school said nothing other then to say they
hadn’t heard back from the Dept of Education or the HSE. No other kids or staff were considered to be a close contact so no action was taken. How can the government be confident of low cases in schools when they don’t know about or bother to take preventative action with confirmed cases ? If you believe schools are safe, you are being conned by Norma. They aren’t safe as you could expect in the middle of a raging pandemic.
Just announced they will not be opening!
How is that day centre’s for special need adults are open at the moment but there is nothing for children? Shouldn’t this work be classified as essential care? A disgrace that we are the only country in Europe that doesn’t recognize this. Ireland neglects it’s children again. Class sizes of these children are small and surely a compromise could be found. A sad day.
@Lucy Legacy: I think you’re actually making the unions point for them. If it’s an essential service it shouldn’t be 11th on the list for a vaccine after prisoners and meat factory workers!
Unions,Teachers and Staff could have done this safely if the desire was there.. it wasn’t it really is that simple
@Sandra: schools I know were ready. No one asked us.
We can all look at somewhere else to find something to support our side of the debate! So why can a child in Northern Ireland know the future of their leaving cert exam and a child in the republic still not know! Transmission rates are high! It’s common sense to protect people as much as possible given that we had so many deaths today!
@Dino Manning: those deaths are for the month to date
@Sandra: wrong there have been over 400 deaths so far this month
@Sandra: wrong, over 400 deaths so far this month
Put them all on the pup!!!
Right move its to dangerous
And for those teacher bashers , teaching is online so if a person is putting in 8 hour shifts working each day why do some people think they should be on pup. This is fact . So please point your anger at NORMA she’s the cute one here…
Love the way RTE play this , bringing out a sample of families each time saying the same message , bad bad teachers , never a shot of inside a classroom , the PPE cutbacks, poor ventilation, poor contact tracing. Never a good news story about what teachers are doing online to help kids. They did this this evening and the next story was from an ICU doctor pleading to everybody to stay home. We should call it Norma news because they are really supporting her devisive message.
A government run, elitist media group. RTE has really failed people working in Education. And this country is supposed to be a democracy???????????
The Government really needs to stand up to these elitist group of workers
@Sandra: I’m really tired of your uneducated comments.
Unions,Teachers and Staff could have done this safely if the desire was there.. it wasn’t it really is that simple
Put them on the pup, they’ll soon turn for work
Another Foley Up
Having read most of these comments and I work in this area it is utter national disgrace, it was a no brainer with the speed the virus took that all schools remain closed,
I have seen comments of many parents with special needs kids who wanted a return to school Thursday. routine is hugely important to every child but even more so 2 ones with special needs. is it the right call? probably is with case numbers. its an improbable balancing act though.
Like most of my colleagues I was ready to get back to working in person. I’d rather be in a classroom than online. I’d even phoned parents to tell them we’d be ready to welcome their kids back on Thursday. What wasn’t clear was whether we’d have any kids. A quarter are isolating due to being close contacts. Some parents are too afraid to send their kids and some don’t want their child stigmatised by being sent to school with the “special needs” cohort the government has been on about.
And of course the government (without agreement from all the unions) had announced every SET teacher would be 5 days a week fulltime face to face teaching – leaving no one to remote teach the children who don’t come in.
There have been no accommodations for SNAs who deal with bodily fluids or medically vulnerable or pregnant teachers/SNAs. Schools could figure this out – meeting diverse needs is what we do. But ironically NO-ONE is asking schools how it could work. I’m so fed up with this flip flopping and premature announcements. I can only imagine the frustration of parents being repeatedly told their kids are going back to school then having it taken away again. I know it’s driving me nuts. Ridiculous shambles.
@Lorraine Mac Rory: you know best comment I’ve seen
Unions,Teachers and Staff could have done this safely if the desire was there.. it wasn’t it really is that simple
@Sandra: low professional standards I would say
@Sandra: The government reduces the PPE budget for schools by 40% at the height of a pandemic while the country is seeing record numbers of deaths and community transmissiin that’s off the charts..and you’re blaming Unions, teachers and staff?
@Maria Quinn: Low intelligence, I would say.
@Maria Quinn: Thick as a brick, I would say.
So I guess close the creches fully then? Childcare workers have even less protection and yet remain open. Many kids of non-essential workers attending too to keep the fees coming (understandable without gov support). It’s either safe to open or not.
Absolutely Horrific decision public health is about the population as a whole-
“Safe” needs to be defined – children are paramount they are life
The Government really needs to stand up to these elitist group of workers
Union boycotting the government to jump the queue of the vaccination campaign.
If they have done their job, the wild spread over Christmas in families wouldn’t have happened so maybe we should put to teach our children the floor workforce of our supermarkets and groceries shops … in less time in unprecedented scary circumstances developed themselves professionally and most of them do not have any master or PhDs and so on ….
@Maria Quinn: unintelligent is all I can say.
@Maria Quinn: What the hell are you trying to say?
The government and general public seems to have a very narrow view of “special learning and development needs that requires accommodations” … hidden ones … in strict privacy … some are temporary because of a life-event such as the mum of the student being in palliative care, any mum affected by smear texts scandal, for instance …. other cases are victims of a crime or traumatic event such as car crash … the learning and development needs of this children cannot be met in their homes by their parents/ carers … time is essential … it’s unfair these kids falling behind their potential
The Government really needs to stand up to these elitist group of workers
Amazes me before covid parents had no problems with schools the big problem was was the access to early intervention school age teams mental health facilities and a whole lot of other services but at the end of the day their children where in school come covid same problem exists but schools have to close but it’s the teachers to blame when the services where never there in the first place
Shambles
Selfish, precious unions and a department who was prepared to call their bluff with people’s care for their children. This is a mess and all involved groups should be ashamed of themselves
I’m preparing work here for students. Just looked online a few times to see how people were reacting to schools not reopening. Most people are sensible and realise it’s too dangerous for school staff and kids to go back. The thing that has struck me and really saddens me is the level of derision aimed at teachers. Plus, a creepy old man stalked me on this. I’m glad we are not going back on Thursday, it’s too soon. And I make no apologies for it. Further, I won’t be commenting here again as our voices have been heard and my job in supporting people working in schools is done.
@Jo Hay: special education needs to reopen, its an esential service. My partner is an sna and she wants to go back to work now. These facilities for special needs are so important for kids and their parents it cannot be stresssed enough.
I myself have worked through the whole pandemic in the med device sector. Our area is orthopaedics, which you would think is not essential considering there is sweet f.a surgeries happening…but yet we are at work. We dont have a union to protect us we just get on with it. We have had several cases at work but we have kept going.
@Paddy Kavanagh: Well, tough Paddy. We’re not going back Thursday. Bye now. Nah, nah, nah, nah, nah.
@Paddy Kavanagh: Your partner can go back, and betray all the other workers there. Anyway, I’m done. Sick of the sociopaths here.
Parent of kids with additional needs here
So this month our family’s (and others like ours) desperate need for additional help and services has been used as a tool to score political points by Norma Foley and her pals. Teachers are not to blame here. They are being asked to risk their health for our children to return to education when really what our children need is consistent occupational, physio and speech therapy and access to psychology services and respite.
We have come to rely on school to make up for the failure of our health service to provide therapy and respite to our children. That’s not what school is and that’s not the job of teachers and SNAs.
If we are at breaking point because our children can’t go to school, well we need to take a moment and appreciate that teachers are filling more than just the role of educators in our children’s lives.
This is a stress test. The HSE have always failed our children. Disability services have never been good enough. Respite has never been good enough.
Please don’t let them shift blame to the teachers. We’ve been fighting for services in court for years. This isn’t a new problem.
@Ann-Marie Uí Éafa: so agree but pepe do not care teachers are easy to blame because they can access them but hse government no not as easy
I am surprised at heading of Article. Should it not read “Unions turndown return to schools for Special Needs”
Nobody wants to critise Uniins stance in Media.!
@anne: Huh?????
@Leonard Barry: I’ve reported you for stalking.
@Leonard Barry: Creep
The Government really needs to stand up to these elitist group of workers
@Sandra: Jesus Sandra we get it. We heard you the 50th time. One intelligent post would be a lot more effective in getting your “point” across then splurging your one line mantra all over the page, ad nauseam.
The Government really needs to stand up to these elitist group of workers
@Sandra: You need to stand down. We are not returning on Thursday. End Of!!!!!
What a Foley Up, that’s great..
Opening schools now while the virus is rampant is tantamount to abuse!
Parent of kids with additional needs here
@Ann-Marie Uí Éafa: And? So am I. Do you want a prize for that or something. You’re not the only one with a special needs child.
@Ann-Marie Uí Éafa: Thanks Anne – Marie for your support. The comments about teachers are really derogatory and upsetting here. Thank you so much.
Thank You Anne – Marie.
Parent of kids with additional needs here
Parent of kids with additional needs here
@Ann-Marie Uí Éafa: I misinterpreted what you said earlier. I didn’t read all your posts. I thought you were against teachers. The whole thing is very upsetting. I’m exhausted from meetings, trying to plan and organise online learning and trying to cope with my own special needs son myself. Some of the people here were just awful in their attitudes towards teachers. I will never again post here because sociopaths on here too. Thanks for all your support though. Hopefully, this mess will be all over soon. Everyone is worn!!!!
Offer teachers the vaccine asap. Then they can be back in work by end of Feb after midterm
Why can Special Schools open up the North and not here its not fair on the kids and their familys Unions and Government have a lot to answer
have your say