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CONTROVERSIAL comments made by an Irish-educated doctor have led to several Australian doctors sharing their experiences of workplace sexual harassment.
Dr Gabrielle McMullin, who was educated at Trinity College, said sexual harassment in Australian hospitals is so rife that female trainees should not to complain, rather go along with it.
During the interview with ABC, McMullin said one neurosurgeon’s career was destroyed after she complained about sexual harassment by a superior.
“Her career was ruined by this one guy asking for sex on this night. And, realistically, she would have been much better to have given him a blow job on that night,” she said.
Her comments were largely criticised, with the President of the Royal Australasian College of Surgeons describing them as “appalling”.
If nothing else, the remarks have got people talking the subject.
More than a dozen female doctors have contacted Fairfax Media since McMullin’s interview. The Sydney Morning Herald said the women backed up her assertion that sexual harassment is common in their field, as is a culture of silence.
‘Dumb b*tch’
One female surgeon said the problem was particularly bad in surgery because it remains a male-dominated profession.
She said women are advised to “keep quiet about sexual harassment, assault and rape … because there is a long history of such reports being dealt with poorly”.
Another female doctor told the Herald she was subjected to misogynistic insults and explicit sexual harassment while training.
She said surgeons routinely told her she was a “dumb bitch”, and that women were “f***ing useless” and men should be hired instead.
On one occasion, she alleges a consultant surgeon told her to “get some knee pads and learn to suck c**k”, while other colleagues laughed.
She also said she was ostracised after rebuking sexual advances from a senior male colleague.
They think they own you, a lot of these guys. As soon as you stand up, you cop a lot.
Another surgeon claims she was regularly subjected to commentary about her appearance, including how tight her skirt was and whether she had slept her way through the training program.
Dr Saxon Smith, president of the Australian Medical Association in New South Wales, told Radio Australia sexual harassment is not tolerated and that women should speak out.
“For your personal health and welfare but also to ensure that you are able to look after those around you as well because you shouldn’t allow this thing to continue,” he said.
What do you think of McMullin’s comments?
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A sexist or racist Australian, surely not. I refuse to belive it. Oh wait, I lived there for three years. It’s commonly accepted is pretty much every sector in oz. We are 20 years ahead of them on that front and I’m afraid to say I’m not joking one little but
and there’s no sexism in holy catholic Ireland is there ?
I don’t think anyone said that now. Just that Irish society is less sexist and casually racist than Australian society which I’d be inclined to agree with.
Sexism and racism are on identical levels in Australia and Ireland. The only difference is that with Aussie culture they are loud and brash so it’s up front and in your face and uncomfortable, whereas with Irish culture Irish people will rarely express what they really think, so it’s covert and dangerous.
Direct quote from Dr McMullin on the Australian doctor website
“When I was an intern in Ireland I sat in an operating theatre surrounded by men discussing how impossible it would have been for a woman to become a surgeon. It was like I didn’t exist.”
You can get off that high horse now.
Another big reason for not living in oz
A big reason to train as a consultant though!!
You reckon this doesbt happen in Ireland
Maggie id wager it happens a LOT less in ireland than Australia. Probably a Catholic thing or whatever, but i cant imagine many irish men would have the b*alls to demand this of an Irish woman. Everyone knows someone who knows someone in this country.
Fred you’ve managed to reach a definitive conclusion in the absence of any facts or information. How did you do that ?
Boganity – do you understand the concept of a wager? It implies a probability. Were someone to collect the required data, my wager could then be tested. In the mean time, look at the thumbs up on my comment. Anecdotal evidence. People know im right.
Point taken on betting and I’ll take your bet as I’m guaranteed to win it. With regard to the thumbs up there’s two elements at play there. Firstly your statement is a positive reinforcement of what people believe already. Nobody wants to believe bad things happen in there backyard, look at reaction the comments got in Australia for the same reason. Secondly most people have no concept of the old boys club the surgical fraternity is. It’s a male oriented closed shop operating on rules and procedures that haven’t changed for 200 years so most people have no capability for absorbing that it’s universal issue. Just as they had no capability of absorbing how widespread child sexual abuse was in Ireland, which allowed it to continue unchallenged for decades.
Remind me,
Symphisiotomy… Our Lady of Lourdes, Neary, Portlaoise… When something is wrong with the medical profession, how long does it take to correct it?
Prof. McMullin has done all of us a great service by whistleblowing a side of medical practice that should be eradicated.
Stage 1, as usual, is the denial.
In the 25-34 age group females make up 57.2% of the workforce
In 2012, 299 new specialists (43.3%) were female
The proportion of female doctors was 50% or higher in 16 of the 46 specialties that had new entrants in 2012.
37% of Consultant Surgeons under 45 are female. (in 2012 – probably higher now)
Ireland isn’t Australia.
Very quick with information to deflect from the real issue David -
Well its difficult to say that surgery or medicine is a mysogynist profession if 40%+ of the consultants are female.
That depends on which hospitals and disciplines they’re working in David, Prof, McMullin specifically referred to that.
I quoted the figure for general surgery – it’s probably amount the lowest. The figures for paediatrics, microbiology would be up at 70-100%.
While I wholeheartedly agree with you that this side of medical practice should be eradicated. I don’t believe the comments made by Dr McMullin can be deemed: ‘whistleblowing’. Urging female doctors to succumb to sexual advances as not to disrupt the status quo or endanger their jobs is a major step backwards.
I’m pretty sure she’s taking an “ends justifies the means” approach. By coming out with these comments she’s making people pay attention and think “are things that bad that such extreme comments are necessary?”. Fair play to her for taking a personal, and probably professional, hit for the sake of bringing much needed attention to this issue.
Whatever about the situation in highly paid positions such as doctors, this problem is rife in low-paid jobs and developing countries. Every woman that this happens to is equally a cause for concern, be she a consultant doctor or a coffee bean picker or a receptionist or a truck driver.
It’s sad that in this day and age that I had to vote saying she made a fair point.
In many professions where men have power and authority, women are seen as intruders and need to be put back in “their place”. It’s sad that women are seen to have no more to offer than what’s between their legs.
its worth noting that there are women who worked in these male dominated work places, who have most probably been subjected to this harrassment, who have subsequently turned the same treatment on innocent male subordinates at a later time.
PS. i’ve seen it, here in ireland, first hand, in the last few years…
There’s just certain places for men and certain places for wemen, if they are in each others roads and causing problems to each other then it’s better to seperate them. You don’t see wemen on building sites, why? Because they’d only be in the road and holding people back. You don’t see men in nail salons, why? Because it’s a wemens environment.
Not sure if serious or a brilliant troll…..
Have you a mangina?
Not sure whether you should go back to Antrim or Kurdistan.
Men can give a great manicure. Don’t let anyone tell you otherwise.
Welcome to the 21st Century Antrim Kurdistan. It must be pretty bleak in the middle ages.
Aww don’t get me wrong here now, there’s plenty of wemen work with me, some of them very decent workers. I’m just saying there’s things suited for certain people.
It is disgusting, and obviously those men need putting in their place ie job queue.
Men and wemen work in perfect harmony only in the bedroom, it’s the only profession they share equally lol
Learn to spell
I think her comments were taken out of context and blown out of the water..
She was using a powerful argument style called “A Modest Proposal” which is a satirical argument “in favour” of what you’re actually arguing against. It went over a lot of people’s heads, particularly in the media: http://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/A_Modest_Proposal
I wonder is this kind of thing going on in Ireland? maybe we should shine a big bright light on it and find out? I’ve heard stories of simular treatment here, with victime being to not to make a complaint, because complaints can be made “go away”… who knows?
In my work I have had dealings with many consultants and I’m sorry to say the majority are ‘up their own xxx obnoxious arrogant self opinionated xxxx hxxxs.
They frequently refer to each other as experts despite the fact that they probably only know 10% of what there is to know in their field.
I say most but not all.
I’m with this lady.
I’ve worked with a lot of them also. The arrogant pigs usually stand me in the corner and point at my body parts in front of other doctors and students. Its demeaning!!!!
This should be taken further. Sexual harassment is illegal.
No woman should take that sht. In these jobs, you need to band together and shout out load about these fkers. Of course another problem is women stabbing other women in the back when this happens and not supporting other women, it’s slave mentality, where one slave uses the misfortune of another to take advantage increase their own position and tries to gain more favour from the abusive master.
but why should support against such behavior be divided on gender lines?
Run along now, Little Eire. The grownups are talking.
Well said.
When my friend was an intern and hoping to move into surgical training she was invited up to “assist” one day in theatre. Something interns can hope for on rare occasions the wards aren’t too busy. She was delighted to get the call, raced off to theatre, changed into scrubs, scrubbed in and was ready to assist…..only to be laughed at by all the men who proceeded to give her their tea/coffee order to get from the canteen. Of course she did, after getting changed again. Definitely wouldn’t have happened to a guy. This was in a Dublin teaching hospital.
When was that? Sounds like a load of horsecrap. Surgeons can be w@nkers, but i’ve never heard of anyone making tea or coffee for anyone in theatre.
David not horse shit. It was in 2004 in a teaching hospital affiliated with Trinity. She didn’t have to make tea, just take the money and go down to the canteen and bring the regs and consultants back coffees and a bun. True story, I was there that day, not in theatre but on the wards.
Her “advice” that young trainees should go along with it is an absolute disgrace. She seems to be advocating that these women should literally prostitute themselves in order to further their career. Typically clinical approach from a doctor, but very dangerous advice to be giving impressionable young women. Better advice would be to say no and threaten to speak out to HR, the police, the board, the wife etc. That will make the perpetrator think twice. Unbelievabe. Next she’ll be saying women should be asking for money generally for sex if they’re strapped for cash.
Yea she’s making a joke of the subject she’s encouraging sexual harrassment of women in the work place.
No one is going to take it seriously if she makes a joke about it.
Just because a proffession is male dominated, doesn’t mean they are all misogynistic pigs, these women are clearly educated and should promptly report these case of sexual harassment with the work place.
Perhaps Sean but you know the way industries work. One may soon find life becoming very difficult.
Look at the 2 Garda whistle blowers here and how the system turned against them until they were finally exonerated.
Good to see this story given attention here, but seriously is that the best headline you could come up with? Not really classy journalism in action there..
On the other hand, its probably what drew me to read the article.
A Headline is meant to grab your attention …
This happens everywhere, every country, every profession…some people with so called ‘power’ take it to the limit…however her remarks are disgusting…I remember my first job, back in the early 80′s, administration…the big boys used to try to get us to make their tea….I said I’m not the tea maker, perhaps you could make your own…they stopped, I don’t have a problem making tea for anyone, it was the assumption that because I was female that was my role, made me mad!
Cup of tea so please Joan.
White with 2.
Any chance of a cuppa now Joan love , I’m parched with the drought .
With friends like Dr. McMullin women don’t need enemies
are you sure she didn’t phrase her statement in a way that didn’t leave her open to legal action? i’m sure she is a smart lady… lets wait and see gow this shakes out before judging her i say….
Are we really expected to believe that the situation in the medical profession in Australia is as vulgar as the picture painted in this article?
Maybe some female doctors and nurses who have worked in Australia might chip in because I doubt you’d get that behaviour in Saud Arabia.
Probably because a woman wouldn’t be allowed to hold a professional qualification in Saudi Arabia. Plus if a woman complained about sexual harassment from someone prominent in Saudi Arabia, she might find herself in chop chop square.
in Saud Arabia, where teenagers are raped, the victim usually gets 100 lashes for adultery, and victims have been known to be forced to marry their attacker.
Not being believed is a huge problem. It discourages women from male dominated careers.
Thanks for the info guys but I clearly knew that already so you kind of wasted your time commenting
Luke, it’s a lack of belief adding to and continuing the problem methinks, no mention of other ozzie medics refuting the claim.
well you didn’t sound like you did luke… nevermind.. feel free not to waste any more of your time either …
Really Luke ? Then why use that country as an example then ?
Only know a nurse lit, and doctors have always been cheeky to nurses, but know they can only flirt for they always need the nurse to stop there full time as they do not.
Not tryin be awful but lot.doctors in oz have Muslim.background
? What crap. There’s more doctors from cork working over there than muslim.
The problem in australia is that surgeons come from expensive private boys schools in sydney or melbourne – and as such are more prone to be arrogant mysogynists
You work in a hospital in Australia David ?
I can’t help but wonder what the reaction would be if this advice was given by a man instead…..?
It wasn’t advise, men took her literally and missed her point, whilst women didn’t and understood clearly what she meant.
Screaming fir public hanging or some such….. Get rid of them.
The Aussie are well know and in some places admired for their chat up lines “get yourself some knee pads” brilliant
Can Pay — Won’t pay. Whoops,sorry, wrong thread.
Ahhh Doctors, they don the white coat and become someone else.
Too much power and authority over the little people.
Send them off to train in Cuba where Doctors are as common as taxi drivers and see how they get on.
Did she follow her own advice ?
Either she is Jonathan Swift or one nasty piece of work.. A clue is…it wasn’t funny….
So did she use her knee pads often
The behaviour of many doctors, both male and female, has largely been deplorable for ever and a day.
Give them 35 grand a year and see how long they hang around, many are not in any way fit to do the job, which
requires them to “care” for others!! And yes, unfortunately , I have direct experience of this “care”.
I’m sure a doctor who spends 11 years training to make 35k a year will really be keen to give you the best possible “care” available….
Didn’t think that one through did you?
Surgeons have a reputation among doctors for being unpleasant, but this takes the mickey. It’s shameful that things like she describes still go on and I’ve heard some awful stories. The irony is, though, the women that do crash through that glass ceiling are on top of their game and end up heads of department and are a force to be reckoned with.
Men who are so insecure they can’t cope with a woman having the same job as them can end up opening up a whole lot of trouble for themselves.
She could be the minister for health,neither of them object to sucking to get ahead
Sure the night wouldn’t be complete without a dirty little schoolboy comment.
Surgeons and their sharp remarks ha ha
Doctor Kneelgood?
As well as being ompletely ignorant she’s completely making a joke out of the subject. If she’s a spokeswoman for sexually harrassed women and she’s telling everyone to treat it as a joke then everyone’s going to treat it as a joke.
Sounds like she is exaggerating quiet a lot.
have your say