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THE SOCIAL DEMOCRATS has rejected Labour’s proposal to jointly enter government formation negotiations on a common, centre-left platform, while a newly formed group of independent TDs say they are “willing to engage” in talks if they are guaranteed a place in the new government.
Labour leader Ivana Bacik told reporters that the Social Democrats informed her party that it intends to continue “to engage on a stand-alone basis with all parties” after a meeting at Leinster House in Dublin this morning.
Deputy Social Democrats leader Cian O’Callaghan, in a written statement after the meeting, said that his party has “always been clear that we want to go into government”.
He did not detail that they informed Labour that they intend to continue as a single party but said the Social Democrats will continue to negotiate with Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil next week to discuss their red-line issues.
Both leaders said it was a largely positive meeting.
Bacik said she would continue to advocate for a common platform between both parties, but that Labour will now need to convene internally to discuss the group’s next move. She added that there “will be opportunities for collaboration” with the Social Democrats.
Independent group looks for seat at the table
A group of eight independent TDs have said they are open to engaging with parties in government formation talks “on the basis that [they] would be part of Government”.
The newly formed ‘Regional Group’ was created earlier this week and includes a couple of TDs who previously were in government in the 2016-2020 term.
The members of the Regional Group are Sean Canney, Marian Harkin, Barry Heneghan, Noel Grealish, Michael Lowry, Kevin (‘Boxer’) Moran, Verona Murphy and Gillian Toole.
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In a statement this afternoon, the TDs said: “The Regional Group is willing to engage if and when we get an invitation. In the event of an invitation the group will meet to discuss strategy and appoint our negotiators. We would enter talks on the basis that we would be part of Government.”
The group said that it would be “desirable that Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael first have agreement on the rotating Taoiseach”.
“Policy and the Programme for Government would have to reflect our concerns and initiatives,” they said.
Galway East TD Sean Canney and Longford–Westmeath TD Kevin ‘Boxer’ Moran, two of the members of the Regional Group, were previously part of the 2016 Fine Gael-led government as part of a group of six independents known as the Alliance group.
Asked recently about his priorities if he was involved in government formation talks, Canney said there are regional infrastructure issues that need to be tackled, such as railway lines in the west of the country and traffic congestion in Galway, but also insisted independents don’t just focus on “parish pump politics” and that his “biggest issue” would be about accelerating housing construction.
Labour and Social Democrats
Labour’s proposal, outlined by Bacik on the very first day of the election campaign, was to unite the Social Democrats and the Green Party after all the ballots had been counted in order to enter formation discussion unitarily.
Labour’s proposal, as of today, has not been accepted.
Asked if Labour are wasting time it could spend on engaging with the larger parties, Bacik said she made a “very clear commitment” to her voters to engage with the Social Democrats and believes it was the right thing to do.
“Our ambition in the Labour party is to grow the centre left to a point where we can deliver the change the communities need,” she said, adding that anyone who is “serious about delivering change must, at least, consider the concept of a common platform”.
O’Gorman and Bacik today said that they believe climate policies would be significantly rowed back with independent TDs in government.
Leaders Micheál Martin and Simon Harris are pausing their government formation talks today as they both have official duties in Edinburgh.
Taoiseach Harris and Tánaiste Martin are in Scotland to meet with the British-Irish Council.
Both leaders have said some short, informal discussions will likely take place – but admitted that both of them will be short for time.
“It’s a very busy night, tonight and tomorrow, so opportunities will be limited enough, obviously there are informal opportunities for us to touch base,” Martin said last night.
Harris told reporters last night that Fine Gael have “sounded out” a number of independent TDs over this week and will meet with political party leaders next week to discuss further.
“I take nothing for granted, and until agreements have been reached and completed, nobody can take anything for granted,” he said.
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@Trump24: ah yes the numbers of emigrants rose again recently, before the election. The homeless figures rose every single month for Nye on what, 4 years ?! God bless us everyone
@John arse: Have you noticed that Alan Kelly is missing from Labour group speaking to media. His need for the “power drug” is overwhelming He was speaking to RTE about a Labour coalition before final results were in . We haven’t forgotten the Water Charges saga, Alan, and, “We will make you pay”.
@MN: Agreed, People Before Profit are the only true left-wing party in the State. Labour & Soc. Dems. are for yuppies who think it’s radical to vote for centrist parties. Labour proved they were nothing more than neo-liberal shills last time they were in govt. with Fine Gael.
@Jacintha Dumbrell: Very hard to pull the wool over the eyes of an old warhorse such as yourself Jacintha, it’s funny because crazy lefty policies has pushed Europe to the right. Don’t forget that. Centrist intelligent parties with common sense is what’s needed, not more blue haired turkeys voting for Christmas,
@Faejit Balloobas: just because there ‘THE MOST conservative/ right wing’ doesn’t mean they are conservative or right wing. Who are you comparing them to? Left wing parties. Fiscally FG and FF are centrist. They support a free market that is owned by the people and not the elected politicians, but they also have left wing policies like social housing and dole payments to employmentally challenged people.
@Faejit Balloobas: Why Larkin left Larkin Labour for voting with the most right wing party in Ireland, Fine Gael, against Fianna Fáil. The words of a founder of the party.
@Freda Peeple: I think you’ll find that austerity policies are the realm of the right. Remind me, who invaded Abyssinia that has a far-right government now?
@Maximilian Kolbe: No difference between the centre and the right, just look at France and their austerity policies. Ironic colonial countries give out about foreigners and some Irish hold their views, clueless.
@Faejit Balloobas: That’s pure nonsense and you know it. Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil are both solidly centre-left parties with some left-wing leanings. They both support inheritance and property tax hikes, minimum wage hikes that hurt businesses, the voted in lock-step with of the Green Party’s wacky environmental proposals like the carbon tax and “Net Zero”, they support rent control and price controls on childcare, they haven’t made any effort to shrink the size of the government once, they keep throwing more money at the HSE instead of privatising it, they are both strongly anti-Israel and they both have a policy of cozying up to China. They don’t have a single policy in their manifestos that is right-leaning.
@Brian D’Arcy: How is that Ironic. Nigeria is one of the most far right countries in the world, they are not a colonial power. Poland has actual far right groups. Football hooligans who hate foreigners and Jews. Look at Legia Warsaw. Tens of thousands of members who walk around as skin heads, with bottles of Fanta. Poland isn’t a colonial power. The Brits were the most colonial power of all time, and they were the first to adopt mass immigration policies in Europe. So is France. I thought you said the colonial powers don’t like foreigners and the non colonial powers like them?
@MN: Labour, traditionally, just the political wing of the teachers’ unions.
There was a time when they were in touch with ordinary people, but they are above that now.
eg, our president
@Maximilian Kolbe: They might hate Jews but they love their fellow far-right Zionists in Israel as per the trend in Hungary, the Netherlands, Argentina, the UK, USA et al. Islamophobia is the common denominator.
@Jacintha Dumbrell: PBP are more a protest movement than a political party who who are destined to fulminate from the fringes. I doubt even Sinn Fein in their desperation to get into government would team up with them. Essentially, a vote wasted for a group that will never wield any real power or influence.
@Harry Callahan: Are PBP against corporate profit ? Do they want zero profit and zero corporation tax returns ? If so they must believe in very small Government budgets. I might vote for them.
@Maximilian Kolbe: There’s nothing centrist about FG fiscal policies. They have proved time and time again that they are very much pro-big business even if it’s to the detriment of the people. This is the most fiscally conservative government Ireland has ever had. Big Business never had it so good. Hence why Ireland is so rich but its majority are struggling.
@Freda Peeple: no in Europe many of the great countries with their very strong infrastructure & healthcare in place it all came from the centre left, much like Labour gave the Uk the NHS. USA under trump was treated as practically signifying the west turning right back in 2016 on, thankfully that hasn’t come to pass in terms of Europe because it isn’t the answer. And id the first to oppose Brussels on a lot, be opposed to this level of unsustainable immigration from the third world across Europe. Also i would support Schengen being taken apart. This should have been started as a process following the jihadist massacre in Paris much of Europes left treats as little more than a slight blip in recent history.
@Brian Hunt: And hopefully they keep woke Helen McEntee away from the justice portfolio. Shes handing out citizenships like confetti., not to mention the draconian hate speech legislation.
@Maximilian Kolbe: As a fellow gay I’d be a severe hypocrite if i was being homophobic. Where did you come up with that? Is it reading or comprehension you struggled with in school?
@Brian D’Arcy haha are you for real? How would my name confirm if I was gay? It has no bearing on what’s being discussed. Your name is Brian Darcy so I assume you are a priest?
@Nigel Hayden: their lucky to me and MEP Aodhan o recently posted about the riot anniversary. How ironic!! He practically wants more division in Ireland and he posts rewriting history and ignoring the terror stabbing. Ah well, it’s not as if children’s lives were nearly taken !! What harm
@Tasty k: The party is more like a debating society than a political party. They have absolutely no intention about taking part in any government because then they’d have to make choices they don’t have to make decisions and and heaven forbid they have to make unpopular choices. They prefer sideline management to getting down inductee on the field of play.
@Tim Brennan: They want to govern in a progressive left leaning government, I’m not sure why that’s so difficult to understand for some people. They have little policy in common with FFG so it hardly makes sense to form a coalition with them.
@Dixie: Doubtful, if anything the Left vote will increase. Thankfully not a single far-right nutjob got elected, one-trick ponies with no policies apart from anti-immigration waffle which only 6% of voters considered a factor in the polling booth.
@Jacintha Dumbrell: You must have your eye on one of the new arrivals Jacintha, not sure they have quite reached those levels of desperation just yet. in fairness I don’t think the far right have been responsible for children going missing, or being maimed. Or for treating women like they are a separate species. In fact “the far right” don’t exist, only in the propaganda spewed by the media, and it is lapped up by gullible people like yourself.
@Jacintha Dumbrell: left wing vote has been falling all over europe, and right wing increasing. France had to form a coalition with the communist party of France just to reach a majority by the skin of their teeth to stop Le Pens right wing government. That’s working out well for them by the looks of it. Lol. Biggest opposition in Germany is now the (far) right wing AFD. Even though it’s controlled opposition, it’s still there. The same can be said for the majority of Europe, and the entire world. Every single government in Africa is far right or fascist. Try identifying as lgbt there and see what happens to you. Middle East the same thing. Russia, China, majority of rest of Asia – same thing. Socially left wing governments are about 5% of the world.
@Kevin Kerr: If you look back on your notes I said the “far right is on the March in Europe” as in right wing parties. We don’t have any credible far right parties at all. But next election after 5 more years of destroying Ireland I think we will have more.
@Kevin Kerr: I’m glad you got it. Would you consider the “far right” views of high ranking clerics of certain religions calling for the end and takeover of western culture worrisome at all? There are areas of Sweden white people can’t go anymore, same in Birmingham, pretty close to home, do you think that’s something to ponder or try to prevent?
@Freda Peeple: Ha ha, loom at your history of far-righg treatment of women, they even lied about the word woman being removed from the constitution during the referendum to take away the woman’s place being in the home. Freeda People, Freeda the head more like.
@Freda Peeple: The ‘no-go areas in Birmingham’ claim was made by a London Tory and has been thoroughly debunked.
‘So there are no go zone areas of Birmingham – it’s official according to an MP from, er, London. Paul Sculley of the Sutton and Cheam area of the capital decided Sparkhill isn’t an area you want to be going to – much to the surprise of us journalists at the city’s local newspaper and all the residents who live in this suburb. It is a perplexing comment to make, especially as he later suggested he’d only been to Small Heath.’
@lesidees: Nationalist right of centre, have a look at Malachy Steenson election mandate on his leaflet available on his website. Educate yourself and stop swallowing the mantra of “fat right” not one of his policies is extreme in the least. Definition of far right is extreme views. I’m sickened so many of our country has been brainwashed out of rational thought.
@Emer McDonnell: Fair play Emer, I’m hopeless at tech so can’t post links here. Facts, stats, and hindsight still won’t be enough to convince the gullible RTE news watchers
@Freda Peeple: Exactly, I just can’t comprehend how people refuse to see we will be exactly the same as Sweden if not worse in a few years time if we don’t try to control the situation now! I don’t know if it’s naïveté or arrogance for some here to think people wouldn’t behave like that over here! Why are we not learning from what’s happening in Europe?
@Emer McDonnell: Government and media manipulation, social conditioning, gaslighting, an out of control number of NGO’s working for well connected people, who are making a fortune out of the movement of people… the list goes on. Things will have to reach rock bottom before people wake up here, We are only at the start compared to mainland Europe and the Uk. Europe will recover, and the traitors will be removed swiftly from their mansions!
Laughing at the far-right on social media cheering when Independents were riding high in the polls for Local and General Elections, when really they are either ex-Fianna Fáil / Fine Gael patsies, or Left-Wing. There is so much political illiteracy in this country.
@Trump24: wiped out?. They started in 2015, have run in 3 general elections, first one they got 3 seats, second they got 6, the third they got 11. They are clearly a party on the rise.
That’s a pity together they would have more traction if they were in Government again and if something was unpalatable which with FFG is a given, they could pull the plug or get some compromise. If either go in alone they will suffer next election.
@Paul O’Mahoney: Either Labour or SDs with FF/FG would comprise a comfortable majority of TDs, so I don’t think there’s any incentive for FF/FG to include both.
@Paul O’Mahoney: In case you haven’t noticed. FF are Centre Left and FG are Centre Right. The much described Far Right and the media free pass Far Left are thankfully shunned by voters.
@thomas molloy: Are you basing that on Bertie saying he was a socialist or FG has the right within the party at one stage? Both parties are centralist if anything and while they provide some relief for those in need they certainly aren’t left is all policies they implement.
@Sheila McNulty: Where did I say that? The issues in country aren’t been addressed and it’s certainly not due to the lack of money. A country like ours with it’s near 100bn income should not run in the way it does. FF/FG are going to be in Government with help if it’s ” like minded independents” nothing will change having Labour and the SDs in government too would balance things up…and Governments rarely collapse here there’s always someone to be bribed.
@Paul O’Mahoney: FF is so socialist that it increased welfare levels to the highest in the world. This is why Ireland is now a welfare magnet country and this has created side effects in housing, healthcare and teacher/pupil and other areas.
@thomas molloy: Either you don’t understand what left is or you’re simply trying to justify your understanding .Increasing SW payments does not make you left , building a society where anyone can participate is one aspect of being left. Have economic policies that are fair to all is left. I’m not one for free anything but there are people especially disabled people who need things just to live .
Clearly both Labour and the social democrats separately are looking to form a government with Fianna Fail and Fine Gael, because “It’ll be different this time” I think not. Both labour and the social democrats as part of their program while canvassing the doorsteps was “Real Change” a kind of anti FF/FG sentiment, but it’s different now, that, as usual, once elected their sentiments towards FF/FG have changed. Speaks volumes about the labour and social democrats politicians who knocked on your door asking for your vote for real change.
@Jim Roche: Modern advanced societies like Ireland see the blatant cheek and wrongness of the money grabbing Socialist left. Punishing sensible serious diligent citizens and with that cash rewarding themselves and their left wing comrades and the work-shy.
@thomas molloy: And explain how most of Europe works? Most EU governments are in the centre with a lean to the left. Look at how their money is used , look at the way their health system, housing, infrastructure, is created and managed .
You either seem to not know what the left does and clearly don’t know what socialism is. Europe has a system where hard work is rewarded, taxes are used for the people, and those who need help are provided with it, based on the resources of the country.
I suggest to do a little research before typing inane, inaccurate posts.
The mean sprititidness and division is unreal but despite the censorship, the journal comments remain interesting to gauge the mood post an election. Unfortunately, a divided country didn’t turn out in enough numbers so SF whatever you think of them have another plot to exclude them having gotten the most single preferences in 2020, come 2nd in 2024. Hope you all sleep soundly those bragging about fg who lost the election, in particular since you dont care about vulnerable people. Just like your joke of a Fg leader proudly doesn’t !!? (I’m NOT a Mary Lou supporter.)
This is where I logout…I’m one of Simon Harris ‘ purposely dropped in it by unreasonable wait lists for resources such as psychology, as one of the vulnerable he like Leo does so passionately despises. People who come on and they proudly fess up to more FFg despite the fact that FG lost the election
It’s disappointing that the left can’t work together. Brilliant strategy by FF & FG divide and concour, and let’s pretend we are different parties. We are a rich country, where the rich keep getting rich & poor poorer!!!
Ms Bacik seems to be attempting to ride 2 horses at once! Thats a circus act, not practical politics, so adopt a clearly defined and expressed policy.
It has to be either to enter Government as a junior element, or go opposition to form a left front and policies.
Given the semi FFFG independents play for Gregory type deals, an invite to Labour is very unlikely, so face that reality, ms Bacik and co.
Fair play to sd. Hopefully, they stick to a left leaning agenda.
And don’t prop up any ffg government.
Labour, on the other hand, are still sell outs. Never forget alan Kelly in government.
The SDs clearly have more insight than Labour. FF & FG are only looking for a mudguard not partners in Government. Labour elite just want a few jobs and pension perks and leave the party go down the Swannie come the next election.
What exactly is ‘the centre-left’? Is it a dialectic contradiction or simply a total hamming of the English language?
No matter, Labour will do as Labour always does when the opportunity arises: enter coalition, screw the poor and face annihilation at the next election. History repeats itself ad nauseum.
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