Can you demonstrate that with financials?

The transatlantic is vastly more profitable.

IAG could use Dublin as a t/a hub as a second hub to Heathrow and expand Aer Lingus as a financed subsidiary fed with IAG traffic.

If Aer Lingus fails or is bought, is it going to be a case of boat traffic only… I don’t think anyone believes that?

A strong ownern/partner is exactly what Aer Lingus needs.

That’s intangible and subject to fluctuations.

I’d prefer to stay on point – as, you well know, my point is valid.

It is virtually impossible to buy a slot at LHR, and will be for many years – perhaps decades.

A BS asset – yes. But a major generator of business and income….

And London city, Gatwick and Stansted don’t?

Very roughly, AL passenger income is about 1m a month – split fairly equally between shot and long haul.

Shorthall carries about 5 times more passengers – so the slots are the most important possession that the airline has.

As mentioned, slots cannot be bought. Aircraft can easily be bought or leased.

If revenue per month is split evenly, and the pax ratio is 5:1 short/long haul, then long haul is much more profitable. EI would be better off concentrating on this, and regional UK connections to Dublin make massive sense. So slots to London become less important to EI’s long term revenue generation.

Fergal there’s no need to bring a bit of common sense and business acumen to the debate here. There are far better places for that. All you need to remember here in the Journal comments section is:

Privatisation of anything is bad. End of story

Slots to London? Its the LHR slots that are being discussed.

Yes longhaul is more profitable – must most airlines want a mix. Flying into Europe etc.

Which would be impossible for AL without the LHR slots.

Those slots alone make up a significant amount of the airline’s €1.3 b value.

Meant LHR gravel.

Jason wants Aer Lingus to operate longhaul and UK/Dublin only.

Because its more profitable. If only business was as simple as that.

If that business model worked – which it doesn’t – Ryanair might just have adopted it….

As things stand, BA use 10-14 of *their own* Heathrow slots to service Irish flights every day. If anything, they would cut those services rather than EI’s, but since BA are under no obligation whatsoever to service those routes, it’s fair to assume they use Heathrow slots on these routes because it makes business sense.

It’s also worth noting that none of Iberia’s Heathrow slots have been taken away from them since the merger with BA.

As such, I’d say a far bigger threat to Aer Lingus services to LHR is if they try to stay independent and end up going to the wall.

Either way though, while connectivity with London is clearly vital to Ireland, connectivity with LHR in particular is not. There are already more flights from Ireland to other London airports than to LHR, and in my experience, most people do their utmost to avoid LHR if at all possible. There are also several other options for long haul connections – Paris, Frankfurt, Amsterdam, Abu Dhabi, Dubai.

Fair enough CT – but LHR continues to grow alarmingly as itis most people’s preference; on the tube, less than 15 miles from central London.

And it will contract to grow, with a very strong lobby for a third runway. Over 75 million passengers a year – the busiest in Europe and third in the world.

Put simply – its where airlines want to be…..

*continue

Again Cornelius that kind of analysis isn’t appreciated or even under stood by the left here.

By the way some people are acting, you’d swear Heathrow is the only option to go anywhere. As you say, from Dublin, you could use any of the European hubs, Frankfurt, Amsterdam, Paris or Istanbul. Much more beyond though, Abu Dhabi or Dubai. Even within North or South America, you could use JFK, Newark, Washington, Atlanta, Philadelphia or Chicago. From Shannon, JFK, Chicago or Philaselphia. Even from Cork, theres a double daily service to Amsterdam, besides the Heathrow route

Besides all that though Heathrow as a hub needs to compete with all of the hubs mentioned above anyway. Even if the Heathrow services form Shannon for example are loss making why would anyone expect Aer Lingus to keep them on anyway? They could cut them in the morning and the government would be powerless. All they could do is make a bit of noise. IAG have promised 5 years more of these services, 5 years longer than the government has now. What more can be expected of a private company?

For people travelling from Ireland to London (as opposed to connecting in London on the way somewhere else), the best airport really depends on whereabouts in London you’re going. London City airport is by far the best option for people going to the City or East End. Stansted is just as good as LHR for the East End or North London. Luton is much better than LHR for North London. Gatwick is the best for South London. Flying into LHR is really only the best option if you want to go to West London.

The other main reason people fly to LHR is to connect to somewhere else – but as I said you don’t have to go to via London at all if your destination is further afield. I honestly don’t think it would be a disaster if there were fewer flights from Ireland to LHR, but in any case I don’t think that’s a likely outcome if this deal goes through.

Will, didn’t say that at all. Can you point where I said it? What I am saying is that EI has huge growth potential on longhaul, both in pax and revenue terms, via Dublin from UK regional airports, and that LHR slots are not the most important part of it’s business model.

Agree with most of that CT. But London is where/the route people prefer.

Will said 75 million pass through Heathrow ever year – but another 75 million go through Gatwick, Stansted, Luton, City and Southend.

Yes there are many competitors – but few in the aviation industry will plan anything without factoring in London.

The third runway at Heathrow is inevitable – as is a second at Gatwick.

London seem to be absolutely pivotal in this industry – although, as you say, it doesn’t have to be.

More BS Jason- you just love to hear yourself talking! Ps your beloved Ryanair put the prices up for pre booking seats between 10 & 20 %! No doubt you’ll say this is something to do with bird strikes etc etc

Protect- it’s bs that EI has huge growth potential? Or is it bs that UK regional airports offer great business opportunities to EI? Or is bs that EI can improve revenue by offering more long haul routes? What’s bs exactly? And I’ve not once mentioned FR here, that’s your obsession.

As for my own voice, it’s a public forum, open for anyone to comment. I actually agree with you that FR can charge too much on routes where they are the only carrier, but you don’t seem to get that there is a massive difference between Dublin and Stansted in terns of how pricing structures work. So that’s it, I agree with some of what you say, I’ve tried to explain some of the rationale behind their pricing etc., as I’ve first hand knowledge. So good luck to you.

No – its Head Office is London. When Diageo is discussed here, Guinness will be mentioned – for reasons of relevance.

In this thread, IAG’s other subsidiaries have no real relevance – as they operate largely in different markets.

Whereas BA has…

Registered legal office for IAG Is where? Madrid

Will said ‘Head Office’ – and he’s correct.

Ryanair will very soon be legally required to offload 25% of their share in Aer Lingus. They know this so they will sell their shares if this offer goes through because it will allow them to sell for what they paid, allowing them to save face with their own shareholders. This would give IAG a controlling share hypothetically*

Of course you don;t really care about that or Aer Lingsu for that matter, all you care about is government bashing to suit what your far left agenda demands of you.

*Obviously this isn’t going to happen. IAG will leave it off if it means the government holding onto their 25.1% stake. You wouldn’t blame them with that government stake being kicked around like political football among clueless back bench TD’s and even more clueless local councillors, as we saw in Co Clare recently

Only problem bob is Ryanair can’t offload them if no one wants to buy them. They’ve been hawking them around for a while now and can’t get a buyer.

Exactly which is why this approach is great timing for Ryanair seeing as they’ll likely have to sell the shares anyway. Aer Lingus shares were worth quite a bit less several months ago and their value will fall even further than that if IAG give up on their takeover approach. If Ryanair can sell at this €2.55 a share offered by IAG, they will get back what they paid for their shares. Hard to tell exactly who would buy Ryanairs share if not IAG.