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Here are the questions on water charges you want answered

Finally, after 22 meetings, the water committee has approved its final report.

WATER CHARGES ARE back – for some, at least.

After 22 meetings the Oireachtas committee on water charges approved its final report this evening.

After an acrimonious week of twists and u-turns, the 20-member committee, which was tasked to deal with the issue of charges, metering and ownership, approved the final draft report, 13 votes to 7.

So what’s in this report? Here are the answers to some of the key questions.

Is Irish Water being abolished?

No, Irish Water is here to stay. The committee agreed that a single water utility will remain, but we’ll be having a referendum on the issue of enshrining the utility into public ownership.

Are water charges completely gone?

Water charges are back for those that use excessive amounts of water. However, the previous scheme of billing everyone for water is over.

The committee agreed that the 2007 Water Services Act can be beefed up to impose “levies” on householders – which is essentially a charge.

What is excessive usage? 

Excessive usage is 70% above the average household use.

The average individual usage has been set at 133 litres per person per day.

It recommended that the Commission of Energy Regulation should determine the average consumption levels and that excessive usage should be based on 1.7 times the average household usage.

Any legislation in the future should also provide for allowances in extraordinary circumstances such as medical conditions and above average household size that falls beyond the threshold allowance and taking into consideration that average usage is 133 litres per person per day.

So will householders get any more bills from Irish Water?

Only if they waste water. Fianna Fáil and Fine Gael maintain that 92% of the public won’t get bills, but the 8% that have been found to waste water will face a levy.

71,000 households (8%) of Ireland’s households account for 32% of all water use in the country and it is these properties that are liable for the excessive use charges.

However, Right2Water TDs maintain the percentage could be a lot higher – stating that up to 40% of householders could end up paying.

Fianna Fáil’s Barry Cowen told the media tonight, that if someone gets a bill they shouldn’t, they should give him a call.

What will happen to those that don’t pay?

Fine Gael chairperson Martin Heydon said those that do not pay their water bills will be treated the same as those that do not pay their other bills. Whether this means debt collectors or court remains unclear. Those details will emerge when legislation is drafted.

What about those with private water schemes?

This falls under the equity heading in the report, whereby it is recommended that members of  group water schemes should have the same financial support offered to those on public water scheme.

What about water meters? 

The State’s roll out of water meters is over but all new build homes must have one. District metering will be rolled out in some areas and there will be bulk metering for apartment blocks.

Are Fine Gael and Fianna Fail OK?

The last ten days has certainly damaged the relationship, but the threat of an election has diminished.

There has been a lot of grandstanding, posturing and game-playing on both sides – and the result? Pretty much back where we started.

Fianna Fáil have denied they have done a climb down, with Cowen stating:

“I do not care if it 2-0, 3-0 or 10-0 or 1-1. When the spin fades away, the fact will remain that there are no charges and Fianna Fáil fulfilled its commitment in this regard.

“I am sorry that ten days were wasted, Fine Gael will have to answer as to why. But essentially water charges are gone. 92% of people will never receive a bill again… this failed regime is gone.”

Do all the other committee members agree?

No. The report was only approved by 13 members – Fine Gael, Fianna Fáil, the committee chair Senator Pádraig Ó Céidigh and Independent Noel Grealish.

Right2Water TDs (Solidarity-PBP and Sinn Féin) as well as Labour and the Green Party voted against the report.

TD Paul Murphy accused Fianna Fáil of u-turn and said this report is another way for Fine Gael to introduce water charges through the back door.

He said people would see through what Fianna Fáil had done in the last week and voters would punish them for it.

Meanwhile, Green Party Senator Grace O’Sullivan has warned that the report will need to be strengthened in the Dáil by the government and Fianna Fáil.

O’Sullivan voted against the report due to Fianna Fáil’s insertion of the Water Services Act 2007 to penalise those who use water excessively.

Ó Céidigh said he 100% stood over the report yesterday and was happy the committee had come to a conclusion.

Heydon said is a”victory for new politics” and claims this report is honest to the Irish people.

What next? 

The motion on the report will be brought before the Dáil tomorrow and there will be a debate. A vote will follow on Thursday.

Read: ‘It certainly must stick in the craw of the workers’ – Shane Ross lambasted for photo of night out with Amanda Brunker>

Read: Water committee told meters should be installed in all new houses>

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149 Comments
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    Mute Jimmy O'Brien
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:02 PM

    One more question :
    When will the one million households get their refunds ?

    483
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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:45 PM

    @Jimmy O’Brien: first thing came to my mind but also interesting where they pull these figures from and no plan on how to determine household size of more than one person. Names of all tenants? They wouldn’t take extra names from landlords last time but called them looking for just one to be the guinea pig which in my book was illegal because when asked if the nominated tenant could forward the other tenants names we got “no we cannot accept extra names to go on the bill but only from that person!!! Talk about BS! So how will to fix it this time because no f****ing way are a huge amount of tenants going to set up with bills for excessive use based on one person and not 4 etc. Ah so is that their trick to get names or how will they identify it as truth, how? Sure 2 tenants living together could say there’s 5 there!!! Pps numbers won’t work. Notice too how 133litres crept down from 150litres.

    http://www.irishexaminer.com/ireland/150-litres-of-water-consumed-daily-by-every-person-245927.html

    153
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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:14 AM

    @Paudi Onail: this is unreal, IW have the payment records on their computer and the persons name!!! And now they want revenue to ask for proof of payment? Does it not get any more crooked and downright ridiculous? So when esb are at fault the revenue refund me? I don’t think so. http://m.independent.ie/irish-news/water/irish-water-crisis/revenue-should-refund-irish-water-customers-fianna-fil-insists-35499350.html

    135
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:13 PM

    privatization of water has to be forbidden under law.

    303
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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:14 AM

    @gregory: It will. When (if) this referendum happens it will be a walkover for the non privatisation of our water services, and rightly so.

    96
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    Mute Deborah Behan
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:49 AM

    @Soccer T’s: isn’t it amazing how easy enough it was to call a referendum on ownership of Irish water? People have been marching and marching for this so it shows FG are only out for FG not the Republic. Colour me shocked.

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    Mute Vic's Burd
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:02 AM

    @gregory: bit late for that – 25% of ownership are already in private hands. Private group schemes, Veoila Water and other businesses. Does the report address those???

    8
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    Mute Daffy the Bear
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:51 AM

    @Vic’s Burd: the ownership referendum will be a red herring: the water supply infrastructure is of secondary concern. They will try to distract with this; the real concern is having public ownership of the natural resource enshrined in the constitution..

    18
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    Mute Ibhar Mac Suibhne
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:27 AM

    @ Daffy the bear : EXACTLY !

    3
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:34 AM

    @Ibhar Mac Suibhne: the distraction is complete! FF and FG have introduced water charges, and they now have a value. Now, it’s the shall matter of private management companies being required to facilitate the 40% of household who will fall into the excess category – maybe one company to aggregate the excess and introduce a management plan. Public ownership of the infrastructure is a red herring – commoditising was always the mission.

    11
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    Mute Brinster
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:04 PM

    Cowan can spin all he wants – this is a climb down by FF.

    Some very welcome points in there – delighted we’ll get a referendum on public ownership. Also conservationists will be happy with a charge for excessive use. Would have been stupid to deliberately introduce a law that would lead to EU fines.

    And FF left with egg all over their faces. A good day.

    313
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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:20 PM

    @Brinster: Still dressing up speculation as fact, like you did repeatedly over the apple tax?

    tut tut

    106
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    Mute Peter donnelly
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:23 PM

    @Brinster: this was the plan all along ff would pretend to object and at the last minute switch sides again as they will do until the election which they are hoping wont be for a few years yet, you know giving time the people will forget but we will not forget ever….

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    Mute Stephen murphy
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:38 PM

    @Peter donnelly: We will.

    17
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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:47 PM

    @Brinster: well get rid of them all come next vote, SF it will have to be as bad as it gets it can’t get worse surely.

    38
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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:50 PM

    @Paudi Onail: We won’t you know. We will just vote the same way as we always do. Nothing changes

    30
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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:55 PM

    @Soccer T’s: A lower percentage of voters are choosing FF/FG every election. Last time they got less than half the vote between them, when I started voting it was something like 85%.

    70
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    Mute Brinster
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:12 AM

    @The Risen:

    For Connolly? That you?

    26
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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:13 AM

    @The Risen: Which is why FF and FG will merge in the near future. Anything for survival! If only the left could get their act together and form a credible alternative. I’m stunned that the social dems get such little support which again suggests that the majority’s mindset is still consumed by civil war politics.

    36
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    Mute John Scott
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:53 AM

    @Brinster: some things never chang. Him an his Brother . Cowen Boys.

    17
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    Mute Daffy the Bear
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    Apr 12th 2017, 10:00 AM

    @Soccer T’s: there is no credible left movement in Ireland (or most Western countries) because decent rational socialist philosophy has been hijacked by the über-PC, progressive, right-on populism.
    For an example of what I mean, take a look at Dublin students out protesting against Trumps election… Remember the guy in the photo with the “Not in my locker room” placard? That is the colour of Ireland’s left movement and the reason why it sadly doesn’t stand a chance..

    6
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    Mute Ibhar Mac Suibhne
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:23 AM

    A referendum on public owner ship of the UTILITY !!! (Pipes and treatment facilities) The door is left open for privatization of our water RESOURCE!

    9
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:36 AM

    @Ibhar Mac Suibhne: you have it in one!

    6
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    Mute Bobby Moore
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:16 PM

    I’m not a customer of Irish Water and never will be. They can fupp right off.

    231
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    Mute James Darby
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:43 AM

    All the supermarkets sell it.

    9
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    Mute Jack Cassady
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:01 PM

    So, the real question.
    How is the bloated quango this is Irish Water going to be funded?

    236
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    Mute Stephen murphy
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:04 PM

    @Jack Cassady: LPT, it’ll be increased next year!

    132
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    Mute Gordon Nash
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:07 PM

    @Jack Cassady: I guess it will be the same people who pay for everything else. Those who pay their taxes.

    188
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    Mute ray.farrelly
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:22 PM

    Gordon Nash. Everyone pays tax in one form or another. Now get down from the high horse before you fall down.

    91
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    Mute Reg
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:36 PM

    @ray.farrelly: True Ray, but then there’s the net conttibutors and the net receivers!

    76
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:40 PM

    @ray.farrelly: No they do not.

    30
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    Mute ray.farrelly
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:51 PM

    Gregory. Care to expand on that? Or do you think only income tax payer’s pay tax?

    36
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    Mute lavbeer
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    Apr 12th 2017, 6:56 AM

    @Jack Cassady: I have no issue with funding water through general taxation. I have an issue with funding the billing system to the tune of 100 to 200 million a year. All to chase 71k households. At least the metering has stopped but I bet the clowns already bought the next batch

    37
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    Mute Boganity
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:54 AM

    @Stephen murphy: true, it’ll end up going from six on the old system to half a dozen on the new, they always win and we always loose…such is life

    5
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    Mute Dave Doyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:48 AM

    @lavbeer: The metering hasn’t stopped. It will continue. It will be expanded. That door was left open. A referendum on the water utility is worth nothing. A referendum on ownership of the water resource is what’s vital. Not this IW utility. 3.5 billion has been wasted so far, all for nothing. The status quo remains. Nothing has been achieved.

    21
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    Mute Boganity
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:31 AM

    @Dave Doyle: this is just a tactical retreat in the end all water will be metered and not just the water we use but even the grey and black water leaving our homes, and we’ll be charged for that too

    7
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    Mute Whoswho
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    Apr 12th 2017, 1:20 PM

    THAT’S AN ABSOLUTE DISGRACE THAT THE GOVERNMENT PUSHED THIS THROUGH AFTER ALL THE PUBLIC RAGE ABOUT THIS. YOU’D BE A FOOL TO VOTE FF or FG AGAIN!!!

    3
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    Mute mary harris
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:13 PM

    How will they measure usage on those who were not metered as metering was suspended

    185
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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:19 PM

    @mary harris: Or those who will now remove their meters and bin them.

    172
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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:51 PM

    @mary harris: how will do they do anything? They installed one meter in large houses sectioned into separate apartments!! Flat rates they used, how will they determine personal usage? They’re back to square one and again it will be decided by the voters cos thousands are renting more now. Also where are the refunds? There will be murder.

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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:56 PM

    @Paudi Onail: Correct Paudi.

    33
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    Mute Deborah Behan
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:51 AM

    @mary harris: I live in an apartment block. How is that going to work?

    12
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:55 AM

    @Paudi Onail: don’t worry. At this moment there is a new company (probably called “servuisce”, “watercoms” or something like that) that will be mandatory for all apartment management companies to sign up with. They will “take the hassle and risk” out of measuring your own water usage, by combining it into a single monthly bill. Failure to pay will result in a reduction of water supply (and legal, as you have to sign over your right to clean water and this agreement is not with the Irish water billing company).

    2
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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:18 PM

    FF coming out of this looking like fools, and will be going into the next election without even a low preference on the voting card of I’d imagine many a person fooled by their promises last time, abolish water charges and Irish Water.

    Back to the streets boys and girls!

    245
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    Mute brian boru
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:11 AM

    @The Risen: FF have clearly set their flag in the FG camp – The Fiannas are one party and FF have deceived everyone of their voters – A very poor day for Irish politics

    The Irish water vs the Irish people battle restarts

    54
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    Mute Mark Sheridan
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:04 PM

    After a week of chest beating by FF and they have just backed down on everything on everything they where beating there chests about.

    219
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:43 PM

    @Mark Sheridan: Frickin disgrace FF cowtowing to ultra free market FG who”d charge the boll@##$s off you acc. free market liberal ideology caring not a jot about fairness equality or the well being of society at large.

    134
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    Mute Nigel O'Neill
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    Apr 12th 2017, 10:54 AM

    @Mark you werent actually fooled into thinking that FF’s chest beating was nothing more than window dressing for the public to continue the illusion that FF are actually an opposition to FG!!

    11
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    Mute Mark Sheridan
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:29 AM

    @Nigel O’Neill: of course I wasn’t. I was just pointing out how the hole thing is a sham.

    4
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    Mute Jarlath Murphy
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:22 PM

    Roll on #GE2017 Always remember and never forget, those who seek to steal your children’s water! Not even a 10th choice vote

    192
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    Mute brian boru
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:16 AM

    @Jarlath Murphy: A vote for the Fiannas is a vote for water poverty

    44
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    Mute Stephen murphy
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:03 PM

    The report was last seen, on a shelf in the Dail bar and will be used to prop up wonky tables.

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    Mute Peter Cavey
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:45 PM

    133 litres a day? An average shower is 100 litres a day

    131
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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:57 PM

    @Peter Cavey: I know, 65 for washing machine. That’s where there getting water charges in, there will be bills and many complaints. The leaks will stay leaking while gif bonuses keep rolling. FF were voted in to abolish IW and they didn’t. Also they will make up for it with hefty fines per litre, worse than going outside your mobile data plan.

    147
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    Mute Warmfartrises
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:12 AM

    @Peter Cavey: Thats a long shower. What the hell you doing in there. Im a 54 litres man myself

    33
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    Mute brian boru
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:27 AM

    @Peter Cavey: Remove the meter

    17
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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:42 AM

    @Warmfartrises: I’ve a house with five women who shower to ironically save water. I could wash for a week with a basin of dirty water and still be way over this limit. Remember, even if you collect your own water and use the drain you will be charged as a “waster”. Someone bring on an election – I’d literally vote *anyone* non FF/FG who will shut down this fiasco.

    7
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    Mute @mdmak33
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:23 AM

    At least the public have a clear picture of who to vote for come GE.no votes for FF,fg, labour,greens.ff have shown they have not changed and will lose a lot of votes.

    114
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    Mute sparky
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:09 PM

    So we get to use 210 litres a day. a referendum to enshrine water to public ownership..but still have to keep the quango IW intact..wtf..

    152
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    Mute tom
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:20 PM

    @sparky: and the meters will continue to roll out and billing company IW waiting in the wings.

    I rather see IW shut down and stop wasting money on installing meters.

    166
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:39 PM

    @sparky: someone has to pay for all the unecessary Audi and other IW cars parked in IW car park as well as their Gold Plated Pensions.

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    Mute Reg
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:39 PM

    @sparky: You’d prefer for water managent to go back to 30 odd diffetent organisations for this small country? I see!

    19
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:44 PM

    @Reg: many of those cc guys got a pension amd re hired by IW at exhorbitant salaries and bonusses plus company car etc etc

    63
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    Mute Old Gordon
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:52 PM

    @sparky: It’s common sense to have a public utility providing a critical public service but yes the old system was great and water just falls out of the sky.

    17
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:00 AM

    @Old Gordon: water does actually fall from the sky.

    55
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    Mute Thomas Maher
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:30 AM

    @gregory: Not according to a certain FG senator, I clearly heard him say on VB show “water doesn’t just fall from the sky”.

    27
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    Mute brian boru
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:19 AM

    @sparky: the fight is only starting

    13
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:59 PM

    On a side Note the Green Party who encouraged all 2 drive Diesel Cars and now want to penalize them after everyone investing heavily in Dirsel cars based on their advice and tax incentives to save the planet, can actually take a hike as they are illiterate from a technical and policy point of view and change their taax policies like the weather.

    99
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    Mute Les Behan
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:45 PM

    Oh look Labour are anti water charges again :-)

    100
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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:49 PM

    @Les Behan: alan kelly?

    34
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    Mute Damian Gavin
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:45 PM

    Another farce, IW is a disgrace of a company. With all the crap regarding them over the last number of years they still saw fit to award huge bonuses to all their staff, They don’t care what anyone thinks of them, j\ust lining their own pockets

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    Mute Martin Flood
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:59 AM

    @Damian Gavin: So what will you and everyone else do about it?

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    Mute Nucky
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:12 AM

    People don’t be blind to this , the excess waste limit will be lower in future years and budgets

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:34 PM

    8% of wasters fined. grand. do you have a valid calibration cert that is in date for the serial number of the water meter being used to define “waste” and is it calibrated according to I.S
    and EN National standards and has the “waster” been provided with the serial number identification of the meter being used?

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    Mute Malvolio32
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:47 PM

    @gregory: Do you have a calibration Cert for your esb meter?

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    Mute brian boru
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:31 AM

    @gregory: Remove the meter

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    Mute mad_fluffy
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    Apr 12th 2017, 1:33 AM

    133 liters if water is very little..if you take into account showering toilet.. if you have visitors once or twice in a week ..there has to be some normality in the house..without being afraid to turn the tap on !!!

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    Mute Paraic McDonagh
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:05 AM

    @mad_fluffy: Nail on the head. And the 1.7 will become 1.4 and then 1.1 then 0.9…

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    Mute Brian walsh
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:05 PM

    When are rebates been paid back ?

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    Mute John003
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:08 PM

    The rebate will be minus the €100 water conservation grant…Won’t be very much…

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    Mute sparky
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:10 PM

    When will the people who claimed the tax rebate be asked to return it.

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    Mute Jimmy O'Brien
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:15 PM

    @John003: But, for me, it’s not about “how much”. It’s about the principle of fairness.

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    Mute Marc Quinn
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:57 PM

    It’s what you would come to expect from FG and FF, fake fighting all over the shop.. they are nothing but profiteers with their fingers on all the pies…

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    Mute Taco Burrito
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:12 AM

    @Marc Quinn: Yet still over 70% of the idiot population continue to vote for these two showers of gobshtes

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    Mute Paudi Onail
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:00 AM

    There’s going to be lots of ‘excessive’ use because they won’t b able work out how many personal are truthfullly resident. We’re well ahead of why they were adamant with that wording. I can see the headache already.

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    Mute Taco Burrito
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:09 AM

    Joke, time to revolt. Anyone who still wants to vote FG or FF needs to wake up

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    Mute Ciarán
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:08 PM

    Are FG and FF okay?? Fook off!!!!

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:08 PM

    That all seems fair, especially the referendum. Can we stop the protests now and get back to the important issues?

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    Mute The Risen
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:19 PM

    @Soccer T’s: Nope. This fudge will fool nobody.

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    Mute Ian Walsh
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:29 PM

    @Soccer T’s: It’s ok, the adults can handle multiple issues at once. If you can only handle one issue at a time then you should have moved on from this long ago. Why are you still here?

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    Mute John Hartigan
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:35 AM

    Barry Cowan just as bad as his brother lining o briefs pocket roll onn GE

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    Mute Grainne Abdulaziz
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:26 AM

    ‘Here are the questions on water charges you want answered’

    Most people would have clicked on this article wondering are they going to be getting a refund, a hot political topic over the last 12 months, The Journal asked itself 10 questions, and this wasn’t one of them.

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    Mute Willy Malone
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    Apr 12th 2017, 4:56 AM

    FF FG were always bringing in water charged. Fool electorate on route.
    Problem this time is no one is fooled.
    They will suffer come election surely this time ….

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    Mute Ronan Sexton
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:10 AM

    @Willy Malone: we said that the last time and the same village idiots voted in these parasitic simpletons again. Nothing will ever change as long as the half wits across the country keep voting in these corrupt, inept fools over and over.

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    Mute Ronan Sexton
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:11 AM

    @Ronan Sexton: a bag of cats would do a better job than these corrupt morons.

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    Mute Paul Cahoon
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:50 AM

    And so privatisation begins, meters mean charges, nothing to do with useage. Allowance will be reduced, more meters installed , money squandered. A complete and utter sell out, remember refuse and how much do people pay now. Water will be sold to a private company at the end of the day. This is the next battle.

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    Mute Thomas Maher
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:56 AM

    133L per day per person. In a house hold. Hmmmmm I,m just going to do some maths
    133 Litres by 365 days equals 48,545 Litres per/year. So anyone who lives alone has just lost 2,455 litres per year. So all single person households. Such as elderly, students, and anyone else living on their own. Have had their water allowance reduced.

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    Mute Thomas Maher
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    Apr 12th 2017, 3:14 AM

    Opps little slip of the thumb there.. It’s not 2455 litres. It’s 1455 litres.

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    Mute Nucky
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    Apr 12th 2017, 2:15 AM

    Will the people except it that is the real question

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    Mute GO GREEN
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:09 PM

    Bottom line they can only agree what will fit and be compatible with EU regulations – not real democracy at all – but at least they will have a referendum so public can keep it in public ownership.

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    Mute Kyle Ocallaghan
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:34 PM

    @GO GREEN: we should the eu be telling us what we can and can’t do. We are a sovereign nation. We as a country with elected officials (unlike the numerous EU presidents) should be able to do whatever we want to. We are a democracy…something the EU seems to be forgetting about recently.

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:45 PM

    @Kyle Ocallaghan: We are a sovereign country who is a member of the EU and who signed up to EU water framework directive. You can thank FF for that

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    Mute winston smith
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    Apr 12th 2017, 6:53 AM

    So anyone without a meter at present can waste all the water they wish without a levy/fine/bill?

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    Mute Derek Poutch
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:59 PM

    @winston smith: what about the 47% of treated water that is wasted by the leaks .this should be the first priority not the few people who will waste water. This is still a scam and the public won’t be fooled by ff or fg.

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:23 PM

    subsidization of roads to rural dwellers who choose to live in a villa and not farming land from city dwellers in a simple semi d needs to be stopped.

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:30 PM

    @gregory: infrastructure efficiency. services@effective cost , health, schools, waste mgt etc

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:37 PM

    @gregory: active farms should be able to claim water infrastructure costs back. But not Villa rural dwellers for whom semi d in the town is not good enough. Welcome to normal Eu rules.

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:37 PM

    @gregory: Maybe we should ALL move to Dublin? Have you a spare room?

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:47 PM

    @Soccer T’s: what is wrong with rural urban centres. there are lots of them want a list?

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:53 PM

    @gregory: Because people who were born in rural areas want to stay in rural areas and that is still their choice, thankfully

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    Mute Paul Santry
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:56 PM

    @gregory: wtf are you on about

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:04 AM

    @Paul Santry: very vocal people on joe duffy rte todat complaining how they pay for water in rural areas by providing their own well and how city and town dwellers are sponging requesting free water while actually we are paying for their roadway infrastructure but not moaning about it.

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:07 AM

    @Soccer T’s: that’s anti Eu policy btw. Infrastucture-Environment. Nowhere in mainland Eu you can buy land and live outside a town unless it is an active farm btw. The same Eu who says we must all measure h20 usage and charge for it in the wettest country in the Eu.

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:21 AM

    @gregory: I heard those people on Joe Duffy today. Trust me they do not represent the majority of rural dwellers. By they way we ALL pay for our infrastructure. Don’t forget that the majority of Irish people live in rural areas and we make no apologies for our life choices. I spent long enough living in cities and thankfully those days are behind me.

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:24 AM

    @gregory: I have no issue with legislation restricting one off housing by the way. You see very few new builds in rural Ireland these days. There are plenty of incentives in the pipeline to encourage people back to living in small towns but it will take a couple of generations for this to happen. I hope you won’t resent the investment that will be needed in these towns to make them viable options for people to move to because currently the majority of them are ghost towns with little or no infrastructure or basic services.

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    Mute Gary
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:17 AM

    “The questions on Irish water we want answered”? You then go on to say one of those questions is “Are Fine Gael and Fianna Fáil OK”??? Does anyone give a Fc€k if they’re not OK?
    What about one of the most important questions that was left out, the refund question?

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    Mute Feargal A Hickey
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:02 AM

    The party of Lawlor Burke and Haughey relying on legal advice , oh the irony.

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    Mute Old Gordon
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:51 PM

    In fairness, Murphy and co are only there to vote against anything as ‘neo-liberal’ whatever nonsense. They are a zero entity when it comes to formulating policy or a coherent strategy to improve water services. What a total waste of money.

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 11th 2017, 11:56 PM

    @Old Gordon: Professional protesters with no real substance. Anti establishment is their only manifesto. Such a shame as Ireland badly needs a credible left wing option

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    Mute gregory
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:08 AM

    @Old Gordon: Most people support Paul Murphy on this issue but would not necessarily admit it right?

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    Mute Willie
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:15 AM

    @gregory:
    True

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    Mute Soccer T's
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:29 AM

    @gregory: He has no interest in real policy formation. He’s simply an anti establishment mouthpiece with no substance.

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    Mute Noirin Kavanagh
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:11 AM

    @Soccer T’s: Soccer T, what would a “credible” left look like?

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    Mute Paula Nolan
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:38 AM

    A question. If the roll out of water meters is now stopped, how can Irish Water measure the usage of homes with no meters?

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    Mute Anastasia
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:45 AM

    A provision has to be included that water is never never privatised that it belongs to the people of Ireland it’s a god given right take a look at country’s that privatised there water.

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    Mute Jonathan Yeo
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    Apr 12th 2017, 5:51 AM

    Total traitors

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    Mute Unitedpeople
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:27 AM

    Ireland citizens do not waste water. Even EU Eurostat has stated Irish people have the LOWEST use of water in the whole of Europe. Fine Gael liars are just creating an issue where there is none with the public, to justify the continued install of meters and their usage.

    REDACTED will again gain by €1.5 Mill to €300+ Million. A number of papers have reported this, as his companies continue to install expensive meters.

    So the legal apparatus for charges will still exist.
    The allowances con will still go on.
    The private company “Irish Water” will still go on.
    Meter usage will still go on.

    ALL the above is what the people have said at the last election in a 75% supporting direction vote, that they don’t want.
    Fianna Fail (with yet once more -u-turn for good luck) has decided to give two fingers to the democratic vote of the people.

    Traitors and liars, they are all.

    Roll on the local elections. EVERY day the public will be reminded just what a bunch of undemocratic liars and back-stabbers, we have currently elected.

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    Mute Andrew Sheil
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    Apr 12th 2017, 12:41 PM

    @Unitedpeople:
    Actually, it states we have the highest..

    “Water use from public water supply ranged from a high of 146.2 m³ per inhabitant in Ireland down to a low of 26.4 m³ per inhabitant in Belgium”

    http://ec.europa.eu/eurostat/statistics-explained/index.php/Water_statistics#Water_uses

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    Mute Catherine Hayward
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    Apr 12th 2017, 10:33 AM

    Just tell me when is the next march fed up with these politicians need to learn that no means no …

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    Mute Aidan Clarke
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:30 AM

    sounds like labour, Fianna Fáil or the high way, ill remember this when it comes to the vote. but then i always know they were liars they were using people to get seats . Think the words im looking for is turn coat

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    Mute Roy Dowling
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:04 AM

    I live in an apartment with no meter. How will they know if I’m wasting water or not?,

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    Mute Paul Lane
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    Apr 12th 2017, 6:59 AM

    This is a silly idea where only those with meters will be charged? Well those who have not be ripped theirs out in the meantime on the basis that they cannot be replaced. So folks rip out your meters and you will never be charged. What stupidity!!!

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    Mute Nick Drake
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:33 AM

    None of this is real, it’s all orchestrated by the loony left TDs and council members to ensure they are voted in again and keep their handy jobs and nice salaries and pensions. Murphy, Boyd Barrett and co are having a laugh.

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    Mute Buster VL
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    Apr 12th 2017, 7:32 AM

    The fairest way to pay for water is to meter it, and pay according to use.
    Period.

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    Mute Ronan Sexton
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:15 AM

    @Buster VL: most houses use roughly the same amount. The myth that people leave their taps on all day is a complete lie. In my 45 years, I have yet to set foot in a house where I have seen a tap left running.

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    Mute YouHaveGotToBeJoking
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:17 AM

    What a complete shambles. Embarrassed for the country. First thing that should have been done is pay back those that actually paid their fees.

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    Mute Ann Illing
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    Apr 12th 2017, 10:03 AM

    Just when is this referendum happening???? ?

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    Mute Ann Illing
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    Apr 12th 2017, 10:02 AM

    Just when is this referendum happening ?? ?

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    Mute Colm Vambeck
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    Apr 12th 2017, 9:42 AM

    So if you take a bath and wash your cloths that’s it. You cant have a drink of water or brush your teeth or have your friends over for a cupa. And dont flush that toilet!
    http://taptips.ie/downloads/HowMuchWater.pdf

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    Mute Gulliver Foyle
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    Apr 12th 2017, 11:47 AM

    Here is a useful chart from the UK to get an understanding of the average litres per day: https://www.ccwater.org.uk/savewaterandmoney/averagewateruse hint: every single family will pay charges. Rural pensioners and single occupant dwellers will be exempt except when they have an actual leak.

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    Mute Andrew Sheil
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    Apr 12th 2017, 1:45 PM

    @Gulliver Foyle:
    Ireland’s allowance 133 l/day/person
    avg. Uk allowance 143 l/day/person

    Not a huge difference

    Using the information from the link you provided, Irelands figures for a four-person household would be 420 l/day/household with excess use only being charged once usage goes past 714 l/day/household. Compared to the UK average for a four person household water usage rate of 450 l/day/household.

    Based on this I do not believe your assertion that every single family will pay charges.

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    Mute robert lester
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    Apr 12th 2017, 8:46 PM

    So all the meters are gone from my road so how will they know if there is excess used? They don’t know how many live in my house as I never engaged with Irish water, so I guess it’s all just a joke. Simple solution, remove your meters.

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    Mute Job Steven
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    Apr 12th 2017, 3:52 PM

    Dear Sir/Madam,
    Do you need funding?
    Do you need a loan?
    Do you need Business or personal Loan?
    Do you wish to refinance your company?

    We give out loan to any individual and company at 2% interest rate
    yearly. For more information, Contact Email:harrybensonloaninvestment@gmail.com

    Name:
    Country:
    Amount:
    Phone number:

    Regards
    Harry Benson.

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    Mute Andrew Sheil
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    Apr 12th 2017, 1:15 PM

    Some things I still do not understand.

    (1) If I leave my tap on all night, how will it be determined that I am wasting water and not my neighbour?

    (2) Who is going to pay for all the leaks in the water system we have? Will ‘general taxation’ now increase or will some other public service get reduced funding?

    (3) What is the incentive for people who wish to conserve water?

    1
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