Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
FINE GAEL AND SINN Féin were happy to hype up a radio debate between Eoin Ó Broin and Richard Bruton but the studied policy discussion it actually turned into was probably a good thing.;
In what is surely some kind of parable for our times, the Twitter chatter about the debate was probably more intense than the actual reality.
The debate came about after Bruton tweeted taking issue with Ó Broin’s comments about a report detailing the cost developers are charging Dublin City Council for apartments.
‘Price gouging’ was what Ó Broin called it. Bruton said Ó Broin was ‘misusing’ statistics and that Sinn Féin’s housing policy was ‘threadbare’. Ó Broin quickly called for a ‘public debate’ between the two. RTÉ’s Drivetime was happy to oblige and so it was.
Not everyone was happy with the plan, with Labour Senator and housing spokesperson Rebecca Moynihan calling it “macho posturing” and seeking inclusion in the debate.
Not too dissimilar a request it must be said than this time last year when Sinn Féin issued a legal letter against RTÉ for its planned exclusion from an election debate.
The shoe perhaps being on the other foot on this occasion.
The build up to the debate even seemed to begin in the Dáil earlier when Pearse Doherty and Leo Varadkar clashed about housing during Leaders’ Questions.
It went along predictable lines, Doherty attacked Fine Gael’s “failed” housing policy and Varadkar said that Sinn Féin’s in the north was no better.
The Drivetime debate was of more substance and basically amounted to the pair outlining their party’s ideological approaches to housing.
The distance between them is perhaps best exemplified by the row over the development at Oscar Traynor Road in Santry, which Dublin City Councillors voted to reject in November.
TheJournal.ie outlined the various arguments for and against the development at the time. It amounted to a developer using public lands to build 853 new homes, 50% of which would be sold privately, 30% to social housing and 20% affordable housing.
Speaking about it this evening, Ó Broin said that the affordable housing could not be described as such, and that a two-bed home would be on the market for €357,000.
He said the privately sold homes would be on the market for over €400,000.
“Because it’s Dublin City Council land there’s no land costs in there, nobody can tell me the €357,000 for two bed apartment in Dublin on public land is a good use of land,” he said.
What you’re also not being told is that the land isn’t being sold, there’s no market valuation of that land and what was put to councillors last year was the free transfer of public land to a private developer.
Bruton said that the “root of the problem” was that Sinn Fein was sticking to the mantra of “only public housing on public lands”.
“They are seeking to exclude any private development on these lands. Now if that is allowed to take hold the notion of a State Development Agency to aggressively intervene in the housing market would be stillborn,” he said.
Bruton went on to say that all parties should support “mixed-developments to cater for all our community”.
The debate was moving along rather laboriously until RTÉ’s Sarah McInerney intervened with a text from a listener who asked the pair to pick one aspect of the other’s housing policy they could agree with.
Neither could do so.
No common ground it seems but at least the debate wasn’t the shouting match that some had feared. Listen and decide for yourself.
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
FG have been in Government for the last 10 years, homelessness increasing, rents increasing, and owning your own home is nearly impossible.
@rumug: Homelessness is not increasing. It is down over 2, 000 in the last 18 months per focus Ireland.
@rumug: So there’s only one explation, it has been their intention to goose up the price of property. I thought FF might change things but no, same BS policies that won’t change a thing. We’re being taken for suckers. The country is empty, yet as an Irish man, I can’t buy a piece of land outside dublin and build a house, as it’s locals only. I’m thinking of emigrating, this dump of a country isn’t worth it.
@Fionn Darland: There were 8,737 people homeless in the week of the 19th – 25th of October 2020 across Ireland. This figure includes adults and children. The number of homeless families has increased by 232% since July 2014 when the monthly figures started being published. Focus Ireland.
@Fionn Darland: piss off
@Fionn Darland: Ah sure, isn’t that great.
@JoyMonkey: if it’s such a kip **** o**.
@JoyMonkey: surely you can buy an already built house. Roscommon has plenty of empty houses.
@JoyMonkey: That’s the other problem with housing, there’s far too many one off housing in rural Ireland, while at the same time towns and villages have no development policies to build up their infrastructure.
I cannot believe FG are trying to blame SF for the housing mess they caused. Like are they just that obsessed and out of touch?
@Keith O’Reilly: We’ll Eoin O’Broin is opposed to social housing in his area and he is the SF spokesman on Housing. You couldn’t make it up.
@Keith O’Reilly: Maybe if sf council members stop blocking housing developments, like the one in the article, the housing situation could improve.
@Fionn Darland: 50% of homes on council owned land to be sold privately at over 400,000 and “affordable” 2 bed apartments for 357,000. Yeah that’s exactly what the working people of Dublin need
@Fionn Darland: LOL if FG Govs would build houses then it would improve ..
@Tim Quigley: Along with everyone else they voted against it yes, like FF, SD and greens.
@Daryl Walsh: these prices are a SF makey up numbers, SF councilors block building of homes to make the homeless figures look worse than they are.
@Tim Quigley: did you read any of it or listen to the debate? They have an alternative proposal in place. Small percentage social (which would cost the state) loads. Some affordable, but not actually affordable and the rest for private sale
@Chris Mc: They blocking the ones that are FG makey up stories of what they actually are .. and it seems every party has people blocking housing for certian reasons .. But FG have been in power for 10 years or so now and things have got worse and that is a fact. They came into power and one of their mantras was that they would not let the Celtic Tiger happen agian, well the false Celtic Tiger occured due to a housing crisis and shortage and here we are again in the same situation.
@Aidan O’ Neill: Of course he didnt, hes just a FG parrott ..
@Da Dell: but housing is the councils remit and Dublin City Council have been dominated by SF in that period.
@Mark Scott: but but but FG wont build the 35k required houses period.
@Tim Quigley: he is not opposed to public housing in his area. He is opposed to the piss poor planning of public housing in his area. Read the contents of the objection and the feedback from the people living in the area who were happy to have public housing but appalled at the total lack of joined up planning for the scheme. Life is not for or against and black or white. There is context in decision. Educate yourself on the facts of the objection and you will reasonably conclude the objection was valid. We should not accept shoddy standards and planning because we live with the effects for generations.
@Tim Quigley: Most politicians are very active in campaigning against many housing developments in their own areas by siding with vocal NIMBY groups. Its an absolute disgrace.
@Daryl Walsh: What are you saying. The site will likely never now be developed so nobody will benefit from any social or affordable homes in what is an excellently located development site. Great job SF as usual!!!
@Fionn Darland: why do people actually make this point ? The reason they are blocked is obviously pointed out that the prices are way way too high ?????
O Broin knows what he is talking about in contrast to Bruton with his spoofing. Fact is the Blueshirts have been in 10 years and have implemented policies for the benefit of landlords and developers.
@Ronaldo Blanc: so are you saying that on that 850 house development, all the houses should go to social housing, where rents are a small percentage of what private rent are and the regular tax paying individual has to pay obscene amounts of money when they want to buy or rent a house. That kind of idea will just push the private house market up and encourage free homes for layabouts.
@Francis: you’re going to get a shock when you realise that the government has done exactly that by taking a third of private housing stock through HAP and making rents the highest they’ve ever been.
Its FG policy to drive up prices because their voters own all the property.
@Shane Carroll: a bit of a difference between 1/3 and all the houses. SF are in favour of giving people free houses with no realistic way of paying for them except tax the shite out working people. They wil encourage the layabout idea and discourage people from working hard and succeeding. They prophecise that they could build 120000 house a year which was unrealistic at best.
@Francis: not all the social housing is for rent. There are schemes for buying to those who are too wealthy for social renting but too poor to buying in private market. This scheme is great for young people. It’s a confined sales to first time buyers, first time buyers that meet certain criteria, and the house is for living, not to rent. It’s like social renting, only not sublet permitted, or live half time elsewhere. If the person don’t use the house for living, the purchase is reverted. Those schemes are normally implemented by the councils so the young people of the council can stay close to their family, stay in their council
@Maria Quinn: why do people feel they are entitled to live near their family if they can’t afford to. If an affordable house is 45 minutes away why shouldn’t they move there. It sou ds good in theory but some one has to pay for that house and that’s is the tax payer. Why should I pay my own mortgage and pay for some one else mortgage. My taxes could be better used in the health or education sector.
@Ronaldo Blanc:
€160,000 for a starter home in Beziers, France (same size as Cork!)
€230,000 for a starter home in Cork, Ireland
- €70,000 more expensive in Ireland – WHY? – a very very defective Constitution.
R Bruton and E O’Broin TDs should get the Referendum on Housing DONE! …
https://www.change.org/p/irish-referendum-on-family-home-special-status
@Neuville-Kepler62F: so you think house prices should be relative to what a person earns. So 2 identical houses next door to each other should be different prices depending who is buying it. 1 couple earning 120000a year should pay more for a house than a couple earning 70000 a year? How is that a fair system?
@Francis: Only a FG reptile could have issues with people wanting to live near their family or friends, you should run for office and see how many agree with you.
@Da Dell: i move to where I could afford to buy a house, away from family and friends back in 2013 on minimum wage because I don’t want to be a leech on society or expect others to pay my pay.
It is a bad reflection on a person when their first comment to another person is an attempted insult. Please don’t comment unless you can be civil towards others.
@Francis: I will talk to you any way i like, and when you make comments like that i will say its reptilian dinosaur stuff with your ‘entitlement’ and ‘free houses’ … I have worked all my life, emigrated twice and never been on on the dole either pal .. There is no such thing as a free house either. I left Dublin towards the end of the Celtic Tiger cause even though I could afford it I refused to pay extortionate rents any more, I moved to Kilkenny and bought a house for less than 1/3 of what I was paying in rent and then commuted back for 7 years taking 5 hours every day, so spare me your crocodile tears and drivel. Lack of proper planning, lack of building house and pandering to vested interests like Corporate landlords and Vulture Funds by successive Gov’s is the problem and not SF or others never in Gov.
@Da Dell: ah, you feel hard done by having to move to kilkenny way back then. Well, put on your big boy pants and get over it. SF and others haven’t come up with what could be called a feasible plan to solve house availability or price idir. SF objecting to planning will cause houses been built and developed in wrong locations adding to the problem that exist.
@Francis: and there it is, free housing! It’s affordable housing for low and middle income workers ffs. There are families all over this country in hotel rooms and on friends couches.
@padar: your too late to this conversation mate, good night
@Francis: so was your sister, mate. Night.
@Francis: yeah do ya hear yourself at all, were you patting yourself on the back for doing the same as if no one else has done it eh !! It dosent make it right or something to aspire too either. And you blame those not in power for not solving something not of their making .. All parties have had people who have objected to housing at some stage for whatever reasons …
Reports show what numbers of houses are required to be build every year and not even a fraction of that has been done any year. Simple fact is that those that have been in power are ideologically opposed to building houses, it goes against their puppet-masters wishes too and i wager a bet that you vote for these ..
@Da Dell: looks like I’m living rent free your head at the moment. Its true ff FG haven’t built any houses in the last 20 years.
@Francis: If that is true SF are living rent free in yours … and yeah they have built only a fraction of the 35k required every year for a functioning economy for the last 10 anyways
@padar: dont confuse the chap with his FG sponsored ‘Free Houses’ narrative ..
@Neuville-Kepler62F: Béziers has a population of 77k and is classified as a town with economy driven by agriculture and tourism.
Cork is a city and the second largest city of Ireland 130k with multinational companies making up a significant portion of its economy..
You can’t compare the two ..
@Ciaran: 130k? What kind of a city is that? Dublin:544k, Belfast 344k/631k?
@Da Dell: i think I have you rattled now.
@Francis: of course, i hit the bottle hard an all ..
PS: BS dosent rattle me, but you keep on with your thinking, maybe sometime youll get it right …
@Francis: So your argument against properly priced public housing is that other people have wrongly paid fortunes up to now so we should allow that to continue for the sake of some strange sense of equality and you also believe that lower rents on public housing will push private rents up? Where are all these layabouts you mention? Before covid we had full employment so please, tell us all where these hordes of layabouts are. We had mass housing projects in the 50s and 60s. There is no evidence this triggered a generation of layabouts. I have a mortgage like a lot of people, I’m lucky enough to earn a decent wage, I paid a lot for my home and I have no problem with large volumes of affordable public housing being made available. It doesn’t effect me, I have a place to live. Have a look at the numbers of people in Ireland who work in hospitality and retail which are low paying jobs. They simply can’t get to the levels of rent or house price being discussed as affordable and what they can currently afford is so far away from the locations they work that it prevents quality of life. This is no way to plan a balanced and fair society. Housing is a social issue about people living in communities and having long term security. Its not about what the person next door paid. Our government are handing publically owned land over to private companies for free to make fortunes developing with Littlemore no benefit to the citizen in need. Its a scandal that should anger all citizens. No matter how much you earn its still your resource and I would rather see it used for a purpose other than to line developers pockets.
@Gerard Smith: Hey forgot to say earlier, will you pass on my condolences to Bernie when you can please .,dc cvdxdq
@Gerard Smith .. OMG sorrry bot that, dont know how i done that, that was meant to be in my whatsapp web .. have received some bad news and I have had a few whiskeys ..
Alos thats an excellent comment you made back to Francis and very well put .. as also a house owner with a mortgage I totally agree with what you had said there and I would vote for you if you were a politican
@Francis: And create long term ghettos!!
@Ciaran: ..”You can’t compare the two .. wrong answer. I just did.
37% of the cost of a first home in Ireland is artificially inflated by mainly levies and taxes. VAT alone is €28,000 – no VAT on homes in France. … looks like you need some yellow vests in Ireland!
Richard Bruton has a six pack. Ffs.
@Vonvonic: dream boat of a man.
@Vonvonic: Not Ffs, Fgs actually!
@Vonvonic: Fair play to him, I hope I have one at his age, I wouldn’t even mind having one at my age!
@Madra: is that boat the Titanic? cause that was impressive to look at but abject shambles as sea going vessel.
@Richard Cronin: lol
Yes we should all listen to the multimillionaire Bruton advice to the ‘little’ people as he bakes some cakes.
@Da Dell: Bakes cakes? Blackrock private college educated OBroin must have a few bob too.
@Fionn Darland: radical chic is all the rage these days
@Fionn Darland: im sure he has, but id say nowhere near Bruton ..
@Fionn Darland: I’d have a bigger problem with our government paying the wages of teachers in fee paying private schools and creating further inequality in our educational system than where Eoin O Broin was educated.
How about just get back to build houses for now.
Wow! Brutons quote in that article !! He literally says FG’s priority is with the private market.
It would be funny if the situation wasn’t worrying
Seems to be conflict with “journal” have sponsored puff pieces with housing developer’s etc now this
@herp: Quote ” It went along predictable lines, Doherty attacked Fine Gael’s “failed” housing policy ” jaysus the tone and content of the journal article is also predictable ..
Then we have reference to Leo pretending there is not a border or a multiple party gov in NI when it suits him .. “Varadkar said that Sinn Féin’s in the north was no better. “
Can people remember Leo whining about how hard it was for him to deal with the DUP over Brexit, maybe Leo should put his money where his mouth is an run some FG candidates in NI and then solve all NI problems
One thing interesting is the rent relief has not be restored by the government. With the pandemic you would have thought the rent relief would have been a great way to reduce the burden of people … maybe better than paying off housing assistance …. The problem is the rent relief exposes the rent income of landlords, taxable income, expose frauds of landlords to the taxpayers
@Maria Quinn: rent relief doesn’t work Maria without rent caps. It simply serves to push house prices up. The rules governing rent increases are for lip service only and can be navigated around quite easily.
People deserve better reporting that this diatribe.
Fine Gael has failed miserably in its housing policy.
have your say