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THE POPE HAS ended his official two-day visit to Ireland.
There was a packed schedule for the pope today, with events starting at Knock Shrine in Co Mayo, before a mass at the Pope’s Cross in the Phoenix Park attended by thousands of people.
There were also a number of demonstrations around the country in solidarity with survivors of clerical abuse. Take a look back:
Good morning! It was an early start at Knock Shrine for people hoping to catch a glimpse of Pope Francis. So far the weather has not been in their favour…
The pope is due at Knock Shrine at 9.45am and in the last few minutes he landed at Knock International Airport.
Some local children on the runway to meet the pope and welcome him.
Meanwhile, Daragh Brophy reports there are 8km tailbacks in Mayo this morning.
Some 45,000 people applied for the free tickets to the pope’s Knock visit. Organisers were encouraging them to travel by coach, warning motorists that they would face a 3km walk to the event.
Pope Francis will only stay in Knock for about an hour. At the shrine he will lead the Angelus prayer – the time has been changed to fit his schedule.
If you are in Dublin, don’t forget that there are road closures – 80 in total – there too due to the mass at the Phoenix Park later.
Areas impacted include Ballyfermot, Chapelizod, Castleknock, Navan Road, Islandbridge, and the north and south quays.
People are advised to take public transport, but these services are expected to be very busy as the hundreds of thousands attending the mass will be using the bus and Luas to get there.
If you really need to get somewhere today, here’s our bumper guide for getting around.
Speaking of the Phoenix Park, roaming reporters Daragh Brophy and Nicky Ryan are there and have some live footage for us on Facebook.
We hope they have their wellies on, it looks very wet there…
They do, at the very least, have an umbrella between them:
And a spacious media centre to shelter in…
The first of the mass goers are being allowed in to take their seats. It will be a long wait for them now though.
To coincide with the mass at the Phoenix Park later, we will also have an event at the the Garden of Remembrance. People will gather in solidarity with with survivors of clerical abuse.
Artists including Hozier, Roisin O from Thanks Brother and Liam O’Maonlai will perform at it.
And in Tuam, Co Galway, Catherine Corless has oraganised an event to remember everyone who died at the mother and baby home.
There was disappointment yesterday that the pope did not apologise or acknowledge a cover-up by the Church in his speech, though he did address the general topic of child sexual abuse by members of the clergy.
Last night, Darren McGavin, a survivor of abuse at the hands of former priest Tony Walsh called for greater accountability within the Catholic Church.
McGavin told a ‘Separate Church and State’ meeting at Dublin’s Gresham Hotel last night that he had hoped to meet with the pope during his visit “because I represent nine lads in Ballyfermot that died from suicide at the hands of Fr Tony Walsh”.
Pope Francis has now arrived in Knock village and is driving through in the Popemobile, thankfully not as quickly as he travelled through Dublin yesterday.
Pope Francis has arrived at Knock Apparition Chapel.
We have an update from Daragh Brophy at the Phoenix Park:
“It was very wet indeed here at the site of the papal Mass, when we arrived shortly after 9am this morning.
“The weather has eased a bit now. There’s a steady stream of people arriving – but it’s mostly people involved in the ceremony at the moment (choirs, priests etc).
One women who’s singing today said she had walked to the papal cross from O’Connell Street. She was also at the concert at Croke Park last night and said she was delighted the pope had spent so long touring the playing field in his Popemobile.
“There’ll be more of that later, before the Mass itself starts at 3pm. The pope will be here at 2.30 and will, once again, tour the site on the back of his custom vehicle.
“There are reporters from around 30 countries in a giant media centre with 400 work areas – including lots of reporters from religious newspapers and broadcasters.”
Pilgrims in Knock are now joining the pope in a silent prayer.
If you’re interested in learning more about how Knock turned into a global pilgrimage site, we’ve got everything you need to know about the ‘strange occurrences’ here.
Next, Pope Francis will deliver a brief address to those gathered outside and will then lead them in the Angelus prayer, which will be in Latin.
Pope Francis is now addressing the crowd.
Speaking of his prayer to the Virgin Mary inside the chapel, he said: “I presented to her all the victims of abuse, of whatever kind, committed by members of the Church in Ireland.
“None of us can fail to be moved by the stories of young people who suffered abuse, were robbed of their innocence and left scarred by painful memories. This open wound challenges us to be firm and decisive in the pursuit of truth and justice.
“I beg the lord’s forgiveness for these sins and for the scandal and betrayal felt by so many in God’s family. I ask our blessed mother to intercede for the healing of the survivors and to confirm every member of our Christian family in the resolve never again to permit these situations to occur.”
The pope is back in his Skoda, windows down, on his way back to the airport. He is a little behind schedule for this flight back to Dublin.
Store this in your brain for future table quizzes:
RTÉ is speaking to the family who greeted the pope when he got off the plane in Knock. Mary McCarthy said “time stood still” when he came down the steps and stood in front of her.
“I had to take the opportunity to kiss him on both cheeks, I didn’t think I’d ever get that opportunity.”
Pope Francis gave them each rosary beads and asked them to pray for him.
Abuse survivor Colm O’Gorman has been reacting to the pope’s address in Knock.
Remember O’Gorman has organised an event in support of abuse survivors this afternoon to coincide with the Phoenix Park mass. He said thousands of people are expected to attend.
Parish priest Fr Richard Gibbons, who is presiding over the pope’s visit to Knock, spoke to us as part of a report on the abortion referendum campaign back at the start of May.
We also visited the nearby small town of Kiltimagh, where we spoke to activists calling for a Yes vote in the referendum.
It’s worth a watch if you’re interested in knowing more about attitudes towards the Church in the area, and how they have changed since the last papal visit in ’79 and the 8th Amendment referendum in 1983.
So, next on the itinerary for the pontiff is a lunch with the papal delegation, once he lands back in Dublin. And after that he will travel to the Phoenix Park – he is due to arrive there at 2.30pm.
Up to 500,000 people are expected to attend the mass.
Back in 1979, the last papal visit to Ireland, over 1.25 million people attended the mass in the Phoenix Park to see Pope John Paul II.
Our reporter Nicky Ryan, who is at the Phoenix Park said there is a high level of security and people have been arriving since early this morning to get a good spot.
He and fellow roaming reporter Daragh Brophy are braving the rain to bring you updates from the park today.
They spoke to sisters Breda Regan and Pauline Lenihan who have brought the same chair their parents brought to the 1979 mass.
“I’ve kind of nostalgic reasons for coming. We’re born and bred Catholics, none of us are as good as we used to be in our youth but we’re still hanging in,” Pauline told them.
Good news from another early arrival Declan Brady, who said the journey there was “very easy”.
“There must have been about 30 or 40 buses waiting and we ended up coming in a bus on or own – we were probably first to leave Swords, there were only three of us on the bus. I’d say once the rain eases off, people will come in droves.”
“We’ve been walking for maybe about an hour and leisurely at that so it hasn’t been a problem,” he added.
We are not sure what is on the menu for the pope’s lunch this afternoon, but the reporters in the Phoenix Park are being well fed anyway…
Bring us back a bit of cake will you, Daragh?
Er, maybe keep the horses off the red carpet…
We have some pictures now from the pope’s visit to Knock:
As we mentioned earlier, there has been criticism again today of the pope’s choice of words in relation to clerical abuse.
He made reference to survivors in his address to the crowd in Knock earlier, and begged for God’s forgiveness for “these sins”.
Abuse survivor Colm O’Gorman pointed out that, again, the pope did not mention accountability “or the Vatican’s responsibility for directing the cover up of these crimes”.
We are hearing that the official headcount for Phoenix Park at the moment is 50,000. Of course, it’s still early – the mass doesn’t start for about another two hours.
Our roaming reporter Nicky Ryan said the numbers heading to the park are starting to build now:
A special shoutout to Paul the bus driver for getting Nicky back into the city centre…
He – Nicky, not Paul the bus driver – will be heading to the Stand for Truth demonstration at the Garden of Remembrance later. There he will speak to people who have attended to stand in solidarity with clerical sex abuse survivors.
And don’t forget there is also an event in Tuam this afternoon to remember those who died at the Co Galway mother and baby home.
Marian Cassidy, who is attending the mass at the Phoenix Park, told us she’d like to hear the pope announce Dubliner Matt Talbot is to be canonised.
Talbot, who was an unskilled laborer, is considered the patron of men and women who are struggling with alcoholism, though he has never been formally recognised as a saint.
He was an alcoholic from the age of 13, but took the pledge at 28 and never drank again. Talbot said he found strength in the early years of his sobriety in prayer and became a devout Catholic.
He died on heart failure in 1925 and when his body was found it was discovered that he wore chains around his waist, one of his arms, and one of his legs, as well as chords around the other arm and leg. These were symbols of his devotion to Mary and his wish be her servant.
“I would love it with all my heart,” Marian Cassidy said of the possibility that Pope Francis could announce Talbot’s canonisation.
She has been praying to him for 40 years.
We have more from the Phoenix Park, where pilgrims are continuing to filter in for this afternoon’s mass. Less than an hour to go now…
Daragh Brophy, still reporting from the park has set the scene for us – he said people came well prepared:
“Raincoats and backpacks were the uniform of the day, and everyone we spoke to said they’d brought a packed lunch.”
Dublin Fire Brigade are among those keeping tabs on those arriving to the Phoenix Park for the pope’s visit. Here’s the latest view from their control tower.
Latest imagery from our command unit in @phoenixparkopw. Corrals starting to fill up, people moving well #PhoenixPark #PopeInIreland #PopeInThePark pic.twitter.com/aSwj5577Vt
— Dublin Fire Brigade (@DubFireBrigade) August 26, 2018
Tánaiste Simon Coveney has given his take on Pope Francis’ comments on clerical abuse.
He said they show he is “clearly angered” by what took place. Speaking to RTÉ Coveney said the pope’s remarks included “the strongest language I’ve ever heard from a pope”.
This photo from An Garda Síochána shows the Phoenix Park is starting to fill up. Just a half an hour now until Pope Francis is due to arrive for his mass…
And here’s the latest update from our reporter Daragh Brophy, who is awaiting the pontiff’s arrival at the park:
“The media centre is rammed now, and there’s been a noticeable uptick in activity as crews get everything organised in time for the pope’s arrival outside.
“Weather-wise, the worst of the rain has stopped but there’s still some misty showers about and most people arriving have either a poncho or a proper raincoat.
“We’ve just been let up to the raised platform overlooking the crowd.
“Much larger crowds coming in from the main drag of the park, Chesterfield Avenue, and from Islandbridge direction.”
It is worth pointing out in the context of discussion around sex abuse by members of the clergy in Ireland that news on the topic broke in the US this morning.
The Vatican’s retired ambassador to the US has accused the pope of failing to act on abuse by an ex-Cardinal.
In an 11-page letter, he claims Pope Francis initially rehabilitated Theodore McCarrick despite being informed of his penchant for young seminarians in 2013, soon after he was elected pope.
As pilgrims flock into the Phoenix Park, crowds are also starting to gather at the Garden of Remembrance for the Stand for Truth event:
And at the GPO, people are currently gathering for the Nope to the Pope protest:
Lisa Breslin told the crowd the people of Ireland stand in solidarity with abuse victims and “there is no need for them to be afraid anymore.
“The Catholic Church is losing its power and the world is waking up to the reality of this institutional power,” she added, receiving a big cheer.
Back at the Phoenix Park, the congregation is growing steadily, though it is not expected to reach the 500,000 figures we have been hearing the the lead-up.
The weather may have been a contributing factor in that, as well as the long walk facing pilgrims and the ban on mobility scooters.
And the pope has arrived at the Phoenix Park. He starts by driving around to wave to the crowd gathered in the rain to greet him:
This from our reporter Daragh Brophy:
“Another weather update for you. That was QUITE the squall we had there, but the rain and wind has died down a fair bit now.
It’s still showery and breezy here in the Phoenix Park. The pope has just arrived.
Pope Francis is smiling and waving.
“He looks a little windswept.
“Enthusiastic cheers from the crowd and people are waving Vatican flags as he tours the site.
The Popemobile stopped briefly there as he shook hands with wellwishers.
Daragh tells us people are reaching up to greet him wherever they can, but not everyone is quite so lucky.
“People are running through open spaces towards barriers to try and catch a closer look,” he said.
Daragh Brophy reports from the park:
“The Popemobile slowed down as the pope made his way through the busier areas of the crowd.
There were some complaints yesterday that his parade through Dublin city centre proceeded with unanticipated haste.
He’s moving at a rather more stately pace here.
“He’s going all about the site, and isn’t due to begin celebrating Mass until 3pm.
“My next few updates may also be about a man moving around atop a vehicle, in other words, so feel free to come back later.”
But not too much later, readers, if you want to catch the mass. It is due to start in about 20 minutes.
The Taoiseach isn’t too happy about the weather today it seems, though President Higgins is still having a ball:
Back at the Garden of Remembrance, our reporter Nicky Ryan says the crowd at the Stand for Truth event – standing in solidarity with abuse survivors – is growing fast.
And in Tuam, an demonstration to remember those who died at the Tuam Mother and Baby Home has also started.
The crowd, which includes hundreds of people, is walking in silence:
At the Phoenix Park, the pope is still touring the site.
Daragh Brophy tells us there is still a fair bit of space in the sprawling site that’s been set aside in the park to host the papal event.
“500,000 tickets were sent out, free of charge, but the rain may well have put some people off this morning. A million people attended Pope John Paul’s Mass here in 1979,” he says.
A sign of how much Ireland has changed over the last 39 years… Bishop Eamon Casey and Father Michael Cleary acted as the warm-up act for the pontiff during his ’79 visit.
Wondering why the pope’s registration number is SCV 1?
From Daragh:
“According to an article in the Telegraph that I just Googled it’s the registration given to all Popemobiles and “is an abbreviation of the Italian and Latin names for Vatican City, Stato della Città del Vaticano and Status Civitatis Vaticanae, respectively”.
“I may be back with more facts purloined from that Popemobile article, if this driveabout doesn’t end soon.”
More from outside the Garden of Remembrance:
The mass at the Phoenix Park is about to begin – the crowd as been asked to refrain from holding up banners or waving flags now.
Here’s a view of the crowd size in the park. We won’t have official numbers from the gardaí until afterwards – people are still making their way inside.
The Stand for Truth event is also about to begin in Dublin’s city centre.
We’ll be bringing you updates from that as well as the mass in the Phoenix Park over the next couple of hours, so stay with us.
Large cheers from the congregation at the Phoenix Park at the first sight of the pontiff on the altar:
As the mass gets underway, Daragh has some thoughts on bishops’ attire:
“The thought ‘some of these bishops have very impressive hats’ just occurred to me. I know they’re referred to as mitres, but my knowledge more-or-less ended there (I’ve only been papal correspondent since yesterday morning). So here’s a bit more info from an ABC News article:
“The tall folded hat worn by popes and other bishops is called a mitre, and is an ancient symbol of priestly authority. Mitre’s come in several styles: simplex or simple, made of white linen or silk; pretiosa or precious, adorned in precious stones; and auriphrygiata or gold (seen here) made of gold cloth or white cloth with a gold fringe, typically worn during celebrations.”
Archbishop Diarmuid Martin in his opening prayer says the Church in Ireland has gone through a difficult time, noting the people have been “wounded” by members of the clergy.
Archbishop of Dublin Diarmuid Martin is talking about the papal cross.
We are gathering around this cross in the hope of a spring for the Irish church, he says.
A spring that does not with to cover up those dark days.
The Church in Ireland needs the message of Jesus to reappear in all it’s hopefulness, he says.
Faith in Ireland is strong, he says. But it is also fragile.
The Pope begins by asking for forgiveness for abuses against people by members of the clergy.
“We ask forgiveness for the abuse in Ireland. Abuses of power, conscience and sexual abuse perpetrated by members with roles of responsibility in the Church.”
He also asks for forgiveness for some members of the Church hierarchy who “did not take charge of painful situations and kept quiet”.
In his prayer, Pope Francis asked pardon “for all the abuses for all the abuses committed in various types of institutions run by male or female religious and by other members of the Church and we ask for forgiveness”.
He said the Church was also asking for forgiveness for those exploited through manual work.
Back at the Garden of Remembrance, abuse survivor Colm O’Gorman started the solidarity gathering by asking the large crowd to silently consider why they are there.
“And then think about our shared intent – what we bring here as individuals, as people, as women, as men, as children as people living in this country and what we’ve got to say to the world. We’re here to stand for truth.”
Following a song by Mry Coughlan – Magdelene Laundry – Brian Kennedy took to the stage, encouraging the crowd to chant “truth, justice and love”.
And in Tuam, Catherine Corless has joined survivors of mother and baby homes:
Outside the Garden of Remembrance, Brian Kennedy sings ‘Imagine’ and the crowd joins in:
Meanwhile back at the Phoenix Park, the pope is leading the prayers again, speaking now about the importance of family.
We’ve heard the total number in attendance is just under 130,000. Here’s the latest aerial photo from the Air Corps:
A few moments of silent reflection now at the Phoenix Park:
Our reporter Daragh Brophy, who has been at the Phoenix Park all day, says the pope’s earlier comments on abuses by Church members were not necessarily expected:
“Material on what he would say in his homily was distributed to the press ahead of the Mass – and his remarks at the opening of the ceremony were a departure from that,” he said.
If you missed it earlier, here are some of his comments:
“We ask forgiveness for the abuse in Ireland. Abuses of power, conscience and sexual abuse perpetrated by members with roles of responsibility in the Church.
In a special way we ask pardon for all the abuses committed in various institutions run by male or female religious members of the church and we ask for forgiveness for those cases of exploitation through manual work that so many young women and men were subjected to.
“We ask forgiveness for the times that as a church we did not show survivors of whatever kind of abuse compassion and the seeking of justice and truth through concrete actions. We ask for forgiveness.”
Gifts now being brought to the altar by families, including Emma Mhic Mhathuna – one of the woman impacted by the Cervical Check scandal – and her children:
If you’re curious about the music today, Daragh Brophy tells us that in total, 3,000 voices from across all 26 dioceses will make up the main choir.
“Many more will contribute to the congregational singing with their own parish choirs in the corrals spread across the Phoenix Park,” he explained.
“Individuals and choirs have been rehearsing together locally in their dioceses for a number of months but this was the first time that the countrywide group was brought together.”
Daragh has also just realised he unintentionally joined the Vatican delegation:
If you missed Archbiship Diarmuid Martin’s welcome earlier, here are some extracts:
“It is commonplace to say that today you come to a different Ireland. The Church in Ireland has gone through challenging times. People have been wounded in the depth of their being by Church people; people’s faith has been challenged and the Church of Jesus Christ has been wounded.
“This Cross which dominates our gathering today is a symbol. It was probably never intended to be a permanent memorial. There were times when people asked that it be removed. There were times when this Cross appeared starkly isolated in the bleakness of an Irish winter.
In these years Ireland has had its winter moments but also its moments of spring. Those of us who know what an Irish winter is like – and we have had good experience of that this year – know also what happens when the first rays of spring sun emerge. Ireland changes.
“Today we gather around the same cross in the hope of a spring for the Irish Church. We look towards a spring sun that does not wish to cover up the harshness of dark days. We wish rather to help families realise anew that the future of Ireland needs the light of the message of Jesus Christ to reappear in all its simplicity and hopefulness.”
We told you earlier that fewer than 130,000 people are in attendance, though 500,000 tickets were sold.
Our reporter Stephen McDermott has reminded us that this month, HSE emergency chiefs warned those with health problems against attending the mass if they were unable to do so, while poor weather is also understood to have kept many mass-goers at home.
He also notes a significant number of tickets were snapped up by protesters when they were made available in July, with some booking hundreds of tickets without any intention of attending today’s mass.
Some more images from the park:
Let’s hear now from our reporter Nicky Ryan, who is outside the Garden of Remembrance.
He tells us writer Marian Keyes made a particularly strong speech:
“More than anything, what we need from the Catholic Church is humility…that these were real children, women, babies…and nothing they [the Church] have said has shown that they think we’re real.”
Hozier also performed at the gathering:
And Colm O’Gorman shared his own story of clerical sex abuse, which he said started soon after John Paul II’s visit, during which he made the ‘young people of Ireland, I love you’ speech.
“You did not love us,” O’Gorman said.
The crowd is now going to start moving in silence to Sean McDermott Street, the site of one of the last Magdalene Laundries.
In Tuam, the names of 796 babies were read out, as people in the crowd held up cards which also had individual names on them:
Earlier in the Phoenix Park, Pope Francis specifically addressed the treatment of women who in the past became pregnant outside of marriage:
“We ask for forgiveness for those times in which many single mothers were told that to seek out their children who had been separated from them, and the same time being said to the daughters and sons themselves, that this was a mortal sin. This is not a mortal sin. We ask for forgiveness.”
The Mass at the Phoenix Park is now coming to an end. The crowd was told that more than 500,000 people were there, but that’s not quite right. We’re hearing around 130,000, but we will have to wait for official figures after it’s all over. As soon as we find out you guys will be the first to know…
And the big announcement people were waiting for – the next World Meeting of Families will be held in Rome in 2021. So the pope won’t have far to travel.
Roaming reporter Nicky Ryan is bringing us footage live on Facebook now from the Stand for Truth walk to Sean McDermott street, the site of a former Magdalene Laundry.
They are making their way there in silence.
At the same time, Pope Francis is delivering his final remarks. He thanks everyone, “religious or not”, to large cheers from the congregation.
The Stand for Truth crowd has arrived at the former Magdalene Laundry on Sean McDermott Street:
And in the Phoenix Park, announcements are being made about how people should leave the site. Some sections being asked to remain where they are for the moment, until they’re given a gate to exit, Daragh Brophy tells us.
They were also being asked not to push and to be mindful of children in the crowd.
“People are taking selfies at the site. ‘If you are asked to stop at any point by stewards you are asked to please obey,’ announcer says. ‘Slán Abhaile.’ … Entertainment is to continue here at the site for the moment.”
Now, road closures today were only supposed to be in place until 5.15pm at the latest, but it is likely that there will be disruption for the next couple of hours as the thousands of people who attended the mass make their way home.
We have more from Nicky Ryan now at the former Magdalene Laundry on Sean McDermott Street.
“You are not forgotten. We love you. We stand with you,” reads one message. Another says: “For my mother, whose abuse was buried by the parish priests.”
And another: “For everyone they hurt…”
The crowd walked there in complete silence:
The last item on Pope Francis’ itinerary is the farewell ceremony at Dublin Airport, which will take place at 6.30pm. After this the pontiff will board his flight back to Rome.
The Stand for Truth gathering has also now concluded:
Here is the crew that will be travelling with the pontiff as he makes his journey home:
The Pope will be arriving shortly at Dublin Airport.
Some last minute handshakes from Pope Francis…
A final wave from the steps of the Aer Lingus plane that will take him home:
Ahead of the Pope’s departure from Dublin Airport, Taoiseach Leo Varadkar has welcomed his call for action and forgiveness in relation to clerical sex abuse, but once again said words should be followed by action.
We welcome Pope Francis’s call for firm and decisive action and for forgiveness. We now ask that from words flow actions. We thank Pope Francis for his visit, and ask for his prayers. pic.twitter.com/6cg2YKh6Pr
— Leo Varadkar (@campaignforleo) August 26, 2018
A sense of normality is resuming in the Phoenix Park, where our tireless reporter Daragh Brophy is still (just about) hanging on.
I'm walking back to the city from the cross. Park v quiet by now pilgrims in ones and twos walking towards Chesterfield Ave. #PopeinIreland pic.twitter.com/lWFFn7ti7W
— Daragh Brophy (@DaraghBroph) August 26, 2018
And he’s off.
Pope Francis boards his plane for his flight back to Italy #popeinireland pic.twitter.com/enCoZhwFnW
— RTÉ News (@rtenews) August 26, 2018
Back in Rome, Vatican News – the official news source of the Holy See – has called the pope’s request for a pardon for clerical abuse, made during his Mass at the Phoenix Park, “unprecedented and unexpected”.
Elsewhere, at least 1,000 people gathered for a vigil at the site of a former home for unmarried mothers in Tuam, Co Galway, to coincide with the papal visit.
Here are a selection of images from the protest taken by PA’s Niall Carson:
Dr Umar Al-Qadri, head of the Islamic Centre Ireland, has expressed his support for demonstrators who attended today’s Stand4Truth march in Dublin city centre.
I also congratulate those that are protesting against the injustices and the covering up by the #Church leadership. Religious leadership must be challenged when required and this ultimately strengthens faith because justice is the essence of faith. #Stand4Truth
— Shaykh Dr Umar Al-Qadri (@DrUmarAlQadri) August 26, 2018
Mayo for Psalm
@ianglen: You win!!!
@ianglen: Don’t knock it, maybe this is what’s needed, a papal visit.
@ianglen: where would you put him, right corner back maybe?
@Pseud O’Nym: In goal, his hands are well exercised from waving lol.
@ianglen: good shout putting him in goal, maybe he’ll have a better kick out than the other two clowns they have in goal
@Lazz Tonge: I think he stands for the victims of the church. But he just made a joke. Relax, it’s not like he cape abuse victims liars like the pope did.
@Dave O Keeffe: *called
Just so very very weird when you see an organization that has been responsible for some of the most horrendous abuses of children around the world now celebrating families.
It is so strange to see children being displayed in front of this organizations leader like a prize.
If this was an illegal cult we would be horrified.
@James Rhatigan: name me one organization that has not had corruption?
@Sayitlikeitis: name one organisation whose members have abused children as much?
@Sayitlikeitis: Are you comparing corruption to child abuse? If anyone else in power, like a Government Minister or Garda Superintendent tried to cover up child abuse there’d be, and rightfully so, uproar. But when it comes to the pope then people salivate over him. The same man that appointed Juan Barros as a bishop after Barros tried to cover up a child abuse case.
https://www.pri.org/stories/pope-appoints-chilean-bishop-accused-child-sex-cover.
@James Rhatigan: no organization in the history of mankind has done more sexual assault and molestation of minors…humans are a funny animal as in they just believe whatever they want to believe…the sexual abuse happened everywhere in the world the catholic church went…if that is not systemic i don’t know what to say…it needs to change..i.e. women need to be more involved and for the love of everything that is holy why can’t the good priests be allowed to marry and have children of their own
@Oisín O’Connor: The point is that this organisation is the only organisation that appears to be immune from prosecution and consequences. Not only that, but when criminal proceedings can be initiated, not only do they seem to be allowed to cover it up, but the leadership actually encourages covering it up, right in the public domain.
@Oisín O’Connor: Theresa May comes quite close?
@James Rhatigan: But James this is not something that is confined to the Catholic Church. It is an illness of man kind and your fellow human beings. To try and disassociate yourself from this is very narrow minded…lock up all priests and no more child abuse??? Think of all the crimes committed in China against your fellow human beings but I don’t see people protesting outside Chinese takeaways on a Saturday night. There are lots of spiritual and honest priests in the world who give their lives to the service of others. Can Catholics not go see the leader of the church without being branded.
@James Rhatigan: Many organisations are not in the business of promoting family values or morality. If they were, then they would quite rightly be in the spotlight in regards to the corruption of those so called values.
@Oisín O’Connor: Answer: Families
@Oisín O’Connor: organisations where children are easily accessed by paedophiles
@Feidhlim Mac Coimín: like schools, hospitals and churches? Hmmm, who runs most of them again?
@James Rhatigan: James, you brief comment is very telling. First its nice to know that at the very least you recognize that corruption is a bad thing. That at least is a start! You did after all try the whataboutism of ‘what about all these other groups with corruption?’
Sio you realise that there is clearly something wrong with transgression of moral norms.
But James, heres the thing, these ‘other’ organisations are not claiming to foster absolute morality and the RCC most certainly is doing so! That others do a bad thing and you accept it as such is self evidence enough to you that the church is immoral in its past and current actions.
Thats the first point, that you accept there is a wrong thing here and we know this because as a defense you pointed to others doing the wrong things. So we know you know its wrong.
Next nuns taking money for babies, the Vatican bank laundering money for nefarious groups and the taking of ‘donations’ by the worlds wealthiest organisation, from people very much less wealthy, the hiding of records or the associated accidental ‘great fires’ used to destroy such evidence is corruption, not abuse. In fact the Church put the New York mob families to shame in their expert handling of such cover ups. I wonder where they learned how to do all that?
BUT abusing children, enslaving pregnant women and putting them to hard forced labour over years, stealing their children and selling them for money, treating them as minions and convincing them they have committed some crime, lying to those children, even to this day, literally labeling them and their mothers as ‘offenders’, mistreating children so badly their mortality rate is five times that of the general population during a time of an epidemic, and disposing of the evidence (the bodies) in a sesspit over generations is not just corruption, thats tyranny, its also infanticide. You’ve heard these things are not good yes? These are the sort of things the local priest tells you is wholly immoral, that sort of thing? yes? You don’t need a priest to tell you its wrong either, you know its wrong, right?
So I think you actually understand the problem here, and its not a problem of the past either. This organisation is still at it. Do you think there aren’t currently the equivalent of Magdalene laundries in Asia, India, Africa and South America? Really? Do you think there are not currently just as many priests abusing children? Do you think the church learned from these moral transgressions or just worked out how to hide it better from authorities? They sure are not coming clean about it and putting measures in place to stamp it out and compensate their victims.
So I think you know right from wrong and jumped to this whataboutism as a last ditch attempt at excusing or justifying or explaining behavior.
But these ‘other’ organisations are not claiming to be the moral high ground or representatives of a deity now are they?
You can carry out a quick thought experiment so that you know you understand this…. it goes like this…. you have a choice of someone to babysit your children. The choices are a random priest, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin or Harold Shipman… put those choices in order of preference in your head there. That’ll explain to you how much you understand of this moral transgression.
All the victims want is for the hiding and running and corruption to cease, to stop, they are still at it! They also want proper complete transparency and for retribution to be made. They want oversight that these actions will not continue.
The Church is currently apologizing and paying lip service but doing nothing. This is wrong yes?
@James Rhatigan: this institution has actually helped more people then you could possibly ever understand, so why don’t whatch what you gotta say.
@Lazz Tonge: so that makes everything ok? “Yes there was rape, paedophilia and abuse but they helped people too so get over it” how many rapes are they allowed per life they improved in your opinion?
Is it just me or are all the anti catholic, anti pope , anti everything just absolutely fascinated by every move /speech made by the pope. I would say secretly yee are all kicking yourselves that you didn’t go.
@Rob: for people that have been hurt and damaged this is like rubbing salt in an open wound and are trying to make fun of them?
@Rob: it looks like the half million that got tickets didn’t even bother turning up. The sheep corals are half empty and the show has started.
@Daveinson: the sections are not ment to be full. The sections stretched right back to the monument.
@Rob: are they *meant to be empty? Waste of money.
@Ali Ní Dhomhnaill: 370,000 no shows
@Rob: lol are you serious? Why anyone would want to walk so far to stand in the cold and rain so they could listen to the leader of a pedo cult is beyond me. I doubt any anti RCC people are jealous. More baffled and disgusted.
It would be nice to read a bit less about what fran ‘says’ about abuse, and more of what he ‘does’ about it…
@The Risen: Needs action not words now. Damage is greater than he seems to realise.
@The Risen: it would be even better to read an article and it’s comments without your silly comments included!!
@The Risen: Oh, Hi Rob. There is a ‘mute’ function for you to hide the comments of any poster you wish. I don’t use it myself, as I also enjoy reading the comments of people I don’t agree with.
@The Risen: ok thanks, didn’t realize
@The Risen: this American boy seems to have it in for him now too, new revelations, he could be in bother frano
@The Risen: He has to have a certain amount of comments every day or he doesn’t get paid, thus the poor quality of the comments.
@The Risen: it would be nice to know what your opinions are on God, death, life as opposed to constantly hiding behind ‘abuse’ a mate???
https://youtu.be/bukrywa6suw
is more like it
@David Cagney: Tremendous
@David Cagney:
More hate.
More cynicism.
@David Cagney: Makes for a nicer world. Not.
@Jim Ni Suilleabhain: what else would you expect from people which have been abused and the company that enabled it can’t even apologise properly and hand over evidence whilst sheltering some of those responsible.
@Jim Ni Suilleabhain: Your surname makes no sense. Just thought you might want to know.
@Brian Ó Dálaigh: Surely if he’s entitled to use any pronoun he wants in English he can choose between Ó/Mac and Uí/Ní/Nic in Irish right? I just assumed he knew and that was his thing.
so I hear according to RTE MorningIreland 26/08/18 … Reported by speakers and survivors who attended the private meeting with The Pope on Saturday …The Pope had no idea what ‘Magdalene’ Laundries or ‘Asylum Refuges’ were…no idea what ‘industrial schools’ were …no idea what ‘Mother and Baby homes’ were though run by religious orders until 1980s/ 1990s in Ireland. Though there have been a multitude of reports written on religious-run ‘institutional abuse’ . On which the International Press has reported on for decades. Some similar institutions run by religious also existed in Canada and Australia etc.
Absolutely amazing speech from the pope. He addressed everything and more. #Forgiveness. Even apologized to single mothers <3
@Ali Ní Dhomhnaill: that’s great, everything is sorted now.
Just watching it here and crowds are tiny! And a lot of the crowd that is there looks to be from other countries. Finally we are seeing a revolt against the church. It’ll probably be the last time we see a pope for at least a couple of generations. Well, fingers crossed anyway!
@Gary O’Brien:”tiny” ? Really?
@SeanGabriel1453: not tiny but less than went to hear Ed Sheeran and attended the gay pride march (oh the delightful irony).
My daughter lives near the phoenix park and had a job interview today in dalkey. No buses, no luas, no dublin bikes, no cycling, massive road closures. In short, she couldn’t get out to connolly to get the dart and no interview. Imprisoned by the pope
@Anne Marie Devlin:
I’m not a fan of himself. But… it’s not like this was announced out of the blue. It’s been planned for weeks and she should have made alternative arrangements.
@Anne Marie Devlin: the pope didn’t close the roads. People were told to give plenty of time and make arrangements weeks ago. She obviously didn’t want the job that much. If it was me I’d have used alternative transport. She would have been less than a 10 minute walk from exiting the controlled access zone.
A job interview on a Sunday seems a bit odd anyway
@Dave O Keeffe: I was thinking the same.
Some awful sad individuals on this thread. Id hate to be filled with so much hatred. Live and let live.
@Donnacha Bhoicaire:
Live and let live??……you saying that to all the people who were abused by the catholic cult?
You’d want to go get a life!
I hope you never find yourself in a situation where a sexual assault or rape towards you is likely, just so I wont have to say to you “live and let live”.
Well done, I’d say your in the running for worst comment of the day…….you sir are an idiot.
@Gazza Lazza: ## off and let us enjoy the mass for ## sake you angry little person. There’s a time and a place. Turn on RTÉ and listen to the music and zone out of your head FOR FIVE MINUTES
@Feidhlim Mac Coimín: People like you are the problem, people who will just brush all of the shit the church has done under the carpet so they can enjoy their mass and listen to the music.
@Sam Harms: says the one who will look to be buried in catholic grounds when you eventually pass away.
@Feidhlim Mac Coimín:
Enjoy the mass all you like, not problem at all with that. In fact I’ve no problem at all what faith or ideology you choose to follow, each to their own.
I do however have a problem with hypocrisy, and even an honest Catholic would have to admit that the Vatican, the Catholic institution including this pope are full to the brim with hypocrisy.
You’re right I am angry. I am angry that the hypocrisy by this institution have destroyed the lives of many, many people, not just in this country but globally, especially the lives of children. I am angry that those involved do not practice what they preach again including this pope given the wide scope and nature of the abuses and cover up, also how victims were made to feel like they had done something wrong.
@Paul: nah I’ll probably be cremated.
@Feidhlim Mac Coimín: the head of the Vatican is here, a place where the Vatican has covered up abuse for decades, when would be more convenient to show him that he’s not doing enough?
@Paul: you do know that there are non religious burial facilities in Ireland right? Also you’re clearly a very mature individual with your little hastag there.
@Sam Harms: says the one with a Christian name, I suppose you don’t celebrate Christmas or birthdays either eh… cut out the bullshit.
@Paul: You mean birthdays and Christmas that started as Pagan traditions? I sure do.
@Sam Harms: proper hypocrite you are , enjoy stuffing your face over Christmas dinner.
@Donnacha Bhoicaire: nice to see people defending pedophiles. They get it so rough. Poor things. /s
It is being reported in the International press that a senior cardinal, apostolic nuncio, has given evidence Francis himself has covered up sexual abuse of children. Disgustingly, nothing in the Irish press.
Even the catholic fundamentalist sites are reporting it.
@Paul Fahey:
Not to mention the mass cover up of the clerical abuse in Chile where a group of 30 or so bishops are set to resign because of their roll in the cover up, side note, the pope has the final say in whether to accept their resignation or not. As far as I know he has yet to make a decision.
Il papa himself claimed he was unaware and didn’t know about the ongoing abuse in Chile.
It was only when he was set to go to Chile (which he did go), to make a well known peder ass a bishop that this issue came to the surface because he was met with mass protests highlighting the abuse especially from this now soon to be bishop.
@Gazza Lazza:
The pope still claimed he did not know even when a cardinal came out and said he hand delivered a letter written by one of the abuse survivors highlighting the type of abuse, who was involved and who saw/knew what was happening but said/did nothing. Again il papa claimed he didn’t know what the cardinal was taking about, claiming he didn’t know about or receive the letter.
The Cardinal then produced a photo that was taken of the cardinal handing the pope said letter.
As per usual there has been all talk but no substance or action.
@Paul Fahey: Not true, it was on Irish news earlier. I’m not saying what this man alleges isn’t true, but apparently there is ‘ history’ with this same Cardinal and the Vatican anyway, and he strongly opposed Pope Francis’s appointment, and there are unrelated issues with this man. I suggest we do a bit more research….
Such hatred on here. No wonder our country is in the mess its in. You can’t blame every priest for the sins of some. There are lots of good ones too and i personally know a good few of them. Plenty of ordinary men and women abuse too so do we blame all of mankind for that. There is abuse in every walk of life and its sad and its wrong. But being full of hatred doesnt help anyone. It just eats u up. Btw. I was born in Bessboro mother and baby home. And i have survived being raped when i was younger but i dont blame everyone for that. Life is too short
@Helen Kiely-O’Regan: but the organisation is still letting pedophiles away with their crimes. If this was any other organisation it wouldn’t have gone on this long. Something needs to be done. Keep your faith all you want but if you support the RCC you support their ongoing crimes.
In answer to Sam Harms and Johnny Masons questions
1. I didnot go to Knock, as I am watching it on T.V. and waiting to go to hospital for a re-do of a botched Hernia and in agony.
2. For Sam ~ I try to be a decent person. I fall down. I did not say I was perfect. I think charity begins at home and when you are a public patient and get infections in hospitals 3 times in a row as I have huge waiting lists, look at the homelessness, I still feel that charity begins at home and that we should look after our own first. That is my own opinion, not my great Aunts. I am no saint and never purported to be. I do hate the vitriol that is being spewed for those people who are believers
@Rosemarie Martin: I had to report one of your comments yesterday because of your own vitriol and personal attacks. Enjoy your mass.
@SeanGabriel1453: where did I say Christine’s don’t do anything for the homeless? I’m defending Muslims because of the awful comments she made yesterday.
@Sam Harms: *Christians
Is it possible to get a fact check on the percentage of nationalities attending to get a proper overview of foreign/domestic attendance?
@sequoia: yawn…
In light of human suffering, acute hypocrisy and evil, I cast this spell:
MUMBO JUMBO, GOBBLEDYGOOK, CLAPTRAP, HOGWASH, GIBBERISH, HOKUM,FLIMFLAM, HOOEY, HOCUS POCUS.
Amen.
for best result enchant this prayer while standing on a frog at sunrise.
It can also be used in a pinch to turn pepsi into coke.
Used this powerful spell and want to show gratitude? – just kiss my ring.
all donations will be used to build a big empty house that reaches waaaay up to the moon.
I love a good mass!!
An open wound they can’t be bothered to fix, disgraceful
“SORRY “ seems to be the hardest word
So the state payed 30 million so that 130,000 pensioners go to the park and sit in the rain for the afternoon listening to the head of an organization that has perpetrated crime through generations asking for forgiveness but refusing to apologize and who hides behind Canon law so that his organization isn’t criminally or fiscally liable. It’s a crazy little country we live in
Who knows they may appear any minute now. Sure be rude.not.too.
Total lock down of the city is not needed
That spell has been cast previously and hasn’t worked are you sure your Genuine ?
@Johnny Mason: Is that comment for me ? Yep, I am genuine. A Genuine human being with genuine failings and faults. I do hate making things work with vitriol. I myself have been a subject of abuse by a nun and spoken about it and have met others in the same position. I am just sick of God haters here. BBC and Jimmy Saville etc., Westminster, the child abuse in Northern Ireland homes, the hypocrisy of high powered people in general and the worldwide abduction of children for snuff movies and prostitution….. I could go on.
@Johnny Mason: no it wasn’t for you but for the baron
@Rosemarie Martin: to put it simply, no other organisation has been responsible for so much abuse for so long, in so many places. If you’d like to distract from that that’s your choice but it did happen and people are dead right to be mad as hell about it.
Going to be some queue for communion today.
Old Pope of the Vatican we love you its just the pervs and thief’s etc that we find a bit off putting
@Johnny Mason: it’s the enabling and facilitation of the pervs I find off-putting. Although “off-putting” is a bit of an understatement.
@James Rhatigan: @Sayitlikeitis: Your brief comment is very telling. First its nice to know that at the very least you recognize that corruption is a bad thing. That at least is a start! You did after all try the whataboutism of ‘what about all these other groups with corruption?’
So you realise that there is clearly something wrong with transgression of moral norms.
But heres the thing, these ‘other’ organisations are not claiming to foster absolute morality and the RCC most certainly is doing so! That others do a bad thing and you accept it as such is self evidence enough to you that the church is immoral in its past and current actions.
Thats the first point, that you accept there is a wrong thing here and we know this because as a defense you pointed to others doing the wrong things. So we know you know its wrong.
Next nuns taking money for babies, the Vatican bank laundering money for nefarious groups and the taking of ‘donations’ by the worlds wealthiest organisation, from people very much less wealthy, the hiding of records or the associated accidental ‘great fires’ used to destroy such evidence is corruption, not abuse. In fact the Church put the New York mob families to shame in their expert handling of such cover ups. I wonder where they learned how to do all that?
BUT abusing children, enslaving pregnant women and putting them to hard forced labour over years, stealing their children and selling them for money, treating them as minions and convincing them they have committed some crime, lying to those children, even to this day, literally labeling them and their mothers as ‘offenders’, mistreating children so badly their mortality rate is five times that of the general population during a time of an epidemic, and disposing of the evidence (the bodies) in a sesspit over generations is not just corruption, thats tyranny, its also infanticide. You’ve heard these things are not good yes? These are the sort of things the local priest tells you is wholly immoral, that sort of thing? yes? You don’t need a priest to tell you its wrong either, you know its wrong, right?
So I think you actually understand the problem here, and its not a problem of the past either. This organisation is still at it. Do you think there aren’t currently the equivalent of Magdalene laundries in Asia, India, Africa and South America? Really? Do you think there are not currently just as many priests abusing children? Do you think the church learned from these moral transgressions or just worked out how to hide it better from authorities? They sure are not coming clean about it and putting measures in place to stamp it out and compensate their victims.
So I think you know right from wrong and jumped to this whataboutism as a last ditch attempt at excusing or justifying or explaining behavior.
But these ‘other’ organisations are not claiming to be the moral high ground or representatives of a deity now are they?
You can carry out a quick thought experiment so that you know you understand this…. it goes like this…. you have a choice of someone to babysit your children. The choices are a random priest, Adolf Hitler, Joseph Stalin or Harold Shipman… put those choices in order of preference in your head there. That’ll explain to you how much you understand of this moral transgression.
All the victims want is for the hiding and running and corruption to cease, to stop, they are still at it! They also want proper complete transparency and for retribution to be made. They want oversight that these actions will not continue.
The Church is currently apologizing and paying lip service but doing nothing. This is wrong yes? Should you not be insisting and demanding that these immoral action cease immediately and not trying to deflect onto others you know are also guilty or moral transgressions?
Says it all :
He’s as popular as Garrett Brooks
That’s a lot of hands doing the Sign of Peace …. are they giving out free hand sanitizers
Saw many people walking back from the event today. The amount of children people brought. Are they not ashamed of supporting a pedo ring?
Goodbye
Not after the fact…thought that’d be obvious
Priests with paedophile tendencies should come forward and be treated with compassion; the Pope should have outlined future protections for kids… otherwise nobody will let their kids be involved alone with clergy, and the Church’s future imperiled
@White Rhino: compassion for paedophiles? How about jail?
@White Rhino: Treated with compassion? Are you deluded…they should be treated to jail time. Your comment about compassion is an absolute insult to people who were abused by the members of the church.
@White Rhino: “Priests with paedophile tendencies should come forward and be treated with compassion;”
Yes, exactly the same amount of compassion we afford every member of the public that admits to such crimes, no less, no more. If they plead guilty it might lessen their sentence. The law is applicable universally, with no exceptions.
In the case of the RCC as an organisation an investigation, not a tribunal should take place. Just as it would if we found their was systemic child abuse in any organisation. If it is found to be a systemic abuse with knowledge from the top and covert actions applied to hide and deflect then just like ANY other organisation it is legislated out of existence (banned).
Thats the rules we apply to everyone, every organisation and special pleading does not work just because … well because.
Also the church are more aware than any state who the culprits are and they hide them, thats the actual problem and its ongoing.
@White Rhino: “otherwise nobody will let their kids be involved alone with clergy, and the Church’s future imperiled”
You have got to be kidding me? That ship left port a long time ago, It sunk of the coast of ‘kiddy fiddling land’ . I’d leave my kids with Harold Shipman before I’d leave them with any priest these days.
What I don’t understand is how the RCC has anything at all to do with children and retains patronage of schools of all things. Thats like Leaving Adolf Hitler in charge of your Synagogue!
have your say