We need your help now
Support from readers like you keeps The Journal open.
You are visiting us because we have something you value. Independent, unbiased news that tells the truth. Advertising revenue goes some way to support our mission, but this year it has not been enough.
If you've seen value in our reporting, please contribute what you can, so we can continue to produce accurate and meaningful journalism. For everyone who needs it.
Sign in. It’s quick, free and it’s up to you.
An account is an optional way to support the work we do. Find out more.
By continuing, you are indicating that you accept our Terms of Service and Privacy Policy.
FOR THOSE IN Ireland not directly involved – that is, most of us – the waves of protest which swept the world last year made for momentous viewing.
The rule of several Arab dictators was ended. Wall Street remained under occupation for months. Russians finally stood up to Vladimir Putin. Students clashed with security forces in the UK and Chile. Violent protests broke out in Nigeria, Kazakhstan, and Romania. Athenians and Madridrileños raised voices and fists. China rumbled with discontent. Web designers, football supporters, ice hockey fans, and Canadian photo caption writers got in on the act.
These outbreaks provided Ireland with some much-needed distraction from the depressing home front. It was a year in which austerity bedded down. Unemployment continued to grow. Economic growth itself remained static. Everyone seemed to know several young emigrants and, tragically, a suicide victim or two. Our radios droned with relentlessly negative economic reports. Lucky enough to be writing a book on the history of popular revolution, one question kept nagging away at me: how had Ireland avoided its own 21st century revolution?
In recent weeks, as demonstrators requisitioned a NAMA-managed building in Cork, and economists delivered yet more damning reports on the state of the economy, the country issued a collective shrug. The Occupy encampment on Dublin’s Dame Street remains tiny. Even moderate reform proposals, such as Fintan O’Toole’s petition and Second Republic, have been handicapped by lack of support. Attempts to ignite modern Ireland in popular activism seem doomed.
But, as I researched, I discovered that this is nothing new. Virtually all Irish revolutionary experiments, at least in the realm of politics, proved neither popular nor successful in their day. Glorious failure is the overriding theme of Irish revolutionary history. The sectarian rebellion of 1641, for example, led directly to the ravages of Oliver Cromwell. Outbreaks in 1848 (by the Young Irelanders) and 1867 (by the Fenians) were more political farce than full-blown revolution.
That is not to say that history cannot provide echoes of our current problems. The Rising of 1798 took place against the backdrop of a familarly restless world. The crisis at home – Catholic and Presbyterian groups united against British rule – was part of broader changes across the globe. With many Irishmen taking part, America had fought and won its war of independence from 1776 till 1781. The French Revolution kicked off in 1789. It had direct and multiple effects on Ireland, not least the attempted invasion in support of the rebels in 1796. In Haiti, beginning in 1791, slaves fought to establish the world’s first modern, independent black state. Growing literacy played a part too. Radical political pamphlets, such as Tom Paine’s best-selling Common Sense, strongly attuned Irish minds towards radical change.
The world which Ireland looks out upon in 2012 seems, if anything, more chaotic and unruly than in the late 18th century. As then, when Westminster had the final say on Irish politics, the Dáil finds its decision-making power proscribed from abroad. It is now the EU/IMF ‘Troika’ which directs Irish budgets. So why have we not risen up in anger? I’ve heard lots of explanations: our youth are too self-involved; we are too addicted to social media; we are inherently cautious and pessimistic; things are not actually that bad; and, my personal favourite: inspired by years of consumerism and colonial domination, our society suffers from general moral cowardice.
All of these hold some merit. It is the original question which is misguided. What good has political revolution done Ireland thus far? After all, most of our rebellions backfired. The valiant but ill-managed Rising of 1798 aimed to throw off colonial shackles. It resulted in the exact opposite. The strength of the British clampdown, the declared opposition of the Catholic hierarchy, and a lack of strategic direction led to a succession of ignominious defeats and the 1801 Act of Union; a closer relationship to British overlords.
This is not unique. A decade after guillotining its royal family, revolutionary France was ruled by a dictator. ‘All men are created equal’, the infamous line from the American Declaration of Independence, conveniently ignored the wives, slaves, and native neighbours of the US Founding Fathers. Few need reminding of Haiti’s downward trajectory since its uprising. Paralysis in present-day Egypt suggests that political revolutions of the ‘classical’ form will continue to descend into anarchy, then renewed tyranny, for some time to come.
Does history, then, leave Ireland with no hope? To avoid such a depressing conclusion, I would suggest a mental sidestep; a shift in the very concept of revolution. It is now a good time to re-institute the original meaning of the word. Before the late 18th century a ‘revolution’ meant a return to tradition; a cyclical restoration of former values. Though I’m confident they would be popular moves, we can no longer justify decapitating our politicians, or storming government buildings with red flags flying.
There are better historical models to mimic. Argentina, exactly a decade ago, defeated many of the same problems as Ireland now faces. Economic mismanagement and IMF debt had led to a breakdown in public services, empty supermarket shelves, and rampant crime. At first, chaos reigned. But Argentines quickly learned that money and politicians do not, contrary to popular assumption, make the world go round. They picked themselves up and formed local assemblies on street corners, subverting the role of central government. Today, in the midst of a global recession, Argentina boasts one of the fastest-growing economies on the planet. Positivity, togetherness, and a healthy ignorance towards authority shine brightest from the Argentine Cacerolazo of 2002.
Recently, TheJournal.ie saw a writer express the need:
To throw away the outworn doctrines and accepted wisdom of the past … to shove aside small minded special interest groups who stand in the way of progress and emerge from this lost decade as a generation who faced up to their challenges.
Revolutionary talk, by any standard. But the progress which Aaron McKenna alludes to will only start when our next generation of rebels choose non-political targets. Though the romantic idea of personalities like Che Guevara is appealing, it is figures such as Einstein and Marie Curie which have done more to change our world. Revolutions in the spheres of chemistry, ecology, and agriculture, often trump those of politics. This is true not only of their everyday influence, but with regard to their longevity and sustainability too.
And tackling everyday problems from a rational, scientific angle quickly becomes political anyway. Where would government representatives derive their raison d’etre, for instance, if every Irish town decided to meet online to vote on local issues? What if every household had a windmill or solar panel to produce its own energy? Or if every village grew its own food? What if barter systems could subvert the need for currency and interest-loaded loans? Crazy ideas, you might say. Impossible. But there are communities in Ireland and across the world already combining tradition with technology to pursue all of these goals.
What’s more, the causes for which the ‘classical’ revolutions were fought have reached heights of acceptance undreamed of by their former proponents. 18th century denizens would have dismissed as equally insane or impossible the notion that human rights, social welfare, and national self-determination could be enshrined in UN charters, EU treaties, and national law. As Bill Mollison once said, self-reliance is ‘the world’s most subversive practice’. We must start to challenge our situation with the greatest weapon known to revolutionaries of the past: imagination.
Derry Nairn is the author of Viva La Revolution!, a new book which looks at revolutions of the past to help us understand our current troubled world. His website is at derrynairn.com.
To embed this post, copy the code below on your site
And Leo V is first out of the blocks with the scare tactics of economic bomb going off in Dublin not the best choice of words but given the choice of words used by continuity F F over the last few weeks it’s hardly surprising.
They will try to scare the living daylights out of us to get this treaty passed.
Enough now enough !!!!
Totally agree. This is the same “politician’ whilst in opposition said that he would pay not a cent more to bailing out Anglo. The Irish electorate get the chimps they deserve…
We need another election to get rid of these lying sods
They will and have said anything to A) get elected
B) get the treaty passed
We need to trust ourselves and know that we can only rely on ourselves
to move forward. Do Not Be Afraid. Stand up straight and tell these politicians that enough is enough.
another election won’t change a thing.
We need a new system, start again, and I like the article above says, at a local community level.
Fuck the government.
Tear up the page and start again Paul? Yeah that sounds good. Sounds a whole ton better than There is NO Alternative.
Every problem has a solution .
It does not have to be the same again ,as Réada says tear up the page and start again.
Ha ha! Brilliant image Paul. Love it.
My thoughts on the bomb
Irish Gov bows to “BombHolder” threats from the ECB over Anglo Debt
http://soundmigration.wordpress.com/2012/01/23/irish-gov-bows-to-bombholder-threats-from-the-ecb-over-anglo-debt/
Feic. Sundays are meant to be quiet days on journal. Read. Liked.
I don’t think we need a violent revolution either. We’re going to have a change alright but global matters will take care of that. I think, as a small country, insignificant in the grand scheme of things, we could easily get away without paying out. Lots of institutions crumbling.
Watched Gilmore few weeks ago on tv and reading between the lines its quite obvious that Ireland has been threatened regarding the paying back of bondholders. I think they should tell it straight and face the music.
Don’t think we should get het up on the question of bartering v money. Money is just a piece of paper symbolising an exchange of energy. It will always exist and things will always have a value. Whether it’s money or a hen doesn’t matter. Piece of paper fits into the purse easier tho.
It’s time to tear up the page and start again. It’s not that scary. Or have we got addicted to fear?
We’re a great country with great people. Let us show the world how to do it and not have their markets dictating to us. Money doesn’t make the world go round. Love does!
No great change has ever come about with out the use of violence, sadly. There will always be casualities. Without serious sacrifice, and total loyalty to the tricolour, we will never get out of this. Nobody actively wants violence, but in fairness it’s probably all we have left. This is the way wars are won.
Touché
A lot of good has come from peaceful protest Paudy. A lot of heartache from war. Wait and see. :D
Paudy I would support anything other than a violent protest & as you mention the tricolour, this itself is a symbol of peace
Our flag is certainly a symbol of peace Peter. No mistake made there. Many since. The last century may have needed violent conflict to help free our land from tyranny. I hope this one will see a more inclusive process to unite our country again.
“Fé mhóid bheith saor, seantír ár sinsear feasta,
Ní fhágfar fén tíorán ná fén tráill.”
No more despots. No more tyrants. No more slaves.
I know, I fully agree that taking a stand without violence is the best course of action. That would be ideal if we were dealing with people who were capable of listening and understanding others. If we were dealing with a government who were more concerned with our welfare above what Germany says, the good Irish name would not be dragged through the mud. Who is out there fighting OUR corner? Nobody. We must do it ourselves but we must unite!
Peace is something Ireland has worked desperately hard for so I’m not suggesting we go back into the dark days. What I am saying is fight fire with fire.
Together, united using whatever means we must, we can and will reclaim Ireland.
People of Ireland unite – stand strong and stand proud. We are passionate and we are proud. We are a better people than they would have us believe.
Paudy. Watching Varadkar talking about bomb threats on week in politics. The truth is tumbling out of their mouths. They can’t help themselves. Lmho. Keep them coming lads…
As Tom Pollard says below. Talk to your neighbours, friends, colleagues. It’s a revolution we’re having alright. From the ground up. We don’t need leaders. We have to stop looking for leaders. The power is always with us the people. We’re waking up. :D
We need to stick together from the top down and show Europe that we are a force to be reckoned with . Non violent . We have had enough of that . But if we could only get our politicians on our side then we could become and do anything …….
…..or the bottom up .We all need to be counted that is what I mean.
It is happening and the politicians know it is happening . Keep up the pressure and try and get to
any public meetings in your area . E mail them, talk to each other a nd stand firm . €1,250,000,000,000 is being handed over to unsecured bond holders on wednesday……
Many people have crippling mortgages. I believe the time is coming to organise a mortgage boycott until the government and banks end this failed austerity and financial assault on Irish citizens. Forgive a portion of celtic tiger mortgages on the family home, Stop the cuts to front-line services, stop re-paying Anglo bonds, no house-hold charge without firstly tackling government waste & inefficiencies, develop a real jobs policy and give our kids hope and a future in this country. Spread the word and they will start listening to us.
Silent P
Spot on. People are waking up to these ideas . I think people should try and attend any public meetings in their area
HEAR what is being said and not just what RTE is reporting. get out and talk to their friends and neighbours …
Réada, I know where you’re coming from, but honestly I think every movement of the people needs a tactical wing in the form of leaders, planners and representatives. It helps to keep the hope alive when those participating can identify and communicate with one another. Rallies and protests need to happen, without representatives of the group the passion for a new Ireland can can easily mutate into something else.
I respect everybody’s opinion here, and don’t think anybody is wrong, we all have a voice for a reason!
Working together with a common goal will bring us and our children a better future.
Silent P, fully agree with you.
With the intelligence and passion we have for Ireland, it’s hard to believe things got as bad as they did. At least we’re ready to stop them – STARTING NOW!
Paudie, there is a protest outside Anglo till Wednesday to protest against the payment to bondholders. Let’s see how many go. I’m going. I suspect I wont have that much company. We’ll see…
OK, well I’ll be there.
Take 3 zeros off that Eileen…
Thanks dowthebow
I think it’s a very good idea really. The idea of local assemblies springing up everywhere could be very good. Sadly while it would be brilliant if the whole country realised that there’s more to life than numbers and suits, and that decision making should really benefit those who will see the results of the decisions, and not just the decision makers themselves, Europe would find some way to clamp down on us, as our debt is related to other countries, and lord knows what might happen then. Although the worst they could do really is just kick us out of the EU, and if we all decide to go back to living for ourselves and not for our bank accounts, this mightn’t be such a catastrophic thing.
The day is coming. We’ve been pushed and shoved about as much as we can take- well at least I have and I don’t think I’m alone on that. It’s now a case of sink or swim. There will be a fight.
THAT IS FIGHTING TALK – PEOPLE OF IRELAND, WHERE IS YOUR FIGHT?!
Hmm there is a lot to be said for the more traditional methods of off with their heads! I really feel the lack of action is down to a hopelessness that our lords and masters have cultivated in us through their bare faced corruption and lies over the years. A tipping point is coming and when it does real change will occur. This up coming treaty may just be it. I’m sure they will spare no expense and threats to get a yes vote…that is if it goes to a referendum at all…but the people will not be fooled again.
Paul O Keefe
I have passed my tipping point when I saw that man Callelly being awarded his high court costs . The law was observed but was justice done ???
There is a serious threat of poverty in this country and at the same time there are a lot of very wealthy people here too. I have had enough.I want people to stop being afraid of speaking their minds and stand up and be counted.:)
Eileen, it is just dreadful. we are being robbed blind and just allowing it to happen. As disaffected as people seem I just find it so difficult to grasp the level of apathy towards action. We need to speak out and resist in whatever way we can. The comments section here is great in that it allows us to leave off a bit of steam but I suspect most of us are preaching to the choir and those that have the power don’t care what the citizens of this country think anyway. I have started writing to TDs and the Trioka mouth pieces today (starting with this cretin klaus.masuch at ecb.int) to let them know exactly what I think of them and their actions. They might not care but at least they will know there is some resistance. I suggest you do the same and anyone else who happens to read this, as if we don’t speak up, we won’t be heard.
Hi Paul . I have started sending e mails to ministers and td’s too. I have attended public meetings in particular the Campaign against the household charge and water tax… I have decided ,and believe me it was a decision … not to be afraid any more . We have a right to speak up and be heard and to be listened to.
I will not register and I will not pay the house hold charge. I am tired and I am tired of being tired .
This is our country , I am Irish first last and always , not European.
Good on you. We need more people to stand up to these criminals. I have just returned from exile abroad and the way things are looking here I’m wondering why on earth I came back. I’m almost about ready to leave again…but not without a fight!
Good for you
Not with out a fight ! :)
This is what I love about Irish people! Right here- I can almost hear the passion in your voices. Stand together united and proud.
The day is certainly coming! All the chatter and talk is just symptomatic of people checking with each other that there is a consensus and legitimacy to the rebellious thoughts going through our minds. Regarding the points made in the article, I wouldn’t despair over our abysmal historical record in armed uprising. I would point out rather that we have our own uniquely Irish way of rebellion. The English learned over hundreds of years that we were ultimately ungovernable without our consent. We invented ‘boycott’ as a primary mechanism for disrupting our enemies and we perfected the art of guerilla warfare as a balancing power when faced by more powerful adversaries. Even our more recent history has shown that we can resort to the most extreme obscenities if pushed far enough. Where are the people in government and Europe who should be able to read these signs that pushing us much further will release a genie which will be very difficult to put back into the bottle once loosed. Last chance guys – be warned: Don’t mess with the Irish because they make a very nasty adversary.
The Idea is right, but will we sit here typing and talking about it? Lets do that and things will get done, unlike the occupy movements! At least they are trying, Government is quiet happy letting people rant on these sites. Because nothing will happen otherwise, so where do we begin with the Revolution of Thought and Mind? Either people or someone get up and start something, or just shut up! Tearing it up and starting again, is a great idea but you have to Get up, Stand up and stand up for your rights! So less talk, more action, people!
Well said Stephen, We should take this well written and realistic column above and use it as a motivating piece of writing. I have been commenting and comment reading less and less on the journal because nothing in the comments narrative changes, and while I agree and respect the base comments of “Journalistas” I see nothing being forged between commentators or public alike.
I have shaken off my January blues and firmly resolved to oppose Property Tax and other crushing proposals, I am spending lost time preparing my veg garden and talking to my neighbours on future proofing our rural community. Already we are a group and with some positivity and no regard for the political status quo we will become an independent, sustainable community and I hope this happens countrywide and then we shall all have a meaningful say and a more independent life. We do not need this European/ Dail Eireann model to run our lives. Very peacefully and very humanley we can all drop the keyboard for an hour a day and start to make friendships or meet and discuss what we would all like and how to help each other achieve it.
Let’s do it for ourselves.
Can I help you?
I have to agree about the effect of typed diatribes, on sites such as this. It achieves nothing other than the delusion that someone is listening to you, and that maybe the few who are motivated enough be be socially active will do something to change the status quo. The unfortunate thing is that many of those so inclined appear to be attempting to subvert the current structure from within, to achieve their goal. This is obviously not working.
The only way to achieve change is to begin with yourself. Collectively rallying friends and like-minded people, through personal and digital social networks, and begin gathering. Set a date, time, and venue and meet up. Brainstorm ideas, which can be openly, constructively, discussed online between meetings. Create a manifesto for an alternative. A new declaration for Ireland. A new independence. A new future. An alternative to a perpetual future existence repaying an unsustainable, unfair, non-democratic, anti-capitalist derived debt burden.
All those typing here need to become physically active. Stand up and be counted, instead of hiding behind a protective screen. Only when people become a conscious and physical resistance to the established structures and, most importantly, gain popular support through the provision of a structured alternative, can any change begin. Currently everything appears to be just disjointed, or negative, commentary achieving nothing other than personal placation. Failure.
I am one such typing hypocrite, so I have to acknowledge that what I now type, I believe, will not change anything. One can only hope that this diatribe, and Tom Pollard’s question, do not go unanswered.
As a commentary on an above suggestion of violence as a vehicle to change, it must be retorted by the example of India which, predominantly, gained independence through non-violence. Also, only by means of constructive dialogue has a semblance of peace come to the north of this island. Violence will only beget more violence, and that is no way to begin anew.
Indeed, do we all just sit about talking about change. I’m all for change in Ireland. I am fed up with feeling like I live in a surreal life- notably 1984! Are we Irish or are we mice?
I don’t trust politicians. I don’t trust anybody in government. Now it’s time for action. Can we organise a group from here?
Less chat, more hat!!
Varadhkar on Week in Politics more or less just said we are too immature to make important decision for ourselves such as that which will be made for us on accepting the treaty. The nerve of this little dictator. Now, more than ever, is the time to take decisive action against these financial terrorists and their puppets. Absolutely sickened by Varadhkar’s latest slur against the people of this country.
Paul. It is brilliant. I commented other day that we were in the middle of a war, an economic war. There’s been a lot on YouTube and www and it’s not outside the realms of possibility to suspect some of it is true. I’m sure many threats have been made to our government ministers. I’m sure they are petrified. It’s a pity they don’t have the courage to stand up for Ireland and have loyalty to their country and her citizens. I also think it’s time we all pulled together on this island to stand up to these economic terrorists.
I know I sound a bit scary but I have never bought the German/Franco thing. The enemy is big money, European too but mainly USA and Russia. Things are happening but I have no doubt that good will triumph. Makes me laugh really because most of this money is just numbers on a computer screen – no gold to back it up. Can’t feel scared when you’re laughing!
It’s great I don’t have to worry about the men in the White coats anymore. Varadkar has confirmed what I said tonight. And I’m sure there’s been more than bomb threats made. People have been killed over far less than €1.25 billion. Just saying…
What Else did Veradkar say ? I missed the show !!!!
He said the the Troika said that if we didn’t pay the bondholders it would be like a bomb going off. And that the bomb would go off in Dublin not Frankfurt. Talk about a threat. Threatening the image of a bomb on our capital city!!! I remember the last bomb and we still don’t know the full truth about that. At least Varadkar is such an eegit he told us the truth.
FG are going to run out of TDs to send out next. Then maybe VinB will be able to get his hands on Enda. :-)
But the Troika! They’re terrorists alright. The Troika Terrorists. Fecking cheek of them.
Oh the same old rubbish about having to pay off our debts or no one will like us any more.
He is an idiot . A bomb going off ?…. Oh those boys know how to TRY to scare people …. and Veradkar is the mouth piece to use to pass the message on. Oh well , I reckon people are more clever than what the government give us credit for …. We shall see and prove them wrong ,eh?
Paul ,
I think he should be the one worried about popularity stakes … He is either working for us or for the Troika and the same goes for the rest of the Government …
You would think wouldn’t you!
Having just come from Argentina it appears that they are on the right track and perhaps their currency has recovered somewhat. What’s evident however is how far they are lagging behind countries like Brazil, Chile and even Uruguay – in terms of arrogance and humility.
“Irish people don’t like to be embarrassed” – an American friend said to me. I keep that in mind as I listen to politicians, watch my own behaviour and others. We are a verbal culture and will talk things to death until they are done in our heads.
I will stop discussing this as it is just more talk and I might embarrass myself.
The Sectarian Rebellion of 1641. What the fuck is that????
It may be just numbers on a computer but its having real and devastating effects on peoples lives. I completely agree that this is war. It is war with decency and humanity on one side and greed and the global financial elite on the other. Unfortunately I don’t believe our politicians are on the side of decency and humanity….well not the ones with their hands in the till anyway.
If they only reduced their own take home pay ….It would be a start . People would feel less isolated. Then hold a referendum and stick with the decision of the people . Then tell Europe …..
@ Eileen I love that statement. ” I’m Irish first, last and always. Not European.”
I Live in Portloise,,,emfufh@gmail.com will get me, and I am sick and tired of talking and posting ,,I am ready for action now. I am sick of being lied to, being financially raped, being pressurised to pay some one elses gambling debts. ENOUGH IS FUCKEN ENOUGH.
Hi Mick, Im only in Tipp less than an hour from you, I’ll mail you and we can have a chat. Thanks and fair play Mick, anybody else interested in meeting up or will commenting on articles satisfy your thirst for much needed change? Stephen Murphy you have me and Mick to talk with, would love to meet up if you want to meet us?.
A lot of people agree, we should do something and as soon as possible. We need to get organised first, do we start at Facebook or have we an expert or organiser that can things moving. I am done with talking and ranting, its not achieving anything? So are people interested in making a difference, A journey of a thousand miles starts with the first step!
Im on facebook Stephen, please feel free to send me a message. The time seems to be ripe and any timewasting could be regretted.We could have a group brainstorm, and identify any skills we can bring.
A lot of Tom Pollards, to my surprise? What would make you unique on facebook, or just start a group and let us know where to look on here. An Irish Movement Group, or something to that effect and make it open!
Bit confused here Stephen?, I did’nt mean to start a facebook campaign. That would be benign and impotent, I did mean that anyone can message me on Facebook and we could arrange a face to face meeting of two or twenty and discuss ideas and take it from there.Im not a serial killer or a lonley heart looking to expand my facebook cache of friends. Dont know how many people I have messaged so far only to hear nothing from. This relates to my earlier post that as much as I like the journal and it’s commentators I find it futile that none of these well meaning , well versed commentators do not want to take their urge to make a difference seriously. We all have skills and life experience to draw on, The current system will never change unless we grab the nettle hard. Hence my activity online is on the decline rapidly and my activism outside in the community is escalating, and it feels good. Im not a couch commentator , Im a tryer. Please Try too anyone reading this post, It feels quite good, mind you I should’nt be saying that as I heard a rumour on a journal post that feel good factors will be taxed by 2014.
times are changing and to compare Che Guevara with the Curie, does not make any sense to me; past history was not as global as it is now! There is a ‘Big Brother’ element in what is going on, and I do not believe in the great conspiracy theory, but having to do what we’re told as a matter of fact is ridiculous; we have to voluntarily register our home…. so did the Jews, they had to register to get their yellow stars… I may be overreacting.. only a little. It is time to deconstruct and re-gain power and confidence in ourselves; what I hear a lot is: what can we do? we can’t do a thing, they are all the same…. the giving-up option is not an option!
The problem is that while you might get agreement that the current system doesn’t work, you’ll get no agreement on what should replace it once you try to move beyond the generalities.
Once you move into that stage everybody will have their own agendas and will want their ideas to be included at the expense of other people’s ideas. In the end you just end up with a new version of what was already there.
“we can no longer justify decapitating our politicians”
ERM…are you sure??? ;-)
facebook and twitter ranting is pointless. politicians just laugh at that. We need to get out in meatspace and actually protest in the flesh. 200,000 people at the gates of lenister house all pissed off and rattling the gates would scare the Sh*te out of them and they might think twice before selling us out! ;-)
have your say